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Damionity
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Posted - 2010.10.08 01:48:00 -
[1]
Training will finally be up in the morning, enough to get my Procurer. Nothing amazing, I know, but it is exciting to me. I finally get to try a Strip Miner!
I was wondering, without bonuses the Miner reads 540 m3. Will that be x3 because it takes 3 min to complete a run? If so, and the cargo is very slim in a procurer, does that basically mean it will only max out my cargo every 3 min cycle?
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knifee
Caldari
Euphoria Released
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Posted - 2010.10.08 01:55:00 -
[2]
I would think (i'm no miner) that the 540m3 will be what you get after 3min.
Also i think most barges fill their cargo up almost right away, so you have to be mining into a can (secure or otherwise).
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Sky Mart
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Posted - 2010.10.08 01:58:00 -
[3]
let me suggest you skip the procurer and go straight to retriever....the Osprey will outmine the Procurer. It is very little time difference to make it to the retriever and you'll be glad you didn't waste the money on the procurer. Unless of course you are going to mine mercoxit with it
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Matalino
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Posted - 2010.10.08 02:18:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Sky Mart
let me suggest you skip the procurer and go straight to retriever....the Osprey will outmine the Procurer. It is very little time difference to make it to the retriever and you'll be glad you didn't waste the money on the procurer.
This!
The stats of any miner are per cycle. So that is 180 m3 per minute base rate for a strip miner.
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Xina Tutor
Amarr
Black Arrows
Sev3rance
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Posted - 2010.10.08 02:26:00 -
[5]
Yeah.. don't waste the isk. wait and get the retriever to mine.
The proc is for baiting purposes only, not mining.
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Dasubervixen
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.10.08 02:34:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Dasubervixen on 08/10/2010 02:34:44
Yes, skip the procurer and get a retriever.
Anything done within the rules of the game is NOT griefing. Get over it. |
Culmen
Caldari
Blood Phage Syndicate
Dead Terrorists
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Posted - 2010.10.08 05:50:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Culmen on 08/10/2010 05:53:33
Confirming two things
First: 540m3 is the amount you get at the end of the 3 minutes cycle
divide that by three to get the ore per minute
Second: The procurer is indeed inferior to a mining cruiser in yield. Skip to at least a retriever.
But I would like to add ( as a person with Exhumers V and three accounts)
MINING IS NOT WORTH IT.
You'll make more money off missions.
Plus you'll need the standings to get a better refine rate anyway.
It's not too late! Turn back now!
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
My Postman
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Posted - 2010.10.08 14:33:00 -
[8]
Very much what every other poster said, skip the Procurer. You are only minutes away from a retriever.
And also very much what culmen said. Mining in highsec is¦nt worth it atm.
Hope this helps
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Damionity
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Posted - 2010.10.08 20:12:00 -
[9]
After I did the math the Proc does do almost the same as my Omen, just a bit more. Mining does pay well in High sec, for a new account/player the money is good. I know to players who are vets and have been here a while a few million is peanuts, but to a newby it is all we need in the beginning. The Proc is 1.5 mill and I do that in one run tossing cans of Kernite to my Bestower. Basically if I can buy a ship in 30 min it is all I need, kind of fits my lvl. As for the missions, I came here from 5 years of WoW, I am quest/missioned out right now. Mining is boring but to me it is a relaxing break from the stress I came from and I'm not trying to be an ISK trillionare. Not now anyway, lol.
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Hallan De'estus
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Posted - 2010.10.08 20:31:00 -
[10]
The other replies have it right: skip the Procurer! Even though it may be cheaper than a Retriever, in the short run you will be ahead by saving up for the far, far better Retriever.
You might also consider joining an indy corp that is active in mining. Any reasonably well-run indy corp will have people who can refine for you with little or no loss AND little or no station tax.
If you've not already done so, use Google to track down a PDF of Halada's Mining Guide.
Good Luck.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.10.09 04:50:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 09/10/2010 04:52:41
First off ... let me assure you that all the guys above who flat out stated that you should skip the Procurer were assuming you were mining in an Osprey rather than an Omen. They are also assuming that you are using Miner Laser II's as opposed to some lesser miner - AND - that you have Caldari Cruiser IV trained so you're getting an 80% bonus to your mining laser output.
Since you are in an Omen ... there are no mining bonuses for that ship ... so it doesn't matter what level of Amarr Cruiser you have trained (as far as mining goes).
For many miners the path is - Rookie Ship > Faction Mining Frigate > Osprey > Retriever > Hulk.
They mine in their rookie ship until they can buy a 20k Faction Mining Frigate - then they start training Caldari Frigates, then Caldari Cruisers - then they get an Osprey and use that until they get into a Retriever.
The conventional wisdom is to skip the Procurer ... but ... we've got several and have gotten good use out of them. Of course ... what we did ... was buy one of them - and then hand it down to the up and coming miners as soon as they could use it. Then, as soon as they could get into a Retriever - they got a hand me down from the guys who had moved on to Covetors and Hulks. A lot of these guys never trained cruisers until later - if at all. You actually don't even have to train Frigates to use a mining barge. So by skipping training for a cruiser - they got to a mining barge a little faster.
The thing is - these guys didn't need to make money (the corporation took care of that) - they just needed to train up as miners. If you need to make money - it is faster if you get into an Osprey or Scythe than it you stay in a mining Frigate until you get a Retriever.
Also - if you are Minmatar ... you want to get out of that Frakking Burst as fast as you Frakking can ... It has no drone ...
*shrug*
It's really up to you. If you're mining in an Omen - the Procurer will be a step up. Unfortunately for you (and my Amarr characters) the Amarr Mining Cruiser is the Arbitrator - which is a good combat ship - but is an abysmal miner. Like the Vexor all it's mining bonuses are to it's drones - but - unlike the Vexor - it can only fit two miners - not 4.
If you want to save a little money ... then skip the Procurer - but if you want to get started in mining barges - go ahead and get it. If you were mining in an Osprey or a Scythe it might be different - but that Omen is getting no bonuses for your mining Lasers the way they would.
What buying a Procuer will get you:
1) Experience in using a mining barge. Such as book marking and warping to places instead of flying over there. Thus - you want to move to another set of asteroids, book mark one - warp to the station - then warp back to your book mark. In a Cruiser - you'd probably just fly over there. Mining barges are slower than cruisers ...
2) 15km range on your Strip Miner as opposed to at best 12 on the smaller miners.
3) More cargo space. Put a couple of Expanded Cargo Hold II's on there and you've got a pretty good cargo hold - which is of more importance if you are doing mine and return than jet canning.
4) Learn about drones ... drones are the miners weapons. Here though ... you may want to just use combat drones until you can get into a Covetor. With your Omen you may well be using 3 mining drones but then that's got a much better tank.
5) A back up ship in case you lose the Retriever. Of course - you'll need to come up with new fittings if you've moved everything over to your Retriever when you get it.
Again ... this is all up to you.
If you are hurting for money ... then it might be better to save for the Retriever ... but if your not you'll be better off in the Procurer than you are in the Omen.
In any case - it doesn't make all that much difference. Procurer's are cheap - but it doesn't take that long before you can get in a Retriever.
*shrug*
So - do what you want.
Orbiting vs. Kiting
Faction Schools |
Damionity
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Posted - 2010.10.09 06:05:00 -
[12]
I had forgotten about the 80% bonus the Osprey got. A bit late now though, I'll be ready for the retriever in 23h. My omen wasn't bad. I had co-processor 1's and 5 miner II's. Jetcanning every 60. I wanted/got the Procurer to see what the Strip Miner was like, to get the time/math of it down. The 3 min cycle gives me time to work on other things I couldn't do with the Omen's 60 sec window. The Pro has it's one good point and many bad, mainly it not having the power to warp from station to belt in one go. Sad because my favorite Kernite Spot is 5 jumps away. I'll wait for the retriever, lol. But I have mining/refining 5 So I do pretty good with mats from the lowby ore for now. I'm just glad I have a second account which gives me a Bestower to toss cans to. If I had to skip back to the station every 6 min I would feel a bit differently about the Procurer, lol.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2010.10.09 08:53:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Damionity
I had forgotten about the 80% bonus the Osprey got. A bit late now though, I'll be ready for the retriever in 23h. My omen wasn't bad. I had co-processor 1's and 5 miner II's. Jetcanning every 60. I wanted/got the Procurer to see what the Strip Miner was like, to get the time/math of it down. The 3 min cycle gives me time to work on other things I couldn't do with the Omen's 60 sec window. The Pro has it's one good point and many bad, mainly it not having the power to warp from station to belt in one go. Sad because my favorite Kernite Spot is 5 jumps away. I'll wait for the retriever, lol. But I have mining/refining 5 So I do pretty good with mats from the lowby ore for now. I'm just glad I have a second account which gives me a Bestower to toss cans to. If I had to skip back to the station every 6 min I would feel a bit differently about the Procurer, lol.
You should be able to warp out to your belts without a problem. You might need to train your warp drives skill up some.
What I do, when I'm team mining, is to jettison a book mark to keep the can open and then just move the ore through the can, dragging it from the miners hold into the can and out of the can into the industrials hold. If someone comes around your belt, you can do a look on them, then move your POV around to their stern to see where they are going. If they head for your can, pull the bookmark - that should be the only thing in it - and pop the can. They will see that you are alert and go bother some one else - as long as you don't trash talk them.
Better still, is to run missions until you find one with a belt in it. Put one of your characters in the mission space and have the mission runner turn the mission in. The space will stay open as long as someone stays in there - but if you both leave it will close. So the miner stays in there and mines while the indy goes back and forth.
Your only problem with mission space is if you are in a system with Level IV agents - those attract battleship mission runners - and those attract Ninja Salvagers to scan them down. Failing to find a Battleship they can harrass - if they find you they might settle for you. Use your directional scanner and see if anyone is using Combat Scanner Probes. The Core Scanner Probes can't find ships so you don't need to worry about them - but the Combat Scanner Probes can.
In any case, find a quiet system with few people in it and you shouldn't have any trouble.
Oh yeah. Jet cans and wrecks last two hours ... so I name my cans with the time I created them, then jettison a new one and move the contents of the old one into it before it comes due. If they pop - they take anything in them with them.
If you're mining in mission space and have to come in through acceleration gates - it helps to put a tractor beam on your indy and maybe a salvager if you are generating rat wrecks. Then he can pull the cans and wrecks to him and empty/salvage them.
If there's no acceleration gate and no beacon, then you can warp right to your buddy.
When you can - usually after getting a Covetor or a Hulk - you want to move on to the Modulated Strip Miner II's - which can use mining crystals. That will give you another increase on your mining. I carry a little container in my hold that I keep the different crystals in. I also like to carry a spare for when one of them burns out. The SM II's will work without a crystal but they mine less than the SM I's without one.
Make sure you read Halada's guide.
Orbiting vs. Kiting
Faction Schools |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2010.10.09 10:43:00 -
[14]
the procurer was an awful ship. I swear that thing ran out of cap just trying to warp to a belt
retriever is much nicer.
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BaldyBob
Minmatar
Shondi Enterprises
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Posted - 2010.10.11 11:57:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Damionity
Training will finally be up in the morning, enough to get my Procurer. Nothing amazing, I know, but it is exciting to me. I finally get to try a Strip Miner!
I was wondering, without bonuses the Miner reads 540 m3. Will that be x3 because it takes 3 min to complete a run? If so, and the cargo is very slim in a procurer, does that basically mean it will only max out my cargo every 3 min cycle?
Look me up in game, come on down to where my corp is mining and our Orca pilot will boost your mining yield like you won't believe.
We're based in hisec, it's not a perfect yield but it's pretty damned close.
Enjoy the new mining barge :)
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