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Yime Nsokyi	Posted - 2011.03.18 13:21:00 - [1] So i've gradually got into trading through reading the posts here and a bit of trial an error and i'm currently up to 4.2b NAV. The problem I am facing is that I have a limited play time each day (some days less than 30mins) and it's a rush to try to check and update my orders to keep them fresh and active. I usually have 40 or so buy orders and 20-30 sell orders at any one time. My question is, how many orders do you MDer's generally have up at one time? and how often do you update those orders? Cheers Yime
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.03.18 13:28:00 - [2] 130, a few times a day. Find out what makes you the most money and cut other things. Over time you should get more money from trading less things. By the way, keep an eye on things you don't trade. They can change.
UfoTRADER Relentless Technologies Quod Erat Demonstrandum	Posted - 2011.03.18 13:54:00 - [3] Four max traders with 150 to 200 orders each, updated a few times a day (time permitting)
Asymoney	Posted - 2011.03.18 14:30:00 - [4] 300 aprox> 100 sell orders - updated 5 - 10 times per day 100 buy orders - updated once per day 50 buy orders - updated once 2 - 3 per week 50 buy orders - fishing orders -updated once per month Asy
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.03.18 14:57:00 - [5] 1, sometimes 2. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Samroski Games Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.18 15:05:00 - [6] 2000 to 3000 (sometimes more). Never updated.
Elise DarkStar	Posted - 2011.03.18 15:10:00 - [7] Whatever doesn't personally burn you out.
Kaivar Lancer Transtellar Import and Export	Posted - 2011.03.18 15:31:00 - [8] 100 orders only ATM. Update at least twice a day.
sesanti Minmatar Astrodynamics Trading Group	Posted - 2011.03.18 16:14:00 - [9] I have between 10 and 20. _______________________________________________ The ShadowMaster - <I am a guy... never mind the portrait>
Worgen Fratmon Minmatar Instapop Industries	Posted - 2011.03.18 20:15:00 - [10] My trader alt does about 30-50 orders. Depending on item, I update them as much as 3-4 times/day or as little as never (either no competition or order filled before price change needed). I check each order at least once a day.
Cheque Please Hot Like Mexico	Posted - 2011.03.18 20:18:00 - [11] 4 --- RL Meeting w/ Chribba
Tehg Rhind	Posted - 2011.03.18 20:37:00 - [12] I try and have as many orders as possible (~300) on the books. Not having all your order slots filled is a bad idea, assuming you have Isk/assets that aren't invested and open order slots. I spend highly random amounts of time updating. I may spend 5 minutes 2 times a week updating or 1 hour a day. It depends. If you're logging on and updating every order without any prioiritizqtion you're doin it wrong. You need to know the orders that are your most profitable, most risky, most competitive, etc and update accordingly. Don't update every order as though they had equal value. Some days I'll update one order ten times and I won't even glance at another order. Think like Asymoney above but instead of static update quantities think of it as an abstract prioritization value.
Dynast Osirians Of Eve Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2011.03.18 21:03:00 - [13] Edited by: Dynast on 18/03/2011 21:03:33 Originally by: Tehg Rhind I try and have as many orders as possible (~300) on the books. Not having all your order slots filled is a bad idea, assuming you have Isk/assets that aren't invested and open order slots. I spend highly random amounts of time updating. I may spend 5 minutes 2 times a week updating or 1 hour a day. It depends. If you're logging on and updating every order without any prioiritizqtion you're doin it wrong. You need to know the orders that are your most profitable, most risky, most competitive, etc and update accordingly. Don't update every order as though they had equal value. Some days I'll update one order ten times and I won't even glance at another order. Think like Asymoney above but instead of static update quantities think of it as an abstract prioritization value. If you want to maximize your profits, absolutely. If you just want to maintain acceptable profits (say, to fund other activities) you want to maximize your ISK gain per abstract units of effort spent. For me, this has been twenty to thirty orders.. more than that starts taking up mindspace I'd rather have devoted to other things.
Syds Sinclair	Posted - 2011.03.18 21:12:00 - [14] ..Right now full sails ahead for me is 60 buy orders and 40 sell orders. And that is with a pretty rigorous pruning system. Like an above poster said, cut out what isn't working to make room for what is, but be mindful that that climate can change on an isk (dimelol).
Atima Minmatar House of Marbles	Posted - 2011.03.18 21:38:00 - [15] 0
Tehg Rhind	Posted - 2011.03.18 23:54:00 - [16] Edited by: Tehg Rhind on 18/03/2011 23:55:05 Originally by: Dynast If you want to maximize your profits, absolutely. If you just want to maintain acceptable profits (say, to fund other activities) you want to maximize your ISK gain per abstract units of effort spent. For me, this has been twenty to thirty orders.. more than that starts taking up mindspace I'd rather have devoted to other things. I agree with that to a point. I only really pay attention to 20 or so of my orders, but its not hard to fill the other 270 or so with stuff that has requires a very small amount of investment and a very small amount of effort, like ML1-3 items. Just set up your orders to clear on market shifts and watch the money trickle in like a leaky faucet.
Ayaska Shran	Posted - 2011.03.19 06:04:00 - [17] Originally by: Elise DarkStar Whatever doesn't personally burn you out. This. Just do what you can to keep your money growing, be it updating every hour on 300 orders, or updating once a week on a few. Currently I have about 200 orders that I update once every day or two. I'll ramp back up when I get some free time.
clixoras	Posted - 2011.03.19 10:21:00 - [18] people are so obsessed with updating orders. Here's a little story, i quit trading (the updating part got the better of me). Tried to sell 30b+ of stuff. Put up sell orders, didn't log in for more than a month and the stuff was gone at the end anyway. Just watch the cyclical movement and base your price according.
Lady Leaf	Posted - 2011.03.19 10:38:00 - [19] I have little over 1000 orders, which I update about once a week. Usually I have to modify about 200-300 orders. The whole ordeal takes 2-3 hours. Yes, it's a pain in the ass, but easy and mostly passive isk. Leaves me more time to pvp.
kla samon	Posted - 2011.03.19 18:05:00 - [20] When I was actively trading I had 1000 orders over 3 toons with a 4th training up. It required about 30-60min/day to check and if they needed updating then 2-3 hrs. Currently i'm down to half-assing it on 2 toons with about 150 orders on each. One I check maybe 2x a month or if i see any major movements in my escrow on jeveassets... the other maybe 1x or more a week. I only keep at it because not to would be like walking past a hundred dollar bill without picking it up. Yes, it can be that easy when you finally "figure it out". After a while isk ceases to be a motivating factor and habit takes over.
Implying Implications Minmatar Autistic Sharks Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.03.19 18:55:00 - [21] I have about 60 orders that I update quite often throughout the day. >Implying Implications
Zeta Zhul Caldari Preemptive Paranoia	Posted - 2011.03.19 19:54:00 - [22] I've got about 1,500+ market orders that vary from mostly selling to mostly buying. I really should update more often but really can't be arsed to do it.
Wyke Mossari Gallente	Posted - 2011.03.19 20:28:00 - [23] Five tycoons gives me over 1200 orders. 60% never. 30% Get reviewed once a month. 9% once a week. 1% May get reviewed several times a day or an hour when I'm actively running an aggressive market manipulation.
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2011.03.20 03:15:00 - [24] maybe 500 or so Check on maybe 170 a day.. alter maybe 100 of those twice a day IF I'm logging on those characters...I'll oftn go days between checking prices .weeks between 150 of the 500. I like to be eratic in whatever i do..(lol) If people are competing with me in a market i previously "owned" I'll log on and change the prices on those items 5 or more times a day to encourage them to run along....maybe wouldn't have even logged on a character like than more than once a week unless someone was trying to eat my lunch.
Companion Qube Minmatar Electron Conservation Inc	Posted - 2011.03.20 11:14:00 - [25] Between 300 and 1.5k orders at any time, depending on motivation I tend to manipulate markets in no-life mode for a few weeks until other people **** off then I go into maintenance mode for a couple of months to keep the market hostile to new people and then it's right back to step one to force new people out and I keep that up until I get bored of eve and stop logging for a few months then you guessed it right back to step 1 also I hate punctuation and sentences drunkpoasting best poasting
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.03.21 04:16:00 - [26] heh I haven't really touched my orders in a bit over 2 months, I even just had a few orders expire. probably have around 50 orders open at max, and I hardly ever touch them. if I update them every few days that is a busy week for me.
Yime Nsokyi	Posted - 2011.03.21 08:46:00 - [27] Blimey that's more than i expected to be honest! I take it the people that aren't updating for days/weeks at a time aren't based in the market hubs?
Gillaboo	Posted - 2011.03.21 11:25:00 - [28] 1-5, frequently concentrated on 1-2 commodities. I daytrade, can't be arsed otherwise to let 90-day orders accumulate, or use any other strategies that involve 100's of market orders. YMMV. -------------------------------------------------------- This space For Rent.
Confuzer Volition Cult -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2011.03.21 12:30:00 - [29] Edited by: Confuzer on 21/03/2011 12:30:04 2000.... update every 3 months if I have to, and I trade everything everywhere. ----------------- Destiny is not a matter of chance. It is a matter of choice. It's not a thing to be waited for - it is a thing to be achieved.
Tehg Rhind	Posted - 2011.03.21 17:11:00 - [30] Originally by: Yime Nsokyi Blimey that's more than i expected to be honest! I take it the people that aren't updating for days/weeks at a time aren't based in the market hubs? BLIMEY! Love it I can't speak for others but I only actively maintain ~10% of my orders and I trade in a hub. You just have to be careful what kinds of orders the other 90% you're running passively are, and set them up to sell in the margins.
Zeta Zhul Caldari Preemptive Paranoia	Posted - 2011.03.21 18:16:00 - [31] Originally by: Yime Nsokyi Blimey that's more than i expected to be honest! I take it the people that aren't updating for days/weeks at a time aren't based in the market hubs? You just have to know your markets. Once you've been trading for some time you'll learn how the markets work in your preferred areas. Which orders need more attention, which don't. You'll also learn the cyclical nature of many markets where chasing after the lowest sell price or the highest buy price may or may not get you anywhere.
Michael J Fox	Posted - 2011.03.22 00:34:00 - [32] over 9000 right? RIGHT?
Misty McGinnity Mystify Trading Company	Posted - 2011.03.22 01:40:00 - [33] Originally by: Michael J Fox over 9000 right? RIGHT? put some effort in teenwolf jesus. 88 would have been a better response.
Confuzer Volition Cult -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2011.03.22 09:26:00 - [34] meh I was wrong... played to much minecraft lately and the orders dried up a bit: Total isk in 1862 orders: 384.240.708.158 ----------------- Destiny is not a matter of chance. It is a matter of choice. It's not a thing to be waited for - it is a thing to be achieved.
Shadroch Gallente Todespropheten Cloud 7 Nebulosa	Posted - 2011.03.22 11:05:00 - [35] I have about 400 Orders I am updating all orders about once a week and 5-10 orders daily. at the beginning i did it more often. but now I am lazy.
Zesoft	Posted - 2011.03.22 13:35:00 - [36] 3 to 5 buy orders No sell orders :D :D
SirHarryPierce	Posted - 2011.03.22 19:45:00 - [37] About 120 orders, updated each 90 days.
Fred Barbossa Dell Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.22 21:25:00 - [38] 100-200 orders, maybe 30 of them are sell orders. All in a hub and most only get updated 1-2 times a week.
Yime Nsokyi	Posted - 2011.03.23 09:01:00 - [39] So it would appear from the responses so far that not many people update their orders daily and some even let them expire at the starting value with no tweaking! This was a suprise for me as I have been trying to update twice per day and still find that my orders are being undercut/overcut in the hub i'm based in. I suppose it's down to competition on the particular item... (and so far i've only really traded with T1 ships and implants) Yime
Samroski Games Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.23 14:40:00 - [40] Originally by: Yime Nsokyi So it would appear from the responses so far that not many people update their orders daily and some even let them expire at the starting value with no tweaking! Yime Once I got past the first few billion, making money became more difficult. I started investing in long term orders that need little maintenance. This has got to a stage where I let all my orders expire without updating. I could update some of these after 90 days, but my operation is such that it is better for me to set up new orders. The large number of total orders makes this profitable. With relatively little input- one weekend a month. Leaves me lots of time (and money) to enjoy other aspects of Eve.
SencneS Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks	Posted - 2011.03.23 16:33:00 - [41] I'm a long term place the order and forget it as well. I might adjust the price of an item if I see a patch note that effects what I'm selling. I am however more active on buy orders. Since I primary manufacture items to sell, I want the materials as cheap as possible, so I maintain about 15-20 buy orders and adjust them. But once the product is made, I set a price, place it and forget it. So maybe 5 Sell orders. When I do go heavy trading though I maintain about 200 orders, adjusting price once every day or two, never really letting the margin get too far away from my item. Sometimes I'll sit and camp a particular item I either just want to get rid of or there is an incredible profit in it at the time, but that's considerably rare. Amarr for Life
Zeta Zhul Caldari Preemptive Paranoia	Posted - 2011.03.23 20:46:00 - [42] Originally by: Samroski Originally by: Yime Nsokyi So it would appear from the responses so far that not many people update their orders daily and some even let them expire at the starting value with no tweaking! Yime Once I got past the first few billion, making money became more difficult. I started investing in long term orders that need little maintenance. This has got to a stage where I let all my orders expire without updating. I could update some of these after 90 days, but my operation is such that it is better for me to set up new orders. The large number of total orders makes this profitable. With relatively little input- one weekend a month. Leaves me lots of time (and money) to enjoy other aspects of Eve. Can I point out that this is a very odd way of doing things? So you're letting a 90 day market order simply expire instead of updating it? You do realize that you're paying broker fees over and over and over again. And completely unnecessarily too right? shrug all you have to do is prior to the market order expiring just modify the order, raise/lower the price by 0.01 isk and the clock on the market order resets for the simple cost of 100 isk. And that applies if the market order is for 1,000 isk, 1,000,000 isk or 500mil isk. If you lower the price the cost is 100 isk. If you raise the price then the broker fee calculation comes into play ... unless the number is so low as to be disregarded by the system. So if you simply raise/lower the price by 0.01 isk once every 89 days 23 hours you can keep a single market order going unless the entire amount remaining is either filled (buy order) or sold (sell order). Seriously here. How much excess broker fees are you paying doing things like this?
TipsyMcStagger Caldari Spruillo WarDec Corp	Posted - 2011.03.24 01:07:00 - [43] Originally by: clixoras people are so obsessed with updating orders. Here's a little story, i quit trading (the updating part got the better of me). Tried to sell 30b+ of stuff. Put up sell orders, didn't log in for more than a month and the stuff was gone at the end anyway. Just watch the cyclical movement and base your price according. I call b.s. Depends on the stuff and where it is I have taken well over a month to move faction ships when I abandoned orders in jita, still have a stack of mission related t2 in another minor hub(motsu) was competitive when I left and orders ready to expire from 87 days, and over the past year have canceled plenty of orders well over a month old buys and sells. There's exceptions to everything but bottom line is people who keep on top of their game and put lots of effort in are most successful. Just not what ppl want to hear.
Samroski Games Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.24 07:26:00 - [44] Originally by: Zeta Zhul Originally by: Samroski Originally by: Yime Nsokyi So it would appear from the responses so far that not many people update their orders daily and some even let them expire at the starting value with no tweaking! Yime Once I got past the first few billion, making money became more difficult. I started investing in long term orders that need little maintenance. This has got to a stage where I let all my orders expire without updating. I could update some of these after 90 days, but my operation is such that it is better for me to set up new orders. The large number of total orders makes this profitable. With relatively little input- one weekend a month. Leaves me lots of time (and money) to enjoy other aspects of Eve. Can I point out that this is a very odd way of doing things? So you're letting a 90 day market order simply expire instead of updating it? You do realize that you're paying broker fees over and over and over again. And completely unnecessarily too right? shrug all you have to do is prior to the market order expiring just modify the order, raise/lower the price by 0.01 isk and the clock on the market order resets for the simple cost of 100 isk. And that applies if the market order is for 1,000 isk, 1,000,000 isk or 500mil isk. If you lower the price the cost is 100 isk. If you raise the price then the broker fee calculation comes into play ... unless the number is so low as to be disregarded by the system. So if you simply raise/lower the price by 0.01 isk once every 89 days 23 hours you can keep a single market order going unless the entire amount remaining is either filled (buy order) or sold (sell order). Seriously here. How much excess broker fees are you paying doing things like this? I totally understand that my way is odd, and that I am paying extra fees. And I know that in about 10% of my orders I would greatly benefit from updating them. But the nature and scale of my operation (7 accounts, >3000 orders) is such, and my distaste of updating is so strong, that I prefer to set up new orders. Gives me 28 days a month to have fun, with 2 spent on making money. I could reveal more details on the nature of my trading, which would further explain my "odd" behaviour, but I am sure you understand why I am not :)
Malcorian Vandsteidt	Posted - 2011.03.24 08:26:00 - [45] Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:35:45 I average about 4 orders on 4 different products and each bring me about 200 Mil profit an order. But the trade off is they take a few hours to sell. And I half ass around most the time. Find something you like and trade in it. There is no perfect item. And everything is valuable to someone. Persoanlly I update my orders based on the Number of units ahead ort in front of me and the flow of the Market on that item. if the flow is high and someone puts something in front of me I simply let it go. If someone attempts to crash the amrket by repeatedly putting an order 5-10 ISK lower then everyone else.. I simply wait till it gets -15 Margin and Buy them out, Leaving them with a huge loss and me with a huge profit on resale.
Comor Dunathis Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.03.24 09:39:00 - [46] Nice post MV. We all know you buy bc/bs for 10-15% under Jita price. We also know you're trying to scam people out of 25b for your "corp", and we know that there's a great item to trade in called technetium.
Kaivar Lancer General Exports	Posted - 2011.03.25 05:18:00 - [47] Edited by: Kaivar Lancer on 25/03/2011 05:23:58 Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:37:07 Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:35:45 I average about 4 orders on 4 different products and each bring me about 200 Mil profit an order. But the trade off is they take a few hours to sell. 4 x 200m x 12 = 9600m So you make up to 9.6b a day?
Hieronimus Rex Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia New Eden Research.	Posted - 2011.03.25 05:39:00 - [48] Originally by: Kaivar Lancer Edited by: Kaivar Lancer on 25/03/2011 05:23:58 Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:37:07 Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:35:45 I average about 4 orders on 4 different products and each bring me about 200 Mil profit an order. But the trade off is they take a few hours to sell. 4 x 200m x 12 = 9600m So you make up to 9.6b a day? You'd think MDers would realize their math sucks, but i guess this isn't S&I.
Kaivar Lancer General Exports	Posted - 2011.03.25 05:49:00 - [49] Originally by: Hieronimus Rex You'd think MDers would realize their math sucks, but i guess this isn't S&I. IDK, my maths seems right. MV states he has four orders, he makes 200m per order, and it takes two hours to complete those orders (there are 12 two-hour slots per day). 4 x 200m x 12 = 9600m or 9.6b daily profit Which is nice.
Malcorian Vandsteidt	Posted - 2011.03.25 08:02:00 - [50] Originally by: Comor Dunathis Nice post MV. We all know you buy bc/bs for 10-15% under Jita price. We also know you're trying to scam people out of 25b for your "corp", and we know that there's a great item to trade in called technetium. Legitimate Business is always a scam. So my clients receiving 17%-35% Profit on their Investments must be one hell of a scam. At some point.. You must realize that a scam eventually ends, where real business continues. Well see what you think in a year. I do agree that perhaps 25B was a lot, But it also wasn't what I was asking for. it was simply the total # of shares I was willing to sell at the IPO release, which by the way.. All of them Sold. Just FYI. And I am obviously still active and haven't ran off with anyone's ISK.
Malcorian Vandsteidt	Posted - 2011.03.25 08:05:00 - [51] Originally by: Kaivar Lancer Edited by: Kaivar Lancer on 25/03/2011 05:23:58 Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:37:07 Edited by: Malcorian Vandsteidt on 24/03/2011 08:35:45 I average about 4 orders on 4 different products and each bring me about 200 Mil profit an order. But the trade off is they take a few hours to sell. 4 x 200m x 12 = 9600m So you make up to 9.6b a day? If I did it for 12 hours straight maybe.. But that's nuts. No currently I make about 200-1.5 bill a day depending on what I'm doing and whether I feel like staring at the market or not.
Loraine Gess	Posted - 2011.03.25 10:05:00 - [52] Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt Originally by: Comor Dunathis Nice post MV. We all know you buy bc/bs for 10-15% under Jita price. We also know you're trying to scam people out of 25b for your "corp", and we know that there's a great item to trade in called technetium. Legitimate Business is always a scam. So my clients receiving 17%-35% Profit on their Investments must be one hell of a scam. At some point.. You must realize that a scam eventually ends, where real business continues. Well see what you think in a year. I do agree that perhaps 25B was a lot, But it also wasn't what I was asking for. it was simply the total # of shares I was willing to sell at the IPO release, which by the way.. All of them Sold. Just FYI. And I am obviously still active and haven't ran off with anyone's ISK. Can you name an investor? Any investor? Show us who magically purchased your shares without going through MD where they can sully your name when you take the money and run (or as you put it, retire).

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