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HeIIfire11	Posted - 2010.12.04 01:56:00 - [1] So I'm just looking through ship stats of other races I haven't learned,and couldn't help but notice how over powered some Amarr ships are. First off they are the only armor tankers that have a 20% explosive resistance when the rest get 10%.The t2 ships get a 70% explosive resistance and with an eanm or two have as good as no armor weak spot.Not to mention most Amarr ships get a resistance bonus or neut bonus which is very deadly in pvp. Isn't really fair in my opinion No this isn't a whine because I'm starting to train them myself now.Just curious as to what other people think about this.
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 01:58:00 - [2] Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 02:00:32 Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 01:58:56 Originally by: HeIIfire11 Isn't really fair in my opinion That's because your opinion is uninformed. Each race gets a 10% bonus to armor resistance for their T1 ships that corresponds to the primary damage type of their racial enemy. The resists are: Amarr: 10% explosive Minmatar: 10% EM Caldari: 10% thermal Gallente: 10% kinetic T2 ships get a larger bonus to either shield or armor depending on their tanking type. -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:03:00 - [3] Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 04/12/2010 02:03:24 Originally by: Arthur Frayn That's because your opinion is uninformed. Each race gets a 10% bonus to armor resistance for their T1 ships that corresponds to the primary damage type of their racial enemy. The resists are: Amarr: 10% explosive Minmatar: 10% EM Caldari: 10% thermal Gallente: 10% kinetic T2 ships get a larger bonus to either shield or armor depending on their tanking type. Q: And Tech 1 sheilds get **** all. Why? A: Don't ask questions and fly Ammar. -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:04:00 - [4] Originally by: Arthur Frayn Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 02:00:32 Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 01:58:56 Originally by: HeIIfire11 Isn't really fair in my opinion That's because your opinion is uninformed. Each race gets a 10% bonus to armor resistance for their T1 ships that corresponds to the primary damage type of their racial enemy. The resists are: Amarr: 10% explosive Minmatar: 10% EM Caldari: 10% thermal Gallente: 10% kinetic T2 ships get a larger bonus to either shield or armor depending on their tanking type. You know,you are right.I didn't notice that.I just started looking because The t3 Amarr cruiser has like 90% explosive resistance and was wondering wheres the soft spot?There is none. But thanks for pointing that out.That clears it up a bit.
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:06:00 - [5] Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 02:08:13 Originally by: Alara IonStorm Q: And Tech 1 sheilds get **** all. Why? A: Don't ask questions and fly Ammar. Because shields regenerate by themselves - allowing for insane passive regen tanking. More resists would overpower them. Each defense type has a slight advantage but in different ways. Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:33:00 - [6] Originally by: Arthur Frayn Because shields regenerate by themselves - allowing for insane passive regen tanking. More resists would overpower them. Each defense type has a slight advantage but in different ways. Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Hahahahaha Yes recharge is a huge matter in PVP, it sure makes sense now why there are 1600mm Plates and no X-Large Sheild extenders. Originally by: Arthur Frayn Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Awww Fail Kitten Troll has Claws. -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
Dirk Mortice	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:41:00 - [7] Originally by: Alara IonStorm Originally by: Arthur Frayn Because shields regenerate by themselves - allowing for insane passive regen tanking. More resists would overpower them. Each defense type has a slight advantage but in different ways. Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Hahahahaha Yes recharge is a huge matter in PVP, it sure makes sense now why there are 1600mm Plates and no X-Large Sheild extenders. Originally by: Arthur Frayn Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Awww Fail Kitten Troll has Claws. Who said we were talking about pvp?
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.04 02:46:00 - [8] Originally by: Dirk Mortice Originally by: Alara IonStorm Originally by: Arthur Frayn Because shields regenerate by themselves - allowing for insane passive regen tanking. More resists would overpower them. Each defense type has a slight advantage but in different ways. Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Hahahahaha Yes recharge is a huge matter in PVP, it sure makes sense now why there are 1600mm Plates and no X-Large Sheild extenders. Originally by: Arthur Frayn Grow a brain, you look like you're in desperate need of one. Awww Fail Kitten Troll has Claws. Who said we were talking about pvp? It has serious use on one PVE ship that can get similar tank Active. Point is it doesn't make much difference to buffer. -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
Anubis Xian Reavers	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:01:00 - [9] Active vs Buffer can mean the difference between going pop and not. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal. Word of Chaos
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:04:00 - [10] Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 03:04:38 Originally by: Alara IonStorm Yes recharge is a huge matter in PVP, it sure makes sense now why there are 1600mm Plates and no X-Large Sheild extenders. Even if you berely buffertank shields, you still get free recharge without the need for remote repping. And X-large extenders boost recharge rate making it better, numbnuts. Oh, and they down slow you down like plates, and they allow you to fit for more damage mods. All while giving you passive regen. And just because uber passive tanking has no real use in PvP except to act as bait, they doesn't devalue the other situations in the game where passive tanking is useful. It's funny that you're ***ing and whining about a mere 10% extra resists that you just have* to have on your shields. How's that brain coming along? It's a slow and steady process, but I know you can do it! -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:04:00 - [11] Originally by: Anubis Xian Active vs Buffer can mean the difference between going pop and not. How do you figure this and in what ships in which situation. -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:08:00 - [12] Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 04/12/2010 03:12:08 Originally by: Dirk Mortice Who said we were talking about pvp? My post was talking about pvp.In pve it makes no difference because you know exactly what damage you will be taking. PvP however you want an omni tank to be ready for what ever,and I agree that caldari has a bit of a problem filling that huge em hole while trying to fit a point and web,or maybe a mwd.Not to mention a cap booster. Edit:And Im talking about the ships as they are,not in a fleet.I'm well aware that you don't fit web/scram on all ships in a fleet.
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:12:00 - [13] Originally by: HeIIfire11 PvP however you want an omni tank to be ready for what ever,and I agree that caldari has a bit of a problem filling that huge em hole while trying to fit a point and web,or maybe a mwd.Not to mention a cap booster. The Moa, Ferox, Drake and Rokh don't. Their ship bonuses give them an extra 25% to EM resist. You fit rigs for EM shield resist to plug the hole and then fit mids for tackle, mwd, point, etc. Of course the smart way to do it is to let others tackle while you do good medium range dps and maintain a good buffer. You don't really expect to solo PvP these days, do you? -- Eventus stultorum magister.
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:15:00 - [14] Originally by: Arthur Frayn Of course the smart way to do it is to let others tackle while you do good medium range dps and maintain a good buffer. You don't really expect to solo PvP these days, do you? Knew you were going to say that,see my edit.You were just a bit faster.But all other races have the ability to tank and fit said modules.
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:26:00 - [15] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Knew you were going to say that,see my edit.You were just a bit faster.But all other races have the ability to tank and fit said modules. And they pay a price for it. They have trouble fitting for DPS and they're much slower with plates fitted. There's a reason why Gallente suck at PvP right now - they're too slow and heavy with plates fitted to close the gap to hit with their blasters. Amarr benefit from incredibly good medium range pulse lasers reducing reliance on speed. Minmatar autocannons have awesome falloff, AND most of them have extremely viable shield buffer fits, allowing for moar DPS and speedtanking. They also don't need cap boosting. Tackle is a non-issue because it's most effective on interceptors and speedtanking cruisers. Using battlecruisers or BS to tackle in a fleet is a bas tactic, and solo PvP in either of them is a good way to get ganked quickly. -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:41:00 - [16] Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 03:43:59 Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 03:42:39 Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 03:41:23 Originally by: Alara IonStorm Then 1600mm Plated Ships with boosted resists, pretty fail argument. Then shield extended ships also with boosted resists and some free regen, pretty fail retort on your part. Originally by: Alara IonStorm Hahaha, 3 is when Dmg Mod are no longer usefull and you are better to fit TE's, as for Missile ships you need an RCU cramed in the low slot nerfing your slot layout more. They'll bumb Sid radius even higher as well midigating speed. Most shieldtanking ships have a max of 5 lows anyway. 3 DMG mods + DCU + whatever strikes your fancy is the norm. I've never needed to use RCU on missile boats. I know how to fit them properly. Sig radius is irrelevant on battleships because everything smaller can usually hit them anyway. If you're flying battlecruisers and below, you can mitigate this with speed mods instead of dps. All told, I'd rather have a bigger speed radius than be slowed to a crawl with plates. Originally by: Alara IonStorm Yea cept they would have to much grid to fit on a Drake and the Rattler is the only benefit. Not a steller arguement. You can fit a full passive on a Drake, Ferox, Nighthgawk, Onyx or Tengu with grid to spare, but whatever. You obviously don't know how to fit ships. By the way, I hope this is an alt you're using to post here. Otherwise, you're an utterly clueless noob who's only been playing Eve for 9 months who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about, and who seems to use mostly shield buffer ships anyway with more losses than kills to your name. Go learn how to fly shieldtanked ships because your fits are a steaming pile of fail. -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Blnukem 192 Amarr Impetar	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:46:00 - [17] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Isn't really fair in my opinion Neither is the drake. Originally by: CCP Navigator This is really not worthy of a thread.
ShahFluffers Gallente Ice Fire Warriors	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:51:00 - [18] Originally by: HeIIfire11 You know,you are right.I didn't notice that.I just started looking because The t3 Amarr cruiser has like 90% explosive resistance and was wondering wheres the soft spot?There is none. But thanks for pointing that out.That clears it up a bit. T2 and T3 Amarr ships do have one soft spot: Thermal damage. Granted, it's not as pronounced a hole as other ships have but it's still there and is often not 'plugged' up. _______________________ "Just because I seem like an idiot doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.04 03:54:00 - [19] Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 04/12/2010 03:54:39 Originally by: Arthur Frayn Most shieldtanking ships have a max of 5 lows anyway. 3 DMG mods + DCU + whatever strikes your fancy is the norm. I've never needed to use RCU on missile boats. I know how to fit them properly. Sig radius is irrelevant on battleships because everything smaller can usually hit them anyway. If you're flying battlecruisers and below, you can mitigate this with speed mods instead of dps. All told, I'd rather have a bigger speed radius than be slowed to a crawl with plates. And yet Armor Battleships are the norm. Originally by: Arthur Frayn You can fit a full passive on a Drake, Ferox, Nighthgawk, Onyx or Tengu with grid to spare, but whatever. You obviously don't know how to fit ships. Yea I do in fact if you were not cherry picking noob mails you would see that. Originally by: Arthur Frayn By the way, I hope this is an alt you're using to post here. Otherwise, you're an utterly clueless noob who's only been playing Eve for 9 months who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about, and who seems to use mostly shield buffer ships anyway with more losses than kills to your name. Go learn how to fly shieldtanked ships because your fits are a steaming pile of fail. Yea picking the ships from when I was about two weeks old and didn't know how to play makes your point. because your so much better at this age And another And another And another -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2010.12.04 04:11:00 - [20] Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 04:11:18 Originally by: Alara IonStorm And yet Armor Battleships are the norm. Because remote armor reps are the norm. Why? Because armortanking capitals are the best. Gallente carriers do the most damage, Amarr carriers have the best fit for logistics, Amarr dreadnought is the best for pos pashing(no ammo use), Gallente Dreadnought is the best Dread for anti-ship warfare(massive drone bonus), shall I go on? In 0.0 combined fleets, you fly the battleships that also tank like your capitals. Originally by: Alara IonStorm Yea I do in fact if you were not cherry picking noob mails you would see that. So you admit to being a liar when you said "Yea cept they would have to much grid to fit on a Drake". Thankyou for undermining your own arguments with cheap retorts. Originally by: Alara IonStorm Yea picking the ships from when I was about two weeks old and didn't know how to play makes your point. Lol, you picked the least appropriate lossmails to call me out on. Those were all situations where I was caught flying unprepared, mostly in wardecs. No skills or fitting choices would have saved me. You should've used this example where I jumped into Losec for a laugh. You sound a little butthurt now. It still doesn't change the fact that you're a 9 month old player who doesn't have the experience to have an opinion worth a damn about PvP. Get back to me when you do. -- Eventus stultorum magister.
William Cooly Sol Enterprises	Posted - 2010.12.04 04:22:00 - [21] ITT: We argue shield vs. armor and buffer vs. active AGAIN. - I troll stupid people.
spoon reaver	Posted - 2010.12.04 07:50:00 - [22] shields vs armor Hull Tank FTW
Hecatonis Amarr	Posted - 2010.12.04 09:18:00 - [23] Originally by: spoon reaver shields vs armor Hull Tank FTW agreed, real men hull tank, i got the certificate to prove it too :P __________________________________________________ stop acting like tw*ts and use your brain
Alyth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2010.12.04 10:23:00 - [24] Edited by: Alyth on 04/12/2010 10:23:31 Originally by: Arthur Frayn Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 04/12/2010 04:11:18 Because remote armor reps are the norm. Why? Because armortanking capitals are the best. Gallente carriers do the most damage, Amarr carriers have the best fit for logistics, Amarr dreadnought is the best for pos pashing(no ammo use), Gallente Dreadnought is the best Dread for anti-ship warfare(massive drone bonus), shall I go on? In 0.0 combined fleets, you fly the battleships that also tank like your capitals. Thats only part of it. The real reason is NO SHIELD SLAVES. That's why armour ships will ALWAYS be better than shield. Not resists. Not fittings. Slaves. And if you fit tank to match your dreads well damn thats just ****ed. Siege green = no RR on dreads so that argument is moot. You'll always be flying with mixed capitals too. so theres always gonna be someone in a Chimera or Lolnidhoggur (which is better at pure logistics than your example of the Archon) to cover the people flying shield tanked support. Originally by:** Alara IonStorm Yea picking the ships from when I was about two weeks old and didn't know how to play makes your point. Quote: You sound a little butthurt now. It still doesn't change the fact that you're a 9 month old player who doesn't have the experience to have an opinion worth a damn about PvP. Get back to me when you do. That's talking absoooooooooooolute *******s. 1: age as no bearing on your skill as pilot, only what you can fly. 2: a lossmail from when they are two weeks old means jack all when you are tossing insults around about being 9 months old. 3: I think you might want to read that comment again while looking in a mirror. Mr Kettle, the pot is calling you black....
Jennifer Starling Amarr	Posted - 2010.12.04 10:46:00 - [25] Edited by: Jennifer Starling on 04/12/2010 10:49:19 Originally by: HeIIfire11 So I'm just looking through ship stats of other races I haven't learned and couldn't help but notice how over powered some Amarr ships are. First off they are the only armor tankers that have a 20% explosive resistance when the rest get 10%.The t2 ships get a 70% explosive resistance and with an eanm or two have as good as no armor weak spot. It's not that Minmatar T2 shield resistances are so low (75% 50% 40% 60%) and some ships even get an extra %5/level resistance bonus on top of that. And at least they don't have to waste slots for cap stuff nor do they have to sacrifice speed for extra armor plates/rigs, like most Amarr ships do. And shields also regenerate on top of that. They can also improve these resistances with Invulnerability Fields. So it's not as bad as you think.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2010.12.04 10:49:00 - [26] Edited by: MotherMoon on 04/12/2010 10:49:03 take a look at minmatar tech2 resistances imo they are a better spread
Zaboth Garadath Amarr Ore Extraction Corporation	Posted - 2010.12.04 12:18:00 - [27] Originally by: HeIIfire11 So I'm just looking through ship stats of other races I haven't learned,and couldn't help but notice how over powered some Amarr ships are. First off they are the only armor tankers that have a 20% explosive resistance when the rest get 10%.The t2 ships get a 70% explosive resistance and with an eanm or two have as good as no armor weak spot.Not to mention most Amarr ships get a resistance bonus or neut bonus which is very deadly in pvp. Isn't really fair in my opinion No this isn't a whine because I'm starting to train them myself now.Just curious as to what other people think about this. If you put it in that way, it does seem that Amarr have better ships than the rest. But when you realize most people fly caldari and minmatar ships, you really have to ask if it makes any difference. _____________________________________________ 'If you really want to make someone hate you, explain to them, logically and politely, why they are wrong' - J. Baylock

CCP Navigator C C P C C P Alliance	Posted - 2010.12.04 12:52:00 - [28] Moved from General Discussion to Ships & Modules. Navigator Senior Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online

Nuniki Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.12.04 14:35:00 - [29] o_0 This type of thread usually goes the other way for Amarr. Hehe.

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