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sarahnova
Demon-War-Lords
Fatal Ascension
1
   |
Posted - 2012.11.24 18:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
What is the point in it i lost a vindi and it gives me 200m for a 1.2bil hull sucks!
anyway i think CCP should make it so insurance payouts are close to the market value of the built ship and not how much in mins it costs. say like 10% below the market avg of the ships price on the market |
Hakan MacTrew
Caledonian Heavy Industries
Sick N' Twisted
31
|
Posted - 2012.11.24 19:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
So what happens when the market gets manipulated so that Bantams sell for 20 million and everyone starts cashing in?
Insurance is based on mineral worth. I think T2 and T3 should pay out more than they do. faction is another matter. The big cost of a faction ship is in the method of procuring it in the first place.
MODULAR DRONES
MORE ORE SHIPS |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
1151
|
Posted - 2012.11.24 20:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
Why would you fly T1 ships ever again if you could get most of the value back on T2, T3, and Faction?
You're supposed to pay through the nose for that extra edge... in more than one way.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
sarahnova
Demon-War-Lords
Fatal Ascension
1
|
Posted - 2012.11.25 14:38:00 -
[4] - Quote
well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss |
Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1134
|
Posted - 2012.11.25 15:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
sarahnova wrote:well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss
Pubbies.
Crimewatch 2.0: Protecting stupid people & rewarding lazy people. This hurts the smart & industrious people by making their intelligence & industry provide them with less benefit over the stupid & lazy people. ~ Ruby Porto |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
225
|
Posted - 2012.11.25 15:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
sarahnova wrote:well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss
If you can't afford to lose it, Don't fly it. |
Sigras
Conglomo
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
242
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 12:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
yeah because we dont have enough isk faucets in the game right now . . . |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
296
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 14:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:Why would you fly T1 ships ever again if you could get most of the value back on T2, T3, and Faction?
You're supposed to pay through the nose for that extra edge... in more than one way.
Insurance on these ships would be more costly.
Lets say you're flying a Golem worth 800 mil.
Insurance would cost 150 to 200 mil.
You would be paid out at 600-700 mil.
when flying a golem you're easily fitted with 300-400 mil in modules/rigs.
That means including, we'll say 200 mil in insurance plus 800 mil for the ship and 300 mil in fittings, your overall investment into the ship is 1.3 billion.
With a payout of 700 mil that's still a loss of 600 mil.
That is enough of a loss to be a huge hit to your wallet and is substantially more of a hit by far than you would take with a relatively equally fitted raven.
However, insurance like this would also suggest more flying of t2 ships in pve and even more in pvp because it would be substantially less of a hit when they did pop.
Also, with the tiericide of t1 ships making them more effective in both pvp and pve, then CCP needs to do something to make t2/t3/faction ships more appealing to players besides sending them through tiericide.
Even once t2/faction ships are sent through the rebalancing they're still going to be less appealing due to cost.
Now, in the case of t3 ships, I personally feel that they're gonna need their mineral requirements substantially reduced because they're all bound to get nerfed out the @ss.
I mean, they're capable of battleship dps and tank while having the size, speed, and mobility of a cruiser, while also having the options of interdiction nullification and covert cloaking.
The point is that there's 2 ways to make t2/t3/faction/pirate ships more viable.
One is reducing the mineral requirements, LP costs, and/or whatever else in order to bring their costs down to a competitive level (which won't happen)
Or two, give players a chance at a stubstantially higher insurance payout for these types of ships so that players will be taking less of a hit when flying one, thus more of these ships in combat.
Again tiericide amongst t1 ships is making t2 not worth it in pvp, and probably continue to be so even after t2 rebalance.
The reason for this is the high cost and limited functionality of t2. They're limited because t2 is designed to be focused ships that are less versatile than t1, but better at their specific tasks than any t1 could be.
However, in pvp versatility is key. |
blake fallout
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 15:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
ID, Rather InSure The (Moduals/Fittings) Then the Ship,
- Normaly Cost Several x more Anyway......
PS: no im not saying do it, 
Linkin park |
Crimeo Khamsi
AirHogs
Zulu People
35
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 16:05:00 -
[10] - Quote
sarahnova wrote:well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss
I think you're misunderstanding the counterargument.
1) Buy a whole bunch of one specific T2 ship, all at once. This will already up the price in itself.
2) Manipulate the market some more so that they cost like 400% more than they should.
3) Insure, and then go self destruct all your ships you bought, and get 360% in insurance of their normal cost for each.
Ta da! you just printed 100-200% of the original cost of each ship in free, magically appearing isk (260 minus costs of markat manipulation and insurance purchase) |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
296
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 17:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
Crimeo Khamsi wrote:sarahnova wrote:well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss I think you're misunderstanding the counterargument. 1) Buy a whole bunch of one specific T2 ship, all at once. This will already up the price in itself. 2) Manipulate the market some more so that they cost like 400% more than they should. 3) Insure, and then go self destruct all your ships you bought, and get 360% in insurance of their normal cost for each. Ta da! you just printed 100-200% of the original cost of each ship in free, magically appearing isk (260 minus costs of markat manipulation and insurance purchase)
That's only if they use dynamic insurance.
If they do as they do with t1 ships, then you'll still get a substantial payout, but not enough to purchase the ship again. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
756
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 18:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
They already significantly upped the insurance payout of t2 ships not that long ago.... You used to get 100-400k isk when you lost a 30m isk AF.
The price of flying t2 / faction ships has always been that insurance payouts are significantly lower than the cost of the ship. This is a good counterbalance to the boosted effectiveness of these ships, and I don't see any good reason to change it.
Seriously, why should the insurance pay out more? How does this "improve" the game? |
Hakan MacTrew
Caledonian Heavy Industries
Sick N' Twisted
35
|
Posted - 2012.11.27 20:24:00 -
[13] - Quote
I fly some faction and a few T2 ships on my PvP account. I accept that they will blow up. Its a matter of when, not if. If I wasn't willing to risk them, I wouldn't fly them.
Persoanally, as soon as I undock a ship for the purpose of PvP, I accept that it is already written off. The fact there is insurance at all is a bonus to me.
MODULAR DRONES
MORE ORE SHIPS |
Crimeo Khamsi
AirHogs
Zulu People
38
|
Posted - 2012.11.28 16:00:00 -
[14] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:Crimeo Khamsi wrote:sarahnova wrote:well thats why im saying the whole market avg minus 10%
take my vindi i lost avg is about 1.1 minus 10% or even 25% is a lot better the 80% loss I think you're misunderstanding the counterargument. 1) Buy a whole bunch of one specific T2 ship, all at once. This will already up the price in itself. 2) Manipulate the market some more so that they cost like 400% more than they should. 3) Insure, and then go self destruct all your ships you bought, and get 360% in insurance of their normal cost for each. Ta da! you just printed 100-200% of the original cost of each ship in free, magically appearing isk (260 minus costs of markat manipulation and insurance purchase) That's only if they use dynamic insurance. If they do as they do with t1 ships, then you'll still get a substantial payout, but not enough to purchase the ship again.
The OP is asking for exactly that: dynamic insurance. Look at the quote I quoted "market average minus 10%." That would be dynamic insurance, since the market price is dynamic.
Anyway, in general @anybody suggesting even non-dynamic increases, no. Insurance doesn't make any sense anyway. No real insurance company would ever even TOUCH ships in Eve Online with a 10 AU pole, much less give out payments without taking into consideration your claims records, and MUCH less based on "market prices" If anything, we should remove insurance, or nerf it by making your premiums go up the more times you file claims. |
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