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Zevix
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Posted - 2011.05.06 21:48:00 -
[271]
Edited by: Zevix on 06/05/2011 21:48:08 Well well, some late comers to the discussion, welcome to it. I walk a thin line here as many of the answers to questions and statements have been responded to in earlier posts and I have been accused of over-repeating myself. The length of the thread has gotten a little lengthy (also mentioned before) so I can understand how some players dont want to go through the whole thing, but i would really encourage you to because this is an important discussion and I think all our voices here needed.
But I think I will add one small idea to the pot that wasnt in earlier posts because it was another mechanics idea and this discussion is more about finding player driven means for all of us. Belt rats, I would as a carebear agree with either beefing them up the way concord was beefed up on you to present a better risk to miners, or make them more often, or best yet, have the rats that spawn do so based on the ship or ships present. An idea that isnt simple nor whole by any means but an idea that could be refined to better suit the game. At present in my hulk even in a .5 system it only takes 5 scout drones to protect from rats and they are gones pretty quickly. So besides the difference in bounty based of system security level it doesnt really feel like the belts have the proper gradation or degree separation in challenge to them. thats not to say they should be impossible for a single miner to deal with, we dont want to turn eve into a giant need for raid groups, but if there was a better balance of defend-ability of industry ships in response to the threat they face from the other 99% of the ship catalogue and rats I think it would be fair to make rats at least a little more interesting to deal with even when a player isnt there to threaten him from what I would define as valid forms of pvp (better faction warfare and better wardec systems I believe you pvp'ers deserve).
"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty" Darwi Odrade, Chapterhouse Dune |
Brycesv1
Caldari Elko Bail Bonds Lonely Maple Conglomeration
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Posted - 2011.05.08 01:38:00 -
[272]
"There is no safe space" is a realism issue. it comes from "there is no safe place"
Concord are the police. No matter how good they are, or how "secure" they are, nothing can stop someone from walking into a police station and killing someone. The police would instantly react and take down the assailant but the innocent would already be dead. Luckily CCP actually likes their carebears and made it an EXPLOIT to escape from the police... Consider yourself lucky that hisec kills have to be suicidal. otherwise, i would have splattered you across your system already.
------------------------------------------------- There once was a man from Nantucket. Who tried to build a good ship but said "**** it". He grabbed his glue and his duct tape too. And thats why th |
Marius Deterium
Caldari Crush Kill Destroy
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:26:00 -
[273]
Please, I'm begging you, just go play Freespace. --- Mining hulls for the juicy goods inside.
Good...bad, I'm the guy with the gun. |
Barbelo Valentinian
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.05.15 13:42:00 -
[274]
Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 15/05/2011 13:45:06
Originally by: ValentinaDLM Edited by: ValentinaDLM on 26/04/2011 00:27:03
Originally by: Merdaneth You are using a false dichotomy. EVE does not exist of just two opposed populations. It is not a question of Carebears vs. PVPers and don't fool yourself into thinking it is.
This is basically what I thought too. The line between carebear and PVPer is more imagined than not.
Yeah, as a (mainly) PvE-er, I agree with this. By the time vets are vets, they do all the stuff EVE has to offer - and they often mission or mine or do industry or whatever, to support their PvP. Some do it grumpily (as one poster pointed out above) - they'd rather pew pew 24/7 and not have to bother with the PvE stuff. That's the burden they have to bear, just as the "pure carebear" has the burden of ever-present risk.
But I think most EVE players are a bit of both, and it's just a kind of fun rhetoric that you see mainly in the forums, to polarize the community into carebears/player killers.
EVE is just fine. Maybe a teensy bit more logic to the "policing" of high sec, to minimise griefing proper (although I guess that has to be balanced with the computing power necessary to implement it), but the risk has got to be there, it's the heart and soul of EVE, and the reason playing EVE is more of an emotionally engaging, adrenalin-pumping experience than any other MMO out at the moment.
*****
"To wake up is to wake the world up" - D.E. Harding |
Jesus Rambo
Minmatar Disciples of Chaos Test Friends Please Ignore
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Posted - 2011.05.15 20:53:00 -
[275]
Originally by: Zevix
WE are the players and WE decide how eve is played.
And WE are the majority, and WE don't agree with you.
Carebear get ganked too mch, come to make a butthurt ragepost on the forums? Nobody cares. HTFU. Being able to kill people out of nowhere in the supposedly 'safe' areas is part of what makes Eve what it is.
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Debrie
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Posted - 2011.05.16 15:13:00 -
[276]
Edited by: Debrie on 16/05/2011 15:18:35 lolz claiming to be obvious majority , in a game wer less than 5-10 % ever have even looked at forums = winner
dont get me wrong I think "high sec ganking" should be possible , but with far more repercussions that currently exist
by that I mean , no insurance for the criminal criminal is FORCED to pay full insurance cost to victem , or become a faction warfare target of that nation untill payment is made
example I have 5+ standings with gallent , you fly into gall territory to high sec grief me (er srry gank) you get nuthing + u gotta pay me , or not be allowed into gall territory ever again
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Karash Amerius
Sutoka
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Posted - 2011.05.16 23:52:00 -
[277]
Newsflash: "PVP"-ers do more carebear things in their time than most carebears. They do everything a carebear does (and mostly better), but also willingly put themselves at risk for fun, glory, and achievement among their peers.. Carebears do not get recognized by their peers as everyone knows anyone can achieve what they do on a daily basis. Think about that.
Eve punishes ignorant people (note: I did not say stupid). If you want to be left alone to PVE in bliss, you will need to learn how to PVP and protect yourself. Eve will always have the wolf and the sheep...get used to that. ========================= Karash Amerius - Operative - Sutoka Fighting Broke - A Eve Online Blog ========================= |
Magnus Witchspace
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Posted - 2011.05.17 03:03:00 -
[278]
To the OP, hisec isn't safe enough already? Goodness me, getting out of bed in the morning is a risk - and yet you want a game with even less risk than your safe, domesticated real life? ;)
Jokes aside, there is an unreal feel about EVE. How realistic is it for a bunch of wannabe pirates to suicide gank a hulk in hisec? Where are the consequences for such actions? Lose a few cheap ships and a status downgrade?
And how realistic is it for experienced players to be can-flipping newbie miners? Talk about pathetic, low-risk activity.
And what about those who brag about stalking the PVE crowd while they're running missions in lowsec?
Give a human being an ethical choice, for which there are little or no consequences, and they will choose the easy, unethical path 99.99% of the time. EVE proves this.
Everybody loves rabbitting on about risks and consequences and yet I see very little risk or consequences for experienced players who choose to pick on newbies.
I would love to see some proper conseqences and risks introduced into the game to address the huge number of cowardly players who choose the easy path. Hisec is crawling with wannabe pirates. We need to be encouraging them into lowsec/nullsec so they can be faced with some risk. Isn't that what piracy is supposed to be about?
But I'm also aware that this would affect the balance of the game in terms of the supply/demand for ore. Simple. Reduce the amount of ore available in hisec space. Let's introduce a few more risks for miners as well!
As for the Carebear v PVP argument - well as someone else stated, that's a false premise. I do a bit of everything in this game. I couldn't imagine being JUST a miner or JUST a PVPer. How boring would that be?
It's very fashionable on the EVE forums to label people as "newbies" or "carebears". But what term do we use for wannabe pirates who want no risk, who only pick on the weak and inexperienced? It's all carebear activity, isn't it?
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Syndryna
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Posted - 2011.05.17 18:57:00 -
[279]
OP owes me a new keyboard. I spit water all over mine laughing.
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Imnot 'Abot
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Posted - 2011.05.17 19:50:00 -
[280]
I think your a little confused about CCP stating high sec was meant to be 'completely safe'. What they(CCP) said was the noobie starting system(s) are off limits to ganking etc.. and is in fact a bannable offense to gank in a newbie system.
So if by completly safe in high sec you mean the 8 or so starting systems for new characters then yes it does exist and in fact you can explore everything EvE has to offer in these starting systems, just dont expect to get rich anytime this century.
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Zheng Xie
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Posted - 2011.05.17 22:29:00 -
[281]
Originally by: Imnot 'Abot I think your a little confused about CCP stating high sec was meant to be 'completely safe'. What they(CCP) said was the noobie starting system(s) are off limits to ganking etc.. and is in fact a bannable offense to gank in a newbie system.
LOL...I didn't know that. Good thing all my attempts ended in failure :P Probably why they're so popular with AFK miners.
Where can I find rules like that?
Quote:
So if by completly safe in high sec you mean the 8 or so starting systems for new characters then yes it does exist and in fact you can explore everything EvE has to offer in these starting systems, just dont expect to get rich anytime this century.
Actually, EvE seems to be completely safe for this guy. It's often said that the only way to be completely safe in EvE is to never undock...well...
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Bootleg Jack
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Posted - 2011.05.17 23:50:00 -
[282]
Security is a good ship and good friends.
/thread
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Rosa Cardenalis
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Posted - 2011.05.18 05:48:00 -
[283]
Quote: It's very fashionable on the EVE forums to label people as "newbies" or "carebears". But what term do we use for wannabe pirates who want no risk, who only pick on the weak and inexperienced? It's all carebear activity, isn't it?
err we call them pirates? people that want e-honour do duels and ask for 1 v 1s. People that want to suceed in pvp pick fights that they think they can win. People that want to profit from pvp pick the easiest possible fights.
When a pack of lions (King of Beasts?) attacks a herd of wilderbeast they don't target the biggest strongest bull they can find.
They go for the young, the old, the sick and the weak.
In RL pirates tend to target civilian ships with little to no defence and potentially high rewards, not much point going for an aircraft carrier with a dingy and a grappling hook.
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