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Sudour
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Posted - 2011.04.15 13:20:00 -
[1]
Haven't been doing it long but skills are mostly around the 4 mark, I've just had 11 straight fails to invent, is that now normal?
Some of these were with cyphers etc, I don't get it, has CCP nerfed this profession in favour of people with BPO's?
The prossess was done in a Caldari Research Station too, are these bugged? Need to know coz I won't waste anymore isk and time.
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Guilliman R
Gallente Northstar Cabal R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.04.15 13:26:00 -
[2]
Yup it's bugged, I'd stop inventing if I were you. Sucks up all the isk atm.
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Proton Power
Amarr Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.04.15 13:54:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Sudour Haven't been doing it long but skills are mostly around the 4 mark, I've just had 11 straight fails to invent, is that now normal?
Some of these were with cyphers etc, I don't get it, has CCP nerfed this profession in favour of people with BPO's?
The prossess was done in a Caldari Research Station too, are these bugged? Need to know coz I won't waste anymore isk and time.
11 Runs is not enough to say its broken. I do about 200-300 runs a week, some weeks I get 100 bpc's, other weeks I get 200 bpc's, but in the end it averages out to what its suppose to be.
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Bobberr
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Posted - 2011.04.15 16:28:00 -
[4]
I do 20 ship invent attempts a day (Frigate), 7 days a week, I average between 30%-40%, which is exactly what it stated to be. Some days are better than others, I do batches of 10, and get between 0 and 6 each batch.
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RaTTuS
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
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Posted - 2011.04.15 16:33:00 -
[5]
this
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Doddy
Excidium.
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Posted - 2011.04.15 17:23:00 -
[6]
Yeah everyone should stop inventing, its broken as hell. I'll keep doing it though so that I can tell you guys when its fixed ok? Cos i am a nice guy.
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Mara Villoso
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Posted - 2011.04.15 17:36:00 -
[7]
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/invention_chance.php |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Gallente Bison Industrial Inc
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Posted - 2011.04.15 22:16:00 -
[8]
You bet it's broken BIG TIME, but not from the standpoint of invention fails.
T2 Ship Component parts will kill your profits. 100 - 110,000,000 for Bustard parts and the dang things won't sell for more than 118,000,000. That is not even worth the bother and does not include cost of decryptors used.
There is still some profit in T2 frigs if you find the right ones.
It's a bad situation. Actually it currently costs more to make components from BPs than to buy the overpriced components themselves.
It's a lose-lose situation ATM.
Playing for 13 months and it's back to PI and mining till my eyeballs bleed.
Pathetic indeed. **************************
"God is nothing but the power of the Universe, as a whole, to organize itself." - Lee Smolin Three Roads to Quantum Gravity |
Hieronimus Rex
Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia New Eden Research.
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Posted - 2011.04.16 01:56:00 -
[9]
As everyone predicted, eventually T2 margins will become essentially T1 margins. Maybe there are a couple of random items out there that still make money, or you can still make money moving stuff out of jita, but invention based on Jita prices probably isn't terribly profitable.
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Adrian Idaho
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Posted - 2011.04.16 06:29:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor You bet it's broken BIG TIME, but not from the standpoint of invention fails.
T2 Ship Component parts will kill your profits. 100 - 110,000,000 for Bustard parts and the dang things won't sell for more than 118,000,000. That is not even worth the bother and does not include cost of decryptors used.
There is still some profit in T2 frigs if you find the right ones.
It's a bad situation. Actually it currently costs more to make components from BPs than to buy the overpriced components themselves.
It's a lose-lose situation ATM.
Playing for 13 months and it's back to PI and mining till my eyeballs bleed.
Pathetic indeed.
If what you say is true (I didn't check the numbers), then that's not a problem with invention itself, but with too many people doing the same thing.
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Krixtal Icefluxor
Gallente Bison Industrial Inc
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Posted - 2011.04.16 20:04:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Adrian IdahoIf what you say is true (I didn't check the numbers), then that's not a problem with invention itself, but with too many people doing the same thing. [:roll:
That's the problem with these forums and know-nothings who just like to comment and say something just to be saying something; without any research WHICH HE ADMITS TO. Why waste the time?? FU
The issue, as EVERYONE knows, is the NC lock on the Technitium Moons and subsequent manufacture and control of the prices of the Ship Components.
Period and final.
Please, restrain your pathetic little fingers from your keyboard unless you truly have something to contribute.
And to actually admit you didn't run the numbers........
My turn for an eyeroll **************************
"God is nothing but the power of the Universe, as a whole, to organize itself." - Lee Smolin Three Roads to Quantum Gravity |
Adrian Idaho
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Posted - 2011.04.16 21:28:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Originally by: Adrian IdahoIf what you say is true (I didn't check the numbers), then that's not a problem with invention itself, but with too many people doing the same thing. [:roll:
That's the problem with these forums and know-nothings who just like to comment and say something just to be saying something; without any research WHICH HE ADMITS TO. Why waste the time?? FU
The issue, as EVERYONE knows, is the NC lock on the Technitium Moons and subsequent manufacture and control of the prices of the Ship Components.
Period and final.
Please, restrain your pathetic little fingers from your keyboard unless you truly have something to contribute.
And to actually admit you didn't run the numbers........
My turn for an eyeroll
Woah, someone has sand in their vagina! My trolling-fu has to be very efficient to get such a long, angry response from a single sentence Seriously, did your **** fall off into your morning-coffee or what?
Now, back to being constructive: there are plenty of T2 items that return a decent profit, and analogously the margins on most T1 ships are pretty slim, too. Maybe the reason for the little profit on ships is that everyone and their dog makes them ("cuz they r c00l")? Supply and demand. Furthermore, you should look up the concept of "opportunity costs". The NC makes only slightly more profit from T2 items than you do, once you subtract all opportunity costs (the difference comes from not having to pay market taxes on the tech). Your argument is exactly the same as MIMAF, which shows just how little you actually know what you're talking about; let's call this fallacy "MMIMAF" (Moon Minerals I Mine Are Free).
Oh, and what makes you think I didn't do any research on this? I merely said that I didn't check the numbers of your example û which shouldn't bother you, except if you didn't trust your own figures.
But, since I'm just a "know-nothing" with "pathetic little fingers", I'll let you get back at being stupid. Oh, and the obligatory "fail T2 producers' tears best tears".
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Lutz Major
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Posted - 2011.04.17 04:20:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor You bet it's broken BIG TIME, but not from the standpoint of invention fails.
T2 Ship Component parts will kill your profits. 100 - 110,000,000 for Bustard parts and the dang things won't sell for more than 118,000,000. That is not even worth the bother and does not include cost of decryptors used.
There is still some profit in T2 frigs if you find the right ones.
It's a bad situation. Actually it currently costs more to make components from BPs than to buy the overpriced components themselves.
It's a lose-lose situation ATM.
Pathetic indeed.
I blame the T2 BPO holders!
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Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.17 04:38:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor You bet it's broken BIG TIME, but not from the standpoint of invention fails.
T2 Ship Component parts will kill your profits. 100 - 110,000,000 for Bustard parts and the dang things won't sell for more than 118,000,000. That is not even worth the bother and does not include cost of decryptors used.
There is still some profit in T2 frigs if you find the right ones.
It's a bad situation. Actually it currently costs more to make components from BPs than to buy the overpriced components themselves.
It's a lose-lose situation ATM.
Playing for 13 months and it's back to PI and mining till my eyeballs bleed.
Pathetic indeed.
This guy speaks the truth.
Do not do invention. Do not build t2 components. Do not build t2 items.
In fact, you're better off just being a happy miner in a random corner of eve
Investor Relation | IPO Doc |
PsychoBabe
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Posted - 2011.04.17 09:24:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Lutz Major
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor You bet it's broken BIG TIME, but not from the standpoint of invention fails.
T2 Ship Component parts will kill your profits. 100 - 110,000,000 for Bustard parts and the dang things won't sell for more than 118,000,000. That is not even worth the bother and does not include cost of decryptors used.
There is still some profit in T2 frigs if you find the right ones.
It's a bad situation. Actually it currently costs more to make components from BPs than to buy the overpriced components themselves.
It's a lose-lose situation ATM.
Pathetic indeed.
I blame the T2 BPO holders!
I blame invention.... this is what happens when you let any monkey with a wrench build stuff. To many ppl building and selling their wares for too cheap and so much demand on the supplies they go up in price. I think invention should fail a lot more.
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Pricecheck idiot
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Posted - 2011.04.17 11:04:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Originally by: Adrian IdahoIf what you say is true (I didn't check the numbers), then that's not a problem with invention itself, but with too many people doing the same thing. [:roll:
That's the problem with these forums and know-nothings who just like to comment and say something just to be saying something; without any research WHICH HE ADMITS TO. Why waste the time?? FU
The issue, as EVERYONE knows, is the NC lock on the Technitium Moons and subsequent manufacture and control of the prices of the Ship Components.
Period and final.
Please, restrain your pathetic little fingers from your keyboard unless you truly have something to contribute.
And to actually admit you didn't run the numbers........
My turn for an eyeroll
Well that's total bull**** because the problem was happening FAR before the technetium price was changed by CCP.
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Burnharder
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Posted - 2011.04.17 12:38:00 -
[17]
Yes, invention is rubbish. Don't do it. Simple.
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TravisWB
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Posted - 2011.04.17 15:11:00 -
[18]
Was doing invention to make some t2 stuff and then there came the invention of tech II cruisers and the mighty Hulk.
A detailed check of component prices and actual ship prices reveals that yes, you can buy the T2 ships on the market for less than the price of just the 2 most numerous components required to build the T2 ships.
Currently only use invention to make stuff we use up, like ammo, drones and mining crystals. For ships and other hi-tech stuff, just buy it, you cannot compete with researched T2 BPOS and null sec botters.
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Burnharder
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Posted - 2011.04.17 15:15:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Burnharder on 17/04/2011 15:15:15 You can't and that is why you don't bother inventing ships without a lot of market research first.
But to the OP, the "randomness" of invention doesn't seem to be the simple flip of a coin per job. Mine tend to either succeed or fail in batches. I'll get 4/5, 5/5 jobs succeeding, then I'll get 5/5 failing. It's not 1/2, 1/2, 1/2, etc. as you might expect if you were flipping a coin, with the occasional 4/5, 5/5. I don't know what the algorithm is - it works out to the correct values over time, but it isn't a simple coin toss I don't think.
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RaTTuS
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
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Posted - 2011.04.17 16:12:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Burnharder but it isn't a simple coin toss I don't think.
please learn stats
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Kiyirari
All Star Shipyards
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Posted - 2011.04.17 16:32:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Kiyirari on 17/04/2011 16:33:33
Originally by: Burnharder Edited by: Burnharder on 17/04/2011 15:15:15 You can't and that is why you don't bother inventing ships without a lot of market research first.
But to the OP, the "randomness" of invention doesn't seem to be the simple flip of a coin per job. Mine tend to either succeed or fail in batches. I'll get 4/5, 5/5 jobs succeeding, then I'll get 5/5 failing. It's not 1/2, 1/2, 1/2, etc. as you might expect if you were flipping a coin, with the occasional 4/5, 5/5. I don't know what the algorithm is - it works out to the correct values over time, but it isn't a simple coin toss I don't think.
These threads always make me laugh
Ever heard of invention calculator ??? 90% of these whine orignate from noobs who run job lots of 5...
Adv lab op at 4 gives you 10 labs slots use = 10 job lots of invention = success ratio of skills to required invention type/decryptor what ever... done over 100 BPC & you will not be far of your true success rate.
Pro tip - don't bother with ship invention ya be lucky to make 5% profit on the best of em...
Revenge is my god and my guns are her angels |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Gallente Bison Industrial Inc
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Posted - 2011.04.17 16:34:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Adrian Idaho
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Originally by: Adrian IdahoIf what you say is true (I didn't check the numbers), then that's not a problem with invention itself, but with too many people doing the same thing. [:roll:
That's the problem with these forums and know-nothings who just like to comment and say something just to be saying something; without any research WHICH HE ADMITS TO. Why waste the time?? FU
Woah, someone has sand in their vagina! My trolling-fu has to be very efficient to get such a long, angry response from a single sentence Seriously, did your **** fall off into your morning-coffee or what?
But, since I'm just a "know-nothing" with "pathetic little fingers", I'll let you get back at being stupid. Oh, and the obligatory "fail T2 producers' tears best tears".
You keep proving my point and tightening your noose. **************************
"God is nothing but the power of the Universe, as a whole, to organize itself." - Lee Smolin Three Roads to Quantum Gravity |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Gallente Bison Industrial Inc
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Posted - 2011.04.17 16:42:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kiyirari
Pro tip - don't bother with ship invention ya be lucky to make 5% profit on the best of em...
Yup. That's what I get after running the numbers on the Caldari Ships at least. There is ONE T2 Frigate that is currently making 'double your money' ATM if sold in a particular region, but that's my secret **************************
"God is nothing but the power of the Universe, as a whole, to organize itself." - Lee Smolin Three Roads to Quantum Gravity |
Burnharder
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Posted - 2011.04.17 17:17:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Kiyirari
Adv lab op at 4 gives you 10 labs slots use = 10 job lots of invention
Guess what... some of us have things to do with the other slots, like ME, PE and/or copy jobs. Doing them in batches of 5 is fine. What's your point?
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Krixtal Icefluxor
Gallente Bison Industrial Inc
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Posted - 2011.04.17 19:45:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Pricecheck idiot
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
The issue, as EVERYONE knows, is the NC lock on the Technitium Moons and subsequent manufacture and control of the prices of the Ship Components.
Well that's total bull**** because the problem was happening FAR before the technetium price was changed by CCP.
Quotage on that change of price by CCP please. Unless they changed it since December when it was possible to actually make about 15% profit on a Bustard, to be ship specific.
Anyone can look at the Graphs and see exactly when the price jump occurred. Just curious as to why nobody else has ever mentioned a CCP Technitium Price Change. Please enlighten and we will believe.
**************************
"God is nothing but the power of the Universe, as a whole, to organize itself." - Lee Smolin Three Roads to Quantum Gravity |
Kiyirari
All Star Shipyards
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Posted - 2011.04.17 20:06:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Burnharder
Originally by: Kiyirari
Adv lab op at 4 gives you 10 labs slots use = 10 job lots of invention
Guess what... some of us have things to do with the other slots, like ME, PE and/or copy jobs. Doing them in batches of 5 is fine. What's your point?
GET alts DUDE; then ya won't be stuck with, what to do with other the 5 slots...
To by pass the bottle neck in what ever ya struggle in..... requires alts to deal with it !!!!!!!!!!!!
Plain & simple fact of invention and production
Revenge is my god and my guns are her angels |
Burnharder
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Posted - 2011.04.17 22:59:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Kiyirari
Originally by: Burnharder
Originally by: Kiyirari
Adv lab op at 4 gives you 10 labs slots use = 10 job lots of invention
Guess what... some of us have things to do with the other slots, like ME, PE and/or copy jobs. Doing them in batches of 5 is fine. What's your point?
GET alts DUDE; then ya won't be stuck with, what to do with other the 5 slots...
To by pass the bottle neck in what ever ya struggle in..... requires alts to deal with it !!!!!!!!!!!!
Plain & simple fact of invention and production
It doesn't, because you can make a good profit with one industry char doing invention, as I can prove.
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Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:22:00 -
[28]
Honestly its a bad investment of your time and isk if you're having your inventor using half of his lab slot to do invention and other 5 to do research/copy.
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSACSE Listing |
Breaker77
Gallente Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.04.17 23:50:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Burnharder
It doesn't, because you can make a good profit with one industry char doing invention, as I can prove.
You can, but 5 slots = X profit while 90 slots = 18X profit!
Really simple math.
Invention is one of those things that scales really nicely. Having 3 characters doing copy jobs and 9 more running invention works great. If you have picked the right item or items then it won't be a problem to pay for the PLEX for 4 accounts, POS, and any other expenses while leaving plenty of profit to spend on whatever you wish.
Not to mention use those other characters to work on PI for even more income.
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Adrian Idaho
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Posted - 2011.04.18 05:22:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Adrian Idaho on 18/04/2011 05:23:54
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Originally by: Pricecheck idiot
Originally by: Krixtal Icefluxor
The issue, as EVERYONE knows, is the NC lock on the Technitium Moons and subsequent manufacture and control of the prices of the Ship Components.
Well that's total bull**** because the problem was happening FAR before the technetium price was changed by CCP.
Quotage on that change of price by CCP please. Unless they changed it since December when it was possible to actually make about 15% profit on a Bustard, to be ship specific.
Anyone can look at the Graphs and see exactly when the price jump occurred. Just curious as to why nobody else has ever mentioned a CCP Technitium Price Change. Please enlighten and we will believe.
I know you're just a troll, and a not even a very talented one, but I'll bite anyway. The technetium price started changing rather soon after the expansion in late 2009. If you make a little effort, you can find two threads by Akita T: one in which he predicts the rise in tech prices, and one in which he cashes out on it. Well, so much for "December 2010"...
So, next time you get your daily whine, do a little research beforehand.
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