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Requesting Feedback on a Potential Business Venture

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Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.01 23:15:00 - [1] Greetings! The goal of this post and hopefully of this thread is for me to briefly outline a business model that has occurred to me, and to solicit the feedback of the community on the feasibility and profitability of the venture. I am not asking for public funds. I would like to draw on the experience of market and industry types who are very familiar with the unique logistics of running a business in this game. I thank you in advance for reading this post and for any constructive feedback you leave me! The Idea: I wish to consider the potential feasibility and profitability of outsourcing Planetary Interaction to other persons. By other persons I do not mean other characters that one controls; indeed, my interest lies in a model where the investing party has a hands-off relationship with the process and merely collects dividends. This obviously is a model that requires a great deal of trust, and the opportunity abounds for the investor to lose his entire principal. I have considered this, and for the sake of this proposal and the discussion of it let us assume that the point is moot by virtue of whatever rationalization you preferùlet us assume that the persons conducting the actual work will never misappropriate or steal the investor's funds or items. The goal for this discussion, then, is to identify several things of which the following are known unknowns: The type of person who would willingly enter into such an arrangement; specifically, at what ages or levels of wealth would a player find the situation advantageous for him. The total resources in terms of in-game ships, skills, time investment and so on that would be required to enact the work. The threshold where entry barriers to the production scheme are copacetic to the degree of profitability. To elaborate a bit further, the intention of the potential investor is to throw a large chunk of moneyùbeyond the amount easily or readily available to the worker on his ownùat a Planetary Interaction production chain which has too great an entry barrier in terms of start-up capital for the worker to afford on his own. This will allow the worker to conduct efficient production of specific items which have a higher resale margin than those available to him at his lower level of capital. In return for this investment in the Planetary Interaction chain, the investor would be repaid the principal and some percentage of the profits at every cycle; eventually, the worker will make enough money from the profit to finance himself, and the investor no longer becomes necessary. I am not a professional writer and do not have extensive knowledge of accounting or business language, so if my description of the business idea is in any way confusingùor if there are specific concerns that I did not think to addressùplease feel free to ask me questions.
Abdiel Kavash Caldari Paladin Order Fidelas Constans	Posted - 2011.08.02 00:03:00 - [2] tl;dr: OP wants an uncollateralized loan of unspecified size to do some PI. Uh, or he wants to loan some money to someone doing PI. I'm not sure. ---
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 00:18:00 - [3] Perhaps you missed the second sentence in my post: "I am not asking for public funds."
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.08.02 03:20:00 - [4] Originally by: Topless Trader Perhaps you missed the second sentence in my post: "I am not asking for public funds." we didn't but these threads are usually a prelude to a failed IPO/bond. Its TL:DR, doubt anyone will read it. Try more point form, less wall of text. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone.
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 03:23:00 - [5] Edited by: Topless Trader on 02/08/2011 03:24:19 I have no intention of or interest in asking for public funds. I am not space poor. My only interest to do with MD is to consult people who have run or participated in businesses involving other people.
KaarBaak Minmatar No Option Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.08.02 03:25:00 - [6] I don't think there is a huge isk-barrier to entry in PI. I don't see who you would get to be your PI worker bees? If they've played enough to get PI skills to profitable level, then they likely have the minimal isk necessary to do it themselves. Circumstances rule men; men do not rule circumstances. --Herodotus, Histories
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 03:27:00 - [7] Originally by: KaarBaak I don't think there is a huge isk-barrier to entry in PI. I don't see who you would get to be your PI worker bees? If they've played enough to get PI skills to profitable level, then they likely have the minimal isk necessary to do it themselves. There is very little ISK barrier to extraction, but it is not usual for a player of the minimum age to have some PI skills to have enough ISK to roll straight into factory-only production in Empire because you can reasonably expect to dump a billion or so per cycle per character.
Nimrod Nemesis Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2011.08.02 04:37:00 - [8] Originally by: Topless Trader Originally by: KaarBaak I don't think there is a huge isk-barrier to entry in PI. I don't see who you would get to be your PI worker bees? If they've played enough to get PI skills to profitable level, then they likely have the minimal isk necessary to do it themselves. There is very little ISK barrier to extraction, but it is not usual for a player of the minimum age to have some PI skills to have enough ISK to roll straight into factory-only production in Empire because you can reasonably expect to dump a billion or so per cycle per character. You would trust an empire newb who has a couple ranks of PI skills with a billion isk in anything?
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 05:26:00 - [9] Originally by: Topless Trader Originally by: KaarBaak I don't think there is a huge isk-barrier to entry in PI. I don't see who you would get to be your PI worker bees? If they've played enough to get PI skills to profitable level, then they likely have the minimal isk necessary to do it themselves. There is very little ISK barrier to extraction, but it is not usual for a player of the minimum age to have some PI skills to have enough ISK to roll straight into factory-only production in Empire because you can reasonably expect to dump a billion or so per cycle per character. How much I trust the individual and what their affiliations are do not have anything to do with the topic at hand.
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.08.02 05:27:00 - [10] Originally by: Topless Trader How much I trust the individual and what their affiliations are do not have anything to do with the topic at hand. Can you hurry & get to the topic at hand, a nice tl:dr version would be good. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone.
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 05:36:00 - [11] Literally the first sentence of "The Idea" is: I wish to discuss the potential feasibility and profitability of outsourcing Planetary Interaction to other persons.
Nimrod Nemesis Amarr Royal Amarr Institute	Posted - 2011.08.02 05:52:00 - [12] Originally by: Topless Trader To elaborate a bit further, the intention of the potential investor is to throw a large chunk of moneyùbeyond the amount easily or readily available to the worker on his ownù Originally by: Topless Trader There is very little ISK barrier to extraction, but it is not usual for a player of the minimum age to have some PI skills to have enough ISK to roll straight into factory-only production in Empire because you can reasonably expect to dump a billion or so per cycle per character. Originally by: Topless Trader How much I trust the individual and what their affiliations are do not have anything to do with the topic at hand. Which leads me back to: Originally by: Nimrod Nemesis You would trust an empire newb who has a couple ranks of PI skills with a billion isk in anything? Lemme see if I can tl;dr this: You want to dump a billion in say p1 on some newb and have him deliver to you a bunch of p2 for you to sell and then kick him a share of the profit? a) Contract it to him for the market value. Problem: He can't afford that. b) Contract it to him for a discount price. Problem: If he isn't stupid, he'll sell it himself and start into business on his own. c) Bring newbs into the corp, have them produce p1 and figure out how to get it to other newbs to make p2 which you sell. Problem: **** output. Basically, you have to find a truly unique snowflake. One who's dedicated enough to have figured out PI and can do the work. One who's poor enough to think this is a good opportunity. One who's rich enough to accept market-value contracts. One who's gullable enough to continue to allow you to use him as passive income. And one who's not smart enough to piece all this together.
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.08.02 06:01:00 - [13] see was that hard? thanks nimrod. @OP In short: your idea is not feasible. PI is full of the i mined it myself its free crowd, like breakdance77 always spouts on about. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone.
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 06:02:00 - [14] Originally by: Nimrod Nemesis Basically, you have to find a truly unique snowflake. One who's dedicated enough to have figured out PI and can do the work. One who's poor enough to think this is a good opportunity. One who's rich enough to accept market-value contracts. One who's gullable enough to continue to allow you to use him as passive income. And one who's not smart enough to piece all this together. Well then, I ought to have an easy time of it. This accurately describes a lot of people.
Speccer Caldari Trigger works	Posted - 2011.08.02 06:31:00 - [15] Well then, I ought to have an easy time of it. This accurately describes a lot of people. But....it doesn't? I'm no Market Discussion guru but coming and asking for the advice of aforementioned gurus and then rejecting what they have to say, just seems arrogant for lack of a better word.
Topless Trader Gallente Hashimoto Corporation	Posted - 2011.08.02 07:25:00 - [16] Originally by: Speccer Well then, I ought to have an easy time of it. This accurately describes a lot of people. But....it doesn't? I'm no Market Discussion guru but coming and asking for the advice of aforementioned gurus and then rejecting what they have to say, just seems arrogant for lack of a better word. I should rephrase that: this accurately describes a lot of people to which I have access that the majority of EVE players do not. We're a community outside of this video game and we have presences in other video games, so getting newbies swiftly up to speed and helping them along the way is one of the perks. I can be fairly sure that most newbies who pick up the game to play with people they already know from outside the game are not going to be chomping at the bit to steal space money; at least, they haven't been for so long as I've been playing this and other games among the same community. You are definitely right that I wouldn't trust some random EVE player who has no idea how things work with money, because scruples aside he'd probably lose it at the first opportunity; but, I feel fairly confident that intelligent adults with access to out-of-game resources and an established community will be able to chug along just fine. Perhaps I should just seek out individual market gurus and solicit a private consultation.
Florestan Bronstein 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2011.08.02 07:56:00 - [17] (1) give PI classes (2) set up cheap buy orders (3) profit ask goons the core value you can provide is to tell people what to produce and how to produce it optimally. A 10m ISK loan to some newbie to get his command centers is useless - he'll get more than that just by doing the tutorial missions.

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