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Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
94
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 18:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Original thread here.
While we continue to wait for the much anticipated POS overhaul, can we please get an easy update?
There are currently 3 versions of the Refinery arrays for POS's with the following stats (that we care about):
Intensive Refining Array Capacity : 200,000 m3 Max refining amount : 75% Refining Time : 10,800 seconds PowerGrid : 750,000 mw CPU : 4,000 tf
Medium Intensive Refining Array Capacity : 25,000 m3 Max refining amount : 75% Refining Time : 5,400 seconds PowerGrid : 375,000 mw CPU : 2,000 tf
Refining Array Capacity : 40,000 m3 Max refining amount : 35% Refining Time : 3,600 seconds PowerGrid : 100,000 mw CPU : 700 tf
Given the history of these arrays, the amount of Ore/Ice that can be mined by even the smallest of groups and it can be easily seen why they don't see more usage.
Will this circumvent Rorqual compression? No Will this circumvent players avoiding Outpost refining? No Will this help industrialists that have limited or no Outpost access? Yes
The ideas behind these "suggested" updates are to allow these arrays to be used by POS owners that do not have access to the obviously more "efficient" Outposts or NPC stations by:
1. Lowering CPU & PG needs 2. Significantly reducing the time to refine 3. Increasing refining capacity 4. Increasing "max" refining amount 5. Keep Ice refining as-is 6. Refine Ore at a base 40% with skills (use the NPC station formula)
> > > NEW Proposed Stats < < <
Intensive Refining Array Capacity : 2,800,000 m3 BASE refining amount : 40% Refining Time : 3,600 seconds PowerGrid : 400,000 mw CPU : 2,000 tf
Medium Intensive Refining Array Capacity : 1,400,000 m3 BASE refining amount : 40% Refining Time : 1,800 seconds PowerGrid : 200,000 mw CPU : 1,000 tf
Refining Array Capacity : 400,000 m3 BASE refining amount : 40% Refining Time : 900 seconds PowerGrid : 100,000 mw CPU : 500 tf
Suggestions and constructive feedback welcomed. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
mxzf
Blackened Skies
1948
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 19:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cross-posting, posting multiple copies of the same thread in different forums, is against the forum rules.
Also, this isn't the way to get in touch with the CSM as you said you were going to try to do in your other thread. If you want to get in touch with them, you just mail them directly. |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
94
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 19:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
mxzf wrote:Cross-posting, posting multiple copies of the same thread in different forums, is against the forum rules.
Also, this isn't the way to get in touch with the CSM as you said you were going to try to do in your other thread. If you want to get in touch with them, you just mail them directly. Per cross posting, yes, I know. I requested the other thread be locked (was just slow getting there).
As far as getting in touch with CSM, I just dug that information up as well a few minutes ago. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
117
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Posted - 2012.07.17 22:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
I thought I posted this in the previous thread, but i guess it got eaten.
This change, as you propose it would change minmatar stations from "most popular in new eden by an order of magnitude" to "only ever used for scrapmetal reprocessing and mineral compression" Not that this is necessarily a bad thing, but it would also make basically all of the refinery upgrades to all of the stations useless.
35% gives you perfect refine with perfect skills and the 4% implant 40% means you dont need either the specialization skill to 5 OR you dont need the implant for perfect refine.
What I would propose would be a 20% base to basic refinery arrays and a 30% base to intensive arrays.
This means that you could get 81.88% yield out of a basic refinery array with perfect skills (85.88% with the implant) Intensive arrays would give a yield of 91.88% (95.88% with the implant)
These numbers would still basically make all refinery upgrades to stations except minmatar ones obsolete, but matari stations would still be better because it is what they're specialized in.
I just dont think you should be able to get 100% refine without a station. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
1631
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 22:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
Outposts offer far more convenience than a POS. 100% refining at a POS that still takes half an hour is hardly convenient. Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
94
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 23:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
Sigras wrote:This change, as you propose it would change minmatar stations from "most popular in new eden by an order of magnitude" to "only ever used for scrapmetal reprocessing and mineral compression" Not that this is necessarily a bad thing, but it would also make basically all of the refinery upgrades to all of the stations useless. Not true. Remember that in an Outpost, you get "instant refine" of all types of stuff. At a POS, it's going to take a you 15, 30 or 60 minutes - for each type of Ore you want to refine - and you can only refine Ore, in limited quantities, nothing else.
With enough Ore, it could potentially take you up to 8 HOURS, or more, to refine it all. Unless you have no other choice, players will still use a Station.
Sigras wrote:35% gives you perfect refine with perfect skills and the 4% implant 40% means you dont need either the specialization skill to 5 OR you dont need the implant for perfect refine.
What I would propose would be a 20% base to basic refinery arrays and a 30% base to intensive arrays.
This means that you could get 81.88% yield out of a basic refinery array with perfect skills (85.88% with the implant) Intensive arrays would give a yield of 91.88% (95.88% with the implant)
These numbers would still basically make all refinery upgrades to stations except minmatar ones obsolete, but matari stations would still be better because it is what they're specialized in.
I just dont think you should be able to get 100% refine without a station. Given the time it takes to refine any sizeable amount of a single Ore type, you should be able to get 100% refine - if you use the implant - at a POS. I'll update the original post to use a 35% base refine rate.
Again, this will have no direct impact on stations as the "instant refine" will always win over the time it takes to grind through a ton of Ore.
Also, Alliances that want to dictate that these arrays are not allowed are certainly free to do so which would further lessen any potential impact to stations. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
118
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 08:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
I guess i can agree on the annoyance of having to wait for your refining to be done; living in a wormhole for a few months will teach you how annoying that is.
That being said, i do question the other numbers you put out there, the question I have is why would anyone use the medium intensive refining array when they could just use two refining arrays and get more ore processed faster with more granulation for the same CPU/PG cost.
The same goes for the intensive refining array
Either the efficiency should suffer, or it should take more time or something. |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
2049
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 13:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck). CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
95
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 18:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
Sigras wrote:I guess i can agree on the annoyance of having to wait for your refining to be done; living in a wormhole for a few months will teach you how annoying that is.
That being said, i do question the other numbers you put out there, the question I have is why would anyone use the medium intensive refining array when they could just use two refining arrays and get more ore processed faster with more granulation for the same CPU/PG cost.
The same goes for the intensive refining array
Either the efficiency should suffer, or it should take more time or something. Suggestions then on numbers, please?
The rough idea I had was to scale, but you are correct, that I didn't anticipate multiple arrays being in use - and I should have expected this.
Capacity - I don't think this should change much, or should just scale on size (e.g. S, M, L). The idea here is to be able to refine a reasonable amount of Ore that is being mined by a decent sized group (or to be able to save it up & refine later).
CPU / PG - I deliberatly scaled these. Sure you can put multiple Intensive Arrays on a tower, but you'll end up with no CPU/PG for defenses, so it would be a trade-off.
Efficiency - Addressed below.
Two step wrote:A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck). Yes, these could be viewed as large changes. I think that when you consider the usage of these structures, this might be all that is needed to bring them back into the realm of the "used".
The Arrays do take your skills into account - it's just that with perfect, or close to perfect, refining skills, the array is capped at a 75% yield. So, yes, somewhere in the equations, skills are used. If you capped it at say 90% pr 95% with no skills needed, then it would just be abused by day old toons.
I know it's possibly a DOA subject, given that a complete(?) POS update is coming. However, CCP did make the change to allow us to rename all the POS modules - granted, that was because of the crazy UI implementation - but it can be done.
As long as these changes can be kept to just adjusting the numbers (e.g. capacity / cpu / pg / refining % cap) and not functionality changes requiring a huge time investment, then they really are 15 minutes stat updates once the updated numbers have been decided upon.
To address the efficiency issue from above with the skills - if you were to just give the arrays a 100% cap - then your skills would truely decide the output and you wouldn't have to touch the forumula (e.g. - output = [array cap] * [reprocessing formula output]).
Thanks for the input. I'm adjusting the OP for refining yield (assuming the formula really is skill based). HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
602
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 19:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
sort of agree with Two Step here. Those are deceptively large changes to a feature which will begin a complete rewritte in less than a year. I don't see a pressing crisis caused by smaller mining arrays being underutilized compared to the largest model that would warrent CCP taking dev time out of existing projects, including said POS revamp. Arydanika:-á"Alekseyev Karrde: mercenary of my heart."-á
CSM7 rep, CSM 4 vet www.noirmercs.com Noir. Academy now recruiting |
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Sigras
Conglomo IMPERIAL LEGI0N
119
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 19:27:00 -
[11] - Quote
IIRC the formula is
(0.375 * (1 + refining * 0.02) * (1 + RefineryEfficiency * 0.04) * (1 + ProcessingSpecialization * 0.05)) + RefineryBase)
so with perfect skills you'd get a 61.875% yield with a 0% refinery.
but the OP is correct, refineries already do take into account your skills, so that isnt much of a change.
I also understand that CCP is already rewriting POSs and the change will be out SOON^tm but this would take next to 0 time as it would just be changing two variables; that being said, i figured AHARM would be all about wanting a better refinery out in WH space. |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
95
|
Posted - 2012.07.18 19:53:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sigras wrote:IIRC the formula is
(0.375 * (1 + refining * 0.02) * (1 + RefineryEfficiency * 0.04) * (1 + ProcessingSpecialization * 0.05)) + RefineryBase)
so with perfect skills you'd get a 61.875% yield with a 0% refinery.
but the OP is correct, refineries already do take into account your skills, so that isnt much of a change.
I also understand that CCP is already rewriting POSs and the change will be out SOON^tm but this would take next to 0 time as it would just be changing two variables; that being said, i figured AHARM would be all about wanting a better refinery out in WH space. Yes, the formula is correct (I should have posted it sooner :) - thanks!
In the short term, this would be a bigger benefit to WH dwellers - at a minimum, it would certainly cut down on logistics. And yes, I have been a part of those "let's help move multiple cap ship quantities of ore into the WH to build with" fleets. Very time consuming.
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:sort of agree with Two Step here. Those are deceptively large changes to a feature which will begin a complete rewritte in less than a year. I don't see a pressing crisis caused by smaller mining arrays being underutilized compared to the largest model that would warrent CCP taking dev time out of existing projects, including said POS revamp. The problem with starting the complete rewrite "in less than a year" is that any potentially finished product is at least a year away with decent testing -- and we've already been pulling the "dead horse" along for a very long time.
That said, this is a simple update with a high return and near zero effort (like renaming the POS structures). While it is industrial-based, it is thowing a bone to the POS owners and, in effect, saying, "we feel your pain, heres an update that we can help you out with now as we integrate this into the new system."
All that needs to be agreed upon are the numbers - then HROLT & AHARM can anchor a few more of these :) HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
95
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 14:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
Looking for more support for the day. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Bunyip
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
This sounds like a reasonable change, meaning that a character will have to have max skills and implants in order to get full refine, when they can achieve that easily on outposts and NPC stations. POSes do need some love, and this is a simple change to allow players to make better use of these facilities.
Supported. |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
100
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 17:58:00 -
[15] - Quote
Bunyip wrote:This sounds like a reasonable change, meaning that a character will have to have max skills and implants in order to get full refine, when they can achieve that easily on outposts and NPC stations. POSes do need some love, and this is a simple change to allow players to make better use of these facilities.
Supported.
Thanks!
I do look forward to the upcoming POS changes - but this simple fix helps out the industrial types to be more self-sufficient in doing alliance / corp production. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
102
|
Posted - 2012.07.27 05:24:00 -
[16] - Quote
Yup... Still need an update. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression -á- The only way to go! |
Ellariona
The Elysian Agoge Elysian Empire
6
|
Posted - 2012.07.27 06:17:00 -
[17] - Quote
Even an increased m-¦/run on the refineries would be good enough and could be done by the devs in less than no time. |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
130
|
Posted - 2012.08.22 16:23:00 -
[18] - Quote
Keeping this at the top - not that the CSM or CCP really cares given the topics & replies in other related & unrelated threads. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression - The only way to go! |
Alx Warlord
SUPERNOVA SOCIETY Tribal Conclave
142
|
Posted - 2012.08.22 23:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
Two step wrote:A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck).
CCP could change the mechanism of the refinery, giving it Job Slots instead of the refine button... It would be easier to code and make skills relevant...
Also take a look at this. and say what you think, it is about the new pos system....
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=143764 |
Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
356
|
Posted - 2012.08.24 09:19:00 -
[20] - Quote
This really needs to be done, people constantly complaining for YEARS that industrialists are risk averse and won't go to 0.0.
Unfortunately 25% flat out nerf on their main in-game activity might also have something to do with it ? CSM7 Skype Leak
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Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
356
|
Posted - 2012.08.24 09:25:00 -
[21] - Quote
Alx Warlord wrote:Two step wrote:A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck). For the new overhaul CCP could change the mechanism of the refinery, giving it Job Slots instead of the refine button... It would be easier to code and make skills relevant... Also, if CCP wants to make things better for POS use, and encourage player to have individual POSes or join corporations, they can set a fix % of the "We Take" that can't be reduced with standing ... or rise the actual "We Take" on npc stations. These way people would use POS to refine... Also take a look at this. and say what you think, it is about the new pos system.... I would really appreciate if someone from CSM could spend a couple of minutes in it... https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=143764
Great minds, I was just bringing this up in the industry forum the other day. If they want destructible stations, more than 1 station per system, modular pos, pos planted anywhere - why not just have 1 structure instead of the 2. Get rid of stations and tie all the station services into the POS - awesome idea - because I had the same one
It would allow people to run a POS as a profession also. Rent offices, try and build systems to accomodate office renters, fill a market for pirates who live there, or simply a refinery pos for your own use.
Really glad I wasn't the only one to come up with this idea, I was about to ****-can it ;)
CSM7 Skype Leak
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Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
356
|
Posted - 2012.08.24 09:29:00 -
[22] - Quote
Two step wrote:A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck).
I would like to point out at this time, that you guys aren't put into the CSM to bring up ideas that have the most support necessarily.
Many times ideas come up that the universally ignorant peanut gallery will not understand, don't get and don't appreciate.
You guys are voted in on your experience, as such I think with some of these things you should be making the most informed decisions available to you in the CSM as a whole.
This IS a good idea. It would open up gameplay that to date has been closed to people who hold sov, and even then sometimes alliances only allow stations to be run by the holding corp. It is a tiny percentage of people.
If you are going to redo POS, then don't do a half assed job of it. Think a little more deeply that just "what they look like".
Cosmetic changes and changes that are "popular" are nice and all, but not necessarily the best or most relevant changes that the game could use.
CSM7 Skype Leak
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Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
551
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Posted - 2012.08.24 11:18:00 -
[23] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Two step wrote:A couple of points:
1) You are asking for some fairly major changes here (having refining arrays take skills into account is hard, because they aren't really tied to a single person). 2) You are asking for changes in an area that CCP has said will be re-written, so any changes would probably be thrown out
If you an get a bunch more support in here, we can bring it up, but I suspect most people would rather CCP spend their time on the POS overhaul instead of changes to POS refineries that few people use (yes, partly because they suck). I would like to point out at this time, that you guys aren't put into the CSM to bring up ideas that have the most support necessarily. Many times ideas come up that the universally ignorant peanut gallery will not understand, don't get and don't appreciate. You guys are voted in on your experience, as such I think with some of these things you should be making the most informed decisions available to you in the CSM as a whole - no matter what some small percentage of forum trolls might say. This IS a good idea. It would open up gameplay that to date has been closed to people who don't hold sov, and even then sometimes alliances only allow stations to be run by the holding corp. It is a tiny percentage of people. If you are going to redo POS, then don't do a half assed job of it. Think a little more deeply that just "what they look like". Cosmetic changes and changes that are "popular" are nice and all, but not necessarily the best or most relevant changes that the game could use. Without being able to look at the code I cannot say exactly how hard the refining by person would be but if you just tied it to the current station refining algorithm and just set the rep to 10 or 5 depending on the persons standing to the POS owner and this would automatically tie in the persons skills like the current refine does, if the output is to be delayed just route it to a sub procedure.
Anyway I like the idea of Player owned Stations of modular design but instead of stuffing around and worrying about wether players will make huge space dongs why not just make a system where you can choose a slot on 1 of the 6 faces of the existing structure. This would also allow multiple stations to tie in the power and CPU available while increasing the costs. Personally I don't care about pretty I want working. Hell if it looks like a borg cube at least it would be a borg cube that works.
Same goes for defense I would like to loose say CPU to add extra armor to the POS and be able to fit gun modules within the pos (this is actually harder as they would need to be part of the structure while able to be targeted individually, or for an easier fix just let them sit off the pos like station guns do atm)
Also I think the size you can build should be truly modular having no baring on whether you are a person, corp or alliance. You should be able to build as big as you want to pay for.
Edit: as to the mean time frankly not fussed. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
356
|
Posted - 2012.08.24 11:25:00 -
[24] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote: Personally I don't care about pretty I want working.
You had me at hello.
This is the same as many of the people who use POS for industry.
It's that age old issue of graphics vs. gameplay... EvE tries to say it has great gameplay, but still we're sitting in the dark ages of early eve gameplay when it comes to many of these systems.
Changing the graphics a bit, and perhaps no shields, or whatever the hell - and not changing the gameplay surrounding these structures is kind of looking at a deep subject but only dealing with it in a shallow way.
If CCP are going to make the time to redo these structures, god only knows when the NEXT iteration of POS will be - 10 more years ?
Can we get some reasonable in-depth gameplay changes before then ?
Corp level mineral taxation, would require it for one.
This is exactly why we need a full analysis by CCP/CSM on the various corporation managements for the various kinds of corps. They all need the proper tools.
Instead of that we debate pos shields and graphical changes.
In reply we get the whole "well if this entirely logical argument can get some support we might consider it". CSM7 Skype Leak
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Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.30 21:47:00 -
[25] - Quote
Keep the likes and responses .. Let's get this easy one updated! HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression - The only way to go! |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
156
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Posted - 2012.10.10 16:26:00 -
[26] - Quote
We keep looking for an easy update..... HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression - The only way to go! |
LuckyQuarter
Lucky Galactic Expeditions
6
|
Posted - 2012.10.20 14:20:00 -
[27] - Quote
As a solo low-sec miner living out of a POS with a medium intensive refining array, I'd really like to see some major changes with the refineries and your proposal addresses many of them.
However: - I think the revised capacity values for all 3 types is too large....especially for low sec, we're constantly having to return to the pos to avoid being ganked so we can't mine for more than 1hr at a time, and frequently no more than 15-30 minutes. I always drop off new ore at the refinery whenever I stop by. ...so I'd really appreciate it if there was a refinery with near 100% efficiency targeted at processing no more than 100K every 30 minutes. This help make me think the extra risks I'm taking operating in low-sec are being rewarded. - Another major issue is that in order to keep safe in lowsec, I need a large tower, and to pay for the large tower, I have to moon mine and moon mining takes up a ton of cpu..the moon harvestors/silos/reactors are constantly competing for available cpu with the refinery. If we're updating the refineries, let's pay careful attention to how it might impact the 'industrial' player in lowsec and minimizing cpu is extremely helpful. I don't mind other tradeoffs to make that work...such as the reduced ore capacity to no more than 100K or 30 minute cycles rather than 15 minute. - Lastly, there needs to be some way to reprocess in a pos....my system might get camped and I may need to tear down some existing things to manufacture new ships/etc. Or, while I'm mining I kill rats but have no way to reprocess the rat loot w/o trying to go through camps to the nearest station. I'm fine if the reprocessing isn't as efficient as a station, make 10-20% less...but I would hope that we could include scrapmetal reprocessing in with an update to the pos refineries. Even if it is only usable on the smallest one and has a small penalty.
Thanks.
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Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
171
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Posted - 2012.11.27 17:41:00 -
[28] - Quote
Keeping this on the radar. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression - The only way to go! |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
274
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 20:20:00 -
[29] - Quote
Fully supported. I think this would be great. The only reason POS refineries are not used is the 75% hard cap. Some wormhole corps still use them as shipping raw ore out and minerals in is more hassle than losing 25%.
Even if nothing was done but removing the hard cap it would make a huge difference. The excessively small batches would still make them a pain to use, but at least you would not be losing 25% of your minerals.
I have used POS refineries in the past for ICE as they do refine ICE at 100%. I can refine at a 35% refinery with zero waste on two of my characters. If I could refine at a POS even if hard capped at 95% I would. A slight loss is worth it on some remote ops. But 25% has made this module almost unusable.
You can say all you want that why should CCP spend time changing a module that is not used. But in fact it the need for this change is the reason it is not used. I am sure it would not be a waste of time, I expect even with the new POS mechanics, if we ever see them, many existing POS modules will be incorporated with minimal changes. This could be one of those modules. |
Infinite Force
Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance
179
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Posted - 2012.12.10 23:53:00 -
[30] - Quote
More to keep this on the radar. HROLT CEO Live Free; Die Proud
Hammer Mineral Compression - The only way to go! |
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