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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.19 01:47:00 -
[1]
Hello MD!
I have been reading the MD for 2 months now and been trying my hand lightly at trading here and there until recently. The last 2 weeks I have really jumped head first in on the Jita trading market and I ended up turning my 60 Million into 105 million. Now I have seen people propose investment opportunities here on MD and figured i would give it a try. I am new to the investment game and really only know what i have read on the MD so please don't take my lack of knowledge as a bad sign.
Purpose of investment:
5 Bil isk to use for trading on the Jita market for 30 days.
Payback:
I am Offering 3% on your Investment (3% because I feel that I will easily be able to pay that back at the end of 30 days. But I do plan on giving back more if I do really well maybe a couple extra %)
Collateral:
I really do not have much for collateral, I have my 4 planets for PI that I'm making a bit of isk off and my 100 mil isk.
If I had 3-5 bil in collateral then I would have used that to try trading with.
Expectations:
Well to be honest I hope to turn the 5 billion into a least 6 billion. (but you said you turned 60 mil into 105 mil) I know enough about trading that just because I have greater isk that does not mean that I will make the same profits as I did when I was using lower amounts of Isk. 6 billion will easily allow me to pay back the 3% and still have made a nice amount for myself.
Q&A:
No doubt some of you have looked up my character and seen it has a lot of time under its belt and wondering why I only have 105 million isk. That is because I started this game a while ago did not get into it right away and then joined the military and have not really had much time to play games. But things are settling down now and time is much more abundant.
If there are any other questions you want to ask I will be glad to answer them to the best of my knowledge as I understand it is your Isk and you want to know it will be safe.
Thanks for your time
Mongo007
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Estel Arador
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Posted - 2011.03.19 01:58:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 19/03/2011 01:58:13
If you've been reading MD for a while you'll know that 5B is too big of a step up, and that 3% is too low if you don't have collateral.
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bobwehada babyitsaboy
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Posted - 2011.03.19 02:45:00 -
[3]
Edited by: bobwehada babyitsaboy on 19/03/2011 02:48:08
Edited by: bobwehada babyitsaboy on 19/03/2011 02:46:00
... i think you need to gain a bit more trust with the community before asking for so much isk. But im really new to this board so what do i know lol
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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.19 03:00:00 -
[4]
Well I am new to the investment business so I am flexible on my Rate. I do not know what is a good rate and i don't want to make it seem like its too good of an offer cause then people are going to think I'm trying to scam them even more then I'm sure there already thinking.
My reason for 5 bil is that Quote " It takes money to make money " sure I can use my 100mil and in 30 days time I might have made 40% to 75% so turned my 100Mil into 140mil or 175mil that's 40mil to 75mil profit. Now in that same time frame if i had 5bil and made 40% to 75% that is 7bil to 8.75bil that is a profit of 2bil to 3.75bil before the interest amount that me and the lender can agree on of course.
Thanks for the reply's and your your time
Mongo007 |
Loraine Gess
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Posted - 2011.03.19 03:07:00 -
[5]
May I suggest getting an audit? If you've been successfully station trading as you say you are, it makes you quite a bit more credible. Also, with no collateral you're going to need to bump your rate up. Speak with VV or someone similar, they might be able to help.
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Genbukan
Best Buy INC
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Posted - 2011.03.19 08:05:00 -
[6]
5b ISK... Well good luck with that, as I don't think you will gain much traction with this. I would say if you spent 2 month's on here you should have come better prepared. I know first hand how the MD can be and the flack that comes with it. If you are looking to start something I would suggest you drop that ISK requested down quiet a bit. Lastly, starting out you should look for something around 250M ISK. I wish you the best of luck.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.19 10:25:00 -
[7]
I suggest you to start with 250-500M and offer 8-10% for an uncollateralized bond.
Anything else will get you flak and will send you back out of MD.
Auditing | Research | 3rd Party | Collateral Holding | EvE RL Charity |
Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.19 13:41:00 -
[8]
Well the best way to learn is by doing. so from the helpful suggestions you have provided I'm taking your advice and lowering my investment to 500Mil @ 8% for 30 days to help build up some well needed reputation.
thanks again
Mongo007
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Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.19 13:55:00 -
[9]
 Originally by: Mongo007
to help build up some well needed reputation.
The youngins never learn 
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Genbukan
Best Buy INC
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Posted - 2011.03.19 15:18:00 -
[10]
So basically you receive the ISK, and we wait for the return on it to be delivered directly by you? What is your plan on tracking, keeping your investers updated? Again you need to go back review your whole business plan and then come back. Not 24 hours - 48 hours, but give it a few more days of good solid thinking. You can scroll a few pages back and view different offerings, but I would have expected that with your 2 months of watching. Good Luck, and actually take the feedback a little further go backk to the drawing board.
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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:00:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Mongo007
to help build up some well needed reputation.
The youngins never learn
Maybe because we get comments like this one rather then constructive ones. ever think of that?
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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:11:00 -
[12]
How would I go about showing you what I am doing? Audit sure cause those are really that helpful. All i see in posts are how people are talking about how they can get around them. So to me audits seem kind of useless if they can be worked around.
If you want I will post weekly updates on my profits as I already keep records on my trading I do.
I took a shot at the moon in asking for 5bil right away I know that but if you do not try you will never know right. So now trying for what has been deemed a more reasonable amount for someone of my stature of 500mil. If your truly worried that i will take your 500mil and run off with it then your not the person who i need to do business with. It would be a waste of a character who has this much time in to do something stupid like scam for 500mil.
Again thanks for your time
Mongo007
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Florestan Bronstein
Amarr
Taishi Combine
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:20:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 19/03/2011 18:26:11
How does offering 500m help with to convince people that you are honest if "It would be a waste of a character who has this much time in to do something stupid like scam for 500mil."?
Trustworthiness is established with cases in which it would be fully rational to scam but you don't.
Not stealing anything when there is no real temptation to steal is no big feat.
edit: and how can you read MD for 2 months and not fully anticipate the way your thread had to head?
The questions, objections, trolling, ... are pretty much exactly the same in each and every thread of this style and we ad a fair number of these loan requests during the last months.
You should do your research first and then write a loan request - now everybody will just say "he is willing to change his plans at a moment's notice to get his hands on the 5b asap, that 500m offering is just some pathetic attempt at rep-grinding and the lead-up to a scam."
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:26:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Mongo007
How would I go about showing you what I am doing? Audit sure cause those are really that helpful. All i see in posts are how people are talking about how they can get around them. So to me audits seem kind of useless if they can be worked around.
If you want I will post weekly updates on my profits as I already keep records on my trading I do.
I took a shot at the moon in asking for 5bil right away I know that but if you do not try you will never know right. So now trying for what has been deemed a more reasonable amount for someone of my stature of 500mil. If your truly worried that i will take your 500mil and run off with it then your not the person who i need to do business with. It would be a waste of a character who has this much time in to do something stupid like scam for 500mil.
Again thanks for your time
Mongo007
So, to tell things straight in face: you looked at past offers but did not notice the *realistic* amounts asked (i.e. low for starters) nor the interests offered (i.e. high for starters).
But you DID notice that bunch of scam-friend preachers stating audits are useless and easily circumvented?
Auditing | Research | 3rd Party | Collateral Holding | EvE RL Charity |
Genbukan
Best Buy INC
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:42:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Genbukan on 19/03/2011 18:42:54
I have given you some great pointers and yet you haven't taken them. Just request for this topic to be closed before you dig a whole you can't get out of. If you are a good person then go back to the drawing board and utilize the great feedback you received here.
Edit: Hope you do well when you return, depending on what you choose!
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2011.03.19 18:50:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 19/03/2011 18:51:07
I also wanted to add this other feedback: there are two entry barriers to new investments.
One is the "obvious" EvE barrier: since EvE is what it is and scamming is supported and approved by it's makers, investors have put a great deal of care trying to weed off the most obvious scams. I.e. audits, asking inquisitive questions and so on.
But there is also the other barrier, which is somewhat more evident in RL: the "he got the wits to do it" test. Expecially in RL (but also in EvE) proving you are honest and with the best intentions is not enough. You have also to prove you are actually good at what you are asking money for, and you have to prove you have the temper, the endurance and the skill to survive the highs and the lows. Therefore what appears "torching" - as long as it's not just negative and trolling - is a trialling device investors may use to see if you are fit for public money or not.
Auditing | Research | 3rd Party | Collateral Holding | EvE RL Charity |
Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.19 20:47:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Mongo007
Maybe because we get comments like this one rather then constructive ones. ever think of that?
Well, rep grinding (and stating this is what you will do) is just slightly above scamming. That one sentence
Originally by: Mongo007
to help build up some well needed reputation.
both ensures that the larger investors will not invest in you ever, and that you really have no idea how MD works.
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Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
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Posted - 2011.03.20 01:11:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Mongo007
Maybe because we get comments like this one rather then constructive ones. ever think of that?
Well, rep grinding (and stating this is what you will do) is just slightly above scamming. That one sentence
Originally by: Mongo007
to help build up some well needed reputation.
both ensures that the larger investors will not invest in you ever, and that you really have no idea how MD works.
I've never liked the jihad against the phrase "rep grinding." You're yelling at newer posters for failing to be disingenuous, and instead being honest about the fact that one side effect of a decent bond offering is that future offerings become easier. Instead it suggests that the best way to get into smart, witty investors' good graces is to lie to their faces.
It's also applied unevenly. When Edwin Rothbard put up a bond offer that was far too small for any purpose other than "rep grinding" nobody yelled at him.
For the record, a) yes I am against bonds whose only purpose is "rep grinding," and b) I'm not in a position to be loaning out money at the time so I have no comment on this particular thread's bond offer.
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Tutskii
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Posted - 2011.03.20 01:30:00 -
[19]
I think the point on rep grinding is that, if you are asking for money your primary motivation should be using it for something useful. IF your rationale for getting money is getting more money later, well, that is sort of a big red flag for any individual who does not want to be parted with his isk.
Roth is a special case because he is a gagillionaire doing this for fun and asking for rather small amounts, but I am sure he is being written down as a no go by the "elite" regardless.
But I would think him the exception rather than the rule.
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bobwehada babyitsaboy
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Posted - 2011.03.20 06:34:00 -
[20]
Edited by: bobwehada babyitsaboy on 20/03/2011 06:34:50
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Sid Haig
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Posted - 2011.03.20 06:49:00 -
[21]
I would be willing to help you out man, 100M isk. Let me know where to send, and are you doing dividend's or just in game mail?
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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.20 07:58:00 -
[22]
Bob and Sid thanks for your offers but at the moment I believe I have someone who is going to fill my offer we are just discussing terms at the moment.
Thanks to everyone for your all your input it has been very helpful.
Mongo007
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Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
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Posted - 2011.03.20 10:28:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Kethas Protagonist on 20/03/2011 10:31:31
If you intend to walk with the cash: well, congratulations, I guess. Please don't try to scam me.
If this is/was a legitimate offer: I'm glad you were able to find an investor. New(ish) players have the potential to be really attractive borrowers since when you start off a lot of comparatively lucrative activities are shut off from you because of lack of capital. The downside is, of course, sometimes they decide not to pay you back.
As an example, if there were some magical way to be 100% sure that a new player borrowing isk from you was going to pay you back, there'd be a huge market for loans in the, say, 30-day, 50-100M, 100% interest range. Every new player interested in PvE could start off with a nicely-fitted battleship and could start doing L4 missions way earlier than they can on their own.
My point, anyway, is that right now you (presumably) enjoy putting time in the game but have very little money to invest. Other people have more isk than they know what to with and would love to get 3%-5% a month with no work. Between the two of you there's the potential for mutually-beneficial deals. Enjoy that competitive advantage as a borrower, and don't let the naysayers get you down.
Unless, again, you're planning to just walk off with the cash, in which case please get off my lawn. No solicitors.
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Edwin Rothbard
Interstellar Arbitrage
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Posted - 2011.03.20 11:27:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Mongo007
Purpose of investment:
500Mil isk to use for trading on the Jita market for 30 days.
Payback:
I am Offering 8% on your Investment
It appears you've adjusted your terms sufficiently that someone will likely take a chance on your investment. Good luck!
Originally by: Breaker77
Well, rep grinding (and stating this is what you will do) is just slightly above scamming.
Borrowing money to demonstrate that you are competent and able to repay it is somehow equivalent to theft and deceit? LOL what?
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
I suggest you to start with 250-500M and offer 8-10% for an uncollateralized bond.
agreed. Please understand you are suggesting that he grind for rep build credit history.
Originally by: Kethas Protagonist
I've never liked the jihad against the phrase "rep grinding." You're yelling at newer posters for failing to be disingenuous, and instead being honest about the fact that one side effect of a decent bond offering is that future offerings become easier. Instead it suggests that the best way to get into smart, witty investors' good graces is to lie to their faces.
agreed.
Originally by: Kethas Protagonist
It's also applied unevenly. When Edwin Rothbard put up a bond offer that was far too small for any purpose other than "rep grinding" nobody yelled at him.
I think you missed the posts by the chorus of people who yelled at me for rep grinding building credit history.
Originally by: Tutskii
Roth is a special case...but I am sure he is being written down as a no go by the "elite" regardless.
Thankfully my offerings cater to retail investors instead of institutional ones. 
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Mongo007
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Posted - 2011.03.29 22:55:00 -
[25]
Hello MD,
Well I have given up on trying to get in contact with the person who said they would be willing to invest in me. I have also decided to Cancel my request for a Loan as work has gotten a lot more busy and my hours jumped from 8 hr shifts to 12 hr shifts so Game time has been cut down quite a bit.
But on another Note I am thinking of starting some from of Lottery. Plans have not been fully worked out yet but my plans are simplified into this. Make 10% profit from each lottery, 90% of Isk goes to winner/winners, Not sure if I will include a maximum isk per person or even a MAX isk that I will take for the Lottery. .... might try and find a Corp who would hold onto the isk so it will help to secure the winnings.
/end thinking lol
Thanks for all the help and Info you have provided for me MD
Mongo007
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