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Artemis Rose
Clandestine Vector
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Posted - 2010.10.28 04:59:00 -
[31]
Scorpion: One of a kind. Can't really rage about the only e-war spec'd T1 BS, even moreso when its the most powerful EWAR
Raven: Easily the best straight up damage dealer from 0-27km or so. Javelin puts its effective ranges out just past 40km if needed as well.
Rokh: With you there, does suck. While its decent enough as a sniper, Hybrids are the main issue holding this ship back.
The best DPS BS and the most useful T1 e-war ship. I'd hate to see what would happen if they actually "FIXED" Cally for PvP 
***
Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space
Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2
WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats |
MADDOGzors
Total Mayhem.
Northern Coalition.
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Posted - 2010.10.28 06:21:00 -
[32]
Rokh doesn't suck, you do.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1199522
Blame Apple for not letting iPhones link properly.
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Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2010.10.28 11:15:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Bad Messenger on 28/10/2010 11:19:09
 Originally by: Roosterton
Originally by: Aerilis
Edited by: Aerilis on 27/10/2010 12:55:00
Wish there was an easy way to fix Caldari PvP but I really can't think of one... Hybrids need a boost so the Caldari turret ships aren't useless. Scorp is the only T1 BS to be a specialized EWAR ship, which is kinda weird, so you can't really compare it to the other races. But ECM is always useful. Rokh is pretty cool and if hybrids get buffed I'm definitely going to train for one.
BS+above, armor tanks are almost always prefered, so Caldari kinda fails... :(
Hey, aren't you that guy who made the thread about Drakes needing a nerf? 
Yes same guy.
But as he is in gallente militia corporation , and his majority of kills come for blobbing Caldari random gangs. He was so fearful when Draketrain did couple ops in gallente/Caldari area and he did not manage to get in mails, atleast on the rate he was used to.
1st time when he saw something new he had to ask for nerf because there was no way to exploit that anyhow or way to ask bans for participants. He tried to solve that problem himself by using EFT but he could not solve it, because he has not enough experience about different ways and tactics to pvp in EVE.
This is Gallente Way to play FW,
WE ARE CALLENTE, WE DO NOT CARE, WE DO NOT HAVE TO DO ANYTHING, WE JUST CRY CCP TO SOLVE THIS !
Same as prayers, sometimes those come true.
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Tusen Takk
Guy Fawkes Trust Fund
31ST Reliables Division
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Posted - 2010.10.28 14:11:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Bomberlocks
I think this thread is 0/10 honestly. The Caldari are getting the long awaited rocket boost in november, which will make Hawk, Kestrel, Merlin, Crow, Malediction, Vengeance etc all very good, if not OP.
Drakes are currently the FOTM in large fleets and very difficult to beat.
Scorps, Falcons, BBs, Griffins, Rooks are all very good in gangs.
And the Caracal makes an excellent, if not the best, anti-frigate cruiser.
Blaster Rokh is pretty fine and will only get better along with the Moa, Eagle, Ferox and Cormorant if Hybrids are boosted next year, which is very possible because people have been complaining about this for a long time.
qft
a small gang i was in was about to win a spar when a scorp warped in, jammed us all to hell, and almost was into our armour by the time we managed to gtfo
granted we were 3 drakes verus an apocolypse a raven and a scorpion, but i mean seriously
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Lady Ayeipsia
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Posted - 2010.10.28 14:36:00 -
[35]
A Rokh is a sniper battleship. Why would you want to put a point an a ship that is suppose to be fighting at extremely long ranges?
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xenodia
Gallente
DYNAMIC INTERVENTION
ORPHANS OF EVE
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Posted - 2010.10.28 15:08:00 -
[36]
Originally by: ImmutableDark
I suck at pvp and can only be effective if I have an "I-Win" button. Please give me one, but dont let anyone else use it. Basically, CCP please design and implement a super wtfpwnmobile especially for me, because if someone other than me had it, my inferior skills would once again rear their ugly heads, and id find a way to lose to someone else flying the same ship.
Fixed it for you
This signature space for rent |
Kraschyn Thek'athor
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Posted - 2010.10.28 16:54:00 -
[37]
Thread Opener = Clueless
Scorpion is a hell of a ship!
Why do you think Scorpions are targeted first in battle?
You can't let them fly freely arround.
Caldari are best in PvE and in ECM Warfare.
Also quite good for shield roams (which are the majority in our corp)
Take this or learn other race.
If you want to switch damage type, don't fly Amarr ;)
And guess, you switch tank for ewar, rest of us change
dps for tank.
God, everyday a whining caldari makes my day :D
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SPACESHIPS LAWYER
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Posted - 2010.10.28 17:14:00 -
[38]
Caldari cannot be used for pvp.
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Thorian Baalnorn
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Posted - 2010.10.28 18:08:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Thorian Baalnorn on 28/10/2010 18:09:46
The problem with caldari isnt completely on caldari. Its more so peoples refusal to use the ships in a way they are good at. Their are some caldari ships that seems no matter how you set them up and how you fly them they just perform terrible ( hello, ferox!) But many are actually pretty decent if your not trying to make a solopwnmobile with 800 dps out of them.
The caracal is one of the best t1 crusiers in the game. This is a ship you can slam some AMLs on and obliterate frigs with. then you can go and slap some HMLs on it and a couple of sebos and do 300 dps @ 150 km. In fact i would recommend the caracal for any caldari pilot for starting pvp. Using it as an HML dps support ship.
The drake, well, this is ship is pretty much the t1 god of eve. Only two things i have found this ships is not real good at, sniping and mining. It is ok on long range but lacks the ability to achieve a true sniping range. It can still hit 525 dps at over 110km or 475 @ 125 km.
The raven is not bad for fighting BC plus fleets. Its range allows its to sit at a safe distant and plaster targets all over the grid literally without moving. Its not a i am going to walk up to you and punch you in the face ship. Its more of a i am going to stand over here and throw large rocks at you ship. 575 DPS @ 220KM( though it takes 25 seconds for the missiles to get their)with a 4k alpha is not that all that bad.
The scorpion you can fit for range jamming and jam at 150 km plus for 10 points or you can plate it and use it close range with reduced jam strength/range.
The tengu is probably one of the best jack of all trades ships in the game.
The cerb is a decent sniper boat.
The onyx can fit a mean tank. It takes a lot of punishment making it good for bubbling gates.
Falcon and rook are pretty good.
Though a lot of people like the harpy more because of DPS i think the hawk is a decent little ship for tackling. It wont kill much solo but it does make a decent tackle and i survived some insane engagements while being shot at in one. I even run DED 4/5 sites in mine, though 5s are a bit nerve racking.
You have to just use caldari properly and it has some decent ships. For example when at range instead of attacking the primary missile boats should be shooting at the secondary. By time the missile volleys start to hit, the secondary is or nearly is the primary. thus you only shoot at every other target instead of every target.
And of course caldari is the best for PVE.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.10.28 18:23:00 -
[40]
I've found missile sniping isn't much use against fleets that aren't already completely ****ed (ie. have decided to sit in their bubble tomb and await destruction) due to the sheer amount of flight time. You need to obliterate something fast if you're going to kill it (assuming logistics is present on both sides) and the tactics used to do that (exellent timing with lauched volleys from a lot of ships) isn't something most fleets can do (and most FCs are just terribad at it).
It's not that they don't want to care about launcher ships, but since launcher ships also happen to be shield tanked, sitting far out of the fleet begging to be scanned and warped onto, and otherwise a huge liability (not adding to the turret alpha of the rest of the fleet), it all adds up to some pretty bad times unless you have ace tacklers. So overall in fleets the caldari are left out the most, which is very odd since the wrote response to caldari pvp is:
"Bad at solo and good at gang/fleet," but they also fail to mention that gang/fleet needs to be quite specialized unless you're flying an ecm ship that's ghetto rigged for a little armor buffer. That means somewhere between solo and fleet there's a mythical sweet spot for caldari which is somewhat embodied by the drake now. They're one of the few ships sturdy and flexible enough to bring shield logistics out and thus give caldari some use.
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Thorian Baalnorn
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Posted - 2010.10.28 19:09:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Thorian Baalnorn on 28/10/2010 19:11:36
Originally by: Leksi Bar'zuk
I've found missile sniping isn't much use against fleets that aren't already completely ****ed (ie. have decided to sit in their bubble tomb and await destruction) due to the sheer amount of flight time. You need to obliterate something fast if you're going to kill it (assuming logistics is present on both sides) and the tactics used to do that (exellent timing with lauched volleys from a lot of ships) isn't something most fleets can do (and most FCs are just terribad at it).
It's not that they don't want to care about launcher ships, but since launcher ships also happen to be shield tanked, sitting far out of the fleet begging to be scanned and warped onto, and otherwise a huge liability (not adding to the turret alpha of the rest of the fleet), it all adds up to some pretty bad times unless you have ace tacklers. So overall in fleets the caldari are left out the most, which is very odd since the wrote response to caldari pvp is:
"Bad at solo and good at gang/fleet," but they also fail to mention that gang/fleet needs to be quite specialized unless you're flying an ecm ship that's ghetto rigged for a little armor buffer. That means somewhere between solo and fleet there's a mythical sweet spot for caldari which is somewhat embodied by the drake now. They're one of the few ships sturdy and flexible enough to bring shield logistics out and thus give caldari some use.
I would agree with you on the going into a gate camp. The drake and the onyx and the ewar ships are the ones that are only really useful in roams. The drake and onyx because of their tanking ability and the ewar is self explainatory. The other missile boats are decent in a defensive role. And ravens are the BS kings of POS bashing. this role is being severely diminished by the insane amount of caps in game. Dreadnoughts and carriers are basically throw away ships now. 10 dreads sieging a POS is much faster than 50 BS sieging the same POS. With carrier support even a deathstar is an easy kill with almost no chance of cap loss.
Caldari are not good at solo fighting. they are only good if in a gang or fleet. Besides the few i listed above they dont always excel at this role either.
caldari ships do need some loving as a race to make them more viable in gangs. Faster missiles with shorter flight times perhaps. Adding a shield version of regen plating that is a low slot module. We have PDS but something inline with regen plating i think would be used often.
You could drop a shield extender or two add a couple of reg plates and still have decent EHP and have room for more ewar in your mids.
Even adding a low slot to all caldari ships would help to some degree. Then it opens up a couple more options for you. You could also make the passive shield amps lowslot items this would make them more useful as well as open up some option in your mids.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.10.28 19:19:00 -
[42]
TBH I don't see a dire need for slots (perhaps some grid..) on a lot of caldari ships, but the big issue is making shield logistics a real option on large fleets rather than a foregone conclusion, but that requires a major upset to the backbone of max-buffer (something armor is a run-away victor with due to 1600s and slave implants) and the imbalance between shield logistics and armor (namely that shield rr doesn't fit on anything but cldari ships well).
If the choice was actually a matter of taste and tactics, I think we'd see a much greater diversity of ships and fleets that might utilize caldari outside of ewar. Unfortunately, like I said, that's a big daisy-chain of things to upset the high-throne of armor buffering so I don't see it happening in the near future, if at all. More likely caldari pilots will continue to be the odd man out in fleets and mostly suited to their own small shield gangs based on drakes or (much more likely in the future) minmatar shield tanking hulls.
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Artemis Rose
Clandestine Vector
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Posted - 2010.10.28 21:27:00 -
[43]
Originally by: MADDOGzors
Rokh doesn't suck, you do.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1199522
Blame Apple for not letting iPhones link properly.
I remember you crying, whining and refusing to fight my buffer Tempest in your beloved Rokh. You're a winner!
***
Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space
Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2
WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats |
Mung Podder
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Posted - 2010.10.28 22:38:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Not to shield tanking they dont, and the maelstrom only gets a great active shield tank when you invest loads in crystal implants, blue pills and the like and even that folds to the right sized gang.
Anything and everything folds to the "right sized gang."
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Diesel47
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Posted - 2010.10.29 12:59:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Diesel47 on 29/10/2010 13:01:34
Originally by: Kraschyn Thek'athor
Thread Opener = Clueless
Scorpion is a hell of a ship!
Why do you think Scorpions are targeted first in battle?
You can't let them fly freely arround.
Caldari are best in PvE and in ECM Warfare.
Also quite good for shield roams (which are the majority in our corp)
Take this or learn other race.
If you want to switch damage type, don't fly Amarr ;)
And guess, you switch tank for ewar, rest of us change
dps for tank.
God, everyday a whining caldari makes my day :D
No you are clueless, the thread is not about PVE so it is irrelevant that caldari are the best at PVE. And caldari are the best at ecm... but what does that have to do with SOLO PVP?
"Also quite good for shield roams"
Keyword roams, again... not solo pvp.
and this doesn't even make sense "And guess, you switch tank for ewar, rest of us change
dps for tank." And guess?? What are you saying?
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Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2010.10.29 13:07:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Mung Podder
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Not to shield tanking they dont, and the maelstrom only gets a great active shield tank when you invest loads in crystal implants, blue pills and the like and even that folds to the right sized gang.
Anything and everything folds to the "right sized gang."
The difference being a great shield buffer tank costs alot less than a decent active maelstrom tank. It also takes alot less flying experience and can last longer against a larger gang than an active tank.
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Diesel47
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Posted - 2010.10.29 13:51:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Originally by: Mung Podder
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Not to shield tanking they dont, and the maelstrom only gets a great active shield tank when you invest loads in crystal implants, blue pills and the like and even that folds to the right sized gang.
Anything and everything folds to the "right sized gang."
The difference being a great shield buffer tank costs alot less than a decent active maelstrom tank. It also takes alot less flying experience and can last longer against a larger gang than an active tank.
The rokh still doesn't have a place anywhere...
Maelstrom for solo pvp, tempest for gang pvp.
Not to mention for the 20th time ... Hybrids. GAH.
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Korg Leaf
Time Bandits.
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Posted - 2010.10.29 14:03:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Diesel47
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Originally by: Mung Podder
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Not to shield tanking they dont, and the maelstrom only gets a great active shield tank when you invest loads in crystal implants, blue pills and the like and even that folds to the right sized gang.
Anything and everything folds to the "right sized gang."
The difference being a great shield buffer tank costs alot less than a decent active maelstrom tank. It also takes alot less flying experience and can last longer against a larger gang than an active tank.
The rokh still doesn't have a place anywhere...
Maelstrom for solo pvp, tempest for gang pvp.
Not to mention for the 20th time ... Hybrids. GAH.
Yeah the major problem with the rokh isnt its shield tank which buffer wise is better than mael or the pest, its the fact that hybrids suck, it has a crappy drone bay and no damage bonus.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.10.29 17:40:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Korg Leaf
Yeah the major problem with the rokh isnt its shield tank which buffer wise is better than mael or the pest, its the fact that hybrids suck, it has a crappy drone bay and no damage bonus.
Correct.
But, shield tanking does nothing to help it.
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I likegirls
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.10.30 04:37:00 -
[50]
I think that the Wyvern should get a boost to its Remote ECM Burst because of Caldari having bonuses to ECM on T1/T2 frigates, cruisers and battleships.
Only change required to Caldari.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.10.30 04:55:00 -
[51]
Originally by: I likegirls
I think that the Wyvern should get a boost to its Remote ECM Burst because of Caldari having bonuses to ECM on T1/T2 frigates, cruisers and battleships.
Only change required to Caldari.
They should give caldari bonus to role playing, that's the only reason to fly the Wyrv.
o7 battle on brave navy solider!
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Joe McAlt
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Posted - 2010.10.30 05:42:00 -
[52]
Sometimes I wonder if the game designers really understand tactics and Strategic Theory at all.
As an example, a fleet made up of shield tanked missile ships should be designed as being light, fast and mobile. Caldari ships should not be particularly agile, but they should be designed to have good acceleration and top speed so that they can fight at the range that their weapons excel at. If they were as light and fast or faster than the Matari, their combination of long range and powerful EW would make them fearsome opponents.
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Thorian Baalnorn
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Posted - 2010.10.30 05:58:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Joe McAlt
Sometimes I wonder if the game designers really understand tactics and Strategic Theory at all.
As an example, a fleet made up of shield tanked missile ships should be designed as being light, fast and mobile. Caldari ships should not be particularly agile, but they should be designed to have good acceleration and top speed so that they can fight at the range that their weapons excel at. If they were as light and fast or faster than the Matari, their combination of long range and powerful EW would make them fearsome opponents.
They do have good speed. Caldari has the slowest base speed in game. Caldari uses shields not armor. Armor is heavy. Armor slows ships down. a plated and armor rigged harby is about 150 m/s slower than a drake( with MWD).
Minnie can do both armor and shield and have the fastest ships in game probably because they are always running away from amarr ship ( that was not a minnie vs amarr ship comment. But a minnie race vs amarr race comment, btw).
The problem is people dont always fit armor tanked ships for armor tanks or a heavy tank CCCs are popular and dont weigh you down like armor rigs thus they go faster because they shed the weight.
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Andrea Griffin
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Posted - 2010.10.30 16:29:00 -
[54]
13 Caldari Solo PVP setups from Battleship to Frigate - Enjoy, by Kessah of The United.
Fix Rockets in '08 '09 2010 2011 2012?! |
Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.10.30 17:22:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Andrea Griffin
13 Caldari Solo PVP setups from Battleship to Frigate - Enjoy, by Kessah of The United.
I did solo pvp last night in a mauler, does that make the ship good for pvp?
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OT Smithers
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Posted - 2010.10.31 07:06:00 -
[56]
Caldari PvP?
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Ralnik
Mutineers
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Posted - 2010.10.31 14:39:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Ralnik on 31/10/2010 14:44:05
Originally by: Diesel47
Caldari also need more mid slots, they are THE shield race after all... Minmitar should NOT be able to shield tank better than the shield race. T
Umm you are missing the basics here..
Amarr = Buffer Armor Tank
Gallente = Active Armor Tank
Caldari = Buffer/Passive Shield Tank
Minmatar = Active Shield Tank
Caldari is not the only "shield race" as they share that role with Minmatar. Caldari is not a "active" shield race as that role is filled by Minmatar much like Gallente are the active armor race.
Meaning yes it makes perfect sense for Minmatar's active shield bonused ships to tank well. Yet try to compare the Cane's shield tank with a Drake and it's not even close because the Drake has bonuses for resists which add to that passive/buffer tank.
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hjgjgfgfgsj
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Posted - 2010.11.02 15:07:00 -
[58]
Originally by: TaluxA
This certainly sounds like a bit of a problem.
But one day you'll get over being serious about Eve and will just fly merlins. Merlins are great.
THIS. Quit flying battleships you carbar be a pro like me fly a frigate for some yaryar and see how it feels and quit complaining about the inferiority of the caldari battleships cause really who gives a **** I was born gayllente so I fly incursuses but if I was born caldari I would fly a merlin and whup butt with it yeah thats right yeah thats right!! lol, seriously though.
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IbanezLaney
Caldari
Dingo took my corp name
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Posted - 2010.11.02 18:23:00 -
[59]
I like the scorp look now. Kinda think its lame all caldari ships are not in that style already - how long does it take a team of professional artists to draw a few bloody ships?
Maybe see sea pea are still stuffing around tryin to make the same 6 cut and paste planets even prettier.
The BS could be fixed by giving caldari/missile battleships a massive scram range bonus so they can actually be used to snipe while pinning targets down. The extra time that gives in pvp while the enemy closes range would help create balance. It would also help encourage lots more sniper fleet pvp.
Short range ships/weapons have too many advantages while ever there is a lack of equivalent long range modules that offer the same ability's.
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Xylorn Hasher
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Posted - 2010.11.03 09:07:00 -
[60]
Best option for Caldari PvP pilot is to cross train Minmatar race. It's sad but true. Caldari ships sux in solo except for a Drake.
In Minmatar you will get propably the best T1 BC - Hurricane - shield tanked 600 DPS and 40K EHP killing machine with 2 spare high slots for neuts / impr cloak T2 and neut...or wait till CCP fix Caldari race which will be... never?
My advice is that: Stop training for Caldari ships ASAP and run for Matars.
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