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Plastic Head
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Posted - 2005.04.01 23:16:00 -
[1]
What is this module used for? What is its pro's and con's?
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Kaeten
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Posted - 2005.04.02 00:00:00 -
[2]
since ccp really made them crap on the test server theres no point in getting nito them. 5km range with a ridiculios 200cap usage or something plus that they do like 1 extra jamming strength than a multispectral. Anyway I hope they fix it 
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Gallante Gallante Gallante Gallante
Gallante Gallante Gallante Gallante
Gallante Gallante Gallante Gallante |
CCP Hammer
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Posted - 2005.04.02 00:01:00 -
[3]
It breaks locks in a point blank area of effect much the way a smartbomb deals point blank area of effect damage. With the incoming EW changes they now have a chance to break locks of much bigger ships than they used too (some say they are worthless as they are on TQ now) but the module now uses more cap so people aren't spamming them. There are talks about introducing larger versions but I need to speak with the research agents more to see if we can come up with a patent.
The pros are the possibility to break all locks within range without needing a lock yourself.
The cons are the high cap use and the fact they will break friendly locks as well. Also they have much shorter range than the targetted sytle EW.
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Plastic Head
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Posted - 2005.04.02 00:37:00 -
[4]
Ok, so frig pilots use them? Like interceptors? To break lock on tq atm..
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Face Lifter
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Posted - 2005.04.02 01:03:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: CCP Hammer
It breaks locks in a point blank area of effect much the way a smartbomb deals point blank area of effect damage. With the incoming EW changes they now have a chance to break locks of much bigger ships than they used too (some say they are worthless as they are on TQ now) but the module now uses more cap so people aren't spamming them. There are talks about introducing larger versions but I need to speak with the research agents more to see if we can come up with a patent.
The pros are the possibility to break all locks within range without needing a lock yourself.
The cons are the high cap use and the fact they will break friendly locks as well. Also they have much shorter range than the targetted sytle EW.
Do you realize that such a module would be primarily used by battleships against frigs in tight orbits?
How long does it take for a frig to re-target a battleships? 2 seconds?
How long does battleship have to wait before the module can repeat? 1 minute?
is it just me or does this sound horribly impractical? Honestly, using 1 multispec instead would be much better idea
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Grut
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Posted - 2005.04.02 01:09:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Plastic Head
Ok, so frig pilots use them? Like interceptors? To break lock on tq atm..
their not very widely used as their useless vs anything bigger then a frig, you'll find them being used on close frigs as something usual people wont expect a burst will stop a friggie shooting at you for 3 seconds + if your in a close range high damage setup like a blaster taranis fighting similar that time means you win
Mostly harmless |
Grut
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Posted - 2005.04.02 01:12:00 -
[7]
Originally by: CCP Hammer
It breaks locks in a point blank area of effect much the way a smartbomb deals point blank area of effect damage. With the incoming EW changes they now have a chance to break locks of much bigger ships than they used too (some say they are worthless as they are on TQ now) but the module now uses more cap so people aren't spamming them. There are talks about introducing larger versions but I need to speak with the research agents more to see if we can come up with a patent.
The pros are the possibility to break all locks within range without needing a lock yourself.
The cons are the high cap use and the fact they will break friendly locks as well. Also they have much shorter range than the targetted sytle EW.
soooooo the cap use means its useless on friggies, and pretty heavy on cruisers leaving you with bs who would have to go short range to use it and lose a mid...... 
Mostly harmless |
Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 04:13:00 -
[8]
Hammer... seriously... who do you think will use that module ?
A BS against a close orbiting frigate ?
No.
The BS will fit a NOS and kill the frigate with a torpedo or drones. The NOS is much more versatile, and gives cap instead of eating cap. And it works all the time. And it can be activated every 12 seconds. A smartbomb is even better: good defense against missiles and kills frigates easily.
A cruiser ?
Against what ?
Not against BS, that's for sure.
Nor against other cruisers (a gallente jammer would do the job better).
Against frigs ?
No again.
Same stuff: NOS is much better.
And frigates can't use them.
So, what's the point of this module ?
Could you give us a single situation where it would be usefull ?
If not, you can aswell leave the module as it is now (close to useless since all experienced inty pilots know how to deal with them) or remove it from the game.
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Lorth
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Posted - 2005.04.02 04:27:00 -
[9]
Well heres where the mod is usefull now.
1: Travel set ups. Its an ok mod to have when your travelling. Ushally you don't need the mid to do much of anything, after the MWD anyways.
2: Ewar. I remember using this in combination with a few corp mates. you can fit one burst to a tightly orbiting frig and then 2 multis to a cruiser of any kind. Put the two multis on your target and have the burst set to auto repeat. Can jam any ship in the game that doesn't have back ups. Could be used say with a thorax with two multis and a vigil with a burst. Not as effective as a BB, but the two formentioned ships have a lot more fire power.
3: Frig fights. I fly mostly frigs, and have been bursted before. But everytime it happens it confuses me enough that its a good 5 seconds before I figure out whats going on. Its something most pilots don't expect. I've kille taranises with stilletos doing this, simply because of the surprise factor.
4: Drones. I could concieve a pirating BB fitting one of these. Even when jammed the 8 heavys from a mining thorax can do enough damage to force a BB to warp off. It used to be the case that if you bursted the drones while the owner was jammed, they would not attack again, untill you made anouther hostile action.
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Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.04.02 04:32:00 -
[10]
Quote:
3: Frig fights. I fly mostly frigs, and have been bursted before. But everytime it happens it confuses me enough that its a good 5 seconds before I figure out whats going on. Its something most pilots don't expect. I've kille taranises with stilletos doing this, simply because of the surprise factor.
Thank you for stating that. You're the ONLYYYYYYY person who understands and factors in the responce of a "Human" with the "Burst" for "Frig vs Frig" combat. This is going into my signature damnit =)
Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
-The Frig- |
Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 05:05:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Sorja on 02/04/2005 14:07:08
Originally by: Lorth
1: Travel set ups. Its an ok mod to have when your travelling. Usually you don't need the mid to do much of anything, after the MWD anyways.
When was the last time you uncloaked withing 7.5 kms of interceptors ? There's a module for travel: WCS. What about the mids ? Even Amarr can reinforce their shields, can't they ?
Quote:
2: Ewar. You can fit one burst to a tightly orbiting frig and then 2 multis to a cruiser of any kind. Put the two multis on your target and have the burst set to auto repeat. Can jam any ship in the game that doesn't have back ups.
Your tight orbiting frigate won't be able to use the burst anyways (240 cap left on a ceptor ? Hmm...). This is a cruiser and up module.
Quote:
3: Frig fights. I fly mostly frigs, and have been bursted before. I've kille taranises with stilletos doing this, simply because of the surprise factor.
Again, but I fly Caldari ships known for their uber capacitor, how can a frigate spend 240 cap for one chance in x to succeed and 100% chance to die if it fails ?
Quote:
4: Drones.
I have yet to die from drones. And I lost my share of ships...
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Famine Aligher'ri
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Posted - 2005.04.02 05:26:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 02/04/2005 05:43:51
Quote:
3: Frig fights. I fly mostly frigs, and have been bursted before. I've kille taranises with stilletos doing this, simply because of the surprise factor.
Again, but I fly Caldari ships known for their uber capacitor, how can a frigate spend 240 cap for one chance in x to succeed and 100% chance to die if it fails ?
1 - He ment he was in a "Stiletto" and killed a "Taranis" with a burst. (From what he said)
2 - What I said "Frig vs Frig" was about the "Suprize Lock Breaking" that can "Stun" a opponent with "Suprize".
3 - Don't think anyone said anything about running "Multi" full time to "Beat" anyone.
4 - 1 cycle with NoS on a frig will work well. As well other cycles when the "Burst" cycle is up.
ECM Multi - 40 Cap : 5s (-4)
ECM Burst - 30 Cap : 20s (8)
= 70 Cap for 1 cycle. (Say 12 strength : 12 - 4 = 8; Bursting for 8)
Ok 1 cycle = Lock broken. Only need one cycle. Then other cycles when you feel you can afford it.
ECM Racial Jammer - 40 Cap : 30s (-6)
ECM Racial Jammer - 40 Cap : 30s (-6)
ECM Burst - 30 Cap 20s (8)
= 110 for 1 Cycle (Say 16 Strength : 16 - 12 = 4; Bursting for 8)
Damn my typing. Had to edit this 100 times. Stupid Keyboard!
I thought I would quote some math for the newbies. You don't need to run "ECM Multi" all the time. Choose your cycles to break lock. It's for a "First Strike" suprize attack anyways. That's what Lorth ment. Wither you choose to break lock in the rest of the fight is up to you. It can be useful, being that is "3-10seconds" of "No damage". That can be critical time to get in "3-10 seconds" of hits.
Example - 200 Autocannons II's : 1.90 or so RoF = Ave 40 damage.
Example - Rounding it to 2seconds : 10/2 = 5 x 40 Damage
You - 200 Damage (Not including 2-3 guns or typical 50-150 damage/critical strikes)
Opponent - 0 damage on relocking.
Famine Aligher'ri, of The Aligher'ri
-The Frig- |
Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 13:44:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Sorja on 02/04/2005 14:05:05
Famine, I don't know what you're talking about dude, this doesn't make sense to me and I read your reply twice. We are talking about the NEW ECM burst here, which is 240 cap, 1 minute cycle and 7.5 range (feel free to correct my figures, I don't have access to test).
Back on the possible use of that module.
If it's true it breaks absolutely all locks from all ships within range, friendly as hostiles, it does mean you could equip a fast ship with several modules and cap charges to jam a ship.
With the high cap usage, low range, low success probability, what kind of ship can you see able to put that module to effective use ?
I don't see a frigate able to do this because of the cap usage, and if on a cruiser, how can you get in range alive ?
You'd need a fast ship, which excludes Caldari despite their numerous mid slots. Even then, you'd need an MWD to get in range, which dries your cap, and cap charges to sustain the use of the module (a second slot used) and you'll end up with 2 bursts equipped at best (4 on a Blackbird but talking about maneuverability...), with absolutely no defense left (armor tanking maybe...).
So, what ship could use them ?
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sokken
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Posted - 2005.04.02 14:48:00 -
[14]
Q: does the module on sisi work so that whoever gets bursted and lose their lock can immediatly retarget, or are they jammed for the rest of the cycle(1min)?
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Black 1
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Posted - 2005.04.02 16:01:00 -
[15]
wouldn't u get concorded if u used them in empire on say a war target... if they accidently hit a can or a passing ship? i know u can say that ppl will not be that stupid but some1 let a SB off out side that popular rens station (idon't know the station... don't like beening in minmatar space too long ). and if it doesn't there will be alts at every sg in yulai and other popular systms just to **** ppl off.
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