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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 10:54:00 -
[1]
When I started playing, I thought the game was developed logically. It was cleverly derived into 3 global areas, where every kind of people can have their fun: 1. High security - for cowards (like myself). 2. Low security - for maniacs and pirates. 3. Null - for the great gang wars. And it appears that the high security zone has no security at all. Pirates just sacrifice their ships gladly, getting the insurance which compensates their loss from CONCORD almost completely and grabbing the loot from the wreck of a legal citizen who was flying right in the heart of Empire! Something should be done to allow normal people fly safe in the High Security (SIC!) areas. 1. All insurance should be void for any ship killed by CONCORD. No sane insurance company would ever insure criminals from being busted by police forces. 2. The wreck of the ship killed in pvp (that considers High Security areas only) should be immediately sealed by CONCORD so no one else can take the loot except the legal owner. Or at least make the ship completely destroyed with all its parts and loot, if that ship had been PVP attacked and killed in hi-secs. So the piracy in hi-secs will become unprofitable, and everyone will be able to play normally.
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Grunanca
Final Agony B A N E
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Posted - 2010.07.28 11:20:00 -
[2]
There are 12376129438646 other games out there that are just like you describe. How about you start to play one of these, instead of trying to ruin this one game so many people liked for more than a few weeks/months. Remember you choose what game you play, so stop trying to ruin it for the people that actually enjoys the game as it is.
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 11:34:00 -
[3]
What's ruining the game? If you want to be a pirate - low secs are a real paradise for you. Cowards choose high secs for safety, risc kills fun for us. Everyone goes where it suits him. What's wrong with it?
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Galvatine
Caldari Dark Materials
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Posted - 2010.07.28 12:16:00 -
[4]
You assuming high sec is supposed to be 100% safe.
Newsflash! It isn't
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DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
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Posted - 2010.07.28 13:47:00 -
[5]
Then it isn't really high security, just a glorified version of low security.
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Ya Huei
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Posted - 2010.07.28 15:12:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Messenger001 What's ruining the game? If you want to be a pirate - low secs are a real paradise for you. Cowards choose high secs for safety, risc kills fun for us. Everyone goes where it suits him. What's wrong with it?
Doesn't it make sense that a pirate will go where it's prey is ? Hardly anything worth looting ventures into lowsec, so u can hardly call it "paradise" for pirates.
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Nestor Laurenitis
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
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Posted - 2010.07.28 15:12:00 -
[7]
Messenger,
In highsec, by design, you are 'safer' not 'safe'. The game is design to punish carelessness even in 'safer' areas, so you either need to be diligent or you need to come to grips with the price of being lazy.
You are operating from the presumption that Hisec is supposed to be safe. It's a fundamental misunderstanding on your part.
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 15:58:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Nestor Laurenitis Messenger,
In highsec, by design, you are 'safer' not 'safe'. The game is design to punish carelessness even in 'safer' areas, so you either need to be diligent or you need to come to grips with the price of being lazy.
You are operating from the presumption that Hisec is supposed to be safe. It's a fundamental misunderstanding on your part.
What's the point in game if your ship got locked and ripped when you're doing mission in hi-secs? Where is 'laziness' and 'misunderstanding' here? I've never ever did a risky things. Never taken a possibly dangerous mission, never responded on PVP provocations, and never ever will go lowsecs. And still there's a risk to die for nothing. It's just a game's bug's exploiting getting insured from COPS. The biggest nonsence one can hardly imagine. More absurd thing than insurance from suicide even. And if there is a High Security area it's really presumed to have some security at all. Now it's got nothing like that. Pirates can kill everyone they wish, get an insane profit, and receive no real punishment for that.
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Seith Silverstein
Something Rotten
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:24:00 -
[9]
I want to play this game by jumping my ships into a "secure" area where people are completely disillusioned to how the game actually works. I then want to quickly and easily kill these people, take the very expensive loot from their ships, and drink their tears. I want to do this whenever I want, with little to no penalty, besides not being able to move goods in high-sec, not being able to buy things in high-sec, not being able to survive gate gun agression in fun ships while fighting in low-sec, having to make alts to make money in highsec to fuel my PvP obsessions. No penalties. None there.
Who are you to tell me I can't play this game the way I want to?
Welcome to the Sandbox.
Originally by: CCP Soundwave I am literally the internet
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:47:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Seith Silverstein I want to play this game by jumping my ships into a "secure" area where people are completely disillusioned to how the game actually works. I then want to quickly and easily kill these people, take the very expensive loot from their ships, and drink their tears. I want to do this whenever I want, with little to no penalty, besides not being able to move goods in high-sec, not being able to buy things in high-sec, not being able to survive gate gun agression in fun ships while fighting in low-sec, having to make alts to make money in highsec to fuel my PvP obsessions. No penalties. None there.
Who are you to tell me I can't play this game the way I want to?
Welcome to the Sandbox.
It sounds like: 'I want to come into your house whenever I wish, r##e your wife, kill your children and force you to eat their meat. And there should be NO PENALTY for that. NO PENALTY at all!!! Who are you to tell me how to enjoy myself?!!'
Every one [censored] like you ruins game for at least ten normal people a day. Hope the developers would take that in mind.
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:53:00 -
[11]
Edited by: De''Veldrin on 28/07/2010 16:53:35
Originally by: Messenger001
Originally by: Seith Silverstein I want to play this game by jumping my ships into a "secure" area where people are completely disillusioned to how the game actually works. I then want to quickly and easily kill these people, take the very expensive loot from their ships, and drink their tears. I want to do this whenever I want, with little to no penalty, besides not being able to move goods in high-sec, not being able to buy things in high-sec, not being able to survive gate gun agression in fun ships while fighting in low-sec, having to make alts to make money in highsec to fuel my PvP obsessions. No penalties. None there.
Who are you to tell me I can't play this game the way I want to?
Welcome to the Sandbox.
It sounds like: 'I want to come into your house whenever I wish, r##e your wife, kill your children and force you to eat their meat. And there should be NO PENALTY for that. NO PENALTY at all!!! Who are you to tell me how to enjoy myself?!!'
Every one [censored] like you ruins game for at least ten normal people a day. Hope the developers would take that in mind.
No, it sounds like you take the game (look up the definition) way to seriously, and probably need to take a break from your internet spaceship pixels for a while. The fact that you can even compare a game to **** and murder indicates just how twisted and warped your sense of reality is.
Alternatively, you're a troll. In which case, +1 internets to you for getting people to believe that load of horsecrap in the OP. --Vel
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Seith Silverstein
Something Rotten
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:59:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Messenger001
Originally by: Seith Silverstein I want to play this game by jumping my ships into a "secure" area where people are completely disillusioned to how the game actually works. I then want to quickly and easily kill these people, take the very expensive loot from their ships, and drink their tears. I want to do this whenever I want, with little to no penalty, besides not being able to move goods in high-sec, not being able to buy things in high-sec, not being able to survive gate gun agression in fun ships while fighting in low-sec, having to make alts to make money in highsec to fuel my PvP obsessions. No penalties. None there.
Who are you to tell me I can't play this game the way I want to?
Welcome to the Sandbox.
It sounds like: 'I want to come into your house whenever I wish, r##e your wife, kill your children and force you to eat their meat. And there should be NO PENALTY for that. NO PENALTY at all!!! Who are you to tell me how to enjoy myself?!!'
Every one [censored] like you ruins game for at least ten normal people a day. Hope the developers would take that in mind.
My desire to do those things has nothing to do with my desire to gank your mission ship. Please keep on topic. We get our penalites for suicide ganking, and believe it or not it does make the game more difficult to be sitting at -10 security status. On top of it all, we have to read DOZENS and DOZENS of whiney "WHY ISN'T CAREBEAR LAND PERFECTLY SAFE ALL THE TIME BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!" posts every day. Please, think of the pirates.
Originally by: CCP Soundwave I am literally the internet
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:06:00 -
[13]
Originally by: De'Veldrin Edited by: De''Veldrin on 28/07/2010 16:53:35 No, it sounds like you take the game (look up the definition) way to seriously
The game takes real time, real effort and real money. And I'd gladly, without any scent of remorse, murder anyone who'd ruined my REAL effort. But there is 1(one) thing why I'll never do anything like that. Know what? THE PENALTIES. If I murder someone - I'll met the direst consequences, go to jail and ruin my own life. Well, that's just what I'm talking about: crimes should be punished harshly. At least, in the civilized part of the world.
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Seith Silverstein We get our penalites for suicide ganking, and believe it or not it does make the game more difficult to be sitting at -10 security status. Please, think of the pirates.
Those penalties are the results of your own crimes exclusively. People doesnt force you to be a pirate, so why should they suffer for your enjoyment?
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Seith Silverstein
Something Rotten
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:20:00 -
[15]
And still, all I hear is:
BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWW!
I will concede that, even though I love suicide ganking, insurance payout on CONCORD kills is a little ****ed up. Everything else is positively silly. Just because you don't understand game mechanics doesn't mean you get to be safe and cuddly. Every time you press "connect" on your login screen, you're consenting to at least some form of PvP. When you press "undock" that form of PvP is getting your ship blown up. CCP knows this happens. CCP likes that this happens. CCP endorses these actions. The reason it works this way is because *it's the way CCP wants it to work*. Don't like it?
Hello Kitty Online is that way ----->
Harden the **** Up
Originally by: CCP Soundwave I am literally the internet
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Magnus Orin
Minmatar United Systems Navy Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:25:00 -
[16]
You consent to pvp when you log in.
If you don't like that, or agree with it, I'd suggest you find a new game to play.
Your tears will not change this. Sarcasm - Because i'm too far away to strangle you. |
Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:45:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Seith Silverstein
I will concede that, even though I love suicide ganking, insurance payout on CONCORD kills is a little ****ed up.
At least some sence from you! Unexpected, really.
Quote: Everything else is positively silly. Just because you don't understand game mechanics doesn't mean you get to be safe and cuddly.
Please, explain me silly one thing about game mechanics I dont understand at all. How can I prevent being suicide ganked right in the middle of the mission? Or everyone should fly exclusively in Tengu with a full antiscan fit?
Quote:
Every time you press "connect" on your login screen, you're consenting to at least some form of PvP. When you press "undock" that form of PvP is getting your ship blown up.
There IS a hell lot of PVP areas. And a big red warning in front of them. When a player jumps there - he seals his own death sentence, and that is his own choise for PVP.
Quote: CCP knows this happens. CCP likes that this happens. CCP endorses these actions. The reason it works this way is because *it's the way CCP wants it to work*.
If CCP greatly desires to sacrifice tons of normal people to a handful of maniacal perverts - that's the best way. |
eliminator2
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:52:00 -
[18]
where there is reward there is risk that is what ccp go by if not rats killing you then a player will eventually kill you
eve is not safe no where in eve is safe everyone is a target everyone is prey -----------------------------------------------
I met Eliminator1..... I chewed it up, and spat it out. Now, he is my minion.
I kill miners and mission runners people say, I call them target pra |
Seith Silverstein
Something Rotten
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Posted - 2010.07.28 18:00:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Messenger001 ...BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW... If CCP greatly desires to sacrifice tons of normal people to a handful of maniacal perverts - that's the best way.
Confirming I'm a maniacal pervert who ****s wives, burns houses and eats babies.
NOMNOMNOM.
It's like this forum isn't even moderated. You can't even get threads locked for trolling anymore!
Originally by: CCP Soundwave I am literally the internet
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Anna Lifera
Gallente Imperial Legion of Amarr HAWK Alliance
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Posted - 2010.07.28 18:04:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Messenger001
At least some sence from you! Unexpected, really.
piracy is piracy, even in low sec, which is also insured.
Originally by: Messenger001
Please, explain me silly one thing about game mechanics I dont understand at all. How can I prevent being suicide ganked right in the middle of the mission? Or everyone should fly exclusively in Tengu with a full antiscan fit?
surviving/avoiding a suicide gank in a missioning ship requires u to not be mentally slow or fail fitted (no eccm subsystem t3 required), both of which apparently fits u.
Originally by: Messenger001
There IS a hell lot of PVP areas. And a big red warning in front of them. When a player jumps there - he seals his own death sentence, and that is his own choise for PVP.
this is not world of warcraft, where u have battlegrounds and sanctuaries. u want that, go back to wow.
Originally by: Messenger001
If CCP greatly desires to sacrifice tons of normal people to a handful of maniacal perverts - that's the best way.
step back from the keyboard, look around u, then take a deep breath. try it. --- LOLOLOL If anything, lvl4s require LESS effort then Mining!... At least in mining you have to check every 4 minutes to move the ore to the can. You're an idiot. - Jerid Verges |
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.07.28 18:23:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Messenger001
Originally by: De'Veldrin Edited by: De''Veldrin on 28/07/2010 16:53:35 No, it sounds like you take the game (look up the definition) way to seriously
The game takes real time, real effort and real money. And I'd gladly, without any scent of remorse, murder anyone who'd ruined my REAL effort. But there is 1(one) thing why I'll never do anything like that. Know what? THE PENALTIES. If I murder someone - I'll met the direst consequences, go to jail and ruin my own life. Well, that's just what I'm talking about: crimes should be punished harshly. At least, in the civilized part of the world.
So you're willing to kill the guy who beats you out of a promotion at work, but you won't because you might get caught and go to jail.
And yet you say the pirates in Eve are the ones with the problems. I'm not sure there's a pill to cure what ails you.
Also, I'm now convinced you're trolling, because that's too damned crazy to be true. --Vel
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Ninetails o'Cat
League of Super Evil
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:18:00 -
[22]
Originally by: De'Veldrin
Originally by: Messenger001
Originally by: De'Veldrin Edited by: De''Veldrin on 28/07/2010 16:53:35 No, it sounds like you take the game (look up the definition) way to seriously
The game takes real time, real effort and real money. And I'd gladly, without any scent of remorse, murder anyone who'd ruined my REAL effort. But there is 1(one) thing why I'll never do anything like that. Know what? THE PENALTIES. If I murder someone - I'll met the direst consequences, go to jail and ruin my own life. Well, that's just what I'm talking about: crimes should be punished harshly. At least, in the civilized part of the world.
So you're willing to kill the guy who beats you out of a promotion at work, but you won't because you might get caught and go to jail.
And yet you say the pirates in Eve are the ones with the problems. I'm not sure there's a pill to cure what ails you.
Also, I'm now convinced you're trolling, because that's too damned crazy to be true.
Just to add to what De'Veldrin said:
You're claiming that this ruins your fun, when you're suggesting that you'd KILL someone for ruining your fun? Doesn't just perhaps cross your mind as ruining their fun just a little?
And also, EVE isn't a civilised part of the world. So in conclusion:
GTFOBTWOW troll.
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Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:22:00 -
[23]
Originally by: De'Veldrin
So you're willing to kill the guy who beats you out of a promotion at work, but you won't because you might get caught and go to jail.
No way. If he beats me in work - it just mean's he's better in work. Honest and simple. But if he'd, say, stolen my wallet - that's way another story... for that I could kill with no doubt. But wont. I'm a very law-abiding citizen.
Quote: And yet you say the pirates in Eve are the ones with the problems. I'm not sure there's a pill to cure what ails you.
No one IRL or anywhere I've been in games couldnt say I treated him unfairly.
It's all about rules. If a person follows certain rules (say, dont fly in low secs, dont respond on PVP provocations, etc) he shouldnt possibly got killed. Now the game has no rules and no one nowhere in no way can prevent himself from being suicide ganked. By the way, I've never been ganked on mis (although been provoked many times - but that doesnt count), but know many of such an instances. If I'd lose my ship - I'll have to quit, it's too expensive. And I dont want to quit. |
Messenger001
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:29:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ninetails o'Cat
You're claiming that this ruins your fun, when you're suggesting that you'd KILL someone for ruining your fun? Doesn't just perhaps cross your mind as ruining their fun just a little?
Not even for a little bit. The guilt is entirely on initial agressor, and the harder he'd been punished for that - the better. |
Seith Silverstein
Something Rotten
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:38:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Messenger001 It's all about rules. If a person follows certain rules (say, dont fly in low secs, dont respond on PVP provocations, etc) he shouldnt possibly got killed. Now the game has no rules and no one nowhere in no way can prevent himself from being suicide ganked.
Bingo. Next Topic Please.
Originally by: CCP Soundwave I am literally the internet
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Malcanis
Caldari Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:44:00 -
[26]
Originally by: DeMichael Crimson Then it isn't really high security, just a glorified version of low security.
Correct, that's a pretty good description.
Hi-sec isn't meant to be safe. It just has more rigorous rules of engagement.
In practice, this means that it's significantly safer than lo-sec, but by no means absolutely safe. And it was never intended to be completely safe. Ever.
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. |
FlameGlow
Rebellion Alliance
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:59:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: DeMichael Crimson Then it isn't really high security, just a glorified version of low security.
Correct, that's a pretty good description.
Hi-sec isn't meant to be safe. It just has more rigorous rules of engagement.
In practice, this means that it's significantly safer than lo-sec, but by no means absolutely safe. And it was never intended to be completely safe. Ever.
It's safe inside the station
Originally by: CCP Manifest Imploding servers are not a part of our business model.
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ihcn
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Posted - 2010.07.28 20:10:00 -
[28]
Edited by: ihcn on 28/07/2010 20:10:28 If you don't want people to suicide you, don't fly ships that are easy or worthwhile to suicide. no faction mods, no expensive cargo, good tank
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Zia Aiz
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Posted - 2010.07.28 21:02:00 -
[29]
Eve online is unique in a sense that piracy, griefing, smacktalking, is allowed even encouraged. Sometimes it creates highly dramatic situations that provides the other side endless entertainment.
I have no doubt, that when CCP would revamp this game in some kind of world of warcraft carebear heaven, they might get more subscriptions.
However, CCP is clear that they want eve online to be a unique sandbox, where everything (or close to everything) is controlled by players, with as much freedom as possible.
These discussions about making this another carebear heaven game are endless, there lots of people wanting that, with always the same answer, it won't happen.
While i have respect in your point of view, i suggest you accept eve online how it is in it's own unique way or try find another game.
Or to say it CCP's words, "HTFU".
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ShahFluffers
Gallente Ice Fire Warriors
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Posted - 2010.07.28 21:18:00 -
[30]
Edited by: ShahFluffers on 28/07/2010 21:23:08
Messenger... you must understand something... one of the basic tenants of EvE is "non-consensual PvP." If someone wants to engage you, they WILL find a way... be it through war-decs, suicide ganking, market PvP, resource wars, etc. In this way, EvE is very similar to real life. But that's also where the similarities end.
I vaguely recall the Devs saying some years ago on how they wanted to see how people would behave in an environment where the rules were not so clear cut... where people could make choices on their own without the game mechanics interfering too much.
To this effect, you have a "Wild West" scenario in space. Cities (high-sec) are safer than towns. Towns (low-sec) are safer than the wilderness. But only in the wilderness (null-sec) there is the possibility to create your own place, with its own rules, and turn over a profit.
To answer you question... the one about how you are supposed to avoid conflict... I can answer in one sentence: to avoid PvP you must DISCOURAGE people from seeing you as a target (or an easy one at least). Some good advice I can give to this effect are: - Become part of a "badass" corp/alliance... one who has people that will have no qualms retaliating for you. - Build up a killboard. Go out into Faction War, a pirate group, or something and kill some things. Having a decent killboard can usually discourage most lame war-decs and such. - Fly "cheap"... no faction mods, no fancy ships... generally nothing too horribly expensive or wouldn't be too painful to lose/replace (T2 stuff is okay). - Fly "smart." Want to avoid that suicide gate camp? Get a friend to scout you. Or you can make the gank unprofitable by not carrying too expensive of cargo. Hell, try doing that MWD-cloak trick... it works pretty well.
Getting back on track here:
Not supported. _______________________
"Just because I seem like an idiot doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown |
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