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Captain Black
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Posted - 2003.06.29 18:34:00 -
[1]
Obviously this is NOT new to this game but I wanted to know something. How many people think creating new characters for the sole purpose of ripping a corp or person off is an expliot? It just happened to our corp today by a new character named "G Wrex". We had quite a lot of noob equipment in Hangar 1 & 2 for new members and he cleaned it all out and recycled it. Now he will probably delete his character. I think if someone's sole purpose to advance is to create new characters to steal from others their account should be deleted. Again, it was noob stuff but I hate people who steal.
CB
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Tehel Necrona
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Posted - 2003.06.29 20:08:00 -
[2]
Well its a shame, huge international thieves have many identies though.. so perhaps although its harsh this is of course a suitable rp method.
Although to be frank it is an exploit and has been used by many to "get ahead".
-Necro
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Cara 'Than
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Posted - 2003.06.29 20:27:00 -
[3]
It happened to my corp yesterday...
I think there has to be a possibility to set a bounty on ppls heads not just the char but the account for doing such things....
__________________
"Fear leads to Anger. Anger leads to Hate. Hate leads to suffering." |
0SKULL0
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Posted - 2003.06.29 21:27:00 -
[4]
something should be done i agree, I have had this happen to me in 2 different corps. the first one the ceo stole everything and sold his account on ebay. the 2nd was done by a a real ass, he wiped the corp out of over 100 mil in assets cause he thought he was better than us, plus he took over corp and booted us all out.
but sometimes wiping a corp out is legit, i am in that position right now, the ceo and director both quit the game and made me a director but i didnt have ceo rights. so i had talk with all active members of corp and we decided to make a new corp. so I made new corp and took all assets with me. all active members were in agreement to do this so i guess that was a legit move since we all worked to get everything corp had.
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SOL0
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Posted - 2003.06.29 21:29:00 -
[5]
I have had an encounter once with G Wrex, I pod killed him when he showed up as a threat in a .0 system.
"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be." |
Vacuole
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Posted - 2003.06.30 03:14:00 -
[6]
Well, it's not an exploit since your chance of being looted is directly proportionate to how trustworthy you are to corp members.
Exploits (in my mind atleast) are situations, where players abuse an obvious flaw or technical limitation of the game to gain an advantage over other players.
That cargo containter thing we always hear about.. ASSUMING ITS TRUE, then that could be an exploit, because a player would use a known limitation of the system (lag associated with sending data down the pipe to the client) to gain a strategic advantage.
(I'm not saying it is or is not, mind you... just hypothetically speaking)
But just as shaking down passers-by at gates is accepted gaming practice within EVE, I think corp looting is as well.
In fact, I seem to remember hearing from CCP that the practice is in fact 'acceptable behavior' by CCP.
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Cardassius
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Posted - 2003.06.30 08:12:00 -
[7]
Just don't accept new applicants right away ;)
ASCI Recruiting! |
DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2003.06.30 11:50:00 -
[8]
We had this with some corp named necrosis, since they did they are running and logging off every system we show up... And they think their winning. lol
Edited by: DREAMWORKS on 30/06/2003 11:50:06
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Malgran Rikes
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Posted - 2003.06.30 15:52:00 -
[9]
There are two types of theft. One is where someone steals from a corporation and then remains, living in EVE, with the consequences of their actions. The second is where, after the theft, they delete that character.
In this respect I think I disagree with Vacuole's reasoning.
Whilst you can perform all sorts of role-play contortions to try and explain the theft-deletion problem, it is to my mind an exploit.
In reality you can not obliterate yourself and transfer money to...yourself. Until they introduce a "fake identity" skill, or a subterfuge skill, it is to my mind an exploit, an exploitatation of the character creation mechanism, in as much as dropping containers is an exploitation of the information traffic dynamic of the game.
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"Things should be made as simple as possible, but not any simpler." Albert Einstein |
Captain Black
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Posted - 2003.06.30 17:41:00 -
[10]
An idea that I thought of is to make all new applicants take a screen shot of their character selection screen and turn it in before they get accepted in the corp. We are going to do this from now on. I accept that theft is part of this game and although I'm not a pirate, I think pirates add a signifigant(sp?) amount of life to Eve. I don't mean to say I hate ALL people who steal in Eve either, I just hate the people who keep creating and deleting characters after they get what they want. Those people are scum imo. Sorry to sound harsh but I can't stand that. I hope the screen shot idea is helpful to other corps.
Thanks,
CB
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Magallen
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Posted - 2003.06.30 18:31:00 -
[11]
That's an excellent ideal. That should stop newbie character corp theft on it's tracks. Only downside is those people that want to join a corp but also want to play solo characters in total privacy, oh well can't have it all you know
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Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2003.07.01 10:51:00 -
[12]
I think the use of alts is a bit ropey and lame anyway, and the use of them to rip off other people is as close to being an exploit as you can get without it actually being one.
The screenshot idea is a good one, but of course anyone with even basic graphic skills can happily fake one in seconds. You could do further checks (such as EVEMailing the alts) but a couple of people could easily get around it.
The best solution would be to have a % next to a character's info which says what % of skill points from a player total that character has. It doesn't impinge on the players privacy, but would immediately show if you're dealing with an alt - giving you the choice whether or not to deal with that person. Of course people could still create 2 accounts, but I think the number of people willing to go that far for the opportunity to clear out someone's hangar full of Miner Is would be pretty small.
Have fun
Finn |
Fearchar Fada
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Posted - 2003.07.01 23:54:00 -
[13]
 Quote:
We had this with some corp named necrosis, since they did they are running and logging off every system we show up... And they think their winning. lol
DREAMWORKS, we did not steal from your corp hangar, nor did we use the cargo container exploit. We brought your mining operations in Ebo to a halt by destroying you cargo pods which were awaiting pcikup from an indy.
Please next time you post, get your facts straight.
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Death is only the beginning.... |
Tolanthas
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Posted - 2003.07.02 09:38:00 -
[14]
In fact, I seem to remember hearing from CCP that the practice is in fact 'acceptable behavior' by CCP.
I hope CCp doesnt beleive that,, its totally crazy.. Petty theft of an item here or an item there I could see but Select all and drag. I would like to see someone who works for microdoft in there werehouse walk out with the entire werehouse and then just recycle it and it give it a friend or them selves with a really cool disguies.. This is the worst type of abuse.
I think something that could help with this is haveing corp hangars as they are buit limiting the size of the hangar space for people themselves. If a player wants an infinite hangar they can start a one man corp and have all they need. Otherwise they are limited to a few ships at a time in the each hangar and a certain capacity hangar. Corps pay for offices in stations and there are limited slots.. Should be one of the advantages of it.
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Badger
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Posted - 2003.07.02 14:37:00 -
[15]
Hmmm, I think this next patch will go along ways to help out with these type of situations.
Respectfully,
Badger
Admiral of Ethics
Hadean Drive Yards
"Fear shouldn't hurt, just never put your hand into a bag of angr |
maximum
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Posted - 2003.07.02 15:34:00 -
[16]
I personally don't see how stealing and deleting a charcter is any worse than using several characters to mine and make profit. I've seen many hardcore players do this, and it kind of ****es me off. I'd rather the game restricted you to just one character. Folk would them think a bit more before acting rashly, and you wouldn't have idiots creating new characters and using them as paws in corp wrs.
In my last corp, which was at war, one player created a new character just so he could start firing on the rival corp in high security areas. The end reult was that the rival corp opened fore on the persky ship and ended up being destroyed by station security. Sneaky and cool you might say, but also very unrealsitic and annoying.
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Captain Black
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Posted - 2003.07.02 17:54:00 -
[17]
Maximum, I was thinking about what you were saying regarding the person creating a new character and attacking the enemy just to have the police attack them after they fire back. That kind of sucks. Listen to this one.. Imagine a bunch of people get together, create one fresh new character a piece, run around high security space blowing up people's mining containers. Miners fire on them, police warp in and kill miners. They will NEVER run out of ships.. Infact, they will never have anything happen to them at all. Here's another one, create a new alt, rob corp "X". Corp X is now very ****ed at you and puts 1mill on your head. Have your buddy kill your alt and BAM, you get another mill from the corp that's ****ed at you. That is STUPID.. :/ People are actually playing the game by creating a continous stream of new characters for this purpose.
lol, now is that fair???
Edited by: Captain Black on 02/07/2003 17:55:38
Edited by: Captain Black on 02/07/2003 17:59:28
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Davian Windspear
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Posted - 2003.07.03 16:32:00 -
[18]
You cant complain about the corp robbery, its a situation which would happen in real life if companies were as slack as yours lol.
Firstly dont let the new people in the corp hangers, its harsh but realistic. IF you have never met this person before why do you trust them? Second if its a 0.0 or 0.1 character its probably and alt, only accept characters who are established into your hangers (even then you can be robbed)
The trick is to make sure you dont let people you dont trust at things you dont want to lose, its simple really. My freind has a corp and has lost nothing, infact if you want to have lots of members who are unknown you are going to get stung.
Also it is valid in my opinion, the character has stolen all your money and then had plastic surgery to change himself with your riches.
Finally on the aspect of the players running round causing battles in new ships this is rubbish, if containers are left floating in space they are not yours, make sure you guard them or pick them up, if you did this they can do nothing. Buy a badger for your group mining and have him pick it all up, instead of mining lots, leaving it there and going to pick it up in a badger, dont complain when its stolen...
P.S i dont do any of these things before you accuse me, i have just yet to be caught out by them. The more you make it limited by rules the less freedom you have and realism in the game. It is Natural, if you are stupid enough to let a stranger in your house sometimes they will empty it. |
GM Rendo
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Posted - 2003.07.03 19:34:00 -
[19]
Well if I may add my thoughts to the dicussion I would have to say that I doubt very much that this problem will ever be completely eliminated. Trust is always an issue and with the 5 level hangars you can easily divide stuff up there for rookies and other more experienced corp members. CCP's plan from what I've heard will probably be to reduce the number of characters that any given customer can create for some period. Another thing that you might see is that it will take increasingly longer time to delete a character as he has to be prepared before he can be deleted. I think this will be done in a few steps though. Finally I wouldn't be surprised one day that some very high level agents would provide you the service to locate alter ego of a character(that is locate his other characters). But of course this is just a rumor and by no means a certainty. I guess we'll just have to wait and see how it turns out.
/Cheers
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Captain Black
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Posted - 2003.07.03 20:36:00 -
[20]
Thanks for the reply GM Rendo.
Davian Windspear, you may think that I am one of those people who want the game to keep getting more "carebear".. Well, fortunately that is not the case. I guess we could just not give new members access to any hangars at all but then you have to sit there a micro manage the hell out of things. <message> Could I have some ammo? <message> Could I have a small shield booster? <message> could I have some more ammo? <CB> Dammit, I just gave you ammo! WTH did you do? Give it to some purple space monkeys???
Heh, I know that's basically what you have to do but o well. I know in a real situation your senior members would be able to help with those kind of tasks so it wouldn't be THAT bad. Guess we can't even give new members access to noob stuff.. <sigh> What we CAN do though(that I just thought of) is create a standard issue list of noob equipment and issue it to them when they join to be stored in their personal hangar. Hmmmm, that sounds pretty good.
Also, I don't understand what was said that caused you to be in such a defensive state of mind..? I wouldn't accused you of anything. I just don't think people should be able to constantly create and delete characters without you ever knowing who they really are. I am really interested and excited in what GM Rendo had to say. Again, thanks to ALL who replied.
CB
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Xytac
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Posted - 2003.07.03 22:33:00 -
[21]
I dont belive the sollution to you'r problem will be solved anytime soon... You have to use your imagination... Make you'r own rules!
Have some not-offical time when you let ppl get in touch with the n00b stuff.. Make sure you trust anyone before allowing them to touch the real stuff.
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Denathis Arabar
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Posted - 2003.07.04 00:36:00 -
[22]
Sorry to you too i wasnt being defensive or offensive i hope lol. I just dont see the problem.
Here is another hint for you, Give the people you know and trust the ability to change the status of any character. Then when the new players want something you or anyone near can let them in, then lock the hangers again, as it would be in real life.
What my freind did was to say to new people here is the hanger (give them access and watch, you can see the things they move lol) if its all disapearing close it quick. Then they can see what there is and what they need, any time they want more you can let them in again and they will get more. If they are there to rob you and have an alt character its likely they will get bored of this.
You could still get caught out by this though, if they have enough patience i suppose.
Another way only put a limited amount of equipment in hanger 1 (low security) then they can rob you but it will be for little ammo and guns, whoever is trusted with you can also do this, it does not need to be regular.
Good Luck with it all and remember Trust no one heheh. |
cadoris
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Posted - 2003.07.11 11:23:00 -
[23]
theft seems to becoming more common in the game both from cargo canisters and corps.
his is just the thing that the bouny hunter career path was made for and the increasing number of private postings for 'retirements' is testimony to that.
theft is present irl and so should be in EVE too. people who complain that their cargo containers floating in space ahould be invunerable are just whining. CCP probably didnt intend for people to strip mine in mining vessels before taking out their indy to collect te loot either. the game expands from its own experience.
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Tri H'Dee
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Posted - 2003.07.11 18:59:00 -
[24]
Hey capt. black :)
Yes I agree, people who steal from corp are the lowest form of scum, we will deal with corp thieves as fast and clean and possible, which means we give em 24 hours to pay back for the stuff they have stolen, which is IMO very nice of us, after that, we blow em up, in which case we tend to pay less attention to the security level of the sector =/
Unfortunately, this only works on the really dumb thieves, who just keep playing on with their characters, the smarter ones who delete their chars are a different problem... I hope ccp finds a way to prevent this form of stealing with no way for the victim to claim his property back.
Btw capt Black and all other AF ppl, look at my sig, im the boss now ;)
Edited by: Tri H'Dee on 11/07/2003 18:59:40
Edited by: Tri H'Dee on 11/07/2003 18:59:52
- afk |
Wil Rufus
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Posted - 2003.07.11 21:58:00 -
[25]
Corp and cargo theft is becoming a more reguler occurence because as the game engine stands there is little that you can do about it.
So now I am spending time using my two spare Character slots to develope one off 'kamakazi' characters. I have a list of player characters who have ripped me off, usually by sweeping up cans dropped by pirates while I'm still fighting.
So long as my Kamikazi's can drop and pod them before Concord turns up then I'll be happy. The beauty of this is, they will never know when, where or by who they will be attacked.
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Kr'Kal
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Posted - 2003.07.14 01:56:00 -
[26]
Why not just put some kind of corp-transfer-log in the game which allows you see who took stuff out of your hangar, i mean it's really not realistic having no means of supervising cargo movements between members and corp hangars. I'd advise CCP to implement that kind of tool to help Corps out
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