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Balancing issue Marauders

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Obsidian Hawk RONA Legion	Posted - 2010.03.02 07:26:00 - [1] Ok, so recently i have been playing with marauders making fittings in eft and what not and noticed that there is one huge balance issue which needs to be addressed again and that is the powergrid on the vargur. 7900 is not enough especially compared to the kronos and paladin. t2 artillary use a base of 3350 powergrid usage. So yeah this seems off track especially when the paladin can use t2 tachyons no problem and the kronos can use t2 425's no problem with some grid left over. so yeah buff varger PG to 9000 at least! so we can use some t2 1400s on it.
Makar Kravchenko	Posted - 2010.03.02 07:48:00 - [2] Edited by: Makar Kravchenko on 02/03/2010 07:48:31 800mm Repeating Artillery II on a Vargur is pretty nice. 1000 dps at optimal, 500 at falloff. Something like 3.5+47km falloff with T1 ammo? I think that would be sufficient for most NPCs. Sleipnir with 650mm Artillery II works just as well, without the benefit of marauder tractor beams. You should see what the Vargur with autocannons does to Damsel in Distress :P. The slow cycle time on 1400mm would be comparible to ICE Mining in a retreiver. Alpha damage is _not_ where its at for mission running. Also, tracking on 1400's is crap. With a marauder you want to try and pull the NPC's close to within 40km, so you can tractor the wrecks. No need to use sniper artillery.
HeliosGal Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.02 07:58:00 - [3] needs something Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00
Mike C Caldari Ipuvaepe Industries	Posted - 2010.03.02 11:57:00 - [4] Originally by: John Rourke 1. Don't get jammed 2. Stationary ships don't react well to 1400s See what I did there? ↑↑ bar is just /quote ↑↑ [03:17:29] Trade Skills > Jesus believes in god [03:17:38] Mike C > believed* [03:17:48] Trade Skills > touche
darius mclever	Posted - 2010.03.02 16:29:00 - [5] the 800mm AC vargur really rocks. smokes anything below BS size in 2-3 volleys max while they approach. putting arties on it seems like abuse.
HeliosGal Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.02 19:32:00 - [6] ccp could always give it some thought Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00
Obsidian Hawk RONA Legion	Posted - 2010.03.02 23:46:00 - [7] well im noticing that marauders are becoming more than mission running ships now. with the huge price decline they are coming closer to becoming pvp ships you could see on the field refularly. While I admit 1200's are nice and good for some sniping, 1400's will be somethin you want to see in pvp. when you are going to face a paladin sitting outside of you ac range burning you what are you doing to do? you need arts to fire back. yeah i will admit the tracking sucks but you know with balancing there are lots of things you can change. I would like to see 1400 vargurs more for pvp than pve, which would require some balance to be in line with other sniper ships and that is the increase power grid. Also i think hte pg for the golem should be increased by about 500. for the same reason.
darius mclever	Posted - 2010.03.03 00:01:00 - [8] Originally by: Obsidian Hawk well im noticing that marauders are becoming more than mission running ships now. with the huge price decline they are coming closer to becoming pvp ships you could see on the field refularly. While I admit 1200's are nice and good for some sniping, 1400's will be somethin you want to see in pvp. when you are going to face a paladin sitting outside of you ac range burning you what are you doing to do? you need arts to fire back. yeah i will admit the tracking sucks but you know with balancing there are lots of things you can change. I would like to see 1400 vargurs more for pvp than pve, which would require some balance to be in line with other sniper ships and that is the increase power grid. Also i think hte pg for the golem should be increased by about 500. for the same reason. what are you smoking? you can happily fit golem with active tank and torps. also ... from the alpha strike the maelstrom is better than a vargur. the vargur with its bonuses shines with ACs. and then you can easily fit a tank. dont believe me? see here.
HeliosGal Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.03 03:03:00 - [9] how about a golem with a AC bonus /. Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00
Ogogov	Posted - 2010.03.03 03:10:00 - [10] Sorry, did someone say the Kronos with its useless-stasis-web-bonus-designed-for-useless-blasters-and-normally-winds-up-being-fitted-with-even-more-useless-railguns had an advantage over something?

HeliosGal Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.03 03:20:00 - [11] Originally by: Ogogov Sorry, did someone say the Kronos with its useless-stasis-web-bonus-designed-for-useless-blasters-and-normally-winds-up-being-fitted-with-even-more-useless-railguns had an advantage over something? yes a kronos with a rocket bonus Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00
Ai Mei	Posted - 2010.03.03 18:57:00 - [12] Originally by: darius mclever what are you smoking? you can happily fit golem with active tank and torps. also ... from the alpha strike the maelstrom is better than a vargur. the vargur with its bonuses shines with ACs. and then you can easily fit a tank. dont believe me? see here. So what you are saying is that, it's better to use a tech 1 sniper battleship than a tech 2 sniper battleship? If it's better to use a maelstrom than a vargur for sniping, then there is something seriously wrong.
Makar Kravchenko	Posted - 2010.03.03 19:19:00 - [13] Edited by: Makar Kravchenko on 03/03/2010 19:23:54 Check. You should probably get the idea out of your head that Marauders are supposed to be used for PVP. I don't know if you noticed but I think CCP gave them a **ty signal strength for a reason. A MultiSpec'd Griffin can jam you 24/7. Bonus to Tractor Beam range and velocity, yeah thats what I I want on my PVP sniper of doom! I bet my 1400's can own them with all that FALLOFF**!
darius mclever	Posted - 2010.03.03 20:11:00 - [14] Originally by: Ai Mei Originally by: darius mclever what are you smoking? you can happily fit golem with active tank and torps. also ... from the alpha strike the maelstrom is better than a vargur. the vargur with its bonuses shines with ACs. and then you can easily fit a tank. dont believe me? see here. So what you are saying is that, it's better to use a tech 1 sniper battleship than a tech 2 sniper battleship? If it's better to use a maelstrom than a vargur for sniping, then there is something seriously wrong. there is nothing wrong with that. the ship bonuses are just more tailored for ACs.
HeliosGal Caldari	Posted - 2010.03.03 21:38:00 - [15] Perhaps its just some minor tweaks needed perhaps a bonus to factional ACs if fitted Signature - CCP what this game needs is more variance in PVE aspects and a little bit less PVP focus, more content more varied level 1-4 missions more than just 10 per faction high sec low sec and 00
Sith LordX	Posted - 2010.03.04 22:42:00 - [16] Originally by: Obsidian Hawk Ok, so recently i have been playing with marauders making fittings in eft and what not and noticed that there is one huge balance issue which needs to be addressed again and that is the powergrid on the vargur. 7900 is not enough especially compared to the kronos and paladin. t2 artillary use a base of 3350 powergrid usage. So yeah this seems off track especially when the paladin can use t2 tachyons no problem and the kronos can use t2 425's no problem with some grid left over. so yeah buff varger PG to 9000 at least! so we can use some t2 1400s on it. They are fine, you just don't have the skills and the isk to properly fit one. As nobody uses a full T2 fit on a T2 BS. They use faction mods/T2 rigs.
Georn VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.04 23:03:00 - [17] Arties work on a Maelstrom and Machariel.. the Vargur is an AC Boat and always has been. And with the changes to projectiles and projectile ammunition.. it's becoming one of the best Mission runners out there. I for one would trade the Powergrid surplus of my Kronos for the AC Vargur performance any day :) ____________ nerf metagaming, boost fun
Moopstah	Posted - 2010.03.05 06:20:00 - [18] How about giving the pally like 30 extra PG so you don't need to use an implant to fit it properly with tachs and a rep?
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.05 10:12:00 - [19] Came in expecting request for kronos boost, left dissapointed.
Sprobe Factorization 42 Corp Butterfly Effect Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.05 17:34:00 - [20] I second the opinion that the Vargur is an AC boat only and underperforms with Artillery. A very good and valid T2 fit - using X-Large Booster II, Amplifier II - uses vast amounts of 800 Boosters. I was doing 1 long-range mission in my vargur, and after that I sold it. It was too demanding in terms of ABing to your targets. Of course, it's ideal for close-range missions and blows everything away with best damage type.. but long-range is simply too exhausting. Long-range boats can always get their distance by ABing away in one direction.. choosing the next target and possibly fastest route through your targets just ****es me off... And yea, it's not the Vargur's fault, I am just too lazy ;) never to old to play

Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2010.03.05 18:55:00 - [21] Originally by: Furb Killer Came in expecting request for kronos boost, left dissapointed. Kronos is fine, buff hybrids. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne


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