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EvE's Unforgiving Nature = More Maturity?

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Mira Robinson Arkons of Myth	Posted - 2011.01.24 08:49:00 - [1] I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Sure, it has it's trolls and griefers, but not nearly as many as with other games. I'm wondering if it's unforgiving universe has something to do with it. Thoughts? ----------------------------- Welcome to EVE. Ship happens.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:00:00 - [2] This smells like science is afoot ! To the bat-statistics-mobile ! _ Make ISK\|\|Build\|\|React\|\|1k papercuts _
Brooks Puuntai Minmatar Nomadic Asylum	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:06:00 - [3] Probably has to do with the fact that EvE is more slow paced then most MMOs. Where character development takes months to years. Also the fact that the game play its self is alot slower and requires patience. The unforgiving probably weeds out the real younger crowd(12-15 Yr Olds) but would be inviting for the older teens.
Kelee Sael	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:07:00 - [4] I suspect that in Eve though since the player you do jerky things to can really ruin your day if he chooses (himself or via mercs) people are probably a little more careful about being a jerk. Stopped playing that other game with a few subscribers (:p) due to every person I met being a complete tool, however in that game they have nothing to worry about from GM's or other players. In Eve the GM's just say "go pod him" :) Of course the few tools you defiantly get are the people that are skilled in the game and have less to worry about :)
Pearre Dash	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:07:00 - [5] Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Haha, what? No way.
Antihrist Pripravnik 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:15:00 - [6] Originally by: Akita T This smells like science is afoot ! To the bat-statistics-mobile ! "The Census report, like most such surveys, had cost an awful lot of money and didn't tell anybody anything they didn't already know ù except that every single person in the Galaxy had 2.4 legs and owned a hyena"
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:54:00 - [7] With which games are you comparing it exactly?
Silver Destiny	Posted - 2011.01.24 09:56:00 - [8] Maybe because young people that are like 13 and 16 lose interest too fast :P
Archbeholder	Posted - 2011.01.24 10:03:00 - [9] Wow playerbase is actually much older than eve on average. Food for thought.
Space Jew Sandwitch	Posted - 2011.01.24 10:04:00 - [10] What the hell? Less griefers than other games? Are you kidding? What do you think griefing is? I guessyou could argue 90% of the player base are just pathetic killmail *****s and not griefers. But... that's almost worse and not more mature
Space Jew Sandwitch	Posted - 2011.01.24 10:10:00 - [11] Originally by: Akita T This smells like science is afoot ! To the bat-statistics-mobile ! I'll warm up the hot air balloon!
Xyrcaryn	Posted - 2011.01.24 10:43:00 - [12] Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Not like it means anything, for windows solitaire gaming community average age would be in 40-s probably
Dr Sheepbringer Gallente	Posted - 2011.01.24 11:10:00 - [13] I think it's more to the slow pace of eve. You can't get into fast packed action in the early stages. With time you get good enough skills to make fast action possible. Yes, you could do that with a limited skill set, but you need experience of finding the actions. Basically you just need to live in eve long enough. That's where these teens get bored. If they can't pick a fight and win ten battles out of nine in the first day. Then they ain't playing it. I very much doubt that the "idiots" even play the whole 14-day period. I mean how many of you knew where and what Jita was in the first day? Probably most of you found out. How many of you knew the bottlenecks and pipelines that lead to 0.0? Which are hunting grounds? Not many. If I want a fight, I know where to guide my ship and I can get into a fight quickly. I think the knowledge of Eve is a key factor in the maturity of players. Also I think some don't really grasp the difference between players and npc's. They might just think you are a npc and leave you alone. I've seen players who trid to chat with the agents and got **ed off at the person In eve you need think more. That probably just hurts their brains. Originally by:** CCP Shadow Dr. Sheepbringer -- It's not that kind of horn.
Sophia Amelia Stone	Posted - 2011.01.24 11:15:00 - [14] I think it's down to a kids idea of fun is different to an older kids (adult) idea of fun.
Jennifer Starling Amarr	Posted - 2011.01.24 11:27:00 - [15] Edited by: Jennifer Starling on 24/01/2011 11:28:11 Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. I'm wondering if it's unforgiving universe has something to do with it. I disagree. For instance the GW playerbase and forums were far more mature than what you read here. And well, unforgiving .. how much does that apply on highsec carebears, for instance? And if you don't mind losing a ship every now and then there's nothing much unforgiving about EVE, except when you're a corp leader in 0.0, which hardly is the majority of the playerbase. Even though the skilltraining is fixed and you don't need to grind I think EVE is far more time consuming than for instance WoW. Travelling takes far more time. It takes far longer to be able to fly a T2 fit BS than to level to max level in WoW, even if you only play an hour a day. EVE is far more hardcore thus attracts more people with a lot of time on their hands. Originally by: Archbeholder Wow playerbase is actually much older than eve on average. Food for thought. Yes I read that too. WoW seems to be more of a family game where (grand)parents and children play along.
Dante Marcellus Minmatar Belligerent Underpayed Tactical Team	Posted - 2011.01.24 11:30:00 - [16] I think not. I've seen the word "gay" on this forum, in the past week, more than I had ever heard it back in High School. And that's only the tip of the pizzaberg. And if you're reading this, you've fallen into a signature trap. You owe me 1m ISK.
Asp IV	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:03:00 - [17] @ OP I see your "unforgiving universe" and raise with 10000.00.00134.124.00 Ƶ"spreadsheet pee vee pee"
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:10:00 - [18] Originally by: Pearre Dash Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Haha, what? No way. This.I used to think so but I learned fast.
Dr Sheepbringer Gallente	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:16:00 - [19] After some thought I also concurred that for example in WoW where the actual gameplay consists of hitting one icon on repeat thus the occasional 2-click combo. In Eve normal gameplay consists of supercombos where three or even four icons are needed! This limiting the userbase average over a single cell ameba. Originally by: CCP Shadow Dr. Sheepbringer -- It's not that kind of horn.
Tiffis	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:40:00 - [20] Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered.
Asp IV	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:43:00 - [21] Originally by: Dr Sheepbringer After some thought I also concurred that for example in WoW where the actual gameplay consists of hitting one icon on repeat thus the occasional 2-click combo. In Eve normal gameplay consists of supercombos where three or even four icons are needed! This limiting the userbase average over a single cell ameba. Trolllolol yeah single cell ameba. That must be it. Moar buttons = moar cells? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-ppqAzrgU4&feature=fvsr /Trollolol
Centri Sixx	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:44:00 - [22] I'd hate to see what you think an immature community is.
Gavjack Bunk Gallente Dark Nexxus S I L E N T.	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:45:00 - [23] oldest playerbases maybe, mature? hmmm... It doesn't tolerate children or their whimsical approach to gaming, that's it's only real strength in my eye. Normally on this forum, you can be quite sure that when somebody is saying something that is absolutely not true, or believing anything CCP say no matter how wrong or stupid, or talking big about the stuff they only wish they had done in their Gangster lives, they're doing it because they are stupid to the core, and not because they are 11 and couldn't know any better.
ivar R'dhak	Posted - 2011.01.24 12:45:00 - [24] Originally by: Tiffis Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Quote: ______________ Mal-¦Appears we got here just in a nick of time. What does that make us?¦ Zoe-`Big damn heroes, sir.` Mal-¦Aint we just.¦
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.01.24 13:03:00 - [25] I already feel a lot more mature, reading this
Aineko Macx	Posted - 2011.01.24 14:00:00 - [26] Edited by: Aineko Macx on 24/01/2011 14:03:28 Originally by: Archbeholder Wow playerbase is actually much older than eve on average. Food for thought. IIRC the average eve player age is 28. What is it for wow? What drives the youngins away is obviously the complexity of the game and the required attention span. I don't know if the community is more mature than others. However, it has some peculiarities because of the demographics eve attracts... ________________________ CCP: Where fixing bugs is a luxury, not an obligation.
Kytayn Gallente	Posted - 2011.01.24 21:39:00 - [27] Originally by: Aineko Macx Edited by: Aineko Macx on 24/01/2011 14:03:28 Originally by: Archbeholder Wow playerbase is actually much older than eve on average. Food for thought. IIRC the average eve player age is 28. What is it for wow?... It is... drum roll... 28.3
Chea Panasty Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.01.24 21:46:00 - [28] Originally by: Brooks Puuntai Probably has to do with the fact that EvE is more slow paced then most MMOs. Where character development takes months to years. Also the fact that the game play its self is alot slower and requires patience. The unforgiving probably weeds out the real younger crowd(12-15 Yr Olds) but would be inviting for the older teens. This is my opinion too, takes hours/days/weeks to train some skills. Younglings don't have the patience for that, not all, but most no doubt. My 8 year old barely has the attention span to wait until some of her WII games load
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.01.24 21:48:00 - [29] Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. We must not be playing the same game. - - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Goose99	Posted - 2011.01.24 21:55:00 - [30] Originally by: Kytayn Originally by: Aineko Macx Edited by: Aineko Macx on 24/01/2011 14:03:28 Originally by: Archbeholder Wow playerbase is actually much older than eve on average. Food for thought. IIRC the average eve player age is 28. What is it for wow?... It is... drum roll... 28.3 Ah, the 1337 basement warriors, spending 12 hours a day farming kms at a gate, with their mothers occasionally bringing down food. Productive members of the society with rl commitments play quick sessions of casual games that offer entertainment. Compulsive mental defectives wait for hours on end at a gate blob farming kms, enlarging their ep3n0r5 while their rl p3n0r5 shrivel.
Barbelo Valentinian Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.01.24 22:01:00 - [31] Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 24/01/2011 22:04:22 Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Sure, it has it's trolls and griefers, but not nearly as many as with other games. I'm wondering if it's unforgiving universe has something to do with it. Thoughts? The most mature playerbase I ever encountered in an MMO was that of City of Heroes/Villains in its heyday. IIRC the statistics, the average age of players of CoX was one of the highest of any MMO, more like mid 30s - perhaps because comics meant a lot to some of us oldsters when we were kids (one of the few outlets to suggest the world was anything other than grey and dreary). No internetz, not even much in the way of computers - music (a huge timesink for most of us) and comics were about the only things that had intrinsic geeky interest. EVE is about average for MMOs IMHO, kind of a mid-20s playerbase, some tools, but plenty of friendly, helpful people too. The nature of EVE gameplay being pretty deep and complex draws out lots of people who like to be helpful with advice about deep and complex things, which is nice. As to "unforgiving" - well, it's just a game, innit? It's "play unforgiving", which isn't really unforgiving. If you play your cards right, losing stuff is a minor upset but nothing to tear your hair out about. ***** "To wake up is to wake the world up" - D.E. Harding
Lellian Marcellus Taron	Posted - 2011.01.24 22:02:00 - [32] Alright, you guys want an example of EVE's maturity? Join channel Live Dev Blog.
Yuki Kulotsuki	Posted - 2011.01.24 22:55:00 - [33] I seem to remember that eve's average age is late twenties, mid thirties. However I would not necessarily equate that to maturity. Example: CCP Soundwave, CCP Screegs. Oh wait, we were talking about the player base weren't we? Originally by: CCP Lemur THIS IS GOD: ... IF YOU HAVE ANY MORE REQUESTS I'M AVAILABLE SUNDAY FROM 10:30 TO 12:00 TO RECEIVE YOUR PRAYERS.
Sophia Amelia Stone	Posted - 2011.01.24 23:03:00 - [34] Originally by: Yuki Kulotsuki I seem to remember that eve's average age is late twenties, mid thirties. However I would not necessarily equate that to maturity. Example: CCP Soundwave, CCP Screegs. Oh wait, we were talking about the player base weren't we? Yep, age does not necessarily equate to maturity. As we had more people joining, I would not mind betting that, that average age has dropped slightly.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari	Posted - 2011.01.24 23:03:00 - [35] Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 24/01/2011 23:05:34 From the looks on the forums, there seem too many big kids in game. However, it does not mean that the playerbase is not helpful. I think the playerbase is one of the most helpful that I have ever seen. Maybe it is because the playerbase is still small compared to others like WoW. As to mature playerbase as in age, maybe yes but in mentality, no. It is just the same as others. Maybe when we have millions of players then we can ask this question again. --------- The making of the new Jenny Spitfire
Verkala Ven	Posted - 2011.01.24 23:48:00 - [36] Not as many trolls and griefers as other games? Have you been through Jita lately? Low-sec ever? Listened to the chat on a large alliance fleet op? I don't know whether it's the most mature or not as a whole, but I do believe it attracts the absolute worst of the worst of gaming. It all depends on how you classify the standard behavior you see in EVE. Some call it 'immature', but others prefer 'repressed sociopathic tendencies with obvious inferiority issues'. Po-TAY-to, Po-TAH-to.
Ephemeron Lubricous Rebel Alliance of New Eden	Posted - 2011.01.25 00:01:00 - [37] I have always believed that the more hardcore a PvP game is, the more responsible people feel for their behavior. Most of the trolling is done with alts - because people feel they might be putting themselves in some danger by using their mains. I also noticed that over the years, the community got a bit dumber and less mature. At same time, the game got more carebear friendly. When it's easier for stupid people to survive, you get more of them. Simple as that.
Sophia Amelia Stone	Posted - 2011.01.25 00:02:00 - [38] Edited by: Sophia Amelia Stone on 25/01/2011 00:04:49 Edited by: Sophia Amelia Stone on 25/01/2011 00:03:14 This community in general is more mature than most of the other MMOs I've played. Still playing a character in AoC ('Age of Conan' for those that don't know) which is an 18+ game. The general chat there is quite childish at times, amongst other things there's a growing group of people that keep spamming 'rawr'. So you can see about 50 lines of 'rawr' every few hours or so, sometime quicker than that. Edit: Removed almost duplicate line.
Ver Selam	Posted - 2011.01.25 00:28:00 - [39] I would say it has one of the most patient player bases around. And the players are unequivocally much older on average that those of any other MMO. But I think you're mistaking smug self-satisfaction for maturity.
Olleybear Minmatar I R' Carebear	Posted - 2011.01.25 02:05:00 - [40] I've only ever played one other MMO besides Eve. The immature raging going on in WoW while in game just plain shocked me. Their behavior made me want to kill the ragers characters and take their stuff. Unfortunatly WoW isn't setup like that. From my time spent in Eve, I have come to believe that because there are consequences in game for our actions and words, we are less likely to act like morons. The forums are full of trolls true. As has been said in a post above me, how many of those people trolling post with their mains? A lack of consequences for peoples actions brings out the 'mouth breathing, kneck beard wearing, stick waving monkies', which alt trolling in the forums allows. Griefers, gate campers, and scammers can be mature. They can also be total tools in local. I've come to realize those in game actions dont necassarily mean the person behind those actions is an immature ass. Just like children, people sometimes need their bottoms kicked a few times to straighten them out. Eve offers that and it is my belief that we have a better playerbase because of it.
Infinity Ziona Minmatar Cloakers	Posted - 2011.01.25 02:40:00 - [41] Originally by: Mira Robinson I've come to realize that the EvE Online community is one of the most mature playerbases I've encountered. Sure, it has it's trolls and griefers, but not nearly as many as with other games. I'm wondering if it's unforgiving universe has something to do with it. Thoughts? Unforgiving nature? I'm sorry but it did have that once, but since its been WoW'afied to the point that its forgiving nature is on par with that other game. I did an experiment, I played BG's and World PvP'd and then played EvE and PvP'ed. When I compared the costs to recover from losses WoW (item repair) was actually more expensive in terms of time to recover then EvE was (Ship and item loss - insurance payout). That CCP refuses to remove insurance for suicide ganking is a very good example. The reason they don't remove it is because they fear that newbies making mistakes and accidentally ganking someone in empire not getting insurance would be unfair. That doesn't seem seem to be a position that a harsh and unforgiving game would take and its not. Its pandering and cuddly. EvE used to be harsh and unforgiving but it no longer is. As for maturity. I see the same level here as a I do in other games, but a much greater lack of respect for game rules and exploiting. --------------------------------------------- Hate Bots / RMT? Do something worthwhile and good for EvE and cause tears and anguish for others, while doing absolutely nothing yourself! Join up.
Ver Selam	Posted - 2011.01.25 03:37:00 - [42] Originally by: Infinity Ziona Unforgiving nature? I'm sorry but it did have that once, but since its been WoW'afied to the point that its forgiving nature is on par with that other game. I did an experiment, I played BG's and World PvP'd and then played EvE and PvP'ed. When I compared the costs to recover from losses WoW (item repair) was actually more expensive in terms of time to recover then EvE was (Ship and item loss - insurance payout). I played World of Warcraft just over 8 months ago. Got a character to 80 and quit. And I'm here to say that you are full of ****.
Goose99	Posted - 2011.01.25 05:08:00 - [43] Originally by: Ver Selam Originally by: Infinity Ziona Unforgiving nature? I'm sorry but it did have that once, but since its been WoW'afied to the point that its forgiving nature is on par with that other game. I did an experiment, I played BG's and World PvP'd and then played EvE and PvP'ed. When I compared the costs to recover from losses WoW (item repair) was actually more expensive in terms of time to recover then EvE was (Ship and item loss - insurance payout). I played World of Warcraft just over 8 months ago. Got a character to 80 and quit. And I'm here to say that you are full of ****. Well, if you camp a gate in blob for hours, you lose nothing. Any pvp cost in other mmos is more than nothing... He's pretty much right. Eve had it once, but nowdays it's all about the km farm, blobing, and extreme risk aversion.
Xailia Unsteady Corporation	Posted - 2011.01.25 05:32:00 - [44] Originally by: Mira Robinson I'm wondering if it's unforgiving universe has something to do with it. This has been the theory for the past 8 years. I seem to remember an informal survey that came up with mean EVE player age of mid-thirties, vs e.g. WoW at mid-twenties. "The sky above the port was the color of a television, tuned to a dead channel."
Quemist	Posted - 2011.01.25 05:39:00 - [45] I guess killmails count as harsh and unforgiving? That's what everyone cares about. They don't care about losing ships as much as they do about a lose on their kb. "Uh oh my Myrm is tackled by a Punisher. Quick, eject! He probably has a gang incoming!" That's really mature doodz.
Infinity Ziona Minmatar Cloakers	Posted - 2011.01.25 06:08:00 - [46] Originally by: Ver Selam I played World of Warcraft just over 8 months ago. Got a character to 80 and quit. And I'm here to say that you are full of ****. So mature! --------------------------------------------- Hate Bots / RMT? Do something worthwhile and good for EvE and cause tears and anguish for others, while doing absolutely nothing yourself! Join up.
Drunken Monk3y	Posted - 2011.01.25 06:11:00 - [47] Troll ^2 = xyz to the ninth.. and the n. dont forget the n, but what the hell were you talking about again ??
Cathy Drall Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2011.01.27 15:46:00 - [48] Sure! Scamming, ganking, stealing, demanding rights to walk in your bras .. it's all so very mature! "Im not nearly as paranoid as people think I am"
ROFLCOPTER SOISOISOI	Posted - 2011.01.27 15:50:00 - [49] Originally by: Brooks Puuntai The unforgiving probably weeds out the real younger crowd(12-15 Yr Olds) but would be inviting for the older teens. I've flown with 12 - 14yr olds before now in EVE. It's the same as anything, some people are mature and can appreciate a slow paced game, others... well just look at these forums.
Captain Megadeath	Posted - 2011.01.27 16:01:00 - [50] Edited by: Captain Megadeath on 27/01/2011 16:01:45 Originally by: ROFLCOPTER SOISOISOI I've flown with 12 - 14yr olds before now in EVE. those weren't kiddies, they were FBI agents in conjunction with Chris Hansen. Did you by chance say that you wanted to "Blank their Blank real hard" You're going down boyo..... Originally by: Cat o'Ninetails my name actually is short for catherine Yeah, Katie Door perhaps...... lol

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