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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Kallen Skye
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Posted - 2011.06.25 11:55:00 -
[61]
the only way i could see anything resembling this idea being implemented would be something for new players only..... during their first say month or two of play they have the option for a one time purchase of a skill points package. This would be sized so they could get a decent jump into the game as a new player without allowing everyone just to suddenly cap their characters out or something.
And the only reason i would even be remotely ok with that sort of package is because i know how daunting the game can be for new players who dont already have well founded friends in game. But at the same time i understand that allowing anyone to just max out there characters with real money would cheapen the game for people. heck if they made it so you could purchase exp points just willy nilly i would quit.... and i haven't even put much time into the game even on my main toon who's sitting on a merm and a few other nice ships.... but what i like is that it actually takes real dedication to become real powerful on here...
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DuKackBoon
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Posted - 2011.06.25 13:20:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Micro Tranactions Rock Edited by: Micro Tranactions Rock on 25/06/2011 11:39:27
Originally by: DuKackBoon
Originally by: Micro Tranactions Rock
Exactly the point, new players are so far behind that it is not fun for them, i can't imagine a player with less then 50m skillpoints doing anything which is really fun or rewarding.
Keep trollin' bro. I got 28.9 million SP, and do solo-pvp, small-scale pvp, did fleet PVP, reverse engineering, invention, production, mining... pretty much everything other than flying capitals you can do in EVE. You don't need to ***** up SP in order to do stuff. Specialize, and you can easily compete with some of EVE's elite PVPers who have gunnery and mechanic on all level 5.
Lol, nice sarcastic one,
Indeed, if you don't have the "very basic" skills atleast at 5 you can't do anything. Older players will always have an edge over you. And thinking that it is elite to have gunnery and mechanics all on 5 is not enough you really need a spaceship skills, navigation skills, electronic skills, at 5 to properly fly and fitt ships! So indeed we need the new players to buy some skills so that the basic, certificates are met.
Wait that is a great idea, please sell basic certificates in the Micro Transaction store!
@Yolo Indeed 50m or 100m is nothing for new players, they can just buy plex and sell them on market for isk.
Not sarcasm. I was serious.
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Asyrdin Harate
Aura of Darkness Nulli Secunda
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Posted - 2011.06.25 13:37:00 -
[63]
I am not fond of this idea
Please don't devaluate years of carefull choises or the sell price of characters by simply letting ppl buy their SP
It would kill half the fun in eve
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Sobaan Tali
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Posted - 2011.06.25 14:06:00 -
[64]
screw it...if eve is down hill from here anyhow, i might as well get a chance to fly a super at least once, even though i have barely enough sp to fly a frieghter. Terrible idea, but since things have been going the way they have, we all may as well have one massive super cap battle...just warp in and kill everything, friend and foe alike.
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subtle turtle
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Posted - 2011.06.25 14:24:00 -
[65]
While CCP has got their "bad idea jeans" on, might as well, right? I would also like to see a change to the Sov system. I think you should have to buy systems with Aurum. I will pay $2000 US for ownership of Jita. It's an Eve fire sale! All game mechanics must go!
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Elrathias
Caldari Legio Prima Victrix
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Posted - 2011.06.25 14:50:00 -
[66]
the day they implement som ting like this ile quit eve so will about 10-15peeps i know.. so thats about 30-35 acounts --------------------------
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Qusal III
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Posted - 2011.06.26 08:13:00 -
[67]
Edited by: Qusal III on 26/06/2011 08:15:12 Edited by: Qusal III on 26/06/2011 08:14:28 I think this is a good idea, if implemented right.
In the lines off: Max buyable skillpoints up to 30m skillpoints. After you reached that you should not be able to add more.
Sell the basic certificates, so people get used to them, and it is really nice for new players. Makes the game more accessable.
Make it really expensive, yes way more expensive then vanitiy items.
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Aeropride
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Posted - 2011.06.26 09:05:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Elrathias the day they implement som ting like this ile quit eve so will about 10-15peeps i know.. so thats about 30-35 acounts
mmo gamers love to talk about leaving when somthing happens they dont like but most will stay. MAinly because of time and money already invested in the character. New games however dont have that luxury. Eve doesnt have that problem.
With that said being able to buy sp sounds like a good idea to me. 1 plex for a mil or 2 sp i like.
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Mourek
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Posted - 2011.06.26 10:49:00 -
[69]
You guys know the game called "Dark Orbit"? thats a mt game where you can buy elite things (ammo, skill, etc.) for money... The people who dont pay dont stand a chance, the game is ruined now, do you want EVE to become this???? please CCP clothes is ok, maybe some rare items or pimp your ship with paint for money but please no SP for money that would ruin this game for real, I know what im talking about.
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.06.26 11:22:00 -
[70]
Now its possible to buy toons for ISK. If somebody have the money he can buy 100 PLEX and buy the best toon for it. So whats the problem anyway ? Besides you will ALWAYS earn more money in RL per hour than in Eve. So rationally there are no real arguments against it. Those who grind ISK are in fact real nolifers because even if you are a student in a university you will earn more working part time in a bar. Ergo : ISK/h < real money/h
What a difference does it make if you buy a toon or SP ? In both variations you simple avoid "stand empty" time where you just "suck and skill". In RL we have everywhere the first and the 2nd class and the only difference is in 1st class you get more comfort. So its goes without saying that a CCP company has to implement such things. It would be strange if it wouldnt be so. In this case CCP would simply renounce possible money which is not rational for a company.
PS : For Protesters : read at least "Economics" by Tim Harford, a popular science book about simple economic principles. Its funny and you get this things clear
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Draelos
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Posted - 2011.06.26 11:59:00 -
[71]
Originally by: MorliDots22 Now its possible to buy toons for ISK. If somebody have the money he can buy 100 PLEX and buy the best toon for it. So whats the problem anyway ? Besides you will ALWAYS earn more money in RL per hour than in Eve. So rationally there are no real arguments against it. Those who grind ISK are in fact real nolifers because even if you are a student in a university you will earn more working part time in a bar. Ergo : ISK/h < real money/h
What a difference does it make if you buy a toon or SP ? In both variations you simple avoid "stand empty" time where you just "suck and skill". In RL we have everywhere the first and the 2nd class and the only difference is in 1st class you get more comfort. So its goes without saying that a CCP company has to implement such things. It would be strange if it wouldnt be so. In this case CCP would simply renounce possible money which is not rational for a company.
PS : For Protesters : read at least "Economics" by Tim Harford, a popular science book about simple economic principles. Its funny and you get this things clear
I'll join in as I'm bored and I find it funny
________________________________________________
*Causally doing an anom*
*Character jumps into system*
Draelos: "Ah, someone in local" *checks characters bio* *asks friend about corp*
---Date of Birth: 2011.06.26 11:45:00---
Draelos: "Brand new player, no worries so, possible scout?" *goes back to anom*
*30kk sp character decloaks in his Loki and warp scrams me...then his buddies jump in*
Draelos: "FUUUUUuu"
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Crispin McTarmac
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Posted - 2011.06.26 13:39:00 -
[72]
The skillpoint system is a huge chunk of eve's gameplay, deciding what skills to train first and planning for a new activity is very engrossing. Waiting for skills to train also give you time to plot, and encourages people to find cheaper, more cunning ways of doing things which feels like beating the odds when it works. There's also an incentive to come back after temporarily getting tired of the game, which can happen a lot. In short, selling skillpoints doesn't just devalue the character market, it completely breaks the game, and I'm amazed that some people actually have to be told this
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Robert Caldera
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Posted - 2011.06.26 17:35:00 -
[73]
Originally by: MorliDots22
What a difference does it make if you buy a toon or SP ? In both variations you simple avoid "stand empty" time where you just "suck and skill".
fine, so we dont need SP purchases? Agree
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Asyrdin Harate
Aura of Darkness Nulli Secunda
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Posted - 2011.06.26 20:52:00 -
[74]
I would like to point out that a character you buy with ISK still represents a lot of time investment by someone. Simply buying SP is entirely different as it would be instant and as such reduces the game experience.
If you want to have more SP this bad...why not just buy a character (to completely reverse the argument) and leave the game experience in tact
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George Holden
Gallente Syndicated Systems ROMANIAN-LEGION
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Posted - 2011.06.26 22:20:00 -
[75]
Not that I support this but just to crunch some numbers on it.
Let's say the average SP/hour is around 2500? I'm not sure about the real average but it seems reasonable to me. The subscription for a year is 131.40$ which translates into 0.015$ per hour.
With that SP rate one SP costs 0.000006$ right now using the 1y subscription. Now let's make a fair package with 2500 SP for 0.10$ a pop and there you have your 5m SP toon costing 200$. Make a hard cap to 10m SP total and prevent some skills to be "bought" and I'd be glad seeing you spending 400$ on a raven pilot to farm your plexes :P
anyway ain't gonna happen or I ragequit!
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Micro Tranactions Rock
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Posted - 2011.06.27 07:41:00 -
[76]
From CCP Zulu's dev blog:
The result of this meeting should be mutual agreement of how virtual goods and services will evolve in EVE.
However, just to prove the point of the Fearless newsletter and give you a further understanding of what it is then there are no and never have been plans to sell ôgold ammoö for Aurum.
This looks promissing, buying skillpoints can be qualified as a service!
For the people saying you can already buy skillpoints in the form of characters on the bazaar, well i just don't like that i would rather buy skillpoints since a character will always have some sort of | history. And i like to create my own history, name etc.
The idea's about maximum skillpoints for buying them are really good idea's so there would be no maxed out characters because of this! And the 7 year old players will still have their "1337" advantage.
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01011 101
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Posted - 2011.06.27 12:58:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Micro Tranactions Rock From CCP Zulu's dev blog:
The result of this meeting should be mutual agreement of how virtual goods and services will evolve in EVE.
However, just to prove the point of the Fearless newsletter and give you a further understanding of what it is then there are no and never have been plans to sell ôgold ammoö for Aurum.
This looks promissing, buying skillpoints can be qualified as a service!
For the people saying you can already buy skillpoints in the form of characters on the bazaar, well i just don't like that i would rather buy skillpoints since a character will always have some sort of | history. And i like to create my own history, name etc.
The idea's about maximum skillpoints for buying them are really good idea's so there would be no maxed out characters because of this! And the 7 year old players will still have their "1337" advantage.
Translation: "Troll~Trolly~McTroll"
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Qusal III
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Posted - 2011.06.27 15:59:00 -
[78]
Originally by: 01011 101
Originally by: Micro Tranactions Rock From CCP Zulu's dev blog:
The result of this meeting should be mutual agreement of how virtual goods and services will evolve in EVE.
However, just to prove the point of the Fearless newsletter and give you a further understanding of what it is then there are no and never have been plans to sell ôgold ammoö for Aurum.
This looks promissing, buying skillpoints can be qualified as a service!
For the people saying you can already buy skillpoints in the form of characters on the bazaar, well i just don't like that i would rather buy skillpoints since a character will always have some sort of | history. And i like to create my own history, name etc.
The idea's about maximum skillpoints for buying them are really good idea's so there would be no maxed out characters because of this! And the 7 year old players will still have their "1337" advantage.
Translation: "Troll~Trolly~McTroll"
Yes a Troll haloween costume is a good idea also as vanity item
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01011 101
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Posted - 2011.06.27 16:34:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Qusal III
Originally by: 01011 101
Originally by: Micro Tranactions Rock From CCP Zulu's dev blog:
The result of this meeting should be mutual agreement of how virtual goods and services will evolve in EVE.
However, just to prove the point of the Fearless newsletter and give you a further understanding of what it is then there are no and never have been plans to sell ôgold ammoö for Aurum.
This looks promissing, buying skillpoints can be qualified as a service!
For the people saying you can already buy skillpoints in the form of characters on the bazaar, well i just don't like that i would rather buy skillpoints since a character will always have some sort of | history. And i like to create my own history, name etc.
The idea's about maximum skillpoints for buying them are really good idea's so there would be no maxed out characters because of this! And the 7 year old players will still have their "1337" advantage.
Translation: "Troll~Trolly~McTroll"
Yes a Troll haloween costume is a good idea also as vanity item
Forget the monocle, I've gotta get me one of those!!!
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Daokao
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Posted - 2011.06.27 17:03:00 -
[80]
Time = Money is a capitalistic idea, much like these MacroTransactions ideas
Time is without value.
The moment you try to place a dollar value on time, the moment your world falls apart.
Having SP = time spent training = AUR-buyable = completely ruined game. Period.
Guildwars and WOW could sell levels, but that's because everyone needs to be on a level playing field at some point. In EVE, it's all about the weak and the strong. The slaves and the masters. The miners, the pirates, the scrubs and the corporations. It's about the weak overcoming the playing field, not buying their way to equalizing it. Goonswarm climbed to the top with their teeth and nails, then lost it all to an "unfair" turn of events. This is what makes EVE exciting. This is why CCP is ruining EVE - by even considering these kinds of things as purchasable with real money. You might argue that PLEX is almost doing what AUR is going to do - but you're just looking at it shortsightedly when you think that's true.
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Zen Sarum
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Posted - 2011.06.27 19:35:00 -
[81]
Only if some bitter vet who ain't subbed somewhere loses 2x the skillpoints..
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Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy Black Sun Alliance
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Posted - 2011.06.27 23:26:00 -
[82]
Edited by: Barbara Nichole on 27/06/2011 23:36:03
Originally by: Daokao Time = Money is a capitalistic idea, much like these MacroTransactions ideas
incorrect.
Time = money a plank of capitalism.. in this case time = isk
Micro-tranaction = federal reserve printing money out of nothing and injecting it into the system causing devaluation of money or hyper-inflation. Out of control government trying to manipulate what should have been a free market.
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Selinate
Amarr Mocking Birds
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Posted - 2011.06.28 02:25:00 -
[83]
the day this happens is the day I unsub. The current SP system of Eve is probably one of the things I dislike most about Eve, but if people are able to start paying for SP then the fun of the game is taken away in its entirety.
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Gevlin
Minmatar Sebiestor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.06.28 02:57:00 -
[84]
Not a good idea, as you said we have the option to buy a premade character, but that character also has a good will past that you have to live with.
It is also a way for a Vet to still partake in the came with out paying to play for some time after selling an alt. As each month goes by a Plex worth of isk is eaten up. Essentially this is a an isk sink. If you now have skill sets with Aurrum the isk value of Characters will drop and this isk sink will disappear. - Bah my spelling sucks
This will also shorten the life span of players playing the game. As it stands you focus on 1 ship learn all the stuff there is to learn about it, you get to know the is and out about it and admire what the next ship you will fly.
here we go again! |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
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Posted - 2011.06.28 05:01:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Jennifer Starling
You mean money spent on paying subscription? Why should I care?
I come from guildwars, you can have a max character in no time and even all classes and subclasses. What's important is your teamplay, tactics, knowledge of the game and personal player skills. Maximum versatility to learn things and try things out. Not crippled by silly artificial SP to do anything or silly gear stuff.
One of the best things I've seen thus far in a mmo. EVE is quite the opposite.
Being low in SP and slow to gain it is not necessarily a curse. It does indeed limit your versatility but it also forces you to be more creative with how you go about things in-game (PVP engagements in particular). One can team up with others to make up for their "lacking" skill points or find ways around it entirely.
Example 1: If your tanking skills are limited and you are facing off against someone with a fair bit of SP invested in dealing DPS, bypass the problem entirely by employing tracking disruptors and/or defender missiles.
Example 2: You have a fair bit of skills invested in frigate combat. You come into a situation where you are staring down an older player in a much larger ship. There is nothing that you can do by yourself but, if you have made friends in your travels, you can call them and request back-up.
True, you can technically "buy SP" right now in the character market... but the difference between that and a Microtransaction "SP package" is that the money you spend more or less "stays" in the EVE economy and recycles (which is the beauty of it). Allow me to follow you through it:
> you want more SP to do stuff > you search the Character Bazaar for a high SP toon > there is a toon in the bazaar that you want > you buy PLEX from CCP > you sell PLEX in-game > person who makes too much ISK in-game buys PLEX > you get ISK, buyer gets gametime you paid for > you pay ISK to the person who is selling his/her character > you get the character, seller gets ISK > seller buys stuff in-game (maybe even some PLEX him/herself?)
In a MT scheme things go much differently: > you want more SP to do stuff > you buy SP directly from CCP > no one else is involved _______________________
"Just because I seem like an idiot doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown |
MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.06.28 10:02:00 -
[86]
Edited by: MorliDots22 on 28/06/2011 10:07:49 "In a MT scheme things go much differently: > you want more SP to do stuff > you buy SP directly from CCP > no one else is involved" -> Butthurt detected ->
Good bye, Ebay-traders, ISK sellers and other scum. Donators prefer to buy directly from CCP and not from some unknown third persons anyway. If I pay for subscription why I cannot pay the same amount of money for the max amount of SP I can get in that time ? Whats better $70 for ****ty monocle or $110 for 24m SP (max year amount of SP) ?
Besides people who buy toons can also do it with bought "black" ISK -> Ebay profit CCP sells SP -> CCP profit
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Anton Gundarin
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Posted - 2011.08.10 16:55:00 -
[87]
This seems to be a fairly hot button topic and I see the validity of many points being made from both camps. I posted something in another thread and the more I mull it over the more it seems like a decent compromise for both sides of the issue and an additional revenue for CCP. Please do me a favor though and read this in its entirety with an open mind before rabidly jumping on it.
First I'd like to point out I'm a big fan of the current skill point system. My wife is expecting twins in the not too distant future and that will for a period of time leave three people in the household under the age of two. For those of you without children that doesn't seem like an issue, for those that do have young'uns you can commiserate with null game time for a good eight months or so. My characters in Fallen Earth with gather dust and will stay at their current level. My Eve character however will continue to grow as I'll be able to fins a few minutes here and there to keep up training. Yea for the skill point system.
Now for purchasing skill points...
I would very much support skill points for purchase on the Noble Exchange if; -They cost the same amount of Aurum a PLEX is worth, -They allow for an average month of skill points without any remap or augmentations (1.2 million, or whatever skill points you would learn in a months time) -They can only be purchased every 30 days once per account
Why would this be a good idea? -Players could get a boost to skill training for that month allowing newer players to experience more of the game more rapidly and older players to finish off a few badly wanted skills in a shorter amount of time. -It would remove the feeling some players may get that they could never "catch up" with players that have been here for a longer amount of time. Keep in mind that a player with a time advantage would still have it under a system like this. A new player that purchases a skill infusion once a month as allowed under the system could catch up to a five year vet that does not purchase any skill infusions, but continues to skill up as normal, but it would take that new player five years to reach the same amount of skill points that that vet has. -Those skill points could be used on alts that players have, but can not currently train if their main character is training skills. (Which would be similar to players having two accounts training -and would mean the same amount of money to CCP). Additionaly players who do not have two accounts might be willing to spend a few months on skill infusions to get an alt up to hauling, mining, or surveying par. (This would mean additional revenue for CCP). -Players would still be required to "learn" their roles- an extra month of skill points is not going to put any new player in a Titan. The basic tenant of Eve, "Don't fly anything you can't afford to lose", would still be in effect.
Why might this be a bad idea? -With the addition use for PLEX and something in the item store that players that don't care for dressing up may want the price of PLEX may go up in the Eve 'verse. -Veterens with years in the game may feel alienated by CCP who is giving player willing to spend additional money a leg up. This is understandable and to be honest appears to be the single biggest argument against selling skill points in the Noble Exchange regardless as how it is dressed up. (Counterpoint -again younger players will not be able to catch up instantly. It will take years of continuous skill infussions to even come close to the calliber a vet with even a year over someone would have) -The ability of skill point infusions even on a monthly basis will allow players to create alts to do jobs that a lot of eve players currently enjoy doing, like hauling, or mining, etc. Of the cons that I've thought of this one seems the most valid argument. -Continued in next post*
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Kara Turin
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Posted - 2011.08.10 17:01:00 -
[88]
Edited by: Kara Turin on 10/08/2011 17:01:23 Continued from previous post
I see the alt argument as the most valid, but would also like to point out that it also would allow players to use their alts in ways they might not want to use their main characters, like piracy or militia warfare -which means more PvP.
In conclusion. Just to hit a few key points of this again and reiterate. Players could only purchase a months worth of "skill infusion" every 30 days, the timer activates 30 days into an account -so no massive skill update until they have explored the game for a full 30 days. The timer than counts from the last purchase of skill points. So if you purchase a months infusion then wait 60 days before you purchase another you can only get one months worth of skill points at which time the timer resets and you have to wait another 30 days to purchase skill points again.
I'm interested in your responses (and those of CCP), but would like to point out that I'm approaching this from a relatively objective and respectful point of view.
If your response is "Noob you stink" I ask you simply move along.
-Cheers
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Joe Risalo
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Posted - 2011.08.10 17:03:00 -
[89]
We can buy characters already which for this game and many others used to be illegal.
You can buy in game currency by purchasing a plex, which again is something that used to be illegal.
Why not let people purchase skill points.
But before we let people purchase skill points, let me buy a pithum a-type medium shield booster for real cash... That's about the only thing I'd pay extra for.
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Newt Rondanse
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Posted - 2011.08.10 17:13:00 -
[90]
Better still, just let players buy skill points in certificate packages.
Price them according to how many skill points are in the package.
Start new characters off with an appropriate choice out of the [Racial] [Profession] Basic certificates.
No insta-titan pilots. No characters wasting SP on random useless stuff that doesn't do what they think it does.
Less complexity => More win.
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