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Bids vs. Buyouts

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Moozh Vozmozhno	Posted - 2011.08.15 18:44:00 - [1] Edited by: Moozh Vozmozhno on 15/08/2011 18:46:46 Every time I read threads on the character bazaar I am annoyed by the constant misuse/misunderstanding of the word buyout. Buyout is like the "Buy it Now" button on ebay. It means an instant and guaranteed sale (provided the funds are provided in a timely manner). If someone posts a sale with: Starting bid: 5bil Increments: 100mil Buyout: 8bil ...you do not say "I OFFER 6B BUYOUT!!1" Regardless of your reasons for adding the word "buyout", what you are offering is in fact a BID since it is up to the seller to appraise and accept the offer. The seller determines if and when to accept the bid. The point of the buyout is that it's a guaranteed sale. If you want a character, yes you might be able to bid and get it for cheaper, but if someone else buys it out while you're busy bidding and lowballing, you miss the opportunity. So if you are seeking instant gratification, or just really like the character's name/SP allocation and want to secure the deal, you pay a little more for that security with the buyout. It's fine to say "I bid X amount of ISK if it can be delivery by Y time" but that is still a bid. Only the seller can set the terms of the buyout.
Kraven Stark Caldari Atavism Industries	Posted - 2011.08.15 18:48:00 - [2] It really depends on what the person saying it means. When the seller gives up a buyout amount, it's the magic number to get past a bidding situation. If a buyer comes in and says they will buy it out for an amount, they are negotiating that buyout price. It is perfectly conceivable that a buyer could come in and offer an alternate buyout price that the seller could agree to.
Magnus Veyr	Posted - 2011.08.15 18:50:00 - [3] There's idiots who yell "BUY OUT!" every two seconds and there's idiots agreeing to them. Don't try to use reason when it comes to human behaviour, it won't work and will drive you crazy.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.08.15 18:53:00 - [4] Originally by: Moozh Vozmozhno Edited by: Moozh Vozmozhno on 15/08/2011 18:46:46 Every time I read threads on the character bazaar I am annoyed by the constant misuse/misunderstanding of the word buyout. Buyout is like the "Buy it Now" button on ebay. It means an instant and guaranteed sale (provided the funds are provided in a timely manner). If someone posts a sale with: Starting bid: 5bil Increments: 100mil Buyout: 8bil ...you do not say "I OFFER 6B BUYOUT!!1" Regardless of your reasons for adding the word "buyout", what you are offering is in fact a BID since it is up to the seller to appraise and accept the offer. The seller determines if and when to accept the bid. The point of the buyout is that it's a guaranteed sale. If you want a character, yes you might be able to bid and get it for cheaper, but if someone else buys it out while you're busy bidding and lowballing, you miss the opportunity. So if you are seeking instant gratification, or just really like the character's name/SP allocation and want to secure the deal, you pay a little more for that security with the buyout. It's fine to say "I bid X amount of ISK if it can be delivery by Y time" but that is still a bid. Only the seller can set the terms of the buyout. The word was invented in 1971 and refers to when a company buys enough shares of another company to effectively control it. All other meanings are bastardizations created over time and are all "incorrect". Also, bastardizations is apparently a legit word. They say you learn something new everyday. Just by coming to the Eve forums I learned 2. And they say our community is grizzled. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
andeira	Posted - 2011.08.15 18:54:00 - [5] blabla I think I know how it works and that I'm important and need to tell everyone. But to be honest Nobody cares Have a nice day ------------- Originally by: Stitcher For frak's sake, it took millions of years of evolution for that brain to get inside your skull, would it kill you to actually USE the damned thing?
Sum Ting Wung	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:04:00 - [6] I will give you 6 Bil RIGHT NOW. You get ISK FAST. You dont have to wait a week and watch the forums as the price goes up a few mil each day. Do you accept a slightly lower buyout price in exchange for your free time? You get more time to do other things, I get a good deal. WIN/WIN. How is this not understandable? I mean damn, its only a 2 Bil ISK difference.
Maken Cheese	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:09:00 - [7] Originally by: Sum Ting Wung I will give you 6 Bil RIGHT NOW. You get ISK FAST. You dont have to wait a week and watch the forums as the price goes up a few mil each day. Do you accept a slightly lower buyout price in exchange for your free time? You get more time to do other things, I get a good deal. WIN/WIN. How is this not understandable? I mean damn, its only a 2 Bil ISK difference. This is not a buyout, it's a bid. The buyer cannot change a buyout nor can he/she negotiate a new amount for a buyout. Anything lower than the seller's listed buyout price is a bid, it doesn't matter if the buyer wants a fast sale or not. It's still a bid. The seller can raise or lower the buyout, but it has nothing to do with the buyer. Any price lower than the seller's max is a bid.
Nadia Celeste	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:18:00 - [8] ^ I think that's the point A bid is a bid is a bid even if you call it a buyout there'd be no difference between writing '6b' and '6b buyout' in a post when the buyout is listed at higher... both mean the same thing so it's redundant. the seller can choose to take the bid immediately and get instant ISK, it doesn't need to be accompanied by the word 'buyout'
Cambarus The Baros Syndicate	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:31:00 - [9] Originally by: Nadia Celeste ^ I think that's the point A bid is a bid is a bid even if you call it a buyout there'd be no difference between writing '6b' and '6b buyout' in a post when the buyout is listed at higher... both mean the same thing so it's redundant. the seller can choose to take the bid immediately and get instant ISK, it doesn't need to be accompanied by the word 'buyout' This is 100% false. Adding the word buyout, at least on these forums, is basically just shorthand for "I have the isk now, if you accept my offer within the next x minutes/hours I will buy your Y, if not, I will withdraw my offer." And as someone already pointed out, you're arguing the proper use of a word, when its real definition is something completely different from what you're insisting it is. If you're going to be anal about grammar, spelling, or semantics, you should at least check in advance to make sure that your point of view is the one that is technically correct.
Sum Ting Wung	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:38:00 - [10] Originally by: Maken Cheese This is not a buyout, it's a bid. Its not a bid. Its an offer. An offer for you to change your buyout price in exchange for fast cash. If you decline my offer, I am no longer obligated to pay 6 bil. If you accept my offer, I am obligated to pay you 6 Bil isk in exchange for the character. Since the RL is different from a game mechanic, buyout prices are always negotiable, unless declared by law.

Neurotica	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:41:00 - [11] always someone wanting something for nothing and someone selling something for too much.
Diomedes Calypso Aetolian Armada	Posted - 2011.08.15 19:44:00 - [12] Originally by: Cambarus Originally by: Nadia Celeste ^ I think that's the point A bid is a bid is a bid even if you call it a buyout there'd be no difference between writing '6b' and '6b buyout' in a post when the buyout is listed at higher... both mean the same thing so it's redundant. the seller can choose to take the bid immediately and get instant ISK, it doesn't need to be accompanied by the word 'buyout' This is 100% false. Adding the word buyout, at least on these forums, is basically just shorthand for "I have the isk now, if you accept my offer within the next x minutes/hours I will buy your Y, if not, I will withdraw my offer." And as someone already pointed out, you're arguing the proper use of a word, when its real definition is something completely different from what you're insisting it is. If you're going to be anal about grammar, spelling, or semantics, you should at least check in advance to make sure that your point of view is the one that is technically correct. QFT you can definitely argue semantics (word meaning) but the accepted meaning of the term on that particular forum (and terms in the real world routinely mean different things in different area of science, economics etc). what b/o means is a limmited time take it or leave it offer, sometimes by a buyer considering other characters simaltaneously and motivated to get it done with, and sometimes by people bluffing to look like they might lose interest unless answered quickly. The seller set's his terms for the legnth of the auction, but almost always retains and by tradition there, retains the right to cancel or chose not to sell...so maybe you'd even take issue with the word "auction" too ?. (its really more of a request for offers than a auction)
Mupdadoodidda Bix Nood	Posted - 2011.08.16 00:37:00 - [13] "Buyout" = Trader = Never sell to or buy from, EVER.
Justin Cash	Posted - 2011.08.16 01:14:00 - [14] Edited by: Justin Cash on 16/08/2011 01:16:42 and on the same token, others fail to realize when they put a BUYOUT say... 4.3b and a person comes along and meets that B/O the person posting the B/O should honor it!!! Prime example: LINKY Above is an example where I offered a B/O that seller posted 4.3b. I met that B/O only to be told she/he wanted to wait for others to chime in. She/he later sent me an email stating that they only wanted to wait and see if someone offered a substantial amount more than the first B/O offer I made. Meh... guess it's a pet peeve of mine but blocked it and would never knowingly do business with a person with business ethics of a badger. If you're going to post a B/O figure then you honor it! PERIOD!! But that's just me I guess. EDIT -> BTW - She/he edited post after I made a comment I had met her initial B/O sell order.
Sum Ting Wung	Posted - 2011.08.16 08:55:00 - [15] Originally by: Justin Cash Edited by: Justin Cash on 16/08/2011 01:16:42 and on the same token, others fail to realize when they put a BUYOUT say... 4.3b and a person comes along and meets that B/O the person posting the B/O should honor it!!! Prime example: LINKY Above is an example where I offered a B/O that seller posted 4.3b. I met that B/O only to be told she/he wanted to wait for others to chime in. She/he later sent me an email stating that they only wanted to wait and see if someone offered a substantial amount more than the first B/O offer I made. Meh... guess it's a pet peeve of mine but blocked it and would never knowingly do business with a person with business ethics of a badger. If you're going to post a B/O figure then you honor it! PERIOD!! But that's just me I guess. EDIT -> BTW - She/he edited post after I made a comment I had met her initial B/O sell order. That's why you quote the woman (as I did above). And yes I say woman, because only a woman would be so devious.
Velicitia Gallente Open Designs	Posted - 2011.08.16 10:01:00 - [16] Edited by: Velicitia on 16/08/2011 10:02:11 in eve -- there is no difference to me between a "6b" bid and a "6b buyout" bid ... for the most part, as a seller I'd assume the buyer has the ISK in hand. RL is different: You can set a price of 20k for a new car. I can walk up and say "17k, cash" as a counter-offer ... yeah, you'll probably say no... but we can then bargain -- I want the car, you want the cash; neither of us want to deal with financing... edit -- spelling. ========================= Originally by: CCP Games, 2010 Creation is so precious; and greed, so destructive. Your choices can make a diference
Telvani Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber	Posted - 2011.08.16 11:09:00 - [17] Originally by: Mupdadoodidda Bix Nood "Buyout" = Trader = Never sell to or buy from, EVER. Oh yes I hate the convenience of being able to buy and sell goods instantly instead of having to wait to get a few % more


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