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[ Proposal ] Improve the Missile Graphic and Potentially Reduce Lag

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Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.03 00:07:00 - [1] This issue has floated around a long time and I was hoping I could round up some folks on it to really get behind it as an improvement. EVE has seen drastic graphic changes in its history (Look at the game when it released and you'll realize that some ships really could be uglier!). The recent changes to Fighter-Bombers made this idea pop in my head initially. The Features and Ideas Link is here: How Can We Mount Missiles? The idea behind missiles is to change their graphic from 'farting' out of the ship's middle to actually launching. My idea is NOT to have turret-like-launchers as that has two big problems: 1) Most ships don't have additional hardpoints in their skins for missiles, or none at all! Take the drake which has zero hardpoints in its skin, but has silos. 2) Multiple missiles originating from multiple points on multiple ships (That's a lot for math-challenged folks like me) couldn't possibly be good for the server, especially in fleet battles. So let's take the Drake and Tempest (because they are easy to refer to): The drake has silos on its sides that are clearly intended to be the missile launchers, being a missile dedicated ship. For our "not" dedicated missile-boat, the Tempest, it has a nifty BIG BOX with TWO BIG DOTS in it...which appears to be about right for launching cruise missiles or torps! THE IDEA: Why not change missiles like fighter bombers, or a variation thereof? I personally think it'd be cool if the drake volleys were not one clump of missile being 'poofed' out the bottom, but were (graphically) shown as exploding from the side of ship in a massive salvo that congregates on the target(s). Same for Tempest: the two missiles (if the ship of course had them) would launch from its side launcher. But what about the math? As we all know missiles are real-time and actually calculate distance, acceleration...so on and so forth. I propose that we upgrade the missile graphics to reflect the ship's actual actions but the math be changed like it has been for fighter bombers, or something similar. If I fire one missile at a time from the drake, the silos will show a missile coming out one at a time (from the silo that corrsponds to F1, F2...etc). The biggest problem with this is that some ships do not inherently have 'launcher graphics' in their skins. An excellent example is the thin Caracal, or the Raven. These ships would likely need a skin upgrade of some sort to make this idea viable...a whole different kind of monster for devs to tackle. I'd appreciate any ideas on solving this! I'm NOT calling for a change in missile stats or balancing, nothing of that sort. This is a purely GRAPHIC proposal aiming to finally give missiles some love and make them look proper. Imagine if turrets only pointed straight on your ship and the bullets flew wherever (like on drones)? Would kinda stink...so why do missiles look so boring? Not just Caldari use or see these weapons, many ships across ALL RACES have missiles as potential, if not necessary, weapons. EVE is an incredible game for many reasons, one of those being how it looks! We've upgraded so many other graphical features in EVE, isn't it time missiles looked as deadly as they are? Picture firing salvos off from your ships and I think anyone could agree this would be a great improvement to see in the game. I bring up the FB fix from recently in the hopes maybe this idea could be tied to it? Reducing server strain is always a plus, but why not make that reduction look cool too?
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.03 01:25:00 - [2] Does anyone ever remember to support their own idea? =p
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.06 00:07:00 - [3] Bump.
klyeme The Mind's Eye Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2010.12.06 02:12:00 - [4] Supported for epic looks!
SandKid	Posted - 2010.12.06 18:31:00 - [5] Would love to see Damnation with proper missile graphics...disco lights might have a competitor finally! Supported.
Anna Ooze	Posted - 2010.12.07 03:47:00 - [6]
AurielS	Posted - 2010.12.07 15:21:00 - [7] Edited by: AurielS on 07/12/2010 15:21:11 I don't even use missiles, but I agree!
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.07 23:51:00 - [8] Bump. For as many views, I'm surprised people aren't supporting this? This thread isn't looking to change balance mechanics and, if the devs can implement it the same as FB solution, could even reduce lag which is ALWAYS a good thing for EVE. Don't just read it, Support it!
Jim Luc Rule of Five	Posted - 2010.12.08 00:02:00 - [9] As a Caldari, I fully support this 100%. Also, randomize the hit spots on the ship models. This is especially noticeable when people are using lasers - all targeting the same point on a ship model. Same goes for where missiles hit. Let's go for realism, randomize the visual location on the client while we're at it.
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2010.12.08 01:38:00 - [10] Absolutely support the missile swarm! No one uses defender missiles anyway so just make missiles act like delayed damage guns and give them awesome Macross-like missile effects and let's call it a day.

galphi Wrecking Shots -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2010.12.08 02:20:00 - [11] I think a lot of people came to the same conclusion when they saw the new fighter/bomber weapon graphics. Replace all missiles with this technique, it'll reduce lag and look so much better!
Halione	Posted - 2010.12.08 03:14:00 - [12] YES! i personally think that missiles should be sorta removed as a clickable object in space like fighter bombers and have defender missiles sort of do fake calculations? like instead of it being a real timed event, make it pre determined with some sort of variation in the missile defender graphical output... ive heard that because missiles are a real object in space that this causes alot of lag... perhaps we can remedy this problem by removing them as a "real object" in space, rework the defenders, revamp the graphics. then we will end up with a awesomer eve!
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.08 03:23:00 - [13] Anyone ever got a Dev tell us how missiles are done graphically? I mean, how hard can it be to leave the fancy first 2-4 seconds be drawn/calculated by the client in a more realistic way? And when that's done let them coem together for the linear 'fire-ball' the server seems to know, but cut off the explosions on the shields/hull once they reached their target (client side again only). /supported support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
matthiastee	Posted - 2010.12.08 14:56:00 - [14]
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.08 22:52:00 - [15] Quote: This is especially noticeable when people are using lasers - all targeting the same point on a ship model. Same goes for where missiles hit. Let's go for realism, randomize the visual location on the client while we're at it. I find this idea very promising, though I don't know enough about the client and programming and such to advance an idea on how that would work. However, given that guns are more or less 'instant damage' and calculate based on the position of the target ship (which presumably has only one position target-able) the ability to change the turrets to not 'focus fire' on single point can probably be changed without affecting any change on the actual mechanic of the weapons. If you've ever watched a miner, you'll know that the lasers will for small moments target different points on a roid as it rotates. This is because for a small time Turret A is closer to Point A whereas Turret B is closer to Point B on the roid. Once the roid rotates enough, both turrets will focus on Point B, until Point C comes into proximity of one turret enough to switch it. This could probably be applied to ship combat forcefully so that the turrets must target different points. Anyways...that likely needs its own thread! If you decide to make one, post the link here so folks can mosey over to it and support it! I appreciate everyone supporting this thread. Keep it up, it will likely be awhile before this could be implemented but if we don't get support behind it CSM won't propose it and CCP might overlook it! If the FB fix indeed proves to be the case for this idea, then that at least saves the dev some groundwork.
Fistme	Posted - 2010.12.08 23:06:00 - [16] Originally by: Tres Farmer Anyone ever got a Dev tell us how missiles are done graphically? I mean, how hard can it be to leave the fancy first 2-4 seconds be drawn/calculated by the client in a more realistic way? And when that's done let them coem together for the linear 'fire-ball' the server seems to know, but cut off the explosions on the shields/hull once they reached their target (client side again only). /supported /thread
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.09 23:40:00 - [17] Bump.
Vertisce Soritenshi O.W.N. Corp OWN Alliance	Posted - 2010.12.10 04:50:00 - [18] These ideas...I like. Sig.Learning skills vote.
Keras Authion	Posted - 2010.12.10 05:15:00 - [19] Supporting! The one big blob pooped out of the center of the ship is boring. Even changing the big blob to a pre-rendered group of smaller blobs (it would still be considered as one object for server calculations) would look good. Bonus points for getting the number of smaler blobs the same as the missiles launched.
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.11 03:49:00 - [20] Bump.

Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.12 20:49:00 - [21] Bump. Even if you don't have any additional input or ideas, please support!
Duchess Starbuckington	Posted - 2010.12.12 23:40:00 - [22] Supported, would also make it easier for the devs to speed missiles up like they intended to do pre-nano nerf. Viable cruise missiles perhaps? O_o _________________________________ ROCKET STATUS: FIX IN PROGRESS...
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.15 03:23:00 - [23] Bump.
Rico Minali Sons Of 0din Chain of Chaos	Posted - 2010.12.15 11:24:00 - [24] Agreed because the 'star trek' look of missiles currently is a bit 80s... And if it can reduce lag then fabbo Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Crazy KSK	Posted - 2010.12.15 18:39:00 - [25] why not?
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.16 18:55:00 - [26] Bump.
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.17 04:18:00 - [27] Originally by: Alias 6322A Does anyone ever remember to support their own idea on the first post? =p I don't support my threads ethier because I put it forward to the community, it is a change to the game, everyone know what I want. I want to see what the community wants. And I want this so free bump for cooler less missiles. -- I can not decide on a sig yet. Under Construction.
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.19 22:03:00 - [28] Bump.
Ogogov Gallente Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2010.12.20 03:25:00 - [29] I like this idea and agree it could go well in with a larger graphical update (one that correctly shows missing shots missing, for instance, and the correcting the offputting way projectile tracers follow the target) But I do feel that doing this for missiles would really screw with the mechanics of the game, as missiles are actual objects spawned on the server that can be shot down or otherwise adjusted. Your proposal would involve removing all of that and replacing it with a similar system that's used to calculate turret hit chance, maybe with a couple of extra variables for things like flight time and 'interception' chance. Launching Defender missiles would then act like an armor hardener, randomly cutting down the chance for missiles to hit. Also I think CCP SHOULD bite the bullet and put proper hardpoints on missile ships. Just sayin' .
Alias 6322A	Posted - 2010.12.20 18:58:00 - [30] You are very right that this would require some heavy work on the behavior of defender missiles. As my OP says, this could POTENTIALLY be used to reduce lag IF the FB fix is employed in a similar fashion. However, over all, this topic is primarily calling for a graphic update to the missile launch. In all reality the flight, impact, and various effects of different missiles are fine in my opinion. What is lacking is the actual launch of the missiles. The most dangerous part of making actual hard-point graphics (turret-like-launchers) is that ships would now have multiple missile trajectories to be calculated: this would not look half bad but I can't possibly seeing it positively affecting the gameplay (i.e. LAG). That and, as the OP says, many ship skins currently lack the actual hard-point mounts for this idea: the most obvious ship being the drake which has no hard-points in its skin. However other ships have this problem too: after mounting turrets, many ships that utilize missiles as a supplementary weapon don't have additional hard-points in their skins. Surprisingly, the only two ships I can think of that the 'turret-launcher' could work are the Raven and Scorpion skins, which have hard-points on their skins that aren't used typically since the ships favor missiles (though both can equip turrets on their T1 versions). All in all, I really want this graphic change to be supported BUT it should be clear that I (and I'm sure everyone else here) DON'T want it to negatively impact gameplay, be that in mechanic changes that require balancing or the accidental summoning of the CPU-Devouring LAGzor from the planet of DOS. (Sorry if you like DOS...)



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