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Mister GTC
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Posted - 2010.04.21 17:56:00 -
[1]
So, I've done some analysis on what would be required for one person to make enough fuel in under a month to run a Large Gallente tower for a month.
I'm assuming fuel will be produced in high-sec, 7 extractors with a rate of 30 units / cycle will be used, no extractor cycles will be missed. One factory to refine from raw materials will be on each planet, every other planet will have a second factory for the second level processing. All other processing will be conducted on other planets.
Based on this, I'm coming up with the following:
Coolant: 4 planets, 571 hours
Enriched Uranium: 6 Planets, 481 hours
Oxygen: 2 Planets, 450 hours
Mechanical Parts: 4 Planets, 361 hours
Robotics: 2 Planets (+1 planet for construction of robotics), 244 Hours
It looks like it will take 19 planets, 126 extractors, 18 basic factories, 9 Advanced Factories, and one other factory (High tech), yes?
Am I way off? I'm kind of hoping I am.
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Kanatta Jing
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:03:00 -
[2]
On good worlds you can get 200/cycle allowing for a 1 extractor : 1 Factory ratio.
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Th0rG0d
Pilots From Honour
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:07:00 -
[3]
I think we can say that unless numbers are adjusted, they've completely solved the POS problems.
Adrift in New Eden |
Mister GTC
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:08:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Kanatta Jing
On good worlds you can get 200/cycle allowing for a 1 extractor : 1 Factory ratio.
The 30/cycle ratio was based on my testing in Oursalaert. What area is the 200/cycle found in, high-, low-, or null-sec? Just curious.
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Kanatta Jing
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:17:00 -
[5]
I know 4GQ had some good planets last I saw... Not encouraging for the Highsec guys.
Just scan around, look for red splotches and 90% full white bars.
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Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:21:00 -
[6]
coolant can be produced on one planet. with 4 extractors allocated for each deposit.
PI POS fuel process flow chart v1.0 |
Mme Research
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:34:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Mme Research on 21/04/2010 18:35:11
Originally by: Celeste Coeval
coolant can be produced on one planet. with 4 extractors allocated for each deposit.
Again, my math might be wrong, but I'm just not seeing that. A large gallente tower requires 5,760 coolant to run for 30 days, yes? That translates to 69.12 million of aqueous liquids and the same amount of ionic solutions, correct?
Even if we calculate 200/cycle/extractor (or 800/cycle for 4 extractors), I'm seeing that it will take 60 days to collect the raw materials, based on the following:
800/cycle * 1440 cycles in a day = 1,152,000 units/day
69,120,000 units / 1,152,000 units/day = 60 days.
Edit: Yes, one of me is an alt. When we figure out which one, we'll let everyone know.
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Gil Danastre
Amarr
Aeon Of Strife
Discord.
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Posted - 2010.04.21 18:46:00 -
[8]
It is possible, though unlikely, that CCP have intentionally fudged the numbers or just made them up at the moment so people can't hyper-prepare for this and have stocks of stuff laid in on day one. Or the numbers just aren't finalized yet. I'd worry more if it comes right around mid may and it's still the same.
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Mme Research
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Posted - 2010.04.21 19:01:00 -
[9]
I'm much more comfortable with my new numbers. If I boost the average rate per cycle up to 200, I can make enough 30 days of Robotics in 30 days using 2 planets.
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Trimutius III
Legio Octae
Rebellion Alliance
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Posted - 2010.04.21 19:03:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Trimutius III on 21/04/2010 19:04:37
Edited by: Trimutius III on 21/04/2010 19:04:00
Originally by: Mister GTC
Am I way off? I'm kind of hoping I am.
Number aren't final at all. So don't bother yourself..
Plus Low and Null secs have 200+ extractions.
High sec planets aren't profitable at all extractions there are very low...
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I am envoy from nowhere in nowhere. Nobody and nothing have sent me. And though it is impossible I exist ¬ Trimutius |
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Storm Breaker
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Posted - 2010.04.21 23:15:00 -
[11]
You have made the assumption that everyone involved in PI also runs a POS. Even if it takes 16 planets doesn't automatically mean POS owners will be short and scrambling for fuel.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.04.22 02:31:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Mister GTC
[...] Am I way off? I'm kind of hoping I am.
- You can run 9 extractors, 2 processors and 1 storage per actual PCC.. so you get more per PCC in raw materials.
- For one large tower (as I already posted 2 weeks ago) you need per hour:
Aqueous Liquids19,200u
Base Metals20,000u
Heavy Metals17,600u
Ionic Solutions19,200u
Noble Gas7,500u
Noble Metals29,600u
Non-CS Crystals8,000u This translates to number of extractors, 30u/min each (200u/min in brakets), running 24/7:
Aqueous Liquids11 (2)
Base Metals12 (2)
Heavy Metals10 (2)
Ionic Solutions11 (2)
Noble Gas5 (1)
Noble Metals17 (3)
Non-CS Crystals5 (1) If you divide those numbers by 9 or 7, and round up to full PCCs, you need 12..13 source planets 24/7 with 7..9 x 30u/min per extractor.
As basic lvl1 processing is out of the way already at the sourcing planets we only have to deal with additional lvl2 and lvl3 processors to fill our quota. We need number of lvl2/3 processors 24/7 (rounded UP again):
Robotics1 (adv)
Mechanical Parts2 (basic)
Coolant2 (basic)
Enriched Uranium1 (basic)
Consumer Electronics1 (basic) So additionally to those 12..13 source planets we look at one more higher level processing planet which has several silos and the needed launchpad, to get the stuff to the surface.
To sum it up, with 30u/min sources you're good to go with 14 planets at most.
- CCP already said that we'll be able to somehow upgrade our PCCs, this means those numbers can come down a bit.
- Last but not least are the schematics numbers not yet final. Only whats on TQ on the 18th is final
- As I don't know how many PCCs a player can manage with maxed out skills, you got something to speculate about right there
Oh, and final note.. 14 planets.. babysitting at least once a day.. you're looking at 3-4 minutes per planet and day and the hauling every week I guess as the volumes are relatively small. Whats the going-rate for that kind of activity in EVE?
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Driven Marcelli
Minmatar
Evil Overhead
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Posted - 2010.04.22 02:40:00 -
[13]
I would never go by the unit procees per hour, but the total yeild per cycle and the number of cycles you can get in in 24 hours
if your supplying your own poses you also need to run a surpluss for thoes days when you just cant log in to update your network or run fule to the pos
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.04.22 02:53:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Driven Marcelli
I would never go by the unit procees per hour, but the total yeild per cycle and the number of cycles you can get in in 24 hours
And that helps you how?
This wasn't about: How much can I make with X planets?
This was about: How much do I need at least to run 1 large POS?
And if you'd seen, I always did round up to get maxed out source planets for the given constraints (30u/min).. this means, those 14 planets will probably run nearly 2 large POS if they're managed careful.
I didn't even check if there is potential for optimizing as 3 different planet types have all the resources needed, thus there could be knock-off effects if you source 2 different basic lvl1 products from the same planet.
TL;DR.. the above calculations where only to demonstrate that high sec dwellers are completely capable of running POS with their own fuel if they wish so.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.04.22 03:42:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Mme Research
Originally by: Celeste Coeval
coolant can be produced on one planet. with 4 extractors allocated for each deposit.
Again, my math might be wrong, but I'm just not seeing that. A large gallente tower requires 5,760 coolant to run for 30 days, yes? That translates to 69.12 million of aqueous liquids and the same amount of ionic solutions, correct?
You're already off track..
For 8 units of coolant you need 13,824M units of each aqueous liquids and ionic solutions.
You forgot that the lvl2 process produces 5 units and not just one.
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Driven Marcelli
Minmatar
Evil Overhead
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Posted - 2010.04.22 04:36:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: Driven Marcelli
I would never go by the unit procees per hour, but the total yeild per main cycle and the number of maincycles you can get in in 24 hours
And that helps you how?
This wasn't about: How much can I make with X planets?
This was about: How much do I need at least to run 1 large POS?
.
Sorry clarifying this a bit I ment the total ammount you can get from one mine on a given run
Currently you have a series of cycles that you can set up your run program for
6 hour work if your willing to rebuild your network every 6 hours, but if your only running 3 6 hour blocks a day your extractors will have a lot of downtime that they are not dumping mats into the silo and thus into the processors.
the same holds true for the 8, 11 and 15 hour cycles(especialy the 15 hour cycle because the odds are you picked that one just because you only plan to log in once a day to do the updates)
Granted, if your smart about your network you dont need the storage silo AT ALL
just rout the mats you need for a 1 hour run if you want to skip the silo all together because you can spit up the stream from any and all extractors to feed each processor exactly what it needs.
or if you insist on needing storage, well you can use the storage in the launch pad and or the CC too.
yes I tested it yes it works you dont need the storage silo, Ive been saving that bit of grid for the past day now.
gets rid of a Storage pond you dont realy need if your only going to produce what you are going to process
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.04.22 04:55:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 22/04/2010 04:57:01
Yeah.. silos are only needed if you got more than 200u/min which can't be stored in the proc/pcc which are there anyways.
So, to make a long story short.. if you want your processors 240m3 storage not to overflow (12k units of raw material) and you also don't want to use a silo/launchpad your combined source to that processor should not exceed those values:
hrs(*)u/min
1400.0
2300.0
3266.7
4250.0
5240.0
6233.3
7228.6
8225.0
9222.2
10220.0
11218.2
12216.7
13215.4
14214.3
15213.3
16212.5
17211.8
18211.1
19210.5
20210.0
21209.5
22209.1
23208.7
24208.3 *) runtime of source, time-frame of input to processor
If you additionally use your PCCs storage for buffering you're even better off (several routes over links make this possible, forth and back.. just maintaining this will be fun(?)).
10k m3 can hold 500k units of raw materials.. thus we get:
hrsu/min
18733.3
24466.7
33044.4
42333.3
51906.7
61622.2
71419.0
81266.7
91148.1
101053.3
11975.8
12911.1
13856.4
14809.5
15768.9
16733.3
17702.0
18674.1
19649.1
20626.7
21606.3
22587.9
23571.0
24555.6
So we easily see, whoever uses a silo on a source planet which just chews on that raw material and spits out basic lvl1 products does it wrong, cause the links can handle this traffic easily at the moment.
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Driven Marcelli
Minmatar
Evil Overhead
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Posted - 2010.04.22 05:23:00 -
[18]
actualy to be honest I was trying to literaly squeez the absolute max yeild from a planet to see what the breaking point is (its higher than some people think) that means useing the CC for storage of raw materials because your letting your proccessors run 24/7 while making your mines produce enough mats to feed thoes same processors.
Currently Im testing one of my other assumptions
the set up for the mining-processing cycle is to not set up a link to the CC AT ALL just plant Proccessors extractors and a storage silo on the hotspot and heres the sneeky part, NOT connect anything to the CC untill you want to move the platform to another location
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Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Initiative Mercenaries
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Posted - 2010.04.22 05:46:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Gil Danastre
It is possible, though unlikely, that CCP have intentionally fudged the numbers or just made them up at the moment so people can't hyper-prepare for this and have stocks of stuff laid in on day one. Or the numbers just aren't finalized yet. I'd worry more if it comes right around mid may and it's still the same.
CCP has stated that the planets that were seeded manually have the intended distribution.
And using high-sec numbers as a basis is just plain idiotic, when 0.0 has 5 times more resources. |
Driven Marcelli
Minmatar
Evil Overhead
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Posted - 2010.04.22 05:50:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab
Originally by: Gil Danastre
It is possible, though unlikely, that CCP have intentionally fudged the numbers or just made them up at the moment so people can't hyper-prepare for this and have stocks of stuff laid in on day one. Or the numbers just aren't finalized yet. I'd worry more if it comes right around mid may and it's still the same.
CCP has stated that the planets that were seeded manually have the intended distribution.
And using high-sec numbers as a basis is just plain idiotic, when 0.0 has 5 times more resources.
actualy they originaly seeded the planets manualy, thats why originaly so many were not avalible |
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Mme Research
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Posted - 2010.04.22 13:00:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Mme Research on 22/04/2010 13:01:49
Originally by: Tres Farmer
You're already off track..
For 8 units of coolant you need 13,824M units of each aqueous liquids and ionic solutions.
You forgot that the lvl2 process produces 5 units and not just one.
AH HA! That's what I get for not building my own spreadsheet from the very beginning. Excellent catch, thank you!
Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab
CCP has stated that the planets that were seeded manually have the intended distribution.
And using high-sec numbers as a basis is just plain idiotic, when 0.0 has 5 times more resources.
Not everyone has easy access to nullsec. I've been testing in Reynire and the numbers are a lot better than Oursalaert.
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