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DejaPeaux
Gallente
Mine 'N' Refine
The Unforgiven Alliance
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Posted - 2011.04.15 07:47:00 -
[1]
Whats going on with the prices of Tech2 Scourge's They are selling for so little now at Jita. I took up a batch of 200,000 last night and only got 410 for them but over the last 2 months they have been around 550... I think it's time to move on to another item.
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ORLICZ
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Posted - 2011.04.15 08:00:00 -
[2]
too many industrialist with free minerals and free time ;]
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Whiteknight03
Theoretical Research
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Posted - 2011.04.15 08:34:00 -
[3]
They're selling fine in other places. Maybe broaden your horizons a bit?
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Proffessor Drake
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Posted - 2011.04.15 08:53:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Proffessor Drake on 15/04/2011 08:53:58
 Originally by: ORLICZ
too many industrialist with free minerals and free time ;]
you sir, have no clue
Rocket fuel has dropped from 8k to 7k p/u over the last few weeks, so this is at least one part of the equation (and quite a large part of the cost i believe)
i moved out of the commercial production of t2 missiles dues to the PI change to the price of rocket fuel.
i wouldnt like to speculate, maybe a few WH corps left their c3's and dumped spare stock below build cost?
since there is usually such a small profit margin on t2 missiles it doesnt take much to cripple the seller's market
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Proton Power
Amarr
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.15 11:55:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Proffessor Drake
Edited by: Proffessor Drake on 15/04/2011 08:53:58
Originally by: ORLICZ
too many industrialist with free minerals and free time ;]
you sir, have no clue
Rocket fuel has dropped from 8k to 7k p/u over the last few weeks, so this is at least one part of the equation (and quite a large part of the cost i believe)
i moved out of the commercial production of t2 missiles dues to the PI change to the price of rocket fuel.
i wouldnt like to speculate, maybe a few WH corps left their c3's and dumped spare stock below build cost?
since there is usually such a small profit margin on t2 missiles it doesnt take much to cripple the seller's market
Actually he is partly correct. Way to many people jumped on the band wagon to produce these, and when supply goes up without a demand greater or equal, the price will fall. This is what happend. In a few months after people clear out what they built and realize no profit to be had prices will rise again.
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P3po
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Posted - 2011.04.16 09:34:00 -
[6]
Edited by: P3po on 16/04/2011 09:35:14
The price of rocket fuel was at 13k and the price of missiles were 560 +-. Than the prices dropped to 8k and the price was still so high. So the drop of rocket fuel from 8k to 7k is definatly not the issue of missiles dropping so low.
And when i check the market now, someone dumped like 15-20 orders for 100.000 units with 5 sec different time for 430 .... so maybe someone is trying to manipulate the market ?
Also dont know if many people started to produce them, since the income from these missiles is stable for 2 years probably .... it got lowered now, iam sure someone will notice if its such an awesome bussiness much earlier.
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2011.04.17 06:45:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Mnengli Noiliffe on 17/04/2011 06:49:56
yeah once i invented hundreds of bpc for missiles and other ammo, all the prices dropped suddenly. probably just my bad karma or something, sorry about that :)
a bit better theory: the 0.0 anom nerf caused lots of people temporarily (?) out of pve activities, which caused drop of demand for t2 ammo on 0.0 markets, hence in jita too.
and what did you think? everyone will suffer from that nerf, it's supposed to work like that. much less isk faucets means much less isk for everyone.
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P3po
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Posted - 2011.04.17 08:37:00 -
[8]
Probably its connected. Also people dont use the drake blobs that much anymore, that can cause the problems also.
Or its only manipulation .... we will see in month or two :D
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Soldarius
Caldari
Northstar Cabal
R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.04.18 09:14:00 -
[9]
Drake and Tengu pilots used Scourge Fury for anoms up in NC land. With the loss of so many anomalies, there is a much lower demand for Scourge Fury now. Not at all surprised that the price is falling.
Originally by: CCP Shadow
...I cannot guarantee (my) sobriety or decency.
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rumncock
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Posted - 2011.04.18 10:00:00 -
[10]
I still buy mine for 600 so perhaps you should start delivering to more than one station :)
But yea, there's more than one factor, the biggest one being what the rage guy said about nc anoms. Will only get worse as well with the war.
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Swynet
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Posted - 2011.04.18 11:49:00 -
[11]
Originally by: DejaPeaux
... Jita
________________________________________________
Originally by: Goose99
In EVE, PVE can happen anywhere, anytime. Whenever you undock, you subject yourself to involuntary PVE.
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Proton Power
Amarr
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.18 11:50:00 -
[12]
I disagree with less annoms as the reason why and stick with my original answer that to much supply now.
Everyone jumped on this wagon. Look at the market history, 10mil+ units to 20mil+ units still sell every day, nothing has changed in that area. The only change is lots more on market.
Rocket Fuel price has little to do with the over-all price of these. When you build 5000 rockets per run, even if the price changes 5000 isk, its only 1 isk per missile per rocket fuel required.
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Ludendorf
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Posted - 2011.04.18 16:58:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Ludendorf on 18/04/2011 16:59:33
Part of it is due to crashing rocket fuel prices, and part is probably due to increasing interest in making missiles, see:
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-1
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-2
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beautyispain
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Posted - 2011.04.18 20:10:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ludendorf
Edited by: Ludendorf on 18/04/2011 16:59:33
Part of it is due to crashing rocket fuel prices, and part is probably due to increasing interest in making missiles, see:
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-1
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-2
As a long term large scale missile producer I can say that this market crash has nothing to do with rocket fuel prices. The scourge furys were selling for around 400 long before the PI patch itself last june (rocket fuel at ~600) so I was producing them at huge profits until the rocket fuel prices skyrocketed to 11k. Even then the profit was around 10-15M/slot every 5.5 days as the missile prices followed up to between 590-790. I think too many people just realized the huge demand of the missiles and their huge profit margins. It was mentioned on Fan fest that the scourge fury missile blueprint was the most bought one...
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P3po
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Posted - 2011.04.18 22:12:00 -
[15]
Yeah, iam producing missiles for 2 years, when the rocket fuel was for 500 and when it was for 13.000 :D
And the difference of 1k in rocket fuel has almost never any impact on the missile price.
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Tenebrae Syrennis
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Posted - 2011.04.28 08:31:00 -
[16]
Originally by: ORLICZ
too many industrialist with free minerals and free time ;]
^^This.
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Tenebrae Syrennis
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Posted - 2011.04.28 08:35:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Whiteknight03
They're selling fine in other places. Maybe broaden your horizons a bit?
And, this.
C'mon, it's Jita FFS...Only reason I even go to that miserable ****hole is to buy T II production stuffs because it's cheap enough there to make playing the penny-war worth it, but for selling ****, I wouldn't even bother.
TL/DR: In general, Jita is where you go to buy ****, not sell it, unless you need/want to get rid of things quickly.
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P3po
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Posted - 2011.04.28 13:25:00 -
[18]
Yea, well ... its much more easier to sell at jita or fly around space and wait weeks for the stuff to sell.
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Tenebrae Syrennis
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Posted - 2011.04.30 08:49:00 -
[19]
Originally by: P3po
Yea, well ... its much more easier to sell at jita or fly around space and wait weeks for the stuff to sell.
This is true, but depends what you're selling...T II Manufacturing margins are pretty thin as it is.
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Magnus Witchspace
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Posted - 2011.05.24 05:08:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Ludendorf
Edited by: Ludendorf on 18/04/2011 16:59:33
Part of it is due to crashing rocket fuel prices, and part is probably due to increasing interest in making missiles, see:
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-1
http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/guides/business/scourge-invention-2
Was about to suggest the same. The only reason I started looking at producing my own scourge furies was due to this article.
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FuzzyLogik360
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.24 17:49:00 -
[21]
Originally by: P3po
Yeah, iam producing missiles for 2 years, when the rocket fuel was for 500 and when it was for 13.000 :D
And the difference of 1k in rocket fuel has almost never any impact on the missile price.
If my calculations are correct, I'm not so sure that rocket fuel costs are as insignifcant as you suggest.
For PE level 5, and a -4/-4 BPC, consider a single batch run of 5000 missiles (and rounding prices):
Material Qty. Price % of total cost
-------- ---- ----- ---------------
Tritanium 15168 3 3%
Nocxium 33 500 1%
Zydrine 29 1000 2%
Megacyte 45 2500 7%
Morphite 8 4000 2%
Rocket Fuel 124 8000 65%
Graviton Pulse Gen. 14 20000 18%
Phenolic Composites 18 600 1%
Total cost = 1,518,304 ISK
As you can see, Rocket Fuel accounts for 65% of the total manufacturing cost - not insignifcant I would say.
In fact, if you reduce the cost of Rocket Fuel by 1000 ISK, then that's a reduction in batch cost of 124,000 ISK, or 24.8 ISK per missile.
Assume a sale price of 450 ISK per missile, meaning a profit of (450 - 1,518,304 / 5000) = 304.
Then 24.8 / 303 = 8% change to the profit margin, for a 1000 ISK change in Rocket Fuel. I wouldn't consider 8% insignifcant.
If anyone spots any mistakes in my maths, I am more than happy to be corrected.
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DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
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Posted - 2011.05.24 19:26:00 -
[22]
What you could be seeing is market warfare.
If someone uses tons of orders to drop the price 20 or 30%, then can then buy up volumes at a big discount and relist at (or above) the old market price.
Even if the price doesnt fully recover, they can still gain 10-15% over a night or two.
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Never Forget the joy of finding a main to link to a scammer alt. N-y-p-h-u-r ! ! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.24 19:34:00 -
[23]
Increased inventor count.
Lowered costs.
Lowered demand.
Prices tank.
Simple, no ?
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
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Posted - 2011.05.24 19:42:00 -
[24]
Simple yes, Possible yes, but it's hard to know sometimes.
All I know is that I have a bpo for this so I wish all you fk's would start producing something else ;P.
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Never Forget the joy of finding a main to link to a scammer alt. N-y-p-h-u-r ! ! |
Arciii
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Posted - 2011.05.24 19:52:00 -
[25]
Another reason may be that Drakes are used a bit less in larger pvp fleets nowadays. Of course they are still used, but atm, at least within the NC, Alpha fleets and Hellcat fleets are used more often. I know for a fact the quantity of sold fury missiles in 0.0 has dropped a lot the last few months. Now there are just too many of them and the price has fallen a little. Like someone else already said above, once people move on because they no longer see good profits in producing them, prices will probably go up again for a bit.
Not saying this is the only reason, just for a part. It's more complex than that.
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Zifrian
Deep Space Innovations
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Posted - 2011.05.24 21:01:00 -
[26]
Sounds like supply and demand coupled with a lack of production diversity on your part.
The market is so dynamic that if you are making money off of something, you can bet someone else will find how to do it soon too.
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P3po
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Posted - 2011.05.24 22:18:00 -
[27]
Fuzzylogic : i never said it dont have impact on the price. I said that the market never reacted so fast in the price changing :D The margin was always the same when the rocket fuel was 500 or when it was 13.000 only now the margin dropped.
And yea, i also think many people learned about this way of making ISK, cus its so simple and easy to skill with big profit .... well, not anymore, but it was :D
People should stop writing articles about ways of making easy ISK :D
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FuzzyLogik360
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.24 22:59:00 -
[28]
Originally by: P3po
Fuzzylogic : i never said it dont have impact on the price. I said that the market never reacted so fast in the price changing :D The margin was always the same when the rocket fuel was 500 or when it was 13.000 only now the margin dropped.
Sure, I can't disagree with that. It's just that I've seen similar statements like this before (see Proton Power's comment before yours, and similar statements on other recent threads). So I thought I would check the numbers. Rocket Fuel does affect "cost", but as you say missile "price" is slower to react.
Originally by: P3po
People should stop writing articles about ways of making easy ISK :D
I whole heartedly agree (but then I would never have achieved success in industry if it hadn't been for the sharing of market secrets by those who came before me).
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