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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:20:00 -
[1]
I found that after i made the upgrade from Osprey to Retriever i mine much much better. however, i find that i cannot take on the stuff i find in the belts with my drones.
I am talking about high sec solo mining, i don't expect to be able to take them on in low sec.
With my osprey i had a few slots to put a decent tank in but with the retriever only having 1, and that being used for my survey scanner so i dont waste 3 minutes mining a roid that only has 300 ore in it, im at a loss.
Anyone got any decent setups for a retriever that can take on the high sec rats?
P.S: I should note that i can actually take on the rats, but they break through my shield each time and take my armor down almost all the way.
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BluNereid
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:22:00 -
[2]
What type of drones? I have absolutely no problem with 5 t2 light drones
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:28:00 -
[3]
light scout drones i dont have the skills to use t2.
I am using the ones that "counter" the rats in the belt, they are weak to explosive.
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Greg Huff
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:32:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Greg Huff on 31/03/2011 22:35:06
Even T1 drones should do the job.
It sounds like you're using the wrong damage-type drones for the area you're in.
What region are you mining in?
edit: Based on you're "explosives" comment I figure you're in Metropolis, Heimatar, or Molden Heath, correct?
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:35:00 -
[5]
Not sure about the region but im mining in Pashanai.
The rats that attack me all have the name "blood" in it so i looked up the weakness of them and it listed it as explosive.
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Greg Huff
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:40:00 -
[6]
Try switching over to Acolytes. They do EM damage and you'll probably rip them apart.
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:43:00 -
[7]
Oh, then it must have been listed wrong, could you link me to a list with the weaknesses and such of the different rats?
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.03.31 22:45:00 -
[8]
As soon as you see the rats land on grid, target them and engage your drones.
If you are repeatedly getting a message about them being invulnerable, you are doing it right. Just keep trying to lock them, so the drones engage the instant the rats are out of warp.
Worked for me.
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Greg Huff
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Posted - 2011.03.31 23:06:00 -
[9]
 Originally by: Typhon66
Oh, then it must have been listed wrong, could you link me to a list with the weaknesses and such of the different rats?
The information is posted on a lot of sites, in a lot of different formats. Some of the ways they get posted it can be confusing, misleading, or just plain wrong.
Try Eve-Info's NPC Ships DB. You can search by specific ships if you know the name, or go by categories. You mining and being attacked by Bloods, and in High-sec. You want to look at Asteroid Blood Raiders Frigate. The first set of damage-type columns is what they dish out, the second is percentage of shield resists.
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Lauren Hellfury
Full Pocket Aggro
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Posted - 2011.03.31 23:08:00 -
[10]
Definitely go with the Hobgoblins. Blood Raiders are weak to em/therm and the Hobs have a damage multiplier of 1.6 vs the acolytes damage mod of 1.15. This more than makes up for the slightly higher resist to thermal that the rats have.
3x hob 1s with no drone skills (outside of light drones 1 and drones 3) will clear any rats you get in a 0.5 before you take much armour damage. In a 0.7 you won't even work up a sweat.
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Ashlar Maidstone
Amarr
Intergalactic Combined Technologies
The Chamber of Commerce
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Posted - 2011.04.01 01:22:00 -
[11]
Hi there,
I mine in the Tash-Murkon region, and in my Retriever I carry with me five t1 Warrior Is. I usually when I first arrived at a belt launch them and set them to aggressive and mine my silly self crazy while the drones to the dirty work.
Mine safe!!
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.04.01 06:09:00 -
[12]
so i have switched to hobgoblins and i find i kill them much faster but they still are able to focus me quickly and bring me down to my armor forcing me to repair each time which costs me constantly. Last time i payed 200k. The problem i have now is that the npcs always seem to focus me and never attack my drones. Is there some special way to make them attack my drones? Or some way to get my drones to attack them.
It seems the NPCs star attacking from about 25-27km out. but my targeting range is 23km so by the time i can target them and send my drones they are already on me.
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.04.01 06:52:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 01/04/2011 06:53:04
I do hope you have a small shield booster in the mid-slot.
If they are targeting you first, then put your drones in aggressive mode.
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News Group
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Posted - 2011.04.01 06:53:00 -
[14]
You want them to attack you and not the drones, they would kill the drones which would get expensive. Your ship is the tank which takes the damage while the drones kill the rats. The good news in the future for you is that high sec rats don't (often) get thru the tank of a hulk.
Keep mining!
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.04.01 06:57:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Typhon66 on 01/04/2011 07:03:54
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 01/04/2011 06:53:04
I do hope you have a small shield booster in the mid-slot.
If they are targeting you first, then put your drones in aggressive mode.
I do have shield boosters but not on my retriever, its only 1 slot that i have, i use it for a survey scanner since, i find that since getting strip miners if i start mining something that has 100 minerals on it, i just wasted 3 minutes. Before, if i did that generally i only wasted a minute and even then i only ended up with a couple 100 less minerals than i would have.
Unless you guys think that the larger shields are better than the ability to prevent the above of course. I'm not really too sure what i should do.
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Sophia Chambolin
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Posted - 2011.04.01 07:09:00 -
[16]
Another thing you could do, if not already train your shield skills to at least IV
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bartos102
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Posted - 2011.04.01 08:45:00 -
[17]
a cheap way to repair your armor is to get an armor rep when you get hit in armor just fit it and rep the armor up outside station :)
same goes with hull
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.04.01 10:22:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 01/04/2011 10:25:21
OK ... a few things ...
1) You're mining in Pashanai which is probably a .5 system rounded up. That means you have the toughest rats in high sec coming after you.
2) Your drone skills probably suck. You want Drone Interfacing trained to Level V - yes I know and screw the whiners - just do it - or stay in higher security levels.
3) If you're going to be down in .5 systems - put on the shield extender and just deal with the short asteroids. You're trying to be efficient at the cost of risking your ship. If you want to be efficient - stay in the higher security level systems.
4) Stay in the higher security level systems until you've got your Mechanic, Hull Upgrades, Shield Management, Shield Operation, Shield Compensation, Energy Systems Management, Energy Systems Operation, Drones, Drone Navigation, Combat Drone Operations, Drone Sharpshooting, Drone Interfacing skills trained up to something decent like level IV. As you train them up - if you want to test them - go on down to a Level 7 system and see how you do. If you're taking to much damage - you're not well skilled enough yet - so go back up to a safer system until are. If you do OK in a level 7 system - try a level 6 and so on until you get down to level 5 and find you are easily handling the rats. If you're skilled up and have good drone skills your drones (any drones) will rip through Hi Sec rats like nothing. You just need to get RIGHT on them. That means you want to have Targeting trained up enough so that you can have your rocks targeted and as least one spare slot ready to target the rats.
5) You can create saved versions of your fittings. Create one with an Armor Repairer in your lows and a structural repairer in your mids - then save that - so you can call it up whenever you need to repair your armor or structure - just make sure the items for the fit are in your Items Hangar as that is where it will look for them (not in any Corporate Hangars you may have).
6) If you have an alt account - you can train them and fit a frigate to repair your Retriever. Also - you can put the in an Industrial to haul for you with the added bonus that the rats may go after the industrial ... which can support a much better tank than your Retriever.
7) Another thing you can do - which most people don't bother with on a Retriever - is to fit some shield rigs. If you really want to fit that ore scanner - that's one way to get some bigger shields and have the ore scanner too.
8) Again - Drone Interfacing V ftw. 20% improvement PER LEVEL in damage from combat drones or ore mined by mining drones - you aren't going to get better that that.
9) If you don't want to interrupt your training for you Hulk by getting your support skills in order first - so that you aren't flying a hollow ship - then put up with the consequences. If you stay in 1.0, .9 or .8 systems - you should have little trouble with the rats and can mine happily away with your Ore Scanner fitted and crappy skills.
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Orbiting vs. Kiting
Faction Schools |
Tryllemine
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Posted - 2011.04.01 12:26:00 -
[19]
In general your main problem is probably that the retriever has 0% EM and 20 % thermal resist. (two lowest in shield on the retriever) You could look into adding some shield defence from Rigs, as you want to keep your middle slot locked with a scanner. 2 x Medium anti-EM screen reinforcer I and 1x Medium anti thermal screen reinforcer. It sould give you about 48% em and 44% therm. though require jury rigging III and shield rigging I.
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Cheapo Hobo
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Posted - 2011.04.01 12:49:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
OK ... a few things ...
No offense here compadre but you're ranting on like a rabid-ridden raccoon. For no good reason.
It will take months or even years to have all those skills, and walking on God's green Earth ain't something we're gonna do forever if you know what I mean.
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.04.01 14:11:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Typhon66
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
I do hope you have a small shield booster in the mid-slot.
I do have shield boosters but not on my retriever, its only 1 slot that i have, i use it for a survey scanner since, i find that since getting strip miners if i start mining something that has 100 minerals on it, i just wasted 3 minutes. Before, if i did that generally i only wasted a minute and even then i only ended up with a couple 100 less minerals than i would have.
I never use a survey scanner. Instead, learn to recognize the size of the asteroids.
Keep in mind that you are not mining as much when you are warping back to the station to repair, and that's cutting into your earnings too (buy an armor repper).
Also, work towards tech 2 drones. I forgot to mention that earlier. As a miner, drones are your only defense, so it is worthwhile putting skill points into them.
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Selene Valkros
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Posted - 2011.04.01 14:21:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 01/04/2011 06:53:04
I do hope you have a small shield booster in the mid-slot.
If they are targeting you first, then put your drones in aggressive mode.
How do you do this? I've looked around and there doesn't seem to be any aggressive/passive/etc mode settings that I've been able to fine. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
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Posted - 2011.04.01 14:27:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Cheapo Hobo
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
OK ... a few things ...
No offense here compadre but you're ranting on like a rabid-ridden raccoon. For no good reason.
It will take months or even years to have all those skills, and walking on God's green Earth ain't something we're gonna do forever if you know what I mean.
Thing is, Mr. GreyHawk is right. The entire skill tree he mentioned is pretty damn short actually (based on a fresh out of the cloning facility alt -- 24 days).
Back when I trained most of those skills... it took twice as long (no, I'm not complaining -- just pointing out that the "new" training times are significantly shorter than when we had attributes at 12 across the boards.)
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Ana Vyr
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Posted - 2011.04.01 16:20:00 -
[24]
Greyhawk is giving very solid advice. I'd scrap the scanner in favor of a shield mod as he suggests. The reality is, you don't stay in a retriever all that long before you are skilled for a hulk. You want to maximize your isk gain so you can purchase the hulk when the time arrives. Those are pricey, but invlnerable to highsec belt rats for the most part.
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Khory Thunderstar
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Posted - 2011.04.01 18:01:00 -
[25]
Training those skills to III should be more than enough to deal with High Sec rats. And that shouldnt even take a week.
The most important skill that you need right now is Drones up to IV or V.
Either way - Blood rats do EM/THERMAL damage ( strongest damage against shields ) and are weak to EM damage. You are using EXPLOSIVE damage drones, the weakest against them.
Change your drones to Acolytes and you should be much better. Also, put a shield booster on your mid slot - should be enough to allow you to regen incoming damage until your drones kill them.
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.04.01 18:31:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 01/04/2011 18:31:57
Originally by: Selene Valkros
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
If they are targeting you first, then put your drones in aggressive mode.
How do you do this? I've looked around and there doesn't seem to be any aggressive/passive/etc mode settings that I've been able to find.
Edit: nvm...google is my friend. :P
For others with less Google-Fu than you...
There are two ways:
1. There is a key mapping to toggle aggressive/passive. I personally hate this because there is no confirmation of which mode they are in.
2. There is a menu (looks like 4 or 5 horizontal lines) you can click on. It has aggressive/passive selection as well as focus fire.
Note that you can also right-click drones in the drone window for more options. You can even create groups for drones so that you can launch a specific set of drones if you have several flights of them (more than you can control). This is also handy to create a Damaged group; you can move drones to this group before/while recalling them, so you know which ones to avoid using or need repair.
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Skorpynekomimi
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.01 20:23:00 -
[27]
In my experience, just train up some combat skills for toughness. Mainly shield skills.
Then, skill drones up to 4. (5 is ideal if you have time, but if you're flying a retriever, you're probably waiting for astrogeology or mining barge to train to V so you can upgrade)
After that, KEEP A DAMN EYE OUT. Do not AFK mine. Alt-tab, but leave the speakers on. Pop back in to check every so often, and tab back INSTANTLY if you hear a targeting alert.
Set auto-target-back, and don't fill up your targets with rocks. Then get pro-active with your drones, sending them off to attack things before they damage you.
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Zeth Shadowbane
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Posted - 2011.04.02 02:03:00 -
[28]
Try putting a small armor repair module in one of your low slots. Using that and 4 t1 drones I had no problem with the rats in .5 systems. The only thing you need to watch out for depending on your engineering skills is your cap level. If the rats catch you when I mining cycle just started you might have trouble running the repair unit. Your shield will go down at times, but you will have more than enough time to repair and recharge between respawns.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.04.02 19:05:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Zeth Shadowbane
Try putting a small armor repair module in one of your low slots. Using that and 4 t1 drones I had no problem with the rats in .5 systems. The only thing you need to watch out for depending on your engineering skills is your cap level. If the rats catch you when I mining cycle just started you might have trouble running the repair unit. Your shield will go down at times, but you will have more than enough time to repair and recharge between respawns.
Most people are going to either have Expanded Cargo Holds or MLU's in those Low Slots ... That's why most miners and industrials are shield tankers - they've other things to do with the Lows.
*shrug*
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Orbiting vs. Kiting
Faction Schools |
Laukus
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Posted - 2011.04.03 15:55:00 -
[30]
we mine in regions with the same rats, I'm in the bleaklands next door to you. My fit had t2 strips, scanner in the med, co-CPU 2 and mlu in the low, medium em resist rig and two medium core denfense shield extended rigs. used 4 hob 1's and was just fine.
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Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
Shakor Freight and Mining Service
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Posted - 2011.04.04 07:20:00 -
[31]
Train up EM Shield Compensation to IV (1D12H, give-or-take) and use this fit (or scale down if needed). Release drones on arrival, set them to aggressive and fire up the strip miners, you should have no problems whatsoever:
[Retriever, 0.5 Blood]
Co-Processor II
Mining Laser Upgrade I
Azeotropic EM Ward Salubrity
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Medium Cargohold Optimization I
Medium Cargohold Optimization I
Medium Cargohold Optimization I
Hobgoblin I x5
Consider training Shield Management as high as possible.
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Tre Circuit
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Posted - 2011.04.04 17:22:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Typhon66
It seems the NPCs star attacking from about 25-27km out. but my targeting range is 23km so by the time i can target them and send my drones they are already on me.
Train up Long Range Targeting to increase the base targeting range, having the skill to 4 will get you to 27km targeting range.
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Khadrea Shakor
Minmatar
Shakor Freight and Mining Service
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Posted - 2011.04.05 08:02:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Typhon66
Is there some special way to make them attack my drones? Or some way to get my drones to attack them.
I'd say the belt rats tend to attack the closest player owned object. If your drones are orbiting you and happen to be 'between' your Retriever and the NPCs when NPCs start their business, it is your drone that pulls the aggro. Not much you can do about this.
Originally by: Typhon66
It seems the NPCs star attacking from about 25-27km out. but my targeting range is 23km so by the time i can target them and send my drones they are already on me.
Train up Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing and set your drones to aggressive. Even if you cannot lock the NPCs, as long as they are in your drone control range, your drones will go after them.
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Tiger Wolf
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Posted - 2011.04.13 22:28:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Typhon66
Is there some special way to make them attack my drones? Or some way to get my drones to attack them.
It seems the NPCs star attacking from about 25-27km out. but my targeting range is 23km so by the time i can target them and send my drones they are already on me.
Im hoping that you know by know how to make your drones attack. If Im understanding your post correctly here, it sounds to me that you are just launching your drones and hope that they attack who is attacking you. In case you dont, after you launch ur drones, right click on "Drones in space" and click engage...Your drones might not attack a rat if they are already aggressed you before they are inside your targeting range...
as far as your survey scanner...keep it if you must, but personally they are a waste of time. If you are concerned about low yield in a roid, stop your miners half way through the cycle. at least then if they pop u only lost an extra 30 seconds over what you did with miner II's...
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Helena Unicorn
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Posted - 2011.04.14 00:57:00 -
[35]
[Rigs]
Medium Cargohold Optimization
Medium Cargohold Optimization
Medium Cargohold Optimization
[High]
Strip Miner I
Strip Miner I
[Mid]
'Anointed' I EM Ward Reinforcement
[Low]
Expanded Cargohold II
Expanded Cargohold II
Drones:
4-5 Hobgoblin I (get T2 ASAP)
Useful skills:
Tactical Shield Manipulation (less chanse damage goes through shield - so to speak)
Long Range Targeting (Target rats further out)
Other things that can help.
Mine near other ppl in belts that can/will help u - perhaps there is a hulk pilot with T2 drones that dont mind blowing them away.
Perhaps there is a ratter in system that wont mind swinging by, shooting ure rats.
Perhaps find a friendly Orca Pilot that wont mind giving u some:
Shield boosts (passive booster skill for Orca Pilot - up to 10% extra shield at max lvl)
Longer Target range (Passive booster skill for orca pilot - cant remember max target range)
+ all the other nice (common) orca boosts, such as Higher Yield, Longer Range and Shorter Cycle time)
In many systems, there many friendly ppl whom dont mind helping one way or the other, there is however also un-friendlies from time to other, so watch ure six.
Helena
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