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Spirulina Laxissima
Minmatar
TotalControl Inc.
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Posted - 2011.01.30 11:28:00 -
[1]
Currently we have re-spawning asteroids, rats of varying danger ( ) and ore-kinds depending on system-security level, with the rarest ores found in 0.0 (with the biggest risk) Of course, we can just mission-mine, and circumvent the issue all together. This rant got me thinking. How can we fix this mess? How can we increase immersion, and possibly even deter botting at the same time?
How 'bout we move away from the strange ore-distribution scheme, and make it dependent on scanning, with a higher chance of finding rare-, high-yield ores in low-to-no -sec?
Make belts system-wide (as IRL), and filled with generic asteroids. Scanning the belt reveals probable ore-distribution, and possible dangers (rats). Scanning asteroids reveals 'veins' of ore.
Ore around rats would be better, in fact: Might as well place Pirate-Faction mining-complexes into the belts. They struck a rich 'vein' and are mining away. Now we can either ninja-mine their find, attack them & steal their ore, or just rat them & move in with our assault-barges. Higher risk = higher reward.
Allow competing player-mining-complexes (asteroid colonies FTW!) in low-sec (0.3-0.0)
Maybe implement a siege-mining mode or whatever.
Make mining interesting, more realistic, more immersive, and make botting less profitable. (who'd want to bot when you can wage mining-wars in realistic belts?)
All right: Flame away, and/or discuss! 
(*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦)
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Incarna be dammed! |
shady trader
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Posted - 2011.01.30 12:19:00 -
[2]
CCP are already looking at having to scan down mining locations as a replacement for the current belt system.
As for system wide asteroid belts, this is also on there long term plans, it used to be on the drawing board till they removed the drawing board.
Macrointel, the place were the nature order of the universe does not hold sway. Pirates and ore thief's are congratulated by carebears for the actions. |
Spirulina Laxissima
Minmatar
TotalControl Inc.
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Posted - 2011.01.30 12:56:00 -
[3]
Cool! Any idea on an ETA for that? 
(*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦)
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Incarna be dammed! |
Crucis Cassiopeiae
Amarr
PORSCHE AG
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Posted - 2011.01.30 12:58:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Crucis Cassiopeiae on 30/01/2011 13:00:12
All around EVE forum you can find many many many posts on the same subject...
EVE <-> BOTS <-> MINING
BOTS <-> EVE <-> MINING
MINING <-> BOTS <-> EVE
there are many sugestions how to solve this problem...
and I support anything that can solve this problem... problem of BOTS... and not only in mining...
and CCP needs to do something... it's CCPs turn now...
but after all this i think that, if CCP wants to solve this problem, CCP need to integrate in client some sort of BOT DETECTION PROGRAM... and that server ACCEPTS ONLY CLIENT CONNECTIONS...
By this bot programers will need to make more effort and not only inject little pyton code in client and make it their puppet...
all other MMOs have some sort of bot detections... EVE must have it too...
when this is done, then you can make some changes in game-play...
and that all will substantially reduce number of bots in EVE... and make EVE again the best game on the market...
"Everybody's at war with different things... I'm at war with my own heart sometimes" |
Aquila Draco
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Posted - 2011.01.30 19:06:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Spirulina Laxissima
Cool! Any idea on an ETA for that?
many ppl want that answer...
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Kahega Amielden
T.R.I.A.D
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Posted - 2011.01.30 19:31:00 -
[6]
Quote:
Cool! Any idea on an ETA for that?
I've heard that ever since I started playing, some 2-3 years ago.
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shady trader
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Posted - 2011.01.30 19:50:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Spirulina Laxissima
Cool! Any idea on an ETA for that?
Well the dev blog about the scanner down mining sites was over a year ago and the idea of system wide belts was on the drawing board for a couple of years before the deleted the drawing board about a year ago.
So CCP's soon(TM)
Macrointel, the place were the nature order of the universe does not hold sway. Pirates and ore thief's are congratulated by carebears for the actions. |
Fournone
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Posted - 2011.01.31 02:35:00 -
[8]
Process for finding miners in belts:
1. WTZ on random belt
2. eventaully find miner
3. target and scram
4. ??????
5. profit
With massive belts:
1. warp to belt
2. dodge roids
3. hide somewhere in belt
4. probe around a bit
5. find and kill serp mining base
6. probe around a bit
7. find miner
8. target and scram
9. ?????
10. profit
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Severian Carnifex
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.01.31 12:11:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Severian Carnifex on 31/01/2011 12:11:21
Originally by: Fournone
Process for finding miners in belts:
1. WTZ on random belt
2. eventaully find miner
3. target and scram
4. ??????
5. profit
With massive belts:
1. warp to belt
2. dodge roids
3. hide somewhere in belt
4. probe around a bit
5. find and kill serp mining base
6. probe around a bit
7. find miner
8. target and scram
9. ?????
10. profit
you are writing this as it would be bad thing or good?
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Uncle Archibo
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Posted - 2011.01.31 12:29:00 -
[10]
My first thought on this is that it damages the new-player experience. Right now, any player in a rookie ship can fly into a belt and start mining. It's not much of an income but that's how EVERYBODY gets started. How would you propose to replace that experience? If CCP has taken a while to answer, I suspect it's because this is a difficult problem. How to give the newbies a meaningful experience (that is: not giving them a walled garden to play in until they can afford to play the real game) while still delivering on a more realistic, interactive system for more experienced players.
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Spirulina Laxissima
Minmatar
TotalControl Inc.
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Posted - 2011.01.31 16:39:00 -
[11]
Fournone: That's pretty much it!
The n00bz would just continue as usual Uncle Archibo: Warp to belt, mine, ???, Profit! 
The regular warp-to point would take you to the edge of the field, and n00b-ships&skills would be enough to scan the 'roids before them & mine away. System-wide belts would be huge, and the chance of encountering evil-rats would be smaller away from their complex. (a couple of roving guards is all)
The more skilled you are, the deeper you can venture into the field & the more exotic ores you can find.
They could probably merge all current belts into one mega-belt with different warp-to points. (gaps in the belt -similar to Saturn's rings, possibly cleared by a small planetoid used as a base by a NPC-corp)
(*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦)
):
Incarna be dammed! |
Fournone
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Posted - 2011.01.31 23:05:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Severian Carnifex
you are writing this as it would be bad thing or good?
good thing
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Uncle Archibo
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Posted - 2011.02.01 00:14:00 -
[13]
Ahh. I see what you're saying. I misunderstood you. When you talked about "scanning" the belt, I read it as "probing."
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Svyatagor
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Posted - 2011.02.01 00:17:00 -
[14]
Orca/rorqual+mining foreman links+implants+faction mining fit = profit.
Lot more profit than bots.
Same as a good mission runner/plexer/ratter with good skills and fit does more isk/hour than an average bot.
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Vincent Athena
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Posted - 2011.02.01 00:48:00 -
[15]
In our real belt here in Sol system the average distance between roids is a million km. And you never get a bunch of roids shoulder to shoulder like we see. Their gravity would make them all clump together in a few hours! But in reality we do have roids that orbit each other.
So what if a "roid" was one big one plus a several small ones in orbit. Moving in orbit. You got to follow them, and could even get bumped by them, maybe even bumped out of miner range if you are not actually flying your ship.
Low end roids (veld and scord) show on the overview, and are scattered over a system wide belt. Slightly higher end ones (say the other high sec ores, and bigger low end roids) show on the scanner, and the best must be probed. Rats get harder as quality goes up and sec status goes down. In the highest sec systems, the low end roids never have rats, and can be seen on the overview, good for new players. And I like the high end ones having rat colonies, and players being able to drop their own colonies. Why limit that to low sec? It would be another reason for high sec wars.
Any roid lasts until mined out, then the new spawn could be anywhere in the system wide belt. To compensate for the extra effort to find and mine, the roids should have more ore. Your hulk and do several trips to one roids before it pops.
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Spirulina Laxissima
Minmatar
TotalControl Inc.
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Posted - 2011.02.01 08:27:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Vincent Athena
Why limit that to low sec? It would be another reason for high sec wars.
You've got a point. I limited it because they usually put the cool stuff into low.
In general I thought that all asteroids would be scattered throughout the belt & needed to be scanned for. Scans would randomly generate average-probable-yields, and the miner could bookmark the ones he likes best. I figured keeping the n00bz at the edge near NPC-corp mining-areas would keep them safer. The 'roids at those warp-to points would have a lower yield of low-end ores, but they'd have the protection of the friendly NPC's. (or just a smaller chance of being hit by rats)
Maybe we could migrate most of the missions to the huge belt too. (after all, many missions spawn 'roids)
Maybe there would be a ice belt farther out similar to the Kuiper-belt. Ice 'roids, mixed with planetoids and comets. Maybe even an Oort-cloud?
Moving orbits have been proposed before. Even changing positions at down-time. Or matching vectors of ships (not to say comets!). Apparently this makes for some serious number crunching, and is harmful to the 'Hamsters'. So I'd be happy with a static universe, but with a more realistic (=interesting) system-look. We can always 'pretend' we are orbiting at high speeds around planetesimals, that are orbiting at even greater speeds around the sun. As long as it looks & feels like we are moving through a real asteroid belt...
(*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦¦`*+.,_,.#¦)
):
Incarna be dammed! |
Severian Carnifex
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.02.01 19:21:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Severian Carnifex on 01/02/2011 19:21:13
Originally by: Fournone
Originally by: Severian Carnifex
you are writing this as it would be bad thing or good?
good thing
then... thanks for supporting good changes... :)
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Spirulina Laxissima
Minmatar
TotalControl Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.24 21:10:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Spirulina Laxissima on 24/03/2011 21:17:19
Also, in this new environment the rat-mechanics could change:
First scouts spawn. If you don't kill them fast, they might call in support, if one escapes he might return a bit later with those reinforcements.
Reinforcements could progressively get bigger, badder, and more numerous depending on how deep you ventured into the belt, and how bad you are whupping their aft waste ejection ports.
This would encourage carebears to fly pvp-esque.
Probably coulda posted this in a rat-mechanics thread, but imho it fits here just fine.
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NinjaSpud
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Posted - 2011.03.24 21:27:00 -
[19]
YAY you linked to my thread
I support this idea. Eve is a very bot friendly game. Mining is an exciting at first, but eventualy boring profession. That (and a little greed) is why bots are so prevelent.
Change mining to more interactive and more profit = fixed macro mining problem.
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Mimiru Minahiro
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Posted - 2011.03.24 22:17:00 -
[20]
Originally by: NinjaSpud
That (and a little greed) is why bots are so prevelent.
Because wanting to do nothing but pvp when you log in (because its the only fun thing in the game) has nothing to do with bots....nope.
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