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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:02:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Kinroi Alari on 10/06/2010 14:05:31
In high sec or access-controlled sov space I prefer using a spaceport (launch pad) to retrieve PI commodities, in no small part because of the storage available at the launch pad and planetary customs office.
But what about low sec worlds near, say, a high sec High Tech Production Plant?
The planetary customs office becomes a predetermined gankfest location, and its proximity precludes using a blockade runner's covert cloak (at least during transfer operations). So spaceports aren't as useful.
In such low sec systems the Command Center's rocket launch function becomes useful (albeit at a 50% increase in export fees). IIRC it launches a can of up to 500m3 and provides a bookmark where the can can be picked up; as I understand it the can cannot be probed. The ships picking up the can, though, are susceptible to probing.
Usually.
While I cannot see using something like a Tengu to pick up PI commodities, I can see using a frigate. In some cases frigates can take advantage of the same thing that makes a strategic cruiser immune to being probed (sensor strength > signature radius in m). And frigate-sized Small Cargohold Optimization I rigs have become surprisingly affordable.
Using tech 1 rigs and tech 2 modules I couldn't get 500m3 in an Imicus or Magnate with my skills while keeping the sensor strength above the signature I wanted (I actually used {signature x 1.08}). But I found that putting three ECCM - Gravimetric II modules on a Kestrel boosted the sensor strength nicely, even without any Gravimetric Backup Arrays. And a single Expanded Cargohold II with two Cargohold Optimization I rigs gave me more than 500m3 of cargo (you can fit two of the expanders and three of those rigs on a Kestrel).
This yields a frigate that can pick up a CC-launched can and that's nigh-impossible to probe; I put one together in Amarr last night for a bit more than 5M or so. It's not immune to ganking -- you still have get through gate camps and pick smart safe spots -- but it does make low sec surprisingly easy to access.
And it even gives a reason to build those stupidly annoying Storage Facilities. ^_^
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Raser Moonstrider
Woopatang
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:10:00 -
[2]
I'm not sure why you would have trouble finding a 30 second window in a low sec system to pick up your stuff from the customs office, unless you happen to be doing it in the home-system of some hostile alliance.
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Grozen
Caldari
Titan Core
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:15:00 -
[3]
Obv you need to move around a bit.Lowsec is nearly not that dangerous if you know how to exploit it.Most of the times there would 3-4ppl in each system and if theres a gate camp it happens rarely and can be evaded with an alt.Nobody is camping the custom offices take it from a guy whos been there cloaked afcourse
knowledge is power |
Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:21:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Raser Moonstrider
I'm not sure why you would have trouble finding a 30 second window in a low sec system to pick up your stuff from the customs office, unless you happen to be doing it in the home-system of some hostile alliance.
I was thinking about it for those areas with semi-active pirate gangs. It's been years since I'd occasionally buzz Rancer for giggles when bored, but I wouldn't try this there -- the good folk near there would eat it in a heartbeat! ^_^
I thought about using it for null sec retrievals from systems where you've planted PI facilities and lost sov to a hostile alliance (or were there wasn't sov, like the NPC null sec areas). A frigate like this is susceptible to bubbles, smart bombs, and smart gate camps (I've seen ruppy pilots that took great pride on insta-popping frigates). But at less than 6M a pop it's still a cheap alternative.
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:24:00 -
[5]
You do not need to be at the office to manage it, only to pick up and drop off. Soon as you are in range, click the button, drag drop and take off. If you approach cloaked, you won't be expected, unless someone is there on the grid and waiting for you, which you should have scanned and made sure no one is, before you warped. You should be able to get away unless you are flying a brick.
Frankly, less dangerous than undocking from a station as you can see what's there before you approach.
The Real Space Initiative - V6 (Forum Link)
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 14:27:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Kinroi Alari on 10/06/2010 14:27:43
Originally by: Grozen
Lowsec is nearly not that dangerous if you know how to exploit it.Most of the times there would 3-4ppl in each system and if theres a gate camp it happens rarely and can be evaded with an alt.
Agreed! Most of my exposure has been with null sec gateways (Placid, Devoid/Derelik), but I do remember running several Duvolle missions in Heydieles before it was connected to the Old Man Star pocket.
But I figure that anything that livens up null sec can't be a bad thing, eh? ^_^
Originally by: Adunh Slavy
You do not need to be at the office to manage it, only to pick up and drop off. Soon as you are in range, click the button, drag drop and take off. If you approach cloaked, you won't be expected, unless someone is there on the grid and waiting for you, which you should have scanned and made sure no one is, before you warped. You should be able to get away unless you are flying a brick.
This is true -- Though I've worked with some fleetmates who are terribly effective at remaining cloaked and then tackle-pouncing. So I tend to expect the same from others. ^_^ (Still doesn't keep me from occasionally losing ships!)
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Thoraxe Rig
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.06.10 16:06:00 -
[7]
Low sec isn't that dangerous. Warp to a safe spot or to a random distance from a celestial, do a quick directional scan, quickly warp to the customs office, pick stuff up, warp out.
If it's camped, transfer stuff to the customs office anyway and come back later.
Simples.
And also, by the sounds of it, you're preparing yourself like you are hanging around out there waiting for the local probe/disco party to start.
It takes less than 10 seconds to get your planet poo out of the cargo container and begin warping out. Unless there's a reason that I'm not seeing that is forcing you to hang about in the same grid for more than 20-30 seconds you don't need to fit your ships for unprobability.
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iP0D
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Posted - 2010.06.10 16:15:00 -
[8]
Blockade runners ...
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Jin Nib
Resplendent Knives
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Posted - 2010.06.10 16:22:00 -
[9]
I've had no trouble operating in low-sec so far. In a simple tier one Badger no less. That said I plan on contracting my finished products to my main who has access to cov-ops ships (bombers make good transports :P) to move em to high-sec.
-Jin Nib
Trading on behalf of Opera Noir since:
2009.03.02 03:53:00
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 17:21:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Thoraxe Rig
And also, by the sounds of it, you're preparing yourself like you are hanging around out there waiting for the local probe/disco party to start.
If I didn't admit that it amused me to do so, I'd be lying. ^_^
(And it gives one time to stock a GSC for later blockade runner or industrial pick up.)
Originally by: iP0D
Blockade runners ...
Reading comprehension and retention? ^_^
Originally by: Jin Nib
I've had no trouble operating in low-sec so far. In a simple tier one Badger no less. That said I plan on contracting my finished products to my main who has access to cov-ops ships (bombers make good transports :P) to move em to high-sec.
I do lurves my blockade runners; I have one character with a Viator and another with a Crane (alas, only the former can carry a packaged cruiser, but I like the latter too). And while I wouldn't presume to speak for him, I remember Seismic Stan of the Freebooters mentioning many, many runs in a ECM-fitted Badger Mk II with a WCS or two.
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.10 19:52:00 -
[11]
It is really easy to drop a 0.5 au combat probe on a planet to see whats around it before warping there.
I like using a DST for in-system moving between the customs offices and the POS. It even has a high-slot for a probe launcher. I wouldn't used it for gate travel though. My Bustard has 35k EHP and a built-in +2 warp stab, and 23k m3 capacity.
You can actually start warping away after reaching the customs office, and put / take your stuff at the same time.
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 19:56:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
You can actually start warping away after reaching the customs office, and put / take your stuff at the same time.
Good tip!
Hmm --
I haven't tried any of the DSTs yet; but that's nice EHP on the Bustard.
(My blockade runners did run a lot higher in cost than the 6M the above frigate cost, of course.)
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.10 20:19:00 -
[13]
If you are really paranoid, and have a second account, you can park a cloaked Falcon way off customs. If someone does manage to attack your cargo ship, jam them and warp both ships away.
My POS-sitter account is my primary researcher and manufacturer. He can't use any weapons not anchored around a POS, but he can pilot the Falcon Recon and use ECM. He's my primary scanner in a Covert Ops Buzard, as my POS is in w-space. The Recon and Covert Ops ship skills go together well too. Lastly he hauls ore with the Bustard to the POS-bound Rorqual when I mine.
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Vilgan Mazran
Aperture Harmonics
K162
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Posted - 2010.06.10 20:33:00 -
[14]
I'm kind of lazy and tend to move freighters around in lowsec fairly often. Dunno what all this stress about people killing you is about :P 1 scout in falcon w/ webs has been fine so far.
Obv blockade runner will be superior for shuttling stuff around though. Wonder how much PI farming it will take to make up losing one cloaky hauler? :P
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Abrazzar
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Posted - 2010.06.10 20:36:00 -
[15]
You could set up two bookmarks at the customs office: One 150+km away on the grid to take a peek and another around 5km away from the customs office so you can warp there and stay cloaked. So then you slow bot withing 2500m of the office, uncloak, pick stuff up and cloak again. If you're quick, you already start warping when you uncloak and pick stuff up just before you enter warp.
But if you are really paranoid, just use the PCC to launch stuff, warp to the can cloaked, uncloak, pick stuff up, can disappears, cloak again. Three seconds and you're gone, cloaked and safe with anyone that may have been able to get a scan result still in warp when you are already gone.
A gatecamp would probably more difficult to avoid and without bubbles, they can only get you when you have ping issues.
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All I want is a better mankind.
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 21:00:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
Obv blockade runner will be superior for shuttling stuff around though. Wonder how much PI farming it will take to make up losing one cloaky hauler? :P
I figured 75-80M for a Viator, 6.5M for a Covert Ops Cloaking Device II, and 8M for two Medium Cargohold Optimization Is. That was why I was thinking about using a frigate rather than one of my Viators. ^_^
Originally by: Abrazzar
But if you are really paranoid, just use the PCC to launch stuff, warp to the can cloaked, uncloak, pick stuff up, can disappears, cloak again. Three seconds and you're gone, cloaked and safe with anyone that may have been able to get a scan result still in warp when you are already gone.
/nod
I was thinking of doing that in a blockade runner when I came up with the frigate idea. ^_^
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.10 22:54:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 10/06/2010 22:59:22
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
I like using a DST for in-system moving between the customs offices and the POS. It even has a high-slot for a probe launcher. I wouldn't used it for gate travel though. My Bustard has 35k EHP and a built-in +2 warp stab, and 23k m3 capacity.
Ack! Home now and I just checked:
* In EFT it's 52k EHP on my Bustard with my skills (Transports 4).
* Cargo is 24,027.5 m3
* It has a Small Tractor Beam I on it. Can't fit an expanded probe launcher.
[Bustard, Basic]
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Damage Control II
Large Shield Extender II
Photon Scattering Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Small Tractor Beam I
Medium Cargohold Optimization I
Medium Cargohold Optimization I
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.10 23:31:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Ack! Home now and I just checked:
Thank you.
I may have to try one of those --
I can think of several places in null sec where that might be better than a blockade runner.
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Jamie Banks
Gallente
Wasted and Still Mining
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Posted - 2010.06.11 04:38:00 -
[19]
Personally I would suggest a bustard with an Improved Cloaking Device and a 10MN MWD can do the Cloak/MWD trick to get out of most camps, and haul a respectable amount of cargo.
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EVE - Everyone vs. Everyone
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.06.11 06:59:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 11/06/2010 07:02:44
Originally by: Jamie Banks
Personally I would suggest a bustard with an Improved Cloaking Device and a 10MN MWD can do the Cloak/MWD trick to get out of most camps, and haul a respectable amount of cargo.
You might have missed the part where I stated above that I would personally never use a Bustard if lowsec gate travel is involved. Even the MWD trick is too slow and risky for my comfort. I only use the Bustard as shown above for hauling within a system.
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Celia Therone
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Posted - 2010.06.11 12:14:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Abrazzar
You could set up two bookmarks at the customs office: One 150+km away on the grid to take a peek and another around 5km away from the customs office so you can warp there and stay cloaked. So then you slow bot withing 2500m of the office, uncloak, pick stuff up and cloak again. If you're quick, you already start warping when you uncloak and pick stuff up just before you enter warp.
It's a good idea to have a safe spot outside of d-scan range because you have to drop your cloak in order to launch stuff from the planet.
Confirming that you can fly a blockade runner to between 2000m (uncloak distance) and 2500m (max customs access distance) from the customs hut whilst maintaining cloak. Then un-cloak, open customs hut, drag your stuff out and re-cloak/warp out.
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Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.11 14:14:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Kinroi Alari on 11/06/2010 14:13:45
Originally by: Celia Therone
Confirming that you can fly a blockade runner to between 2000m (uncloak distance) and 2500m (max customs access distance) from the customs hut whilst maintaining cloak. Then un-cloak, open customs hut, drag your stuff out and re-cloak/warp out.
Excellent --
Like most, that's also the jump gate "sweet spot" range for which I try when camping cloaked. Alas, I am clumsy with cloaks and sometimes screw up, as happened two weeks ago when I had an alliance mate land on me unnoticed -- 5kyscreamx chased my pod for two jumps, and I had to replace yet another covops. ^_^
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
Illectroculus Defined
Chooch Inc.
Twilight Federation
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Posted - 2010.06.11 22:34:00 -
[23]
Cloaky haulers are win in many ways, but just be aware that if you're visiting the customs office then you have to decloak in a very public place and there's no sentry guns around to discourage smaller ships from engaging.
So I'm pretty sure we'll see some enterprising pilots in stealth bombers camping these - no delay between decloaking and locking, plus frigate locking speed makes these exceptionally good for this purpose.
Myself I've been using an amarrian toon in low sec using a Sigil with a full rack of stabs, and of course some healthy paranoia. Could probably add low friction nozzle joints for extra agility and an ECM burst, but if you do get scrammed and can't warp your best bet is to make sure that you drop all your cargo in the customs office so you don't lose it. Sigil is nice because it has 5 lows, and can be flown by an alt with very few skills, and it's cheap, so if you can't GTFO before that SEBO'd Dictor infinipoints you then you've not lost much.
Regardless, I've got a bunch of alts working in empire one is building p3's using low-sec planets and primarly moving them offworld using launch cans. Some P2's are getting exported in larger batches via the customs office, and for those I use a cloaked falcon for extra GTFO support.
Vote Illectro for CSM5! Supporting the New Generation of Eve Players |
Veliria
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Posted - 2010.06.11 22:39:00 -
[24]
I use a Skiff for low-sec PI haulage.
+2 warp stab, cruiser align times, enough PG for a MSE and a high slot for a regular cloak just in case.
Oh, and it can carry about as much as a Blockade Runner at half the price.
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Emporer Norton
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Posted - 2010.06.11 22:55:00 -
[25]
I use a mastodon for moving stuff in lowsec +2 warp strength base omni tank and bonus for shield tank have 2 invulls and a small shield booster on it with a t1 and t2 rig holds just a bit over 30km3
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Grozen
Caldari
Titan Core
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Posted - 2010.06.11 23:38:00 -
[26]
low sec heh go try 0,0 the rates are just a bit different and more dangerous too but the rewards are .
knowledge is power |
Capita List
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Posted - 2010.06.12 00:23:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Capita List on 12/06/2010 00:24:03
Cheap wins every time. Sigil loaded with cheap nanos and stabs is what i've been using. Hurts less when you jump into a dictor, but still gets away from the little big-shots in cheapfit pirate gear.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2010.06.12 00:43:00 -
[28]
1. Don't be lazy.
2. Think creative.
Navitas/Tormentor/Bantam with Frigs 5 could hold ****load of stuff, don't even need expanders.
Burst is probably best to be used, for it can fit some actual tank.
And they are freakin' cheap.
[Burst, Everyday PI hauler]
Inertia Stabilizers I
Photon Scattering Field I
Invulnerability Field I
Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters
Prototype Cloaking Device I
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Thanks CCP for cu |
Illectroculus Defined
Chooch Inc.
Twilight Federation
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Posted - 2010.06.12 02:00:00 -
[29]
Mining frigates are cheap, too cheap to fit a cloaking device on, also worth looking at are the t1 astrometrics frigates - you can fit a whole launch can in a magnate, and it's easy to make them unprobeable without fitting a very expensive cloaking device.
Vote Illectro for CSM5! Supporting the New Generation of Eve Players |
Kinroi Alari
Gallente
Pan Galactic Gargle Blasters
Important Internet Spaceship League
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Posted - 2010.06.16 15:07:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Illectroculus Defined
Mining frigates are cheap, too cheap to fit a cloaking device on, also worth looking at are the t1 astrometrics frigates - you can fit a whole launch can in a magnate, and it's easy to make them unprobeable without fitting a very expensive cloaking device.
Know what's disturbing about a Magnate?
Put three Small Cargo Opt rigs and three Expanded Cargohold IIs on it.
You now have a frigate that hauls 1000m3!
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Nam Sibyllam quidem Cumis ego ipse oculis meis vidi in ampulla pendere... |
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Casmy Blue
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Posted - 2010.06.16 18:06:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Casmy Blue on 16/06/2010 18:21:30
I've never been caught in low-sec, and my blockade runner paid for itself in either two or three low-sec trips to get PI goods, depending on what the market value ultimately ends up being for them.
I always use a scout, I never haul during peak hours, I never carry more than a few million, and I use the absolute cheapest ship I can for what I need (in terms of m3) for that particular run.
I have never felt the need to run a gate camp to get into the systems I needed to. If there's a gate camp, all you need to do is find a 5 second window where they aren't paying attention or come back later in the day. It's not hard.
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Seismic Stan
Greenbeard's Freebooters
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Posted - 2010.06.24 15:27:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Kinroi Alari
I do lurves my blockade runners; I have one character with a Viator and another with a Crane (alas, only the former can carry a packaged cruiser, but I like the latter too). And while I wouldn't presume to speak for him, I remember Seismic Stan of the Freebooters mentioning many, many runs in a ECM-fitted Badger Mk II with a WCS or two.
It was actually a mammoth loaded up with warp core stabilisers, but I learned my lesson - it doesn't work. I solo opportunist pirate caught me undocking from a 'chuck-out' station and although he couldn't warp scramble me, he repeatedly bumped me, preventing me from aligning to warp. I fly a Prowler for all low-sec duties now. It's got far less cargo capacity, but it's got a much higher survivability rate.
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ihcn
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Posted - 2010.06.24 15:42:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Emporer Norton
I use a mastodon for moving stuff in lowsec +2 warp strength base omni tank and bonus for shield tank have 2 invulls and a small shield booster on it with a t1 and t2 rig holds just a bit over 30km3
protip: that shield booster will not help you in the slightest
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Vasundhara
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Posted - 2010.06.24 17:23:00 -
[34]
Here is a link to my recent thread on this topic for more info including blockade runner fittings.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1337122&page=1
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2010.06.24 23:14:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Kinroi Alari
I thought about using it for null sec retrievals from systems where you've planted PI facilities and lost sov to a hostile alliance...
Good luck with that..
Afaik you loose stuff on planets where you got no Sov. |
Pytria Le'Danness
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Posted - 2010.06.26 22:23:00 -
[36]
I have a cheap T1 hauler in my PI system and use this to do customs stuff. Agility fit (prototype cloak if you want to be very paranoid) and if it gets popped - no big loss. All inter-system travel is done by Blockade Runner though.
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