Originally by: digitalwanderer

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The entire history of CCP's expansions can only be considered partial releases at the most with the content of each one hardly receiving any updates later on, but in the meantime players keep training skills and gaining SP and get the ability to do more either way....Do you want examples:


Faction warfare....Released the in one of the expansions and never touched again.
Epic storyline arks......Same thing and there was supposed to be more of them than the 4 we have now.
Planetary interaction....Click fest and boring as hell, hardly something you'd name an expansion for.
T3 ships....Only 1 cruiser released for each race and it's been 2 years already with nothing more added since.

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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I "get" EVE just fine thanks.....There's CCP's vision of what it can be and they make pretty cool videos about it, and there's the reality in game and in quite a few respects, sometimes they look like completely different games with new content coming in horribly late and unfinished and needed quite a few patches to get most of it sorted out...Heck,as an example, it only took 2 years to get rockets fixed and this problem was reported so many times in the past it wasn't even funny....

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Originally by: Plus 1

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You just said you aren't even flying supercaps so what's the point of this for you? Btw, you can train up another character on your 1 account to be a supercap pilot. You don't need two accounts. The flying "coffin" effect is part of the difficulty of flying them, yet this is driving you away from them. They are a bit too cheap and common overall, but it will be interesting to see how the actions taken against botters affect that in the long run.

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Originally by: Judicator Saturnius

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We agree on this, but i'm taking issue with your over-riding point (and the only reason this thread has any reason to be in ships&mods, conincidentally) that EVE needs more ships. I dare say i'm not alone in thinking this is really the worst possible thing for EVE at this juncture.


Again, what does this have to do with new ships? Even with an infinite amount of resources being poured into EVE I don't think they could continually add new ships patch after patch and continue to keep them at all balanced to preserve gameplay.

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Perhaps the fact that the underlying problem is that CCP tries to release too many expansions of new content wich hasn't had enough time to mature, balance and sort out the bugs, usually every 6 months or so, while at the same time fixing~ balancing the content that already is in the game right now...The list of stuff already in game to fix~balance~improve before they even bother with adding even more(incarna), is enourmous as it is and they don't seem to see it or care....Just simply release more content every six month.


As for me, and like i said earlier i'm still training skills thru all this time and running out of objectives to aim for, and it was CCP(way back in 2003) that stated that up to 5 tech levels were to be part of the game eventually and 8 years later we're not even at the half way mark yet, and in that thread where CCP anwers players questions, they stated that more T3 ships might not come until sometime in 2014...


I will have run out of stuff to train well before then if they hold to that schedule....It's this lack of focus and trying to release all sorts of different content and doing it half assed every 6 months, then forgetting about it for years in some cases that somewhat ****es me off.

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Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis

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Call me when you find a gaming company that does it "perfectly". I'll wait here whilst you look...

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis

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Call me when you find a gaming company that does it "perfectly". I'll wait here whilst you look...

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I never said perfect either, but there's a lot of content that's already been released that needs more development, before releasing even more still and no one is holding a gun to CCP's head to release incarna ASAP quite frankly....Many don't even care about incarna as eve is a space game above all else.


Some have expressed disapointment that incarna will be limited to captains quarters for the time being, but CCP is following the same patern as they did with previous patches, offering the initial experience, preview, glimpse of their future vision and taking years to complete it, all the while the current content needs attention.

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Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis

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Incarna and the introduction of CQ is meant to attract new players. Part of what EvE is - a game where you are effectively your ship - is unattractive to traditional MMO players. CQ is going to allow you to see yourself for the first time. I think CCP hopes that's going to mean a boost in subscribership...and that's why they are rushing it out.

As far as current content needing attention - I agree. But the last thing you can do is sit back and focus on old stuff while players start to get tired of the current stuff. Balance is the key. As much as it's heresy...Blizzard does that better than anyone else out there.

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Perhaps the fact that the underlying problem is that CCP tries to release too many expansions of new content wich hasn't had enough time to mature, balance and sort out the bugs, usually every 6 months or so, while at the same time fixing~ balancing the content that already is in the game right now...The list of stuff already in game to fix~balance~improve before they even bother with adding even more(incarna), is enourmous as it is and they don't seem to see it or care....Just simply release more content every six month.

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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As for me, and like i said earlier i'm still training skills thru all this time and running out of objectives to aim for, and it was CCP(way back in 2003) that stated that up to 5 tech levels were to be part of the game eventually and 8 years later we're not even at the half way mark yet, and in that thread where CCP anwers players questions, they stated that more T3 ships might not come until sometime in 2014...


I will have run out of stuff to train well before then if they hold to that schedule....It's this lack of focus and trying to release all sorts of different content and doing it half assed every 6 months, then forgetting about it for years in some cases that somewhat ****es me off.

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Originally by: Judicator Saturnius

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You're right, I think they released too many ships myself. They probably could have done without motherships, black ops, assault frigates, etc. But this runs counter to your OP. If you want pain-stakingly balanced content you don't get a new pony very often. Again, I get it, you don't like the way the game has been developed. Neither do it. But this has sweet ****-all to do with you wanting another ship to play with. Are you not getting that?


So another t3 ship would solve your problems and give you reason to play again? What happened to all that fluf about incarana and fixing broken things, and more careful development processes? You're going to run out of things to train? Not even in another 8 years. You might run out of relavent things to train based on your current interests, but that is a glass ceiling that i'm ok with. Would you rather just have rank VI tacked on to every skill so you could get another 1% out of your ship for 90 days of training?

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Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter

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That being said id love to see an offer to turn a 100m+ SP Char into a 500k SP Jove Char with access to Jove ships.

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Originally by: Swynet

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Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter

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That being said id love to see an offer to turn a 100m+ SP Char into a 500k SP Jove Char with access to Jove ships.

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Making vets even more unmatchable and powerful at the expense of the new ones...

Sure there must be some interest for some to tank 300 battleships in some frigate and feel like gods but what about trying to kill Titans or Super carriers with T2 frigs fleets? - this is a huge goal for you guys.

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Originally by: Swynet

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Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter

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That being said id love to see an offer to turn a 100m+ SP Char into a 500k SP Jove Char with access to Jove ships.

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Making vets even more unmatchable and powerful at the expense of the new ones...

Sure there must be some interest for some to tank 300 battleships in some frigate and feel like gods but what about trying to kill Titans or Super carriers with T2 frigs fleets? - this is a huge goal for you guys.

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Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter

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Having played as long as the OP, im not as much worried about new ships but with the balancing of the existing once (or more like CCPs ignorance to balancing).

That being said id love to see an offer to turn a 100m+ SP Char into a 500k SP Jove Char with access to Jove ships.
I would happily accept extremly long skilltimes (eg ~4 months for jove cruiser 5) for these ships.

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Originally by: Naomi Knight

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Originally by: Swynet

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Sure there must be some interest for some to tank 300 battleships in some frigate and feel like gods but what about trying to kill Titans or Super carriers with T2 frigs fleets? - this is a huge goal for you guys.

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oh new ones oohhh noooo they should be able to do everything at day 1 , poor newbies :_(

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Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis

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Originally by: Naomi Knight

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Originally by: Swynet

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Sure there must be some interest for some to tank 300 battleships in some frigate and feel like gods but what about trying to kill Titans or Super carriers with T2 frigs fleets? - this is a huge goal for you guys.

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oh new ones oohhh noooo they should be able to do everything at day 1 , poor newbies :_(

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Do you actually read posts, or do you just see a key-work or two in there and decide it's time to start spouting off your drivel?

Contribute to the conversation or p.i.s.s off.

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Originally by: Naomi Knight

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so as you didnt do the first why dont you do the second as you should?:O

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Originally by: Plus 1

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You just said you aren't even flying supercaps so what's the point of this for you? Btw, you can train up another character on your 1 account to be a supercap pilot. You don't need two accounts. The flying "coffin" effect is part of the difficulty of flying them, yet this is driving you away from them. They are a bit too cheap and common overall, but it will be interesting to see how the actions taken against botters affect that in the long run.

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In order to train another character in the same account, i have to stop training on this main one and that has nothing to do with the difficulty of the game content all, but rather CCP policy to encourage players to get additional accounts so that you can keep all the main chars of each account training, wich CCP is always pitching offers to every current player in the game, and i've said no for the past 8 years, and you'd think they'd get the hint by now...

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Originally by: Plus 1

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Why do you care about pausing training on your character who has nothing left to train for?

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Frankly, it's been a recurring friction point since 2004 and i barely had a year into the game and only 11~12 million sp and new players were already complaining about the skill point gap back then, but it doesn't change the fact that those who've stayed this long with the game are having issues with choosing what to train next, and many times that involves training skills they have very little interest or use in, just to keep the char busy with something.

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Originally by: Plus 1

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That's what doesn't make any sense. You are complaining about not having anything to train for and asking for new ships when there's big training sinks and other ships that you are refusing to train for.

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Originally by: Naomi Knight

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Originally by: Swynet

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Originally by: Jargo Stonecutter

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That being said id love to see an offer to turn a 100m+ SP Char into a 500k SP Jove Char with access to Jove ships.

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Making vets even more unmatchable and powerful at the expense of the new ones...

Sure there must be some interest for some to tank 300 battleships in some frigate and feel like gods but what about trying to kill Titans or Super carriers with T2 frigs fleets? - this is a huge goal for you guys.

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oh new ones oohhh noooo they should be able to do everything at day 1 , poor newbies :_(

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Originally by: Haleuth

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The OP raises a valid point tbh, im in the same boat.

I dont agree with introducing jove ships or any other ships as it will only lead to years of balancing issues.

Remember the saying from 2004-2005? "specialisation is the key"

Well i'd personally like to see that back tbh. Allowing players with 100-150 million skill points to pick say 1 gunnery skill only and train it to level 6, 7, 8 etc. Those levels will take along time and wont cause balancing issues.

As a rough estimate (not ingame atm)

Medium blaster specialisation with max perception + willpower:-

level 6 = 52 days = 2% damage
level 7 = 200 days = 2% damage
level 8 = 800 days = 2% damage

I'd be happy with that rather than train stuff i'm never going to use

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Originally by: digitalwanderer

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Edited by: digitalwanderer on 29/05/2011 18:19:57
Edited by: digitalwanderer on 29/05/2011 18:15:49

I guess that's also an option, even if the bonus is pretty small given the really long training times to get it.....2+ years of training to get to rank 8 on one skill,yikes....

Yes but i and others like yourself will train it, rather than train nothing or something we wont use, deep down i know that you would train 1 gunnery skill to rank 8 if available.

And yes i do remember the specialisation argument and policy that CCP tried to encourage several years ago, but that would only be feasable if they introduced new ships and skills at a much faster rate than they did, so that a player could keep on training skills relevant to their chosen starting race/profession, but they didn't and it's ancient history how so it hardly matters...As much as i hate to say it, it's almost as if CCP after the first couple of years simply didn't have an overall gameplan for EVE, and has been trying a bit of everything in terms of content with every expansion with the intent of making the game easier and more popular by having more activities, but no clear focus overall.

The specialisation augument was used to get us to train the new gunnery+missile skills introduced during 2004-2005. It actually has even more relervence today since all combat characters become the same over time. Allowing us to train 1 gunnery skill to level 6,7,8 etc would bring that back without breaking anything. When we play online games we all want to be a little bit unique right?

The reason CCP dosn't have a long term gameplan and tries to do a bit of everything is because, as i've said before the organisation is now full of dead wood. Sure they hire new staff as the company has grown but these new staff end up with the same attitude as those older members = ****e. It all boils down to how much they love/play their product. Its no secret that the vast majority of CCP either dont play Eve or play PvE content only. The Peter principle ???

I see the future vision video and while it is impressive, i fear it'll take years to pull that off fully, and that's assuming CCP doesn't get distracted with something else in the meantime, and it's happended quite a few times where we've seen tech video's (like flying on planet atmosphere shown in 2004), that never materialised in game....Who here wouldn't love that particular feature and maybe even have combat between ships in that environment, while a ground war is raging below on the surface of the planet itself...

Deep down you know that the future vision video is nothing more than eye candy conjured up to pull new players in. You've been around long enough to know that it is nothing more than bullcrap just like the flying through the atmosphere, or the mining revamp that never happened. Theres now to many instances of ****e shown at fanfest that never happens m8.

Given that the ships can't be made of tritanium if they're flown in the atmosphere(tritanium explodes if i'm not mistaken), that means training a whole new class of ships(each race has it's own ships obviously) and the skills that go with it too for their research and development and construction so it satisfies many fields within eve and what the player chooses to do, and an oportunity like this is wasted by CCP.....

You want more PvE content?? Cmon, thats all they've been doing for years if you think about it.

I'd wager all my isk and yours that the in station combat displayed in "a future vision" will never happen.
Haleuth

Originally by: Haleuth

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Remember the saying from 2004-2005? "specialisation is the key"

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Originally by: Haleuth

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And sorry for not being able to multiquote m8.

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