| Pages: [1] :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Joe SMASH
You Got A Purty Mouth
   |
Posted - 2010.06.04 15:48:00 -
[1]
Ok, help me settle a little debate I am having with a corp mate. Is it really possible with the new probing system to be completely 100% unprobable? Assuming the prober has level V skills and faction probes (perfect situation for him) and the target has all the relevant skills to level V as well. What is the magic formula to make the target immune to the prober?
I have done some research and a lot of the information is pre-apocrypha or a bit old for my liking. Thanks for your feedback!
PS: Cloaking does not count!
-----------------------------------
 Originally by: Kali Zero
Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
|
Arous Drephius
|
Posted - 2010.06.04 16:23:00 -
[2]
Yes, it's possible. IIRC if your sigRadius/sensorStrength ratio is > 1.08 then you can't be probed.
|
FlameGlow
Rebellion Alliance
|
Posted - 2010.06.04 17:38:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Arous Drephius
Yes, it's possible. IIRC if your sigRadius/sensorStrength ratio is > 1.08 then you can't be probed.
you messed up the formula somewhere as sigRadius/sensorStrength is >1.08 on pretty much anything with no fit  it's either <1.08 or sensorStrength/sigRadius |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
|
Posted - 2010.06.04 18:02:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 04/06/2010 18:02:29
Normally written as:
Sensor Strength > 1.08 * Signature Radius
same as:
Sensor Strength / Signature Radius > 1.08
With 108 apparently being the highest probe strength possible (perfect skills + best probes + best launcher + best ship + implants + boosters, etc.)... so I've read.
|
Grimpak
Gallente
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
|
Posted - 2010.06.04 18:31:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 04/06/2010 18:02:29
Normally written as:
Sensor Strength > 1.08 * Signature Radius
same as:
Sensor Strength / Signature Radius > 1.08
With 108 apparently being the highest probe strength possible (perfect skills + best probes + best launcher + best ship + implants + boosters, etc.)... so I've read.
one thing I wish is that they lowered the calibration cost of grav. cap upgrades.
in cov ops frigs, there is no need to fit T2, because 2x T1 is better, and in T3 ships... well, the damn things cost 200 calibration points each, so take a guess...
---
Quote:
The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Joe SMASH
You Got A Purty Mouth
|
Posted - 2010.06.04 23:41:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 04/06/2010 18:02:29
Normally written as:
Sensor Strength > 1.08 * Signature Radius
same as:
Sensor Strength / Signature Radius > 1.08
With 108 apparently being the highest probe strength possible (perfect skills + best probes + best launcher + best ship + implants + boosters, etc.)... so I've read.
Any idea if this is by design or just a by-product of combining specific modules/setups to get unintended results? So, in our debate, the person who was arguing the side of "There is such a thing as an unprobable ship" wins?
-----------------------------------
Originally by: Kali Zero
Warp core stabilizers are like condoms. Nice and safe, but they make it a little less fun for everyone involved.
|
Celia Therone
|
Posted - 2010.06.05 02:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Joe SMASH
Any idea if this is by design or just a by-product of combining specific modules/setups to get unintended results? So, in our debate, the person who was arguing the side of "There is such a thing as an unprobable ship" wins?
During Apocrypha the bug testers noticed that some ships were completely unprobeable using the new probing mechanics. I believe covert ops frigates fell into this category.
CCP changed things to make those ships probeable but didn't take into account ECCM modules making them harder (impossible) to find. (Or they did take it into account and wanted it to work that way/didn't care which seems odd given that they did care enough to change how things worked shortly before release.)
My main in a dual rigged helios using sisters launcher, sisters combat probes with probing skills at 4 (but no scanning implants) was unable to scan down a modestly skilled alt in a frigate with 2 active ECCM despite knowing exactly where it was.
|
NoNah
|
Posted - 2010.06.05 02:59:00 -
[8]
Keep in mind, there's not all that many ships that can viably do this. T3's used to, but theres a bug making it sort of hard right now.
Parrots, commence!
Postcount: 904662
|
empire hauler
|
Posted - 2010.06.05 09:44:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Arous Drephius
Yes, it's possible. IIRC if your sigRadius/sensorStrength ratio is > 1.08 then you can't be probed.
now in teory thats correct. 
in practice there is at least one way (bug/exploit) to probe down even theoretically unprobable ships. 
it works well only against those whom the trick know not. 
|
Drykor
Minmatar
Aperture Harmonics
K162
|
Posted - 2010.06.05 11:56:00 -
[10]
Originally by: empire hauler
Originally by: Arous Drephius
Yes, it's possible. IIRC if your sigRadius/sensorStrength ratio is > 1.08 then you can't be probed.
now in teory thats correct.
in practice there is at least one way (bug/exploit) to probe down even theoretically unprobable ships.
it works well only against those whom the trick know not.
Maybe you should report this bug then..
|
Socio Stan
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 06:01:00 -
[11]
Originally by: NoNah
Keep in mind, there's not all that many ships that can viably do this. T3's used to, but theres a bug making it sort of hard right now.
I'm somewhat concerned about this. Where can I find how how to not die in a fire to this while I'm afk bonusing in an unprobable T3? |
Lubomir Penev
interimo
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 07:55:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Socio Stan
Originally by: NoNah
Keep in mind, there's not all that many ships that can viably do this. T3's used to, but theres a bug making it sort of hard right now.
I'm somewhat concerned about this. Where can I find how how to not die in a fire to this while I'm afk bonusing in an unprobable T3?
Check your sig radius and especially sensor strength once undocked, the game sometime "forget" to apply subsystems bonus.
--
081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner
blog |
Derek Shmawesome
We Know Derek
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 08:06:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Celia Therone
Originally by: Joe SMASH
Any idea if this is by design or just a by-product of combining specific modules/setups to get unintended results? So, in our debate, the person who was arguing the side of "There is such a thing as an unprobable ship" wins?
During Apocrypha the bug testers noticed that some ships were completely unprobeable using the new probing mechanics. I believe covert ops frigates fell into this category.
If I'm not mistaken it was super capitals being unprobable. I believe originally the mechanic didn't take into account the signature size. It just compared probe strength versus sensor strength of the target. As supercaps have 150+ sensor strength they couldn't be probed anymore. Fail mechanic got adjusted accordingly.
Now heavy ECCM can make for unprobable ships. But that way you have to gimp the fit quite badly. That's why it is ok.
|
Sorted
Highwaymen
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 13:07:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Socio Stan
Originally by: NoNah
Keep in mind, there's not all that many ships that can viably do this. T3's used to, but theres a bug making it sort of hard right now.
I'm somewhat concerned about this. Where can I find how how to not die in a fire to this while I'm afk bonusing in an unprobable T3?
Legion needs 3 faction CPU mods, 2 ECCM (best named t1) and 2 Low slot backup arrays (best named t1), leaves room for 3 command procesors 1 cloak and 4 Gang mods. You need to have the jobber for Sensor Str increase and Powergrid I think.
Loki is similar
Enjoy.
|
z0de
The Bastards
The Tusker Bastards
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 13:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Sorted
Legion needs 3 faction CPU mods, 2 ECCM (best named t1) and 2 Low slot backup arrays (best named t1), leaves room for 3 command procesors 1 cloak and 4 Gang mods. You need to have the jobber for Sensor Str increase and Powergrid I think.
Can you post a fit? I'm struggling to get the 5 lows.
á
á
|
Ophelia Ursus
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 13:44:00 -
[16]
Originally by: z0de
Originally by: Sorted
Legion needs 3 faction CPU mods, 2 ECCM (best named t1) and 2 Low slot backup arrays (best named t1), leaves room for 3 command procesors 1 cloak and 4 Gang mods. You need to have the jobber for Sensor Str increase and Powergrid I think.
Can you post a fit? I'm struggling to get the 5 lows.
Something like this, perhaps?
[Legion, command0r]
Warded Radar Backup Cluster I
Warded Radar Backup Cluster I
Caldari Navy Co-Processor
Caldari Navy Co-Processor
Caldari Navy Co-Processor
Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Command Processor I
Command Processor I
Command Processor I
Armored Warfare Link - Damage Control
Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defense
Armored Warfare Link - Rapid Repair
Skirmish Warfare Link - Interdiction Maneuvers
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints II
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints II
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints II
Legion Propulsion - Chassis Optimization
Legion Offensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Legion Defensive - Warfare Processor
Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Legion Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
|
Shanky McStabber
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 14:07:00 -
[17]
There is also a bug with the sensor strength of a ship being incorrectly calculated when you use Sensor Implants and the Sensor subsystem. This particular bug was verified by CCP months ago and I haven't heard of a fix yet.
So if you plan to make a T3 ship invisible to probes, you will have to use either the sub-system or Sensor implants (not both).
|
Dethmourne Silvermane
Gallente
League of Gentlemen
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 14:56:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Shanky McStabber
There is also a bug with the sensor strength of a ship being incorrectly calculated when you use Sensor Implants and the Sensor subsystem. This particular bug was verified by CCP months ago and I haven't heard of a fix yet.
So if you plan to make a T3 ship invisible to probes, you will have to use either the sub-system or Sensor implants (not both).
WTF? It's enough of a gimp when you combine them :(
Regarding high-sec mining:
Originally by: AmarrettoDiAmarr
3-4 million ISK/hr is perhaps .15 0r .20 US$/hr; not quite prison wages and you are around less honest people.
|
Shinnen
Caldari
Northern Intelligence
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 19:29:00 -
[19]
fit a cloak already...
|
NoNah
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 20:26:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Shinnen
fit a cloak already...
Excellent advice, it makes your ship really useful. Oh wait. =/
Parrots, commence!
Postcount: 647060
|
Cameron Freerunner
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 20:56:00 -
[21]
I don't have to use any CPU mods on my loki. I have to give up two mids for eccm, but thats it. I have good fitting skills though.
You need the dissolution subsystem and the amplification node subsystem and two eccm mods. Don't use drones, they can be scanned. Also, I think there was a bug (fixed in the patch IIRM) that didn't give the bonus correctly if you were using a maintenance array at a POS. I have heard, but never confirmed, that a rat who paints you affects your sig and thus makes you possibly scannable. |
Noran Ferah
Red Sky Morning
|
Posted - 2010.06.08 21:12:00 -
[22]
Confirming that being target painted will allow a prober to get a warpable lock on you.
Also, every T3 is able to do this. Logistics ships have been doing this for a long time.
|
Socio Stan
|
Posted - 2010.06.09 02:34:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Ophelia Ursus
Legion Stuff
Not too many ways to fit a cloaky probe immune booster, but here's another one. Bubble immunity costs you the 4th link:
[Legion, New Setup 1]
Co-Processor II
Co-Processor II
Warded Radar Backup Cluster I
Warded Radar Backup Cluster I
Command Processor I
Command Processor I
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Conjunctive Radar ECCM Scanning Array I
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing
Skirmish Warfare Link - Interdiction Maneuvers
Skirmish Warfare Link - Rapid Deployment
50W Infectious Power System Malfunction
5W Infectious Power System Malfunction
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Legion Propulsion - Interdiction Nullifier
Legion Defensive - Warfare Processor
Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Legion Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Legion Offensive - Covert Reconfiguration
So as long as I check my sensor str after session change, I have no other bugs to worry about? That's good, because I'm already in the habit of doing that. |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
|
Posted - 2010.06.09 17:56:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 09/06/2010 17:56:49
T3, Covert Ops, and Recons can be made un-probe-able.
Example: un-probe-able T3 command ship with 4 gang links:
[Tengu, LottsaLinks]
Warded Gravimetric Backup Cluster I
Warded Gravimetric Backup Cluster I
Co-Processor II
Co-Processor II
Command Processor I
Command Processor I
Command Processor I
Conjunctive Gravimetric ECCM Scanning Array I
Conjunctive Gravimetric ECCM Scanning Array I
Siege Warfare Link - Active Shielding
Siege Warfare Link - Shield Efficiency
Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing
Armored Warfare Link - Damage Control
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Core Probe Launcher I, Sisters Core Scanner Probe I
Tengu Defensive - Warfare Processor
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Offensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Tengu Propulsion - Interdiction Nullifier
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
|
empire hauler
|
Posted - 2010.06.09 18:27:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Drykor
Originally by: empire hauler
Originally by: Arous Drephius
Yes, it's possible. IIRC if your sigRadius/sensorStrength ratio is > 1.08 then you can't be probed.
now in teory thats correct.
in practice there is at least one way (bug/exploit) to probe down even theoretically unprobable ships.
it works well only against those whom the trick know not.
Maybe you should report this bug then..
it has been reported but ccp is 2 busy with other bugs atm to look in. for the time id just recomend using a deep safe in addition to ''unprobable'' as ccp hasnt managed to remove those either.
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |