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Horizonist
Yulai Guard 2nd Fleet Yulai Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.15 17:45:00 -
[1]
Now, I am not trying to be a pessimist, kudos to CCP for all their hard work so far. However, I really want to know one thing.
Before Incursion, PI was a cool and nifty way to make an impressive passive income (800 mil - 1 bil a month). Post Incursion, PI has been hammered down to something that will still pay for an account, but anything left over will barely be loose change (I make about 600 mil a month myself).
As I have understood it, Dust514 will allow Console gamers to hop into Eve and help in-game people fight over planetary installations.This begs the question: why on Earth would anyone find it worth fighting over planetary installations? PI is hardly an impressive source of income anyway, why design a project on the scale of Dust for the purpose of fighting over something that is, in the end, not really worth that much anyway? Or are CCP planning something deeper with Dust?
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Vaspade Boirelle
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Posted - 2011.03.15 17:47:00 -
[2]
Internet Space Cows?
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Horizonist
Yulai Guard 2nd Fleet Yulai Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.15 17:50:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Horizonist on 15/03/2011 17:50:36
Originally by: Vaspade Boirelle Internet Space Cows?
iseewhatyoudidthere
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.03.15 17:58:00 -
[4]
CCP is adding an entire new section of space (no sentry guns and no bubbles), aka "the Ghost Empire", which is the existence of the ancient race of the sleepers. There are stations there but they are inhabited by sleeper drones and they need to be cleared out before capsiluers can dock there. If abandoned too long the sleeper drones will reinfect stations.
That will be their biggest role.
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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:02:00 -
[5]
They have to be planning something new with it or they collectively suffer from a severe case of ******ation. PI in general is still in an infantile state of gameplay and has loads of room to deepen it even if you look just the EVE only portion of it. FFS a significant feature like interacting with planets in an scifi MMO doesn't currently even have basic multiplayer functionality. I just can't believe CCP would consider the current framework that is PI as satisfactory with no need for improvement.
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Arnakoz
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:11:00 -
[6]
agreed. i think they would have to drastically increase the risk/reward aspect of PI if they expect DUST to go anywhere.
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:14:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Horizonist why on Earth would anyone find it worth fighting over planetary installations?
Earth is not one of the planets.
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Horizonist
Yulai Guard 2nd Fleet Yulai Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:14:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Horizonist on 15/03/2011 18:15:08
Originally by: Sig Sour CCP is adding an entire new section of space (no sentry guns and no bubbles), aka "the Ghost Empire", which is the existence of the ancient race of the sleepers. There are stations there but they are inhabited by sleeper drones and they need to be cleared out before capsiluers can dock there. If abandoned too long the sleeper drones will reinfect stations.
That will be their biggest role.
Do you have a reference for that? I am asking because I heard something like this being brought up on Features & Ideas way way back...but then again, it was nothing but a suggestion, made by a player, and I dont even think the thread lasted that long.
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Fat Freddy
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Posted - 2011.03.15 18:17:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Destination SkillQueue PI in general is still in an infantile state of gameplay and has loads of room to deepen it even if you look just the EVE only portion of it.
...
I just can't believe CCP would consider the current framework that is PI as satisfactory with no need for improvement.
Oh dear, either I've been trolled, or you have not been playing eve very long.
CCP policy on features and expansions goes something like this:-
"I know! we'll introduce a new feature, it'll be so awesome, we'll make sure there is plenty of scope to expand it and make it really good."
CCP then show how awesome it is at a fanfest or in a series of dev blogs, and it does indeed look awesome.
Time passes...
CCP release the expansion/feature and explain it has a lot of potential to be built upon despite the crummy current implementation. A few days go by and a number of little patches are added to make the crippled feature work without crashing, job done.
No further work will be carried out on the feature as the devs now have a new and improved idea, "something completely different! It can be expanded and improved upon, it will be awesome!..."
and the cycle continues.
Cosmos missions Faction warfare Epic arc missions Wormholes Planetary Interaction Incursions
Well you get the idea.
Fred
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Aeronwen Carys
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Posted - 2011.03.15 19:19:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Sig Sour CCP is adding an entire new section of space (no sentry guns and no bubbles), aka "the Ghost Empire", which is the existence of the ancient race of the sleepers. There are stations there but they are inhabited by sleeper drones and they need to be cleared out before capsiluers can dock there. If abandoned too long the sleeper drones will reinfect stations.
That will be their biggest role.
You and your drunken trolling Sig. Leave the poor noobs alone, lol.
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Horizonist
Yulai Guard 2nd Fleet Yulai Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.15 19:22:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Aeronwen Carys
Originally by: Sig Sour CCP is adding an entire new section of space (no sentry guns and no bubbles), aka "the Ghost Empire", which is the existence of the ancient race of the sleepers. There are stations there but they are inhabited by sleeper drones and they need to be cleared out before capsiluers can dock there. If abandoned too long the sleeper drones will reinfect stations.
That will be their biggest role.
You and your drunken trolling Sig. Leave the poor noobs alone, lol.
andyouarecallingwhoanoob?
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Zelphinine
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Posted - 2011.03.15 19:31:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Fat Freddy No further work will be carried out on the feature as the devs now have a new and improved idea, "something completely different! It can be expanded and improved upon, it will be awesome!..."
and the cycle continues.
Cosmos missions Faction warfare Epic arc missions Wormholes Planetary Interaction Incursions
This is so depressingly true. I remember when the Epic Arcs were going to be the new hotness, since they were new around about when I (re)joined EVE. Ha ha no.
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Velicitia
Open Designs
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Posted - 2011.03.15 21:04:00 -
[13]
I wonder if they're not going to use ISK as the currency, but whatever useless (to us) currency that the empires themselves use.
IIRC they had at one point an "ISK -> Faction currency" exchange rate somewhere... with ISK being so valuable that a few hundred (or was it thousand) of it is more than what an average worker planet side makes in a YEAR.
So we treat that mil or three isk/day of PI income as pocket change, whereas in the DUST realm, its "worth" a whole hell of a lot more...
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Winters Chill
Amarr Born-2-Kill 0ccupational Hazzard
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Posted - 2011.03.15 21:16:00 -
[14]
I worked out that 1 isk is worth roughly 500 "dollars" if you regard "dollars" as planetary currency.
As eve has no Gold to base a translating standard on, I based my calculation on the base value of tobacco as sold in NPC stations. If you look at the price of naval ships and aircraft it actually translates quiet nicely.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.15 21:50:00 -
[15]
I vaguely remember reading/seeing something about tying DUST into Sov mechanics, but CCP is kinda tight lipped about anything concerning DUST. - - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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mkmin
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Posted - 2011.03.15 21:54:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Barakkus I vaguely remember reading/seeing something about tying DUST into Sov mechanics, but CCP is kinda tight lipped about anything concerning DUST.
Well, I think they used to have an idea of what they wanted to do with it. But since PI turned out to be **** poor quality with only minor upgrades since and little payoff for continuing to improve, they've probably reconsidered exactly how it's going to tie in. It's going to tie into PI, and there's a team currently working on the connection, but I'm betting it's not going to be a game changer for anyone who cares. Of course there will be massive penalties for ignoring it, but no benefit to actually doing it.
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Vincent Athena
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Posted - 2011.03.15 22:08:00 -
[17]
Im sort of wondering why the OP says 800 mil a month is cool and nifty, but 600 mil a month is worthless.
Im also wondering if Im going to do my PI, go off line, then come back the next day and find all my stuff has been blown up by a 10 year old with an x-box.
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Zel Nughat
Amarr Nughat Corp
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Posted - 2011.03.15 22:17:00 -
[18]
What makes a colony valuable is the resources available to it, but as it is now, resources change their location/distribution in some random way, you don't need to be extracting anything to see it happening, just a little patience.
What's the rationale behind this behaviour? why do minerals change their location so easily? I could kind of accept that in a lava or plasma planet, but in a barren planet?
Why would capsuleers fight over the location of a colony in any particular planet, if its location has no meaning anymore?
A few weeks ago, I was redesigning one of my colonies, as command centers cannot be moved, I had to put everything else on almost the other side of the planet, very useful double clicking on the planet to go to a lone cc...yeah.
The first time PI came, I played with it for a while, made some bucks, enjoyed its novelty, after a while, all my colonies where abandoned, sitting in there, waiting for a command from me, forsaken because of pure boredom.
This last iteration of PI seemed promising, and having liked the idea before, I plunged into it once again, remade all my colonies, changed planets, skilled up to lvl5 some PI related skills, made a whole different story, I even heard or read, that resources could vanish if you extracted too much, so I was careful, I tried to.
But I saw that something was not right, I deliberately left all colonies to finish their extraction cycles and waited, a couple of weeks later and look and behold, the resources moved around by themselves without human interaction.
That means colonies have no permanent value and their location is irrelevant on the long term.
So I ask again:
Why would capsuleers fight over the location of a colony in any particular planet, if its location has no meaning anymore? |
Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2011.03.15 22:49:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Fat Freddy
CCP policy on features and expansions goes something like this:-
"I know! we'll introduce a new feature, it'll be so awesome, we'll make sure there is plenty of scope to expand it and make it really good."
CCP then show how awesome it is at a fanfest or in a series of dev blogs, and it does indeed look awesome.
Time passes...
CCP release the expansion/feature and explain it has a lot of potential to be built upon despite the crummy current implementation. A few days go by and a number of little patches are added to make the crippled feature work without crashing, job done.
No further work will be carried out on the feature as the devs now have a new and improved idea, "something completely different! It can be expanded and improved upon, it will be awesome!..."
and the cycle continues.
Cosmos missions Faction warfare Epic arc missions Wormholes Planetary Interaction Incursions
Well you get the idea.
this, doesn't really matter what DUST does cause it will be broken and never fixed.
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Vincent Athena
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Posted - 2011.03.15 22:49:00 -
[20]
Rebuilding all your stuff at a new location costs isk. If the current site is not mined out then why move? My planets in w-space have maintained their production level sufficiently high to keep 3 strings of P2 production going continuously since PI was updated. And I have had to move nothing but extractor heads.
Also we do not know what dust players will be fighting over or destroying. It may be command centers we lose, which is significant isk.
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Horizonist
Yulai Guard 2nd Fleet Yulai Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.15 22:50:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Zel Nughat stuff
Resources do not move around randomly - they are fixed to their respective locations and regrow over time. The only thing that is random about resources are the nuggets, which do spawn randomly.
Thats how I have understood it at least
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Commander TGK
Gallente The Deep Space Armada
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Posted - 2011.03.15 23:09:00 -
[22]
Rememeber that PI is still in its infancy, as people have said. CCP told us a while back that there were going to be space elevators and planets worth significantly more than the average planets, think of it like the current moon goo system. They just aren't implemented yet.
Also, that idea about the sleeper stations and whatnot rings a bell......and that would sure bring some damn fun to DUST. Bottom line, DUST should be kinda like Mass Effect, at least combat and movement wise, people would love it.
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Zel Nughat
Amarr Nughat Corp
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Posted - 2011.03.15 23:21:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Horizonist
Resources do not move around randomly - they are fixed to their respective locations and regrow over time. The only thing that is random about resources are the nuggets, which do spawn randomly.
Thats how I have understood it at least
Yes, they do move, a lot, very slowly.
Originally by: Vincent Athena Rebuilding all your stuff at a new location costs isk. If the current site is not mined out then why move? My planets in w-space have maintained their production level sufficiently high to keep 3 strings of P2 production going continuously since PI was updated. And I have had to move nothing but extractor heads.
Also we do not know what dust players will be fighting over or destroying. It may be command centers we lose, which is significant isk.
w-space is nullsec, the density of resources is way higher than in lowec, in lowsec you can barely feed those 3 lines for a week if you are very, very lucky. -------------------------------------------
The moon is a terrible mistress... ...who walks the night with demons of dread. |
MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.15 23:24:00 -
[24]
600 million of passive income per month is nothing to you?
Grief a PVP'er. Run a mission today! |
Blnukem 192
Amarr 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2011.03.15 23:48:00 -
[25]
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 600 million of passive income per month is nothing to you?
Pretty much.
Originally by: CCP Navigator This is really not worthy of a thread.
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egegergergsdgedgege
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Posted - 2011.03.16 00:35:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Fat Freddy
Epic arc missions
Thats a really good example. CCP coded and introduced an entire new mission system that allowes all kind of stuff like alternate endings, different branches in arcs. A whole lot of work for 10 arcs in total?!? They promised to introduce a lot of arcs time after time because they now have proper tools to design them. But all we got is a starter arc. and one for each major faction. A whole lot of work for nothing.
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Bhattran
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Posted - 2011.03.16 01:36:00 -
[27]
Tie it into sovereignty, upgrade indexes and hilarity ensues or have benefits that boost your production when/if you control a planet or a planet region etc so more profits through volume.
There are numerous methods that could be used to make kicking your 'neighbors' off your land more beneficial to you. That says nothing of the fact that PI is needed for resources used throughout New Eden so someone HAS to do it on some level. If Dust sucks and kicks too many people out of PI we'll have to deal with huge costs for goods, also entices more people to do PI, or maybe by then bots will be running most PI and hiring dusties.
--WIS/Incarna/Ambulation where microtransactions come to play, and uh bars.-- |
Sarkelias Anophius
Gallente The Alpha and the Omega
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Posted - 2011.03.16 02:00:00 -
[28]
I would like to note that nothing you are complaining about affects the only legitimate and enjoyable aspect of this game, which is PvP.
I am the infinite space. I am the most conquering one. |
digitalwanderer
Gallente DF0 incorporated
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Posted - 2011.03.16 02:11:00 -
[29]
Well,the potential of Dust 514 is definitely there, but as other mentioned it can't be just an initial working implementation and then expand upon it later on just they've done with eve itself, wich many features have yet to be developed further and it's been quite some time for some of them...
The FPS market is brutal and there's games like crysis 2 coming out in a few days, and battlefield 3 looking absolutely amazing and with features like destructible environments(7 story buildings coming down..).
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Dr Sheepbringer
Gallente Halinallen veroparatiisi Inglorious Carebears
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Posted - 2011.03.16 07:12:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Blnukem 192
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 600 million of passive income per month is nothing to you?
Pretty much.
So then Dust will basically mean nothing to you. So why whine?
Originally by: CCP Shadow Dr. Sheepbringer -- It's not that kind of horn.
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