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Charlotte Yakamoto
Amarr
Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:07:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Charlotte Yakamoto on 20/01/2011 19:07:52
When wormholes came out, they were the big unknown, unpredictable, nobody knew about statics, so they were interesting and fun. Nowadays we have staticmapper, and every wormhole has become mapped, we always know exactly what to expect, what statics there are, and so on and so forth.
What I suggest is making W-space unpredictable again, as it should be. Make it always have 1 or 2 exits as it has nowadays, but make these exits random. If a wormhole has a static to another wormhole, make that wormhole randomly be a connection to any type of wormhole, so anything from C1 to C6. Likewise, if the wormhole has a kspace connection, make this random too, either HS, LS or Null. It would make life a lot more interesting and fun, plus it would prevent having certain systems being valueable whereas other systems being completely worthless due to their statics.
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Jovan Geldon
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:08:00 -
[2]
Thumbs up to making WH space interesting again
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Charlotte Yakamoto
Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:09:00 -
[3]
Supporting my own proposal.
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Jeddeita
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:10:00 -
[4]
Supported. It'll give a new lease of life back to wspace.
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EVEStuff.net - High Quality Corp & Alliance Web Hosting |
Sedilis
Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:13:00 -
[5]
+1
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Felix Macey
Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:15:00 -
[6]
supported
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Helio Kitty
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:16:00 -
[7]
+1
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Loki Sei
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:22:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Loki Sei on 20/01/2011 19:23:38
Maybe something where it becomes chance based and completely based on class of system. Number of outbound WH would be 0 to 3 with 1 being highest likelihood. Then each WH has certain chance of being either w-space or k-space. If k-space the High, Low, Null would also be chance based witrh Class 1 being maybe 50/30/20, but a Class 6 being 5/25/70 or something. If W-space they would be more heavily weighted to the same class system. So a Class 1 would connect more to Class 1 and 2 then 5 and 6. Same in reverse. Then also each WH has a chance of respawning.
But whole heartedly vote for more "randomness" in statics.
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Greg Huff
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:40:00 -
[9]
 Originally by: Loki Sei
Maybe something where it becomes chance based and completely based on class of system. Number of outbound WH would be 0 to 3 with 1 being highest likelihood. Then each WH has certain chance of being either w-space or k-space. If k-space the High, Low, Null would also be chance based witrh Class 1 being maybe 50/30/20, but a Class 6 being 5/25/70 or something. If W-space they would be more heavily weighted to the same class system. So a Class 1 would connect more to Class 1 and 2 then 5 and 6. Same in reverse. Then also each WH has a chance of respawning.
I like this.
Also add more in w-space. Roaming patrols... I think it's safe to say that we've manage to wake the sleepers, let them be more active. Include (random chance) some higher level signatures and anomalies in lower systems (i.e. C1 can spawn C2 or C3, C4 can spawn C5 or C6) - this provides an occasional challenge to local residents and a potentially serious surprise to w-hole raiders.
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Princess Unicorn
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Posted - 2011.01.20 19:47:00 -
[10]
I support this and wish to see it implemented.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.01.20 21:06:00 -
[11]
+1
As I know little about wormholes, I thought this was how they worked already. I'm a bit disappointed to learn that is not the case.
_____________________________
¬DesuSig |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.20 21:39:00 -
[12]
When busy also make some anomalies at least have random spawns, and that shouldnt mean they bbq everything in site, just that you get a bit more different situations. When busy also implement that for missions, normal anomalies, well pretty much everything.
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Slimy Worm
Lonetrek Salvage and Scrap
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Posted - 2011.01.20 21:41:00 -
[13]
I support the general idea. Another thing to do would be to prevent towers above a certain size from being anchored in low C-level wormholes; wormhole space is supposed to be unknown, not an impregnable fortress-home.
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haav0c
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Posted - 2011.01.21 06:42:00 -
[14]
Hey! Raath worked hard on staticmapper and I worked hard on beta-testing it!
Yes, WH space is predictable, but it's a hell of alot less predictable than null.
Also, not supported because I like my cushy c1 pos farm with highsec exit.
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Raath Nambode
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Posted - 2011.01.21 07:09:00 -
[15]
The answer to this one is simple. If you find that staticmapper makes your life in WH space too easy and you want the element of surprise back...... stop using staticmapper.
Forget I ever wrote it. This game is all about using our imaginations and make believe, so pretend the site doesn't exist and never use it again and hey presto! you have your element of surprise back!
In all honesty though, before I wrote staticmapper, A-HARM and CCRES already had most of the systems mapped out. They knew where you all were and it really ticked them off when I went public with that site so all because a small minority of WH dwellers (I see the site statistics and page hits per day) find life a little too easy won't stop the big boys from having the upper advantage. If you want surprise and challenge, find which systems A-HARM are inhabiting and drop a tower there. That'll present quite a lot of unknowns for you to deal with.
There are still a lot of unknowns about WH space. It's impossible to map WH space because the destination is random but what you're asking also is a little crazy. Imagine being a noob corp in a C1 then spawn a C6 exit and CCRES pop through to say hello. If that's what you guys want then petition CCP to your little hearts out but I still think your crazy.
Leave alone is what I say.
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Jeddeita
Minmatar
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2011.01.21 09:25:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Raath Nambode
The answer to this one is simple. If you find that staticmapper makes your life in WH space too easy and you want the element of surprise back...... stop using staticmapper.
Forget I ever wrote it. This game is all about using our imaginations and make believe, so pretend the site doesn't exist and never use it again and hey presto! you have your element of surprise back!
In all honesty though, before I wrote staticmapper, A-HARM and CCRES already had most of the systems mapped out. They knew where you all were and it really ticked them off when I went public with that site so all because a small minority of WH dwellers (I see the site statistics and page hits per day) find life a little too easy won't stop the big boys from having the upper advantage. If you want surprise and challenge, find which systems A-HARM are inhabiting and drop a tower there. That'll present quite a lot of unknowns for you to deal with.
There are still a lot of unknowns about WH space. It's impossible to map WH space because the destination is random but what you're asking also is a little crazy. Imagine being a noob corp in a C1 then spawn a C6 exit and CCRES pop through to say hello. If that's what you guys want then petition CCP to your little hearts out but I still think your crazy.
Leave alone is what I say.
The point is not that staticmapper cause's it to be unpredictable, rather that the mechanics cause it to be unpredictable. Staticmapper is just a result of those mechanics and opportunity. If you used a system like the one mentioned a few posts up then your chances of getting higher class WH's in lower class ones are weighted against it happening too often. If you make use of mass limits relative to the class of the hole that it's going to then people can't, for example, drop a carrier on a C1 POS... as amusing as it would be from time to time.
If things were truely random then no, the big corps/alliances would not still have things mapped out, you can't map our randomness. You even stated that yourself. Sometimes being a little crazy is a good thing, the world would be a boring place otherwise...
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Raath Nambode
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Posted - 2011.01.21 09:55:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Jeddeita
The point is not that staticmapper cause's it to be unpredictable, rather that the mechanics cause it to be unpredictable.
so stop using it. If you don't use the site, WH space won't be predictable
Originally by: Jeddeita
Staticmapper is just a result of those mechanics and opportunity. If you used a system like the one mentioned a few posts up then your chances of getting higher class WH's in lower class ones are weighted against it happening too often. If you make use of mass limits relative to the class of the hole that it's going to then people can't, for example, drop a carrier on a C1 POS... as amusing as it would be from time to time.
ok have you actually looked into the mass allowance for the static types? This is already a mechanic in the game. C1s only spawn statics allowing Bcs ore smaller in. C3s/C4s nothing larger than an orca, C5s and above anything below super caps. You'll never get a carrier in a C1 unless you build it there, but there's nothing to stop a blob of BCs.
Originally by: Jeddeita
If things were truely random then no, the big corps/alliances would not still have things mapped out, you can't map our randomness. You even stated that yourself. Sometimes being a little crazy is a good thing, the world would be a boring place otherwise...
That is one mindset, however I think folks are missing a massive pointer here. If the cryptic comments of the developers from other threads are anything to go by, there's a reason that CCP didn't add a random mechanic to the WH spawn. It would have been very easy for them to do it, but they didn't. Now my reasoning is they did this for a reason, perhaps as part of the lore and background story regarding WH space. Leads me to believe that these WHs are not as "Random" as some people suppose or would wish them to be. Perhaps there's some intelligent reasoning behind the grouping of certain static types into regions and constellations? Who are the sleepers? are WHs really natural occuring events or was there something more behind them??
WH space appears to be a massive puzzle and the assignment of the statics appears to be part of the key. My site helps to visualise the puzzle and perhaps one day someone will look at the region view and go "Ahah! There'a a pattern here!".
The devs have even said that they're waiting for us to progress the story along and find something and most folks who do crossword puzzles scribble notes in the margin. Staticmapper is little more than a doodle on the side of the cosmic tabloid and I have a feeling that this is an intention of CCP that one of us create a search tool like it. Why else did they not add a random mechanic to the spawn?
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Charlotte Yakamoto
Amarr
Lead Farmers
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Posted - 2011.01.21 11:58:00 -
[18]
This suggestion has absolutely nothing to do with your site, so please don't act as if I insulted you or your work, because I didn't, it is useful and good to have with the current way wormholes work. Not using staticmapper wouldn't change a thing, because the wormholes will still have the same statics as before, my home will still have the same exit wormholes every day.
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Jeddeita
Minmatar
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2011.01.21 12:06:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Raath Nambode
Stuff
If you read what I said regarding mass in relation on one of the suggestions about weighted spawning it makes sense, assuming I'm talking about the current spawning is incorrect as were talking about ways it could be improved.
I know very well how current mass limits work, however if you went around having *random* spawns to random classes then you would have to completely ensure that there would be no way on new eden that people could get things they should be able to into those lower class systems.
If there's a reason for it then so be it, these are suggestions and nothing more.
And as was said, I don't see why your acting like this is a personal attack on your site.
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Raath Nambode
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Posted - 2011.01.21 12:15:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Charlotte Yakamoto
This suggestion has absolutely nothing to do with your site, so please don't act as if I insulted you or your work, because I didn't, it is useful and good to have with the current way wormholes work. Not using staticmapper wouldn't change a thing, because the wormholes will still have the same statics as before, my home will still have the same exit wormholes every day.
I never thought for one moment that you were slating my site at all. But there's a reason why WH space is the way it is. If you look at the development blogs and other posts on the characteristics of WH space, there's cryptic comment after cryptic comment about why WH space operates as it does, but what you're proposing is that CCP forget about whatever future plans they have for W space and ignore what they've already put in place for us to "discover".
Unless we get an official CCP confirmation we're all left guessing but I still thing CCP did this for a planned purpose. I for one have always been excited about W space and can't wait to crack this nut and find out what juicy kernel CCP has in store for us.
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Seamus Donohue
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.21 15:33:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Seamus Donohue on 21/01/2011 15:36:10
Not supported.
I suspect Raath Nambode is correct. I cite as supporting evidence for Raath's point-of-view: http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=31-05-10
"The capsuleers. They will settle. They will understand the network eventually, and they will command it."
__________________________________________________
Survivor of Teskanen, fan of John Rourke. |
Daneel Trevize
Black Viper Nomads
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Posted - 2011.01.21 16:01:00 -
[22]
Random connections would be a nerf to all w-space, people would find it harder to get in and out, and unable to rely on their connections for somewhere to pve or jump those doing pve, or even find people to pvp against who are used to the same level of gangs & effects.
How do you think most people would take it if they get even a few days of only very high/low class holes with no route to restock, no anoms they can reasonably run, and corps with cap ships coming in to break their stuff?
I'd say w-space could do with having a few more dynamics sprinkled about it, but they still won't form a much greater network unless people are scanning more than just static sigs and size 10s. |
Val'Dore
Word Bearers of Chaos
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Posted - 2011.01.21 16:41:00 -
[23]
Every time a website can be built around a game feature that is billed as difficult, unknown, or just random, that game feature is not difficult, unknown, or random enough.
~No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously.~ |
Rafia Landras Audeles
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.01.21 17:26:00 -
[24]
Raath is correct. Wh's work as intended and if they aren't random enough for you, don't use the statics and just use the random exits when they present.
Very not supported.
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Green-Core
The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2011.01.21 17:48:00 -
[25]
Edited by: De''Veldrin on 21/01/2011 17:49:13
No.
If you want unpredictable, move into a C6 WH and wait for AHARM to find you. I guarantee you will have as much unpredictable as you can stand at that point.
You will also be very glad you know how WH's work so you can GTFO when they reinforce all your towers with their Dreadnought and Carrier pairing.
<3 you guys though!
--Vel
I'm more of a care-badger. |
Jovan Geldon
Gallente
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2011.01.28 00:21:00 -
[26]
Originally by: De'Veldrin
If you want unpredictable, move into a C6 WH and wait for AHARM to find you. I guarantee you will have as much unpredictable as you can stand at that point.
No, that isn't unpredictable at all. In fact, I know EXACTLY what would happen if someone did that.
I will concede that there *might* storyline reasons as to why things work as they do, but vague hints of possibly some sort of unknown intelligence behind it all, or maybe not, is no reason to let an exciting and new frontier become stale and homogenous like it is becoming now. We can't say anything with certainty when it comes to W-space and the sleepers, as the many multi-page threads in Eve Fiction show. If they were that desparate to cling onto lore, CCP could just fudge it and say "Yeah, there's been a...supernova...or something...and now all statics are random. Enjoy!" and you'd still have your lore to back it up.
Heck, even just slapping a in few more regional statics would spice it up a little. It doesn't have to be a earth-shattering change to WH mechanics as we know them, it just needs to change a little to throw some more unknown factors into the mix.
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lwxsky oli
FACTS on EVE
OWN Alliance
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Posted - 2011.01.28 02:42:00 -
[27]
supported. this is what I thought how wormholes work now.
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Thune Vorpal
The Night Crew
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Posted - 2011.01.28 08:35:00 -
[28]
Yes
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EdwardNardella
Capital Construction Research
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Posted - 2011.01.28 18:44:00 -
[29]
I do not support removing or changing current wormhole mechanics, but I am open to adding new more random wromholes on top of the current system.
CCRES is recruiting pilots who want to live in WSpace/Wormholes. Fill out an application here! |
Maxx Overseer
Decrypt Enterprise
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Posted - 2011.01.31 14:38:00 -
[30]
yes that was the fun of it
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