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Arden Elenduil
The Skunkworks
13
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Posted - 2013.01.18 13:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
It's long since been known that there's something wrong with highsec wardecs. This is pretty much common knowledge yet even with the recent changes to the wardec system and crimewatch, not much has changed in terms of commitment that people generally put forward during a wardec.
The main reason for this is, as has been stated millions of times before, the fact that if **** start being upwardly inclined, one side docks up and refuses to come out to fight. There is a lack of incentive to fight.
This has been interpreted by some (not going to name any names, but just take a look at the latest CSM minutes) as a reason to turn highsec into some sort of themepark where everything is jolly safe and prancing about on rainbow ponies but doing so would be a massive mistake in my personal opinion.
Because of this, fellow Skunks Psychotic Monk and Rareden helped me come up with what might be a potential solution.
Eve is a cruel place, it's what it's known for. Thus, instead of making it safer, we simply provide corporations, even carebear ones, with an incentive to actually fight over something.
How do we do this? We give them Corporate Headquarters. Now you may be thinking, don't we already have this? Technically, yes. But in reality it's nothing more than a glorified NPC station that you 'might' call home. A lot of corps don't even use it anyway.
What I'm proposing, is HQ's in the shape of a miniature modular outpost, that can be anchored in highsec (only in deadspace, so safespots). This HQ would act like a miniature station that can be upgraded to provide certain bonuses for the owning corporation in that particular system. Needless to say, these HQ's would be destructable.
HQ's would be constructed by players from BPO's that are seeded on the market, as are the upgrade modules. People can buy or build one, and then anchor it in deadspace (only 1 per corporation). The HQ would NOT require standings with any faction whatsoever. Once anchored, it onlines and people can use it as a station for their corporation only (you cannot set standings, so only your corp can dock there). It'll also automatically set your corporate HQ to that system, and it cannot be moved again unless you decide to scrap your HQ.
Once online, different upgrade modules can be purchased and installed. These modules provide advantages such as: Corporate refinery A limited amount of research slots (not as effective as a POS) A limited amount of production slots (not as effective a a POS) System wide bonuses to either mining, siege, skirmish, information or armored warfare (for example they could be equivalent to a non-bonused ship providing all 3 links at once). These bonuses STACK with fleet bonuses provided by specialised ships. Boosts to NPC bounties or mission rewards (isk or LP) Corporate repair facilities Corporate clone bays with jumpclone facilities etc...
Modules can be changed to something else, but this would take a significant amount of time (for example 24 hours). Especially some of the boosts can give a defending corporation a 'homefield advantage'.
The HQ itself, and the modules that are installed on it, will require some measure of an upkeep cost, however this should not be too significant. Otherwise it wouldn't be profitable to actually have a HQ and people wouldn't use them.
Now in order to prevent proliferation and to encourage conflict between corporations, there would be a hard limit on how many HQ's can be placed in a system. The lower the sec status (and thus the better the ores for example) the less HQ's can be placed (CONCORD can't keep watch over an infinite number of HQ's).
This, combined especially with the boosts to for example mining will make for corporations competing with one another to be able to place their HQ in those systems in order to get the maximum amount of revenue. As a result, they might either hire mercenaries to take down the HQ's of an opposing corporation, or simply go to war themselves.
When a HQ is attacked, attackers will first have to knock it into reinforced. Once this happens, all modules are turned offline and will cease providing their boosts. Any production or research jobs will also be halted and stuck. Assets can still be evacuated however (and it is adviseable that this is done).
After the reinforcement cycle ends, the HQ becomes vulnerable again and can be destroyed. Any and all ships and assets that are inside at the time of destruction can be dropped. All players that are docked will lose their pods and subsequently be shipped to the nearest clone vat. In order to save the HQ, it simply has to be repped up just like any regular outpost or POS would.
There's multiple reasons why CCP could implement this. It's a buff to highsec carebears (we all know how much they love them). It provides corporations with a real place to call home. It provides an incentive and an actual goal to partake in highsec wars, not just for griefers or pvp-ers, but also for industrialists, mission runners and miners. It provides the poorer corporations that don't have standings or the funds required for a POS with the ability to (within limits) research and create BPC's. The modular design means that it can be a small scale testbed for the POS revamp. Destructibility means that it can be a small scale testbed for destructible outposts in nullsec space.
This is of course just a preliminary idea and I'm hoping that the following discussion can add ideas or features and completely work out the kinks. |
Skippermonkey
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1758
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Posted - 2013.01.18 13:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
tl:dr ? COME AT ME BRO
I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION |
av ra
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 13:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
I support this product and/or service. +1 |
Ellysva
Fistful of Finns Nulli Secunda
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 14:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
For once a good improvement idea for empire wars / empire space in general.
The last 10^n patches have all just buffed up highsec security, and griefers have no place in this universe anymore. No more butthurt, only plain stupid carebearing, market PVP and shipspinning. No learning curve, no experience through mistakes... *sigh*
This highsec sov mechanism would at least give some reason to not dock up totally during a wardeck. |
Daichi Yamato
Swamp Bucket Swamp Bucket Empire
526
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Posted - 2013.01.18 14:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
anything that encourages players to put hard assets into space gets a +1.
Is the HQ a must? or just something that can provide potential benefits most ppl would like to use?
also, i dnt see anything that would benefit mission runners who usually have to fly a jump or two out of their home to make money and most PvP corps would probably keep to guerilla warfare. so this is pretty much just for miners. |
Arden Elenduil
The Skunkworks
14
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Posted - 2013.01.18 14:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
The HQ is not a must. It's completely optional, but provides benefits to those that use it. As for mission runners, you could say that it provides boosts for the agents that are in system with it for example. |
Daichi Yamato
Swamp Bucket Swamp Bucket Empire
526
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Posted - 2013.01.18 15:03:00 -
[7] - Quote
Arden Elenduil wrote:The HQ is not a must. It's completely optional, but provides benefits to those that use it. As for mission runners, you could say that it provides boosts for the agents that are in system with it for example.
fair enough, though missioner runners make more money from bounties and loot over rewards and LP's, its better than nothing.
if the manufacturing and research is not as good as a POS. wont corps just erect a POS in the same system and use that instead? relegating the HQ to the role of an expensive booster, but little more. |
Zixie Draco
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
162
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Posted - 2013.01.18 15:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
This idea is adorable and precious. Bless your heart. Would you like a kitten? |
Skippermonkey
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1759
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Posted - 2013.01.18 15:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
As you know arden, we just conversed the idea for over half an hour
It simply doesnt work in the manner you hope it will COME AT ME BRO
I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION |
Steam Cat
The Skunkworks
11
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Posted - 2013.01.18 15:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
I support this idea. |
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sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
615
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Posted - 2013.01.18 15:36:00 -
[11] - Quote
Yeah! Now this will definitely get these wimpy industrialists and miners to undock.
Looking for a fight? Dec someone who will fight. Oh wait, you just want free kms.
So you want riskless pvp? I know just the thing for you - shooting red crosses. Rats will let you molest them as much as you want and shoot back like a miner. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Arden Elenduil
The Skunkworks
15
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Posted - 2013.01.18 16:37:00 -
[12] - Quote
EDITED THE OP |
Dohickey
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3
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Posted - 2013.01.18 16:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
This idea needs more cowbell. |
Daichi Yamato
Swamp Bucket Swamp Bucket Empire
528
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Posted - 2013.01.18 17:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:Yeah! Now this will definitely get these wimpy industrialists and miners to undock. Looking for a fight? Dec someone who will fight. Oh wait, you just want free kms. So you want riskless pvp? I know just the thing for you - shooting red crosses. Rats will let you molest them as much as you want and shoot back like a miner.
or its a way for miners to get even more yield and compete with eachother for 'territory'. competition in what, i thought, is a competitive game.
preferred the station idea, because i generally want more player stations that can be shot and less NPC stations. something to shoot while ppl sit docked is nice. even mercs dock up when decced. :( |
Arden Elenduil
The Skunkworks
15
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Posted - 2013.01.18 17:17:00 -
[15] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:sabre906 wrote:Yeah! Now this will definitely get these wimpy industrialists and miners to undock. Looking for a fight? Dec someone who will fight. Oh wait, you just want free kms. So you want riskless pvp? I know just the thing for you - shooting red crosses. Rats will let you molest them as much as you want and shoot back like a miner. or its a way for miners to get even more yield and compete with eachother for 'territory'. competition in what, i thought, is a competitive game. preferred the station idea, because i generally want more player stations that can be shot and less NPC stations. something to shoot while ppl sit docked is nice. even mercs dock up when decced. :(
I initially thought that as well, but talking to Elise changed my mind. It'd be something too big to be really easily coded and generally CCP is trying to move away from structures to shoot and into people doing stuff in space. |
Luc Chastot
Moira. Villore Accords
179
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Posted - 2013.01.18 17:28:00 -
[16] - Quote
Interesting. Make it idiot-proof and someone will make a better idiot. |
Oblivion Maximus
I.RAGE Smug Delinquents
16
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Posted - 2013.01.18 17:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
excellent Idea... Very nice.. Give something for people to fight for! +1 |
Daichi Yamato
Swamp Bucket Swamp Bucket Empire
528
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Posted - 2013.01.18 17:51:00 -
[18] - Quote
Arden Elenduil wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:sabre906 wrote:Yeah! Now this will definitely get these wimpy industrialists and miners to undock. Looking for a fight? Dec someone who will fight. Oh wait, you just want free kms. So you want riskless pvp? I know just the thing for you - shooting red crosses. Rats will let you molest them as much as you want and shoot back like a miner. or its a way for miners to get even more yield and compete with eachother for 'territory'. competition in what, i thought, is a competitive game. preferred the station idea, because i generally want more player stations that can be shot and less NPC stations. something to shoot while ppl sit docked is nice. even mercs dock up when decced. :( I initially thought that as well, but talking to Elise changed my mind. It'd be something too big to be really easily coded and generally CCP is trying to move away from structures to shoot and into people doing stuff in space.
i thought CCP were trying to have ppl own more stations and have less stations run by NPC corps. ah well, dockers gotta dock |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
616
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Posted - 2013.01.18 19:25:00 -
[19] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Arden Elenduil wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:sabre906 wrote:Yeah! Now this will definitely get these wimpy industrialists and miners to undock. Looking for a fight? Dec someone who will fight. Oh wait, you just want free kms. So you want riskless pvp? I know just the thing for you - shooting red crosses. Rats will let you molest them as much as you want and shoot back like a miner. or its a way for miners to get even more yield and compete with eachother for 'territory'. competition in what, i thought, is a competitive game. preferred the station idea, because i generally want more player stations that can be shot and less NPC stations. something to shoot while ppl sit docked is nice. even mercs dock up when decced. :( I initially thought that as well, but talking to Elise changed my mind. It'd be something too big to be really easily coded and generally CCP is trying to move away from structures to shoot and into people doing stuff in space. i thought CCP were trying to have ppl own more stations and have less stations run by NPC corps. ah well, dockers gotta dock
There should be a "gank" button to undock them, because, you know, other ppl exist purely for your entertainment, right? Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Arden Elenduil
The Skunkworks
17
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Posted - 2013.01.18 20:18:00 -
[20] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:There should be a "gank" button to undock them, because, you know, other ppl exist purely for your entertainment, right?
Please try to keep your comments limited to constructive criticism, not an overly obvious attempt at a troll
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Yuri Wayfare
Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
240
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Posted - 2013.01.18 20:26:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sorry Arden, I still think you're approaching this from the wrong angle.
High Sec defenders don't fight for two major reasons, in order of importance:
a) They don't want to fight.
b) They only stand to lose.
Not much we can do about a). These people simply don't want to fight others.
As for b), giving them more stuff to lose is only going to make things worse.
And the complicating factor is balance. Giving purchasable/conquerable advantages to high seccers means buffing high sec income. I don't think anyone wants to go down that path. The alternative is to balance it out by reducing the high sec income baseline. Malcanis' Law dictates that then, only the old and rich will hold these advantages because they have the overwhelming power to defend them.
If anything is to be done about high sec wardecs (and "let it be" still strikes me as the best idea I've heard so far) it needs to be something that provides a gain for the defender rather than merely a mitigation of loss. Better yet, it needs to provide an incentive for others to fight on the defender's behalf. One might, for example, put that war dec fee to use as a bounty on the attackers, to be paid out only to the defender and his official allies. "Suddenly, trash pickers! HUNDREDS of winos going through your recyclables." -Piugattuk
Be careful what you wish for. |
Daichi Yamato
Swamp Bucket Swamp Bucket Empire
528
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 22:12:00 -
[22] - Quote
sabre906 wrote:There should be a "gank" button to undock them, because, you know, other ppl exist purely for your entertainment, right?
ur right, eve should be about flowers, rainbows and consensual pvp only.
maybe we can extend the current 'safety' system so that modules cannot be activated against those who have configured their settings to 'i dnt want to be shot at' |
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