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Best-Value PI Product?

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Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.23 22:42:00 - [1] So, I've been doing PI for a week or so now, and am really liking it. But I'm obviously looking to maximize my time and profit here. So I'm hoping that people will have some advice about which product is going to give me the best value over time. Keep in mind that I'm not opposed to multi-planet manufacturing -- I'll do the 5-planet advanced commodity production if I have to. (I can manage 5 planets so that's not a problem if I'm looking to focus each planet on an output type.) But as I mentioned, time is an issue: I don't necessarily want the highest-value market product if it's going to take me twice as long to make next to a lower tier product that will net me 3/4 as much in half the time. Looking forward to your responses!
Alotta Fachina	Posted - 2011.02.23 22:55:00 - [2] Errr, there is no answer that anyone can give that you couldn't come up with yourself if you put some numbers down on a pad. You just want an answer with no work involved. Download a spreadsheet off the forums, find out for yourself. Or Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available.
Normal citizen	Posted - 2011.02.23 22:56:00 - [3] Believe it or not, but my numbers indicate it's actually more profitable to just turn in base products (i.e. micro organisms etc.). However, this is more time consuming as you have to tend to your planets much more often. But then again, you can almost extract twice as much if you don't have any processors.
Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.23 22:58:00 - [4] Originally by: Alotta Fachina Errr, there is no answer that anyone can give that you couldn't come up with yourself if you put some numbers down on a pad. You just want an answer with no work involved. Download a spreadsheet off the forums, find out for yourself. Or Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available. Golly, someone asking for advice on the forums! Thinking someone might be able to answer a question! Thanks so much, though, I appreciate your expert opinion.
Breaker77 Gallente Reclamation Industries	Posted - 2011.02.23 23:00:00 - [5] If I told you Item X was the best, then everyone would make Item X and it would be worthless in a few days. No one will tell you what is the most profitable. You have to do the math for yourself.
Umega Solis Mensa	Posted - 2011.02.23 23:02:00 - [6] Maybe you'll get honest answers.. maybe you'll get bread crumbs leading you away from other people's profits, which is more likely than the former. Best crunch numbers yourself. Find whatever meets your standards in profit value, time used to make, and don't forget time taken to sell/transport. Keep in mind how much is daily traded on average.. also don't forget their is still mass surplus in some of the items that is slowly dwindling, which will explain some funky numbers. Make it fun for yourself.. as long as your content with your results, other people's results are irrelevent really. ---------------------------------------- Treat the EVE markets like you are its Pimp.. it is your 'willing' employee to fondle n use n abuse as you please.
Alotta Fachina	Posted - 2011.02.23 23:04:00 - [7] Originally by: Del Vikus Originally by: Alotta Fachina Errr, there is no answer that anyone can give that you couldn't come up with yourself if you put some numbers down on a pad. You just want an answer with no work involved. Download a spreadsheet off the forums, find out for yourself. Or Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available. Golly, someone asking for advice on the forums! Thinking someone might be able to answer a question! Thanks so much, though, I appreciate your expert opinion. You weren't asking for advice, you wanted someone to tell you what to produce to make the most money. You may vehemently deny this, but its what you did. Asking advice is one thing, you wanted a hand out. Look under the sticky at the top of the science and industry sub forum there are spreadsheets available that will answer the question for you. But that might be too much work because you'd have to download them.
Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.24 01:16:00 - [8] Originally by: Alotta Fachina You weren't asking for advice, you wanted someone to tell you what to produce to make the most money. You may vehemently deny this, but its what you did. Asking advice is one thing, you wanted a hand out. Look under the sticky at the top of the science and industry sub forum there are spreadsheets available that will answer the question for you. But that might be too much work because you'd have to download them. You are very friendly and are an excellent teacher. I respect your opinion and have learned a lot about PI from this exchange. I hope others may benefit from your wisdom as much as I have.
Brock Nelson Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.	Posted - 2011.02.24 02:49:00 - [9] Robotics is the best
ApophisXP	Posted - 2011.02.24 09:16:00 - [10] Apple pi! These posts represent my Personal views and not those of my Corporation nor my Alliance.

Neechi HollanderDanny Black Serpent Technologies R.A.G.E	Posted - 2011.02.24 10:32:00 - [11] Best product to build/sell is Robotics 1 Lava - Chiral Structures 1 Storm - Reactive Metals 1 Barren - Precious Metals 1 Toxic - Toxic Metals 1 Barren (lowest sig radius = more structures/links) Production / Factory planet - Reactive + Precious = Mechanical Parts - Toxic + Chira = Consumer Electronics - MP + CE = Robotics
Cyniac Gallente Twilight Star Rangers	Posted - 2011.02.24 11:06:00 - [12] Originally by: Alotta Fachina Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available. I have to say... seeing the responses so far this is probably the most solid suggestion (even though the OP does not seem to appreciate it)
Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.24 20:55:00 - [13] Originally by: Neechi HollanderDanny Best product to build/sell is Robotics 1 Lava - Chiral Structures 1 Storm - Reactive Metals 1 Barren - Precious Metals 1 Toxic - Toxic Metals 1 Barren (lowest sig radius = more structures/links) Production / Factory planet - Reactive + Precious = Mechanical Parts - Toxic + Chira = Consumer Electronics - MP + CE = Robotics Thanks!
Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.24 21:01:00 - [14] Originally by: Cyniac Originally by: Alotta Fachina Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available. I have to say... seeing the responses so far this is probably the most solid suggestion (even though the OP does not seem to appreciate it) You're right, I don't appreciate it. I wasn't looking for a hand-out, I was looking for advice. Because it's a FORUM. (If someone asked for ship fitting advice in that section, and the first response was "Figure it out for yourself," that would be pretty lame, and we'd never have anything like Battleclinic.) Prices for different products vary wildly, but there are consistently high demands for certain ones like Coolant, for example. But given the relative scarcity of the extraction products for certain outputs, and the extra time required to get them, surely one could determine, at least on a general level, what a decent rate of price demand vs. time required to produce would be for certain items. I was simply asking if someone had already done the math. If you want to call that a "free handout," well, that's your prerogative. But if that was the case, please never read a guide to mining, or ask which ores are most in demand, because holy crap, you're just looking for a free handout! Just figure it out for yourself!
Caldariftw123	Posted - 2011.02.24 21:19:00 - [15] Originally by: Del Vikus Originally by: Cyniac Originally by: Alotta Fachina Look at the market, find the items that are the most profitable, see what it takes to make them, do I have that resource available. I have to say... seeing the responses so far this is probably the most solid suggestion (even though the OP does not seem to appreciate it) You're right, I don't appreciate it. I wasn't looking for a hand-out, I was looking for advice. Because it's a FORUM. (If someone asked for ship fitting advice in that section, and the first response was "Figure it out for yourself," that would be pretty lame, and we'd never have anything like Battleclinic.) Prices for different products vary wildly, but there are consistently high demands for certain ones like Coolant, for example. But given the relative scarcity of the extraction products for certain outputs, and the extra time required to get them, surely one could determine, at least on a general level, what a decent rate of price demand vs. time required to produce would be for certain items. I was simply asking if someone had already done the math. If you want to call that a "free handout," well, that's your prerogative. But if that was the case, please never read a guide to mining, or ask which ores are most in demand, because holy crap, you're just looking for a free handout! Just figure it out for yourself! Advice on a ship fitting is one thing, it is advice yeah .. but "advice" on a profitable market item? Nah, that's a bit no-no. You don't ask for, and people don't tell (generally), their profitable trade routes or what items they produce to make X profit and how .. There are people that give that information, as you found someone suggested an item and a process to get it, but most people realise that if they tell you what the math they spent time doing tells them then it will no longer be a profitable item as more people will get in on it. So yeah, you asked for a handout, and people rightfully said gtfo and do it yourself.
Mister Rocknrolla	Posted - 2011.02.24 21:25:00 - [16] Originally by: Del Vikus I was simply asking if someone had already done the math. If you want to call that a "free handout," well, that's your prerogative. Actually...that's pretty much the definition of a "free handout." Just excercising my prerogative.
Railman85	Posted - 2011.02.25 02:10:00 - [17] Edited by: Railman85 on 25/02/2011 02:15:55 Edited by: Railman85 on 25/02/2011 02:15:11 Originally by: Del Vikus So, I've been doing PI for a week or so now, and am really liking it. But I'm obviously looking to maximize my time and profit here. So I'm hoping that people will have some advice about which product is going to give me the best value over time. Keep in mind that I'm not opposed to multi-planet manufacturing -- I'll do the 5-planet advanced commodity production if I have to. (I can manage 5 planets so that's not a problem if I'm looking to focus each planet on an output type.) But as I mentioned, time is an issue: I don't necessarily want the highest-value market product if it's going to take me twice as long to make next to a lower tier product that will net me 3/4 as much in half the time. Looking forward to your responses! Your question can't be answered, because prices change all the time. For example 6 weeks ago I built 5 planets producing plasmoids, because it was the most expensive material at price 600isk per one unit. Right now it cost 300isk and its not a good business anymore (on the other hand reactive metals skyrocketed from 300isk to 600isk). It is also common thing, that selling directly refined materials is more profitable than processing them into commodities Thats why I create a tool that calculates PI production costs: http://eve-tools.org/planetaryCalculator.html This spreadsheeed (not mine) will be also useful for you: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ar_YTOcXpvb9dGFIdHJlb0VmYXBORWRrcXFkeHNjcWc&hl=en_GB#gid=10 Few people here told you to produce robotics, but according to my site and spreadsheet you get same money for robotics as for materials required for robotics (if so, then why waste power to manufacture robotics??) Eve Tools - Tools for eve; manufacturing, reprocessing calculator, trade finder, market browser, product prices, trade hubs ranking
SencneS Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks	Posted - 2011.02.25 16:24:00 - [18] You could also look at P1 items that are cheap but you can produce in mass volumes. Things like Water which is used in all levels of PI production is pretty decent return with not much effort. You can mass produce very quickly and sell it for a cheap price and make a decent return. That's if you can ship large quantities of it. Note here that I used Water as an example. A lot higher level producers simply buy the cheap material instead of wasting their power-grid on extractors and processors for it. So cheap PI items are sold in massive quantity to these people. You can hold up to 15,000 units in a launchpad. More often then not, you can fill the LPad with P1, and process out of it, and have the P2 item deposited back into the same LPad. While it's not a massive ISK printer, face time with PI is pretty low. It's not "passive" income but it sure feels like it. Amarr for Life
Del Vikus Minmatar Intergang	Posted - 2011.02.25 19:12:00 - [19] Thank you to both SencneS and Railman85 for your reasonable and informative replies. This is precisely the kind of friendly advice I was hoping for.
Dallmarr	Posted - 2011.02.26 03:38:00 - [20] Edited by: Dallmarr on 26/02/2011 03:46:15 Just pick 5 p1s (these are currently making money: bacteria, Biofuels, biomass, Chiral structures, industrial fibers, proteins, reactive metals, Silicon) if they make a p2 -- great don't chase the isk. example: item X was losing 4% per item from refining from p0 2 days ago. as of this post, it is making 13% over p0 PI market likes to move. watch the above items take a dive now

Companion Qube Minmatar Electron Conservation Inc	Posted - 2011.02.26 11:14:00 - [21] Waffles son, waffles. drunkpoasting best poasting
Brock Nelson Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.	Posted - 2011.02.26 15:55:00 - [22] Originally by: Companion Qube Waffles son, waffles. 2008 called, they want their waffles back 2010 called, they want their pancake back Ponies is the new meme
Melchiades Seti	Posted - 2011.03.01 00:00:00 - [23] Since they changed PI I don't make much from P1 stuff anymore in HiSec, so I mostly buy P1 and make P2 and P3 stuff from it. The two that cost me the most are Precious Metals and Electrolytes. I'm no PI genius, but that's been my observation. In fairness, I don't deal with them all, but I deal with a lot of them. Assuming the universe is your oyster, I would find a place that has loads of those. (I avoid low sec.) A good place to start anyway, you can always change it.
Dawnstar Gallente Kiroshi Group Exiliar Syndicate	Posted - 2011.03.01 02:23:00 - [24] Been awhile since I ran PI, but the locations you have to work with are a huge factor in the profitability. A planet in deep 0.0 will churn out vastly more P0/P1 for the same amount of work than a planet in empire will (not counting the work involved with transporation). The higher end items are more fixed in their time to cost (being the same regardless of where you're at). Something to consider when you're weighing what is the most profitable. -D
Soldarius Caldari Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E	Posted - 2011.03.01 02:46:00 - [25] k, I'll bite. There are 2 factor that you need to look at when deciding what you want to do in PI. One is market volume, and the other is location. If you plan on extracting resources rather than buying them off the market, you will need to set up extraction site. Generally, the lower the sec status of the system, the better the extraction rates (risk vs reward). Ex.: in nulsec, you can extract and produce P1s on the same planet without worrying about running out of resources. In hisec, it requires more extractor heads, thus leaving less grid for processors. So you will have to spend time moving extractor heads, and sometimes even extractor control units when your hotspots dry up. You will also have to haul materials from planet to planet more frequently if you plan to make higher level products. If you buy resources off the market for producing higher level products, check your prices carefully. Many of the PI products sell for less than the cost of their materials. I produce POS fuels simply because they have good volume, decent prices, are fairly easy to produce, and a fair amount can be hauled in a T2 industrial ship. Originally by: CCP Shadow ...I cannot guarantee (my) sobriety or decency.
Cyniac Gallente Twilight Star Rangers	Posted - 2011.03.01 09:15:00 - [26] Originally by: Del Vikus You're right, I don't appreciate it. I wasn't looking for a hand-out, I was looking for advice. Because it's a FORUM. I think you missed my point. What I was stressing was not that the response telling you to work it out yourself was the best there ever was (though I still think it's solid) - I was simply trying to point out that the blanket advice to just make robotics is not necessarily the best, as has already been pointed out. If you gave more information about what you were doing or willing to do it would be simpler to give you more constructive advice. I'll give you the example of robotics - The value of robotics is only marginally greater than the value of its component materials. So a logical conclusion is that it is not worth the effort. Until you take logistics into account. Robotics takes up significantly less space than its components and when you are dealing with a complex logistics setup (e.g. when you haul to highsec from null or deep WH space) having a material that's simpler to transport is best. Ultimately though, only you know all the details of your situation so you will have to work things out for yourself if you want the best profit (and this will likely change on a regular basis). If on the other hand you want to just get a decent profit you can go with any of the above suggestions.


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