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Kariva	Posted - 2010.12.25 07:43:00 - [1] Edited by: Kariva on 25/12/2010 07:51:22 When you run in 3d mode(glasses,redcyan ,etc...) it looks little crapy. Is CCP planing to upgrade their compability witch the new technology ?
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:08:00 - [2] You need to be more specific.. Also, what do you expect from a 3D environment where distances are so huge, that any 3D effect will not be really visible. The only places where I would expect 3D to have any use and also recognisability would be: - tactical overview - solar system map - space map - spinning your ship, docked in station Anywhere else it's practically useless. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Zora'e Amarr Royal Black Watch Highlanders Warped Aggression	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:08:00 - [3] Originally by: Kariva Edited by: Kariva on 25/12/2010 07:51:22 When you run in 3d mode(glasses,redcyan ,etc...) it looks little crapy. Is CCP planing to upgrade their compability witch the new technology ? Honestly.. every few years a new 3D craze overwhelms the world. It wasn't good the first time, second time, third time etc. When will people get it through their thick skulls that 3D is nothing more than a very poor visual gimmick. - Ceiling Cat may be watching you, but Basement Cat is shooting at you!
Kariva	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:15:00 - [4] Originally by: Tres Farmer You need to be more specific.. Also, what do you expect from a 3D environment where distances are so huge, that any 3D effect will not be really visible. The only places where I would expect 3D to have any use and also recognisability would be: - tactical overview - solar system map - space map - spinning your ship, docked in station Anywhere else it's practically useless. If you turn 3D on you will see the flat screen moving 2cm back and thats's all in EVE . Would be nice to see your ship in 3D in hangar and in front of a station. It would realy look great... If someone played other games in true 3d he knows what i mean. Just look at the effects in JC2 or BATMAN... or any other game fullly suporting 3d...
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:18:00 - [5] Originally by: Zora'e Originally by: Kariva When you run in 3d mode(glasses,redcyan ,etc...) it looks little crapy. Is CCP planing to upgrade their compability witch the new technology ? Honestly.. every few years a new 3D craze overwhelms the world. It wasn't good the first time, second time, third time etc. When will people get it through their thick skulls that 3D is nothing more than a very poor visual gimmick. There are uses for this.. If you can see naturally where everyone is on the tactical overview without the need to rely on the artificial vertical markers onto the plane and without the need to constantly turn it around to get a feeling for it. It would also be nice to have this feature for the star map. Though, the uses there are very limited as you can't really do anything there, where you would need 3D orientation. But maybe if we get gate-less space travel this might become useful.. Also this time around 3D will stay and have a break through. Personally I only go into the cinema for one thing: Blockbuster in 3D. Anything else I'm not interested any more and can wait until they bring it on BR/DVD. 5 years down the road I'll have my own 50" 3D LED TFT and that's it then. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Zora'e Amarr Royal Black Watch Highlanders Warped Aggression	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:19:00 - [6] Edited by: Zora''e on 25/12/2010 08:23:16 Originally by: Kariva Just look at the effects in JC2 or BATMAN... or any other game fullly suporting 3d... Don't know about JC2 but Batman? Please... some dude running around in tights and hangin with a teenage boy. Doesn't take any brains to know what is REALLY going on THERE. edit 4 Tres Farmer I went to Costco a few weeks back and they had a wide screen TV there (was probably about 50in) that was built for 3d. I will be frankly honest. If that is the current tech for 3d, it hasn't improved. The visual on the TV sucked major dog backside. - Ceiling Cat may be watching you, but Basement Cat is shooting at you!
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:24:00 - [7] Originally by: Kariva Originally by: Tres Farmer You need to be more specific.. Also, what do you expect from a 3D environment where distances are so huge, that any 3D effect will not be really visible. The only places where I would expect 3D to have any use and also recognisability would be: - tactical overview - solar system map - space map - spinning your ship, docked in station Anywhere else it's practically useless. If you turn 3D on you will see the flat screen moving 2cm back and thats's all in EVE . Would be nice to see your ship in 3D in hangar and in front of a station. It would realy look great... If someone played other games in true 3d he knows what i mean. Just look at the effects in JC2 or BATMAN... or any other game fullly suporting 3d... Sorry, I don't have those stuff at home to test it. What flat screen are you talking about? The whole view that is visible in usual 2D is moved virtually INTO the TFT? Are there any driver settings for your 3D stuff that would force this onto the graphics of games like AA settings and the like? I mean, the 3D part is done by the graphics card.. and the only things I assume those other 3D-supported games do is somehow manage to do some optimisations for the 2D UI overlayed onto the 3D stuff.. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:29:00 - [8] Originally by: Zora'e I went to Costco a few weeks back and they had a wide screen TV there (was probably about 50in) that was built for 3d. I will be frankly honest. If that is the current tech for 3d, it hasn't improved. The visual on the TV sucked major dog backside. We'll, I was talking cinema NOW and 3D 50" for home use in about 5 YEARS. Had you been to the cinema and seen one of the 3D movies? Can't talk much about the story for Avatar (dances with the wolves V2.0) for example, but the 3D was stunning.. The glasses suck and for home use the screens and tech isn't ripe yet either, but as I said.. this time 3D will stay with us. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Zora'e Amarr Royal Black Watch Highlanders Warped Aggression	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:32:00 - [9] Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Zora'e I went to Costco a few weeks back and they had a wide screen TV there (was probably about 50in) that was built for 3d. I will be frankly honest. If that is the current tech for 3d, it hasn't improved. The visual on the TV sucked major dog backside. We'll, I was talking cinema NOW and 3D 50" for home use in about 5 YEARS. Had you been to the cinema and seen one of the 3D movies? Can't talk much about the story for Avatar (dances with the wolves V2.0) for example, but the 3D was stunning.. The glasses suck and for home use the screens and tech isn't ripe yet either, but as I said.. this time 3D will stay with us. I wish. I would have loved to see Avatar in 3D just to experience what everyone was raving about. Unfortunately, no theaters anywhere close to where I live run anything in 3d. And getting to the ones that do entails either flying, or taking a boat. - Ceiling Cat may be watching you, but Basement Cat is shooting at you!
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:39:00 - [10] Originally by: Zora'e Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Zora'e I went to Costco a few weeks back and they had a wide screen TV there (was probably about 50in) that was built for 3d. I will be frankly honest. If that is the current tech for 3d, it hasn't improved. The visual on the TV sucked major dog backside. We'll, I was talking cinema NOW and 3D 50" for home use in about 5 YEARS. Had you been to the cinema and seen one of the 3D movies? Can't talk much about the story for Avatar (dances with the wolves V2.0) for example, but the 3D was stunning.. The glasses suck and for home use the screens and tech isn't ripe yet either, but as I said.. this time 3D will stay with us. I wish. I would have loved to see Avatar in 3D just to experience what everyone was raving about. Unfortunately, no theaters anywhere close to where I live run anything in 3d. And getting to the ones that do entails either flying, or taking a boat. That explains that. I'm really sorry for you. I hope you get a chance for this soon though, cause it's really exiting the first 2-3 times. I think I was 3 times in Avatar for this (100km drive one tour) So if you go, buy two shows, cause you want to see it again asap And I really agree on the tv sets.. not ripe yet, but show me one early adapted tech for home use which could be considered good (mobile phones anyone or home computers?). Give it time. Cinemas won't drop it any more, cause 3D is the BIG selling point above 40" home screens with 7.1 sound. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX

Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:41:00 - [11] I saw a movie in 3d when I was a kid.... well it honestly isn't any better in feature films, and is pretty much just a way to make movie tickets cost even more.
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 08:56:00 - [12] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton I saw a movie in 3d when I was a kid.... well it honestly isn't any better in feature films, and is pretty much just a way to make movie tickets cost even more. ..as a kid? You mean red-blue-glasses or those special dome-widescreen theatres which offered 3D documentations/shortstories since the 80'ies? IMAX.. that had been my 1st contact with this tbh.. a movie about a kid in the future aboard a space station.. all in 3D. 15min long. PS: most of the pictures I wan't to keep for remembering stuff I do in 3D since 10 years now. First just by moving the camera horizontally about 50cm and taking another picture (if stuff moves the result is bad though) and since 2 years I modded 2 samsung digital cameras to release at the same time. Can even do waterfalls and plants in the wind now without loss in 3D quality.. And since 1 year I think Fujifilm has a camera out that does this natively with 2 lenses.. PPS: people who say that this is just FOTM stuff always baffle me. If it were up to you, then we'd still have b/w tv.. or even just radio.. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Kry Nanase GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.12.25 10:06:00 - [13] My laptop is a 5740DG (acer) with a 3d screen. It comes with tridef stereoscopic driver and I have tested it with eve. The game is not supported, but it works. It doesn't give you a flat screen or anything like that. You see it in true 3d, and it is configurable. So depending on your settings, you can see it flat or with different levels of depth. I thought it was really impressive, enough to show it to a friend who dislikes eve, and he thought the same. When you are docked everything suddenly looks huge, I don't know how to explain it. It's like if you were looking to a HUGE place through a window. Once you undock, again stations feel huge as hell, it's not something I can explain, you have to see it yourself. Unfortunately, it is not playable. There are graphic glitches because the game is not supported, and you feel quite dizzy because of that. Even if it was supported I'm not sure I would feel comfortable with it. I am in other games, but in eve, I don't know. I just wanted to say it works, sort of, and for some minutes it was quite amazing.
Wiki Leaks	Posted - 2010.12.25 10:23:00 - [14] You'd be amazed that we've had true 3D in cinema for years, only they are called theatres. And nobody wants to see them. Every single moment of my life is in 3d. Not sure what you kids have been doing... walking round with one eye closed? 3D technology, the additional of conditionally visibly data, would have much better application that simply faking a 3rd representation dimension which collapses the moment you moved your head. 2 player games on one fullscreen would be one, right off the top of my head. The only good result of this latest resurrection of a terrible idea was that everybody who wouldn't shut up about Transformers has now shut up about Transformers, sadly only to yack endlessly about Avatar, but I'll take what I can.
Nuniki Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.12.25 10:23:00 - [15] Edited by: Nuniki on 25/12/2010 10:24:44 Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton stuff + PPS: people who say that this is just FOTM stuff always baffle me. If it were up to you, then we'd still have b/w tv.. or even just radio.. Going to have to "strongly agree" here. If it were up to the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it!" crowd, we'd be clubbing down deer in the wilderness and cooking it over an open fire, an open fire we FOUND. If you are reading this, you are lucky.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2010.12.25 11:12:00 - [16] Quote: My laptop is a 5740DG (acer) with a 3d screen. It comes with tridef stereoscopic driver and I have tested it with eve. The game is not supported, but it works. It doesn't give you a flat screen or anything like that. You see it in true 3d, and it is configurable. So depending on your settings, you can see it flat or with different levels of depth. I thought it was really impressive, enough to show it to a friend who dislikes eve, and he thought the same. When you are docked everything suddenly looks huge, I don't know how to explain it. It's like if you were looking to a HUGE place through a window. Once you undock, again stations feel huge as hell, it's not something I can explain, you have to see it yourself. Unfortunately, it is not playable. There are graphic glitches because the game is not supported, and you feel quite dizzy because of that. Even if it was supported I'm not sure I would feel comfortable with it. I am in other games, but in eve, I don't know. I just wanted to say it works, sort of, and for some minutes it was quite amazing. I played EvE with: - eDimensional shutter glasses (plus dongle) - iZ3D drivers, something like TriDef you used but imho they are better. EvE looks good, only issues are: - the whole 3D depth seems "boxed" to a certain range, there's not an huge depth of field as someone would expect off space distances. - close planets for some reason tend to have an odd divergence - writings are hard to look, because the 3D scene would naturally make you look at it from a "natural" distance, while writings are so small that you must look close at the screen and then the 3D scenery looks too close. - Auditing & consulting When looking for investors, please read http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
Siouxsie B	Posted - 2010.12.25 11:23:00 - [17] The current glut of 3D is utter *******s and I don't want it, ever. Why the hell would you want someone else deciding your focus point for you? That's what the 3D TVs and glasses sets do, don't be fooled into thinking that it's actually 3D. 'Real 3D' would be holographic 3D and nothing else will work. Try focussing in on something in the background in a '3D' film/game - or try watching an enemy other than the one the director/programmer has decided you are looking at - it doesn't work properly. Waste of time and money and it only fools thickies...
Kroisia	Posted - 2010.12.25 11:32:00 - [18] This concept has held my interest for quite awhile now... and I think Tres Farmer is right about it "staying with us"... large corps (RL) are throwing a lot of money at the technology and are finally starting to expand the content. There are only like two sample videos on Youtube for EVE in 3d, and they're a good example of how a game shouldn't be implementing 3D... the UI handling was awful. But... EVE isn't really geared up for it (yet), which comes back to the OP's original question, and a valid one given the quantity of games that are starting to put effort into supporting the new content. With the refined graphics capabilities of EVE and how realistic it is (over other games), IMO, it'd be awesome to see CCP start working toward making a nicely usable 3D setup. Don't think they're too far off as it is... just need to garner some support from the playerbase to help get them thinking about it (if they're not already). And no, I don't agree with the idea that this is going to remain a "visual gimmick"... graphics cards and rendering capabilities have FINALLY reached the point where they can handle (and properly render) 3D environments. It'll become the norm in the near future - almost the same as seeing 50% of people driving down the road talking on cell phones. (think the old HAMs of the day would have thought their communications niche would be overtaken by almost every teen in the modern world?? Doubt it!)
Murev Vorchilde Caldari End Game.	Posted - 2010.12.25 11:49:00 - [19] Edited by: Murev Vorchilde on 25/12/2010 11:49:17 Originally by: Siouxsie B The current glut of 3D is utter *******s and I don't want it, ever. Why the hell would you want someone else deciding your focus point for you? That's what the 3D TVs and glasses sets do, don't be fooled into thinking that it's actually 3D. 'Real 3D' would be holographic 3D and nothing else will work. Try focussing in on something in the background in a '3D' film/game - or try watching an enemy other than the one the director/programmer has decided you are looking at - it doesn't work properly. Waste of time and money and it only fools thickies... You dont want the director deciding your focus point?, wow thats very weird - How Id Fix Secret world of pensioners
Decus Daga	Posted - 2010.12.25 11:51:00 - [20] I personally hope its not too far into the future. Ive been looking at a 3d projector for a few months now(holding off until the tech gets a little more worn in lol). Yeah saw avatar, both in 3d and 2d, 3d rocked like hell, ive seen eve in 3d at a mates - yeah station spinning looks great! reading text = meh. But hey, im sure with proper support they can denote the text box to be pure fore-front. Honestly its going to happen, and yes im old enough to remember the old versions of 3d :P Decus Daga Medjai Prime

Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 12:30:00 - [21] Originally by: Siouxsie B Why the hell would you want someone else deciding your focus point for you? That's what the 3D TVs and glasses sets do, don't be fooled into thinking that it's actually 3D. 'Real 3D' would be holographic 3D and nothing else will work. Try focussing in on something in the background in a '3D' film/game - or try watching an enemy other than the one the director/programmer has decided you are looking at - it doesn't work properly. If that's the case for 3D, then it's the same for 2D.. LOL. Also, in the critism section of wikipedia about 3D films this problem is mentioned and they're working on it apparently. Btw.. when they introduced audio on films or colour, did you also 'don't want it ever'? Cause, the audio from the movie can never be the real audio. And the colours can't never be the real colours.. LOLOLOLOLOLOL support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
ILikeMarkets	Posted - 2010.12.25 12:31:00 - [22] Honestly, I'd prefer they wouldn't- not yet. The current 3D technology is still insufficient. It is far better than previous attempts, I'll give em that, but it is not something people are ready to commit to 100%. That being said, it would be a huge waste of resources as CCP would probably finish the migration right as the current craze ended and the next 3D technology emerged.
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 12:40:00 - [23] Originally by: ILikeMarkets Honestly, I'd prefer they wouldn't- not yet. The current 3D technology is still insufficient. It is far better than previous attempts, I'll give em that, but it is not something people are ready to commit to 100%. That being said, it would be a huge waste of resources as CCP would probably finish the migration right as the current craze ended and the next 3D technology emerged. If they rework the UI next anyway, why not? Can't cause that much work on top of it.. The only thing they have to take care of is that the UI needs to be rendered differently for 3D (right/left eye) so they can adjust it's virtual distance from the human sitting in front of the screen.. Then some special treatment for brackets in space and voila.. ready. support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Kry Nanase GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.12.25 12:56:00 - [24] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Quote: stuff I played EvE with: - eDimensional shutter glasses (plus dongle) - iZ3D drivers, something like TriDef you used but imho they are better. EvE looks good, only issues are: - the whole 3D depth seems "boxed" to a certain range, there's not an huge depth of field as someone would expect off space distances. - close planets for some reason tend to have an odd divergence - writings are hard to look, because the 3D scene would naturally make you look at it from a "natural" distance, while writings are so small that you must look close at the screen and then the 3D scenery looks too close. I had those same issues with tridef. However I don't remember it being boxed. Actually that was what impressed me, the stations where huge and very far away, it was... a different game. Maybe it's just my perception, or that I'm not used to the effect. Or perhaps it's a difference in this particular game with tridef and iz3d. Maybe it was all in my mind. I suppose all the drivers let you configure the same things. For those who don't know, Tridef let's you modify the level of depth (how flat objects look) and the depth level where the scene is rendered. So you can have a 2d plane and move it, or you can have 3d objects inside or outside it. With maximum depth the inside of stations was really really big, but I guess the divergence was too high and it made me feel uncomfortable. I also had the problem you say with planets, and another issue where both images (right and left eye) would suddenly move, ruining the effect (this was the most important problem). A tridef bug IZ3D doesn't have, I guess. Also, I was using passive glasses with interlaced images, so I could barely read the text, as that halves the vertical resolution.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.12.25 13:26:00 - [25] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha EvE looks good, only issues are: - the whole 3D depth seems "boxed" to a certain range, there's not an huge depth of field as someone would expect off space distances. That rather sounds like it's working as it should. The thing about depth perception in a space game is that the distances will (or should) be so huge that you'll have next to no parallax so beyond even fairly small distances, everything just becomes flatà àunless you change the interocular distance, but then everything runs the risk of just looking like small-scale toys. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Shintai Gallente Arx Io Orbital Factories Arx Io	Posted - 2010.12.25 14:11:00 - [26] Edited by: Shintai on 25/12/2010 14:12:14 Why would EvE support the current crappy "3D" using blur and out of focus to create a false 3D? Its like asking why EvE doesnt support the previous 3D attempt with the red/blue glasses. Or why it doesnt support another fail technology like eyefinity etc. In 1-2 years I bet you the current "3D" will be gone again. Just like its predecessors. It will only stay the day we get real 3D. But thats like 10-20 years away atleast. Also a small sidenote: About 10% of all people is directly unable to see this fake 3D. And another 10% or so got so good eye coordination that this fake 3D gives them headaches, dizzyness, nausia etc. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Grez Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2010.12.25 14:24:00 - [27] Not to do with the software. Tell NVIDIA to fix their drivers. It just interprets the scene and renders two images certain distances apart. If it's interpreting that incorrectly, you get crappy 3D. ---
Shintai Gallente Arx Io Orbital Factories Arx Io	Posted - 2010.12.25 15:12:00 - [28] Originally by: Grez Not to do with the software. Tell NVIDIA to fix their drivers. It just interprets the scene and renders two images certain distances apart. If it's interpreting that incorrectly, you get crappy 3D. Drivers dont matter essentially. Its the same issue in the cinema. Look outside of what the director wants you to see. And you get punished badly in this fake 3D. You could just start to play/watch in a fraction of the resolution. And never think while you watch. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.12.25 15:22:00 - [29] Originally by: Shintai Originally by: Grez Not to do with the software. Tell NVIDIA to fix their drivers. It just interprets the scene and renders two images certain distances apart. If it's interpreting that incorrectly, you get crappy 3D. Drivers don't matter essentially. Its the same issue in the cinema. Look outside of what the director wants you to see. And you get punished badly in this fake 3D. You could just start to play/watch in a fraction of the resolution. And never think while you watch. Why do you keep it calling fake 3D? It's a picture for each eye, like in real life.. You have the effect of focus being at a distinct depth the director intended (or better the cameras had focused on) and can't naturally focus how you want, but you can't do that on a 2D movie either.. So I really don't see the problem. That's like wanting a real golden colour tone on your screen and your monitor can't deliver it, cause he can't create 'gold'. I had no problem looking around on a screen with.. uh.. I don't know.. probably 12m wide and 6m high and could look at what I wanted. All was 3D. You can't tilt your head while watching, as the polarisation filters won't work any more then.. but besides that there was no real flaw. So, if you could describe what your real problem with it is..? support Public Idea Tracker \| 24hr PLEX
Herping yourDerp	Posted - 2010.12.25 15:44:00 - [30] Eve in 3D's expansion will be called Headache Innnnnnnnnnnnn spaaaaaaaaaaaacccceeeeeee



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