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Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 00:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
I need some tips. I don't quite understand how I lost this fight. Seems like I could barely hit him the whole time even with my web on him and eventually I just ran out of cap. He had a small nos on me and I had tried neuting him with a small neut but I think it hurt me more than him.
Eventually I stopped firing my guns and tried to let my cap build a little so I could run the web and my guns at the same time for maximum effect but still I just barely scratched him. I kept approaching and then keeping at distance to minimize angular velocity but still no dice.
From looking at one of his recent losses it appears he runs an ancillary shield booster which would make sense from what I saw during the fight but I really don't think that was the main problem. Should I try tracking rigs? Was that just a fight I shouldn't have taken? |
Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 01:16:00 -
[2] - Quote
Was just looking over my fit. Apparently I had a med neut equipped and not a small. Was thinking I was flying another fit I had worked up. So I guess I neuted myself out trying in vain to drain his cap. But if your opponent has a nos should you not run the neut? Maybe I should equip ecm drones? |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
798
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Posted - 2012.10.06 01:31:00 -
[3] - Quote
The problem was you were flying an omen. One of the least effective cruisers in the game. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
81
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Posted - 2012.10.06 01:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
You capped out in an amarr ship? this is completely unbelievable and you should feel bad for the troll. |
Sheynan
Lighting the blight
71
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Posted - 2012.10.06 01:47:00 -
[5] - Quote
Omen: http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14799730
(similar) Harpy: http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14789869 |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
182
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Posted - 2012.10.06 02:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
It is possible he had a tracking disrupter on. But I imagine he had duel ASB, prop mod, tackle. Whatever it was.. it worked. Props to him.
Your fit could be improved. 1 tracking enhancer Repper or plate, but not both. If you can't fit a repper that out-reps frigate DPS, then don't fit one at all.
I love ecm drones, but I would think Hobs on a frigate would be a better choice.
I dunno dude. I think you just lost to a good pilot.
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Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 02:26:00 -
[7] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:It is possible he had a tracking disrupter on. But I imagine he had duel ASB, prop mod, tackle. Whatever it was.. it worked. Props to him. No TD. I was watching for that.
RavenPaine wrote:Your fit could be improved. 1 tracking enhancer Repper or plate, but not both. If you can't fit a repper that out-reps frigate DPS, then don't fit one at all.
I love ecm drones, but I would think Hobs on a frigate would be a better choice.
I dunno dude. I think you just lost to a good pilot.
The reason for the small repper is to patch up scratches between plexes. I got the idea from Prometheus as shown in his fit here. [Omen Navy Issue, Standard] Damage Control II Small Armor Repairer II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Medium Diminishing Power System Drain I
Medium Energy Metastasis Adjuster II Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Hobgoblin II x5
Replacing it with another resistance plate wouldn't have helped in that fight. It wasn't a case of not having enough HP. It was a very long fight and I basically died the death of a thousand cuts.
I think part of the problem is I only have Amarr Cruiser 4 and until I raise that to 5 along with a couple of other skills I cannot get cap stable even with just my guns on. I can fix that problem but my inability to track him is what ultimately killed me and what I don't know how to fix. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
962
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Posted - 2012.10.06 03:30:00 -
[8] - Quote
as soon he is in his close orbit you have lost. A slasher can easily kill coercer and this ship has far better tracking. Omen just takes a bit longer. Dont let them come that close a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 03:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
Bienator II wrote:as soon he is in his close orbit you have lost. A slasher can easily kill coercer and this ship has far better tracking. Omen just takes a bit longer. Dont let them come that close
Yeah I thought about that. He was most likely dual prop fit too. I figured I needed to brawl because I have a scram fitted. Maybe I should have risked letting him get away. What about an AB fit for plex brawling like I'm doing? Omens just seem so vulnerable if they can't dictate range. |
Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
610
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Posted - 2012.10.06 06:20:00 -
[10] - Quote
med lasers are a very bad choice for shooting at frigs, their tracking blows. i am not surprised at all by the results of your fight, as soon as the harpy gained a close orbit you were done. |
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Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
310
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Posted - 2012.10.06 10:13:00 -
[11] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:med lasers are a very bad choice for shooting at frigs, their tracking blows..... 'Nuff said.
Only exception is the DLP Coercer, but then the destroyers have that godly tracking bonus. In general, laser boats are best used in tandem (read: gangs/fleets).
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Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
540
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Posted - 2012.10.06 11:43:00 -
[12] - Quote
AB sig tank most likely, cap him out and align some where, once either his prop or his scram is lost you can burn out and blap him thanks to the reduced transversal by range and him following (hes very likely to orbiting at 500 meters) http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 13:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Muad 'dib wrote:AB sig tank most likely, cap him out and align some where, once either his prop or his scram is lost you can burn out and blap him thanks to the reduced transversal by range and him following (hes very likely to orbiting at 500 meters)
So instead of manually piloting away and toward him I should just align to something, apply my neut and wait until his cap gives out and gives me a chance to pulse the MWD and blast him? I'm still tempted to give the AB fit a chance seeing how 99% of my fights are consensual and the omen is still slower than just about everything even with a MWD.
I have decided not to try to solo in this ship until I have Amarr Cruiser V, Propulsion Jamming V, and Fuel Conservation / Afterburner V if I go with an AB fit. Almost 13 mil SP and still in a frigate :( |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
963
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 14:15:00 -
[14] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote: I have decided not to try to solo in this ship until I have Amarr Cruiser V, Propulsion Jamming V, and Fuel Conservation / Afterburner V if I go with an AB fit. Almost 13 mil SP and still in a frigate :(
i have 37 and still in a frig :) a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
Tamiya Sarossa
Resistance is Character Forming
210
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Posted - 2012.10.06 18:58:00 -
[15] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote: So instead of manually piloting away and toward him I should just align to something, apply my neut and wait until his cap gives out and gives me a chance to pulse the MWD and blast him? I'm still tempted to give the AB fit a chance seeing how 99% of my fights are consensual and the omen is still slower than just about everything even with a MWD.
Yes, this is what you should do. As soon as it becomes clear that you can't hurt a ship orbiting you up close you need to immediately take steps to break away from him - worst case you'll have to wait for a lucky neut cycle and warp as soon as his point drops, but at least you won't lose the ship. No one has ever died from attempting to GTFO too soon.
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Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
543
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Posted - 2012.10.06 19:04:00 -
[16] - Quote
also worth a mention (tho i dont like to ecm at all)
Navy omen has 5 light ecm drones, while they can be killed fast by a frig, one jam and you are able to get some range. Now depending on what the frig is thats on you, dps drones might be better, but at the very least its gunna by time and divert attention. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
Koujjo Dian
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
18
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Posted - 2012.10.06 20:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Muad 'dib wrote:also worth a mention (tho i dont like to ecm at all)
Navy omen has 5 light ecm drones, while they can be killed fast by a frig, one jam and you are able to get some range. Now depending on what the frig is thats on you, dps drones might be better, but at the very least its gunna by time and divert attention.
Yes, I was already considering ECM drones. Thanks for all the advice. |
Piugattuk
CLOROFLORFILAPLANKTONPLATES
70
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Posted - 2012.10.07 08:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
you can fit medium II's on a navy slicer???? wow the next time im not pvpeeing I must note that. |
Cyrek Ohaya
Perkone Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.10.07 20:19:00 -
[19] - Quote
Tracking issues vs. frigates thats a deep weakness, you could have that covered with a prop jamming fleetmate. Not saying the omen is a terrible ship, its a nice fitted omen, get someone to cover up that niche weak spot. |
Meditril
T.R.I.A.D Ushra'Khan
131
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Posted - 2012.10.08 12:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
Medium neutralizer has the problem that it is neutralizing only every 12 seconds. If he has a small nos installed then he gains cap every 3 seconds from you. This is usually enough to run AB + Scram. So a small neutralizer would have helped you probably. You just need to align at something and wait until he caps out and drops one or two AB cycles. Then you will gain some range which then would allow your guns to hit him a few times... but there is a lot of dicing in this.
However, for most crusiers it will get very hard if a ship comes that close. Even a Stabber Fleet Issue (which has a great tracking with medium AC) has problems killing a frigate in very close orbit. You should not let frigates that close to you. |
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Gibbo3771
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
241
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Posted - 2012.10.08 13:36:00 -
[21] - Quote
The problem persisted as soon as you let an afterburning 400dps AF get under your guns.
Also I have 75mil sp and still fly frigs, they are awesome. Everytime you dont like my comments/posts the terrorists win and your a disgrace to your country. |
Idris Helion
University of Caille Gallente Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 15:05:00 -
[22] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:The problem was you were flying an omen. One of the least effective cruisers in the game.
Bah, heresy. Navy Omen is one of the best cruisers out there. The base Omen is indeed a problematic boat -- too hard to fit well, especially if you have low to middling skills. But Navy Omen? Awesome-sauce.
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Idris Helion
University of Caille Gallente Federation
153
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Posted - 2012.10.08 15:15:00 -
[23] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:med lasers are a very bad choice for shooting at frigs, their tracking blows. i am not surprised at all by the results of your fight, as soon as the harpy gained a close orbit you were done.
That's why I prefer long-range beams to short-range pulses on my Navy Omen. T2 beams and Aurora crystals put most frigs in the graveyard long before they can get in close. Drones take care of those fast or lucky enough to get in under my guns. If a frigate pilot gets under your guns and kills your drones, you're done: every good PVP pilot knows to use cap-warfare on Amarr ships. Neut them out, then kill them. I think that's why Amarr ships tend to be more popular in fleets than as solo ships -- in fleets you have logi support. (Though a lot of solo pilots like the Arbitrator, because as a drone-boat it doesn't suffer as much from cap warfare as other Amarr ships.)
The Maller might be a more effective brawler once the cruiser rebalancing goes into effect. The Omen is really better suited to ranged attacks and kiting.
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Doddy
Excidium. Executive Outcomes
252
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Posted - 2012.10.08 16:26:00 -
[24] - Quote
Its simple really, your buffer fit didn't out last his active fit. It is the inherent weakness of buffer fits, you are always at risk of being slowly diced by either an active tank ship or a kite. In this case your poor tracking meant the harpy was both. If you had been in a proper active tanked nomen he probably wouldn't have been able to kill you either and it would have been a cap booster run off. The anc booster has really shown up this weakness in fotm buffer fits, but it existed before hand.
125 mil sp btw and incursus is my favourite ship. |
Doddy
Excidium. Executive Outcomes
252
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Posted - 2012.10.08 16:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:Muad 'dib wrote:AB sig tank most likely, cap him out and align some where, once either his prop or his scram is lost you can burn out and blap him thanks to the reduced transversal by range and him following (hes very likely to orbiting at 500 meters) So instead of manually piloting away and toward him I should just align to something, apply my neut and wait until his cap gives out and gives me a chance to pulse the MWD and blast him? I'm still tempted to give the AB fit a chance seeing how 99% of my fights are consensual and the omen is still slower than just about everything even with a MWD. I have decided not to try to solo in this ship until I have Amarr Cruiser V, Propulsion Jamming V, and Fuel Conservation / Afterburner V if I go with an AB fit. Almost 13 mil SP and still in a frigate :(
While the above is generally correct, his small nos is probably enough to keep his scram/web on.
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Tortise Winkle VonDudenberg
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2012.10.09 12:36:00 -
[26] - Quote
Doddy wrote: 125 mil sp btw and incursus is my favourite ship.
Das a lot of SP |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
37
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Posted - 2012.10.09 17:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
Agree with most previous comments;
1) Primarily, try to blap him on approach > use scorch crystals, make him chase you directly, manually pilot away from him o/heating your MWD and all tackle to maximise the time he spends suffering in your killing zone.
2) If he does get close and hes running blasters, tackle and AB off one single small nos then you should (tm) get lucky eventually. O/heat neut, switch to imperial navy multifreq crystals (instant ammo switch for lazors), align to anything, take the heat off your own tackle, then try and pulse your o/heated MWD to gain distance and revert to 1.
Failing that, scream in comm's like a girl for assistance from your homeys like this > ''EEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeEEEEEEEEEEEEEEk!!! HAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaAAAllllppp meeeeeeEEeee!!!!!!''
Side note > Love that your ship went from ONI, to Omen, to slicer and then back to ONI during this thread. Omni ship for the win/lose.
o/
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Cerlin
Serious Internet Spaceship Holding Company IMPERIAL LEGI0N
6
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Posted - 2012.10.09 20:05:00 -
[28] - Quote
Assault frigs are amazing ships, especially the blaster ones. I am an Enyo/Ishkur pilot myself but whenever you kill a cruiser it is an amazing feeling. I can fly a wide variety of cruisers but I still often go back to frigs, they are by far the most fun ships in eve for me.
So yeah, dont get tackled by an assault frig.... The best way to avoid dying. |
Beat General
Painkiller.
58
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Posted - 2012.10.09 21:04:00 -
[29] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:Bienator II wrote:as soon he is in his close orbit you have lost. A slasher can easily kill coercer and this ship has far better tracking. Omen just takes a bit longer. Dont let them come that close Yeah I thought about that. He was most likely dual prop fit too. I figured I needed to brawl because I have a scram fitted. Maybe I should have risked letting him get away. What about an AB fit for plex brawling like I'm doing? Omens just seem so vulnerable if they can't dictate range.
If you are in a pickle that medium neut probably could of been used to cap him out for a second so you can warp off.
Next time, try to align to something... Overload the neut and watch carefully. The second his warp scrambler drops warp off.
If he has a nos it might be a problem. Thats what ECM drones are for |
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