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Question2
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Posted - 2005.01.19 03:50:00 -
[1]
Which would imply that caldari is the best race because they are the specialized missle race.
Im minmatar.Ive tried using autocanons.I got shot up,did low damage,ate ammo like no tommorrow and took forever to kill stuff.
Then i went to howitzers.I did med damage,but had to constantly stay at a certain range,which made collecting loot a pain in the ass......especially when missions throw waves at you.
I then went to missles.I did very high damage,never missed,never had to worry about tracking,never had to worry about optimal range.I just warped in,started spamming missles as the rats raced towards me,and moved to collect loot.
Even with level 2 missle oepration and level 1 standard missles,howitzers simply couldnt compare......even with gunnery 4,sharpshooter 2,surgical strike 2 and a myraid of other gunnery skills.I didnt even do 50% of the damage 75% of the time.
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F'nog
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Posted - 2005.01.19 04:01:00 -
[2]
For new players, missiles are easier. You have to train more skills to be effective with guns, but when you do, you can outdamage missiles with good hits, and there are many more advantages, like no travel time.
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Sergeant Spot
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Posted - 2005.01.19 05:19:00 -
[3]
Missiles are the uber NPC killing ammo.
For pvp, missiles have 'value' (especially if used wisely), but guns can be better.
For few skill points, missile are good, but with many skills points, guns are better at pvp.
As for the idiots that want missile advantages nerfed, I have no problem with that IF, and ONLY IF, missiles are also buffed at the same time so they gain new advantages to keep them balanced with guns.
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Infinity Ziona
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Posted - 2005.01.19 05:38:00 -
[4]
IMO Missiles are arguably the best PvP weapon, primarily because people don't want to 'gimp' their setups by fitting anti-missile defenses like smartbombs, defenders or don't know how to or don't want to learn how to.
IMO Lasers are the UBER NPC weapon, not missiles. 0 Ammo, awesome damage and when combined with apoc super tank with its cap laser bonus or the Armageddon with its laser bonuse, you can sit in a belt and chain very big spawns that would eat a Raven or Scorp shield tank for dinner and you can do so indefinitely, long after the Raven or Scorp needed to return to base for missiles.
So I don't think the that the title is accurate at all.
Infinity Ziona
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Wendat Huron
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Posted - 2005.01.19 05:59:00 -
[5]
Then again you can outrun missiles.
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Daakkon
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Posted - 2005.01.19 06:02:00 -
[6]
the missile overhaul will introduce alot of new missile skills so missile boats are more specialized
missile overhaul will probably come in febuary or march if in march then the ew overhaul will be in febuary
www.dark-cartel.com |
Bernard Normal
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Posted - 2005.01.19 09:15:00 -
[7]
If the 'overhaul' follows normal CCP procedure they'll take away many of the advantages only to let us build them back up with months of training. As we're addicted (well, I am) we'll grumble a bit but take whatever they throw at us.
I've definitely grown more cynical, you know.
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Siddy
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Posted - 2005.01.19 10:01:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Daakkon
the missile overhaul will introduce alot of new missile skills so missile boats are more specialized
missile overhaul will probably come in febuary or march if in march then the ew overhaul will be in febuary
i hope it will nerf missiles to hell and back
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Thyro
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Posted - 2005.01.19 10:24:00 -
[9]
The main issues with missiles are:
They always hit the target (if the targeted ship doesn't have counter measures).
They always do the same level of damage (which doesn't happen with anyother weapon in the game).
Therefore missile boat ships are nobrain... just press the fire and wait the results
So are good for NPC including PVP
ATM missiles are the way to go YES... until someone NERFS them too
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Ishana
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Posted - 2005.01.19 10:26:00 -
[10]
Well I play minmatar and ever since I learned the torp skill to 1 I'm raking in the isk doing lvl 4 missions solo. It's so insanly easy to do it's not even funny anymore.
So get a phoon and start spamming torps, or just go train caldari and have 1 setup to rule them all.
just my 2 isk
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Scorpyn
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Posted - 2005.01.19 10:33:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Thyro
The main issues with missiles are:
They always hit the target (if the targeted ship doesn't have counter measures).
They always do the same level of damage (which doesn't happen with anyother weapon in the game).
Therefore missile boat ships are nobrain... just press the fire and wait the results
So are good for NPC including PVP
ATM missiles are the way to go YES... until someone NERFS them too
Actually I disagree with those being any problem. Turrets have average damage and higher rof so it's evening itself out anyway.
The problems as I see it are :
1. Battleship size missiles can hit frigs easier than frig size missiles, it should (perhaps) be the other way around. However, turrets are a lot better than missiles at long range, so maybe this isn't that much of a problem - missiles (or drones) for anitfrig short range, turrets for antifrig long range.
2. Missiles require less training time than turrets to be effective. This is the main problem as I see it.
btw projectiles are being boosted atm because they're too bad.
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Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.01.19 10:53:00 -
[12]
I helped a guy flying an Apoc kill a L4 mission spawn today, he shot a Guristas Scorp for about 2-3 minutes and got it down to about 75% shields.
I opened up with the Raven with Kinetic Torps and killed the damn thing in about a minute or so.
So yes, beams are cheaper in the long run but if you build your own ammo from recycled loot it really doesn't make a difference.
www.hadean.org
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Basileus
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Posted - 2005.01.19 11:02:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Infinity Ziona
...'gimp' their setups by fitting anti-missile defenses like smartbombs, defenders or don't know how to or don't want to learn how to...
So smartboms work as missile defense as well then? I though only defenders were used for such purposes...(?)
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Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.01.19 11:05:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Basileus
Originally by: Infinity Ziona
...'gimp' their setups by fitting anti-missile defenses like smartbombs, defenders or don't know how to or don't want to learn how to...
So smartboms work as missile defense as well then? I though only defenders were used for such purposes...(?)
Yes, smartbombs can be used for missile defense.
You just have to time it right, and have a smartbomb fitted that does more damage to the missile than it's hitpoints can withstand.
www.hadean.org
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Jin Entres
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Posted - 2005.01.19 11:37:00 -
[15]
Not another topic about missiles?
I'm only going to remind you about missile wastage. Shooting npcs in a complex you're bound to lose many missiles miscalculating the amount needed to take down an enemy far away. Just another downside.
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Uridium
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Posted - 2005.01.19 12:54:00 -
[16]
Yep with defenders, smart bombs and just plain distance Missiles do have a hard time, which is why i fully understand turret users who have......well turret disruptors that nobody ever uses to counter them NEED missiles to be nerfed more.. in fact add a anti missile turrets and drones that take missiles out too, oh yeah and make em pay 100 isk per missile they want to fire by way of a pop up box in the middle of thier screen. Top that off with turrets hitting wrecking shots everytime without fail and i rekon it will be about level 
These posts from people wanting whatever they dont use nerfed to kingdom come really do make me laugh 
Mentioning no names of course.
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Your Clipper Lighter Perfectly Strikes Hash Wrecking it for 0.57 grams 8) |
Valentine Keen
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Posted - 2005.01.19 13:06:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
Missiles are the uber NPC killing ammo.
For pvp, missiles have 'value' (especially if used wisely), but guns can be better.
For few skill points, missile are good, but with many skills points, guns are better at pvp.
As for the idiots that want missile advantages nerfed, I have no problem with that IF, and ONLY IF, missiles are also buffed at the same time so they gain new advantages to keep them balanced with guns.
Sadly though, they're not balanced in the first place, which is why they've been working on changing them for ages. Sure, some new things might come along, but don't expect them to keep them as powerful as they are now.
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Lizanne
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Posted - 2005.01.19 13:26:00 -
[18]
With hi Perception and willpower, guns will always be better with a little training...
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Rift Scorn
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Posted - 2005.01.19 13:33:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Daakkon
the missile overhaul will introduce alot of new missile skills so missile boats are more specialized
Well overdue if you asks meh!
on a total hi-jacking off topic moment, Daak, i heards j00 was up in BKG- a few days ago 
Should proove interesting 
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Question2
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Posted - 2005.01.19 14:27:00 -
[20]
I think its a combination of certain guns being underpowered and missles being overpowered.
For one thing.....its simply a godsend having an optimal range of everything.In some level 1 missions ive had to kill 10+ rats in waves.Fiddling to make sure i stay at the optimal range 10+ times in a single mission would drive me mad with micro-management boredom,and would ensure i would have to spend some 10+ minutes getting near cargo containers.
Secondly,the shorter range weapons fire more.....but do less damage.This sounds nice and all but has the unprecendeted side effect of eating ammo like no tommorrow.OKay,after you get started and start raking in some ISK,ammo costs mean nothing....i got 1000 flamebursts for 12k which i can easily get several times over in a single mission,and agents quite frequently give random ammo.The thing is,cargo capacity.......
They also let you get raped by NPC ships mounting missles and close in weapons.The rate at which a rifter loses shield and armor to a standard 0.3 security pirate in close range is simply amazing....NPC ships always have some form of close in weapon that you would have to deal with if you use close range weapons unfornately.
Missles let you stay out of harms way(relatively).
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Jamin Berry
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Posted - 2005.01.19 14:50:00 -
[21]
i say projectiles are the way to go,
i love torps and cruise, but! in fleet battles ur only role can be to take out enemy support craft within ur fleet, because it takes ages for ur torps/cruise to get to the primary/secondry target.
also they will be nerfed, because they are gud gud.
+ projectiles/tempests are gettin unnerfed. and the thing is i can do the dmg of 3 torps (1500) in 1 gud shot from my howy at like 40km instantly also, in my rupture i can almost do the dmg of a torp from 70km away(459 wrecking). pre patch.....
every weapon type has thier advantages, and disadvantages, live with it
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markol
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Posted - 2005.01.19 16:35:00 -
[22]
You think missiles are the super weapon? Try flying a raven in a fleet. Engagements happen at 50km+ so it takes your missiles about 1 minute to get to the target. You know what happens to a target after 5 seconds of concetrated fire by an entire fleet of gankageddons, gankapocs, gankathrons, gankaphoons, and gankapests? I don't care if you are flying 99% resistance to all damage types titan with 3 million HP. You are going to go down long before the first missile hits you. Did you also rememember that misiles have to travel around objects that are in the way? What happens in a battleball? Your target is probably hidden behind 30 different ships that keep moving around. So you are lucky if your misiles still have any fuel to even reach your target.
The only thing you can do in a raven while in a fleet battle is try to pick off frigs and hope that they dont notice you locking them. Spam a few cruise at them, and hope that he does not run away. You can also start spamming torps at a BS that no one called a target on yet, and hope that by the time your torps get close to that BS, some one will make him a target and you will get on the killmail for having landed one volley at him.
Now for the NPC side of things. If I go on a hunt, I fill my hold 50% capacity with misiles, that will last me about 40 minutes of extensive hunts. After which, I have to go back to the station to re-arm. Missiles take up A LOT of space. Never have I had to reload as much when I was driving a megathron. That is part of the reason I am going back to it as soon as I can afford to buy one.
You want to nerf a superweapon? Nerf the gankegeddons.
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Dianabolic
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Posted - 2005.01.19 17:06:00 -
[23]
To answer your question:
You're missing something.
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Sorja
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Posted - 2005.01.19 18:46:00 -
[24]
You can call for a nerf of missiles (btw, only silly people call for nerfs since the nerfbat will hit them next) but the devs won't listen to you.
Just because the devs know their game and have tons of calculation charts that you don't have. You just fell in the common trap: 'the grass is always greener over there'.
I fly missile boats, and as soon as I can I switch to gun boats !
Guns do much more damage, while requiring more skills. And missiles are pathetic in PvP.
I fly a Raven to make cash with missions, only to build wealth untill I have the skills to fly an Eagle, or Harpy, or other races BSs. Unless CCP introduces new stuff that make missiles better in PvP.
It's PvP that keeps the game running, btw, what will you do with your ore and modules if we don't blow them up ?
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Abomination
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Posted - 2005.01.19 20:48:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Sorja
I fly missile boats, and as soon as I can I switch to gun boats !
Guns do much more damage, while requiring more skills. And missiles are pathetic in PvP.
you wont think so once you get scrambled and webbed by a frig you cant do anything about. |
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