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Stonewall Jackson Adama
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
0
   |
Posted - 2013.02.02 10:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s? I'm not talking fuel blocks or t3 cruisers. I'm talking more about regualar low to mid-level production, t1/t2 frig and cruiser hulls and mods/boosters. I was thinking about moving a small manufacturing operation into a c4/c3, but I was worried it would arouse too much attention. If I leave it in k-space, there will be a lot of transporting in and out of w-space, just as there will be a lot of transporting in and out if I stay in w-space, so the logistics isn't really what is bothering me. |
Shenra Twrin
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
27
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 10:45:00 -
[2] - Quote
i can you give somethhing to consider.
Manuf... in a WH is ofc possible but why would u want do it?
Your Pos can easy be reinforced, your Hauler can easily be ganked and to haul all that stuff is a nightmare. Syrsly you gain no advantage... or let me say only one.. You can Produce in secred nobody can know what you Prod..
But dude its not worth it.....
The ORE BELTS dont spawn frequent... everybody in wh looove to gank thos hulk/vengaces
Wouldnt do it. if you do respect for that level of masochism |
Stonewall Jackson Adama
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 11:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
I've lived in plenty of WH"s, c4's/c3's, c5/c3's, and a c5/c6. I've never had any problem with transport ships, exhumers, or gas suckers being ganked. I close superfluous holes, I keep scouts everywhere, I constantly dscan. That's not what I'm worried about. What worries me is someone seeing a pos with some manufacturing in it and saying 'sure, let's put that into reinforced'. |
Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics
K162
1357
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 11:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
No point at all in building anything in WHs that you can build in HS. |
Cavilha
Tupy Industries
6
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 14:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
If you think only in manufacturing is not worth it. For in HS and you can also do with more facilities.
The advantage of this WH industry in the range of possibilities. Make reactions, mining, PI, PVE and of course always a bit of PVP to distract.
If your concern is the logistics take a C1/HS everything will be simple.
I live in a C3/LS and like industry. FACOS reactions, produce items T1/T2, inventions and so on.
I never had any problem with logistics. Usually once a week appears a connection to HS or LS with easy access.
Just a little care and experience will prevent being ganked. |
Morwraith
Obstergo
Exhale.
7
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 15:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
People won't RF a pos just because you're doing manufacturing if thats your concern. As long as the pos has proper defense people will most likely leave you alone especially in a c4. Although the points that others have brought up are valid concerns. |
Tommassino Preldent
SON OF RAVANA
Dominatus Atrum Mortis
14
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 15:35:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:No point at all in building anything in WHs that you can build in HS.
Nanite paste is worth it, if you enjoy doing PI. The compression on that thing is insane. |
Casirio
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD
Exhale.
377
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 16:59:00 -
[8] - Quote
If they reinforce your pos send us a message we will come pew for free :) |
Sith1s Spectre
Sky Fighters
Talocan United
84
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 20:02:00 -
[9] - Quote
Stonewall Jackson Adama wrote:Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s? I'm not talking fuel blocks or t3 cruisers. I'm talking more about regualar low to mid-level production, t1/t2 frig and cruiser hulls and mods/boosters. I was thinking about moving a small manufacturing operation into a c4/c3, but I was worried it would arouse too much attention. If I leave it in k-space, there will be a lot of transporting in and out of w-space, just as there will be a lot of transporting in and out if I stay in w-space, so the logistics isn't really what is bothering me.
TL:DR Manufacturing ships and mods isn't worth the effort in WH space. Manufacturing items from PI is.
Cheers,
Sith
CCP please consider hats as a clothing option for our spaceship barbies.-á
Artist impression of what this could potentially be http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t66/ROBC5Z06/sithsig_zps86971c83.jpg |
Rek Seven
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD
Exhale.
608
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 20:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
I manufacture stuff in wormholes but nothing that requires a large amount of ore. If i could upgrade my pos with a refinery that had a 100% yield, i would probably consider manufacturing ships.
Why i play EVE:-á20% for gameplay experience, 30% for the social aspect and 50% because of CCPGÇÖs empty promises.-á |
Razor Rocker
Ellis Research
37
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 23:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Do you live in a WH full time right now? Because if you don't right now, then I'm confused as to why you'd ever manufacture in a WH. HS is the best place for t1-t3 production, and if you want reactions then go to lowsec. That way you can become familiar with the area, have a cyno into the system, and there is a great thing called local chat. However, if you are dead set on manufacturing in a WH, do what the previous posters have said and move into a C1/HS or C2/HS. |
Arazel Chainfire
Sons Of 0din
Dark Therapy
180
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 00:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sure you can manufacture in WH's. However, aside from small scale producing for just yourself/a few people (note, not full time), I highly doubt manufacturing ships and modules would be worth it. T3 cruisers are the only maybe, but even then I'm not sure it would be enough to be worth fueling a POS for it.
So what other types of manufacturing? Well, you could run reactions, and it is safer for a small timer to run reactions in a WH than in lowsec. But you still run into the issue of volume - namely, you're tossing a lot of volume through the WH's, which leads to lots of extra logistics, and the possibility of loosing some ships to someone ganking you. Still viable with proper market research though. Speaking as someone who has previously run multiple towers for reactions in the past though, you are going to hate yourself if you go down this path... Managing POS's is by far the most likely thing to lead to eve-burnout in my experience.
So that pretty much leaves PI. And while PI can certaintly make you a decent amount of isk, in anything other than a C1 its really just some isk on the side, not something worth basing the majority of your WH money-making out of. |
Ryuji Takemiya
Omni Tech Industries
Initiative Associates
25
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 05:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
You have to bring the gas in from low and null, but you can cook up some illegal boosters out in W-Space. And who doesn't like to fly smacked up?
It's good for your m8s and to sell.
|
Zoltan Lazar
128
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 08:16:00 -
[14] - Quote
I see X-L ship assembly pos's, super-lab'd pos's and obvious carebear production pos's in WH space all the time, usually in C3 holes. They're very rarely attacked, for two reasons. One, they usually indicate the defender has at least one cap, which makes a supcap fleet rather difficult to field. Two, a reinforce timer of more than 24 hours means having to find another route back to the attacker's home WH after killing your tower.
TL;DR Put your reinforce timer to above 24 hours, have at least a carrier and a moros if not more to defend. |
Holy lanyaie's
Posthuman Society
10110001100111101000
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 12:03:00 -
[15] - Quote
Shenra Twrin wrote:i can you give somethhing to consider.
Manuf... in a WH is ofc possible but why would u want do it?
Your Pos can easy be reinforced, your Hauler can easily be ganked and to haul all that stuff is a nightmare. Syrsly you gain no advantage... or let me say only one.. You can Produce in secred nobody can know what you Prod..
But dude its not worth it.....
The ORE BELTS dont spawn frequent... everybody in wh looove to gank thos hulk/vengaces
Wouldnt do it. if you do respect for that level of masochism
oh my god
|
Stonewall Jackson Adama
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 23:13:00 -
[16] - Quote
Razor Rocker wrote:Do you live in a WH full time right now? Because if you don't right now, then I'm confused as to why you'd ever manufacture in a WH. HS is the best place for t1-t3 production, and if you want reactions then go to lowsec. That way you can become familiar with the area, have a cyno into the system, and there is a great thing called local chat. However, if you are dead set on manufacturing in a WH, do what the previous posters have said and move into a C1/HS or C2/HS.
not right now. I've been playing other games and skilling in eve (which is pretty much playing eve). I'm thinking of moving back into a c4/c3 with a few people and was curious if manufacturing was worth it. From what I've seen so far, I'll probably just stick to making stuff from PI.
Logistics has never been much of a problem. I've spent 90% of my time playing eve in a wh and I had good guidance when I started out. It would be bit more of a hassle than doing everything in HS, but there's something about having a secret manufacturing facility in w-space that really strikes me the right way. |
Stonewall Jackson Adama
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 23:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
Arazel Chainfire wrote:So that pretty much leaves PI. And while PI can certaintly make you a decent amount of isk, in anything other than a C1 its really just some isk on the side, not something worth basing the majority of your WH money-making out of.
The manufacutring would just be a side project - something to spice up my wh life. I'd just roll c3's with another person or two (or by myself) or take advantage of rolling c5's/c6's and their ladars for the bulk of my isk. |
Stonewall Jackson Adama
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 23:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
Ryuji Takemiya wrote:You have to bring the gas in from low and null, but you can cook up some illegal boosters out in W-Space. And who doesn't like to fly smacked up?
It's good for your m8s and to sell.
I really, really like the idea of having an illegal drug manufacturing setup in w-space. That's why I play eve. |
Godfrey Silvarna
Frozen Dawn Inc
Arctic Light
65
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 23:22:00 -
[19] - Quote
The main reason to run industry in wormholes is that K-space sucks and should be avoided at all costs.
That is more than sufficient. |
Sam Koli
GNADE Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.04 09:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
I once made good ISK with Reactions. and WH space is more secure for me than low/0.0 sec. but it is still risky, because it needs quite some assets, which you put on risk.
The main reason WH sucks for Industry, is the logistics. so I would only consider it with a higsec static. |
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
105
|
Posted - 2013.02.04 23:17:00 -
[21] - Quote
Zoltan Lazar wrote:I see X-L ship assembly pos's, super-lab'd pos's and obvious carebear production pos's in WH space all the time, usually in C3 holes. They're very rarely attacked, for two reasons. One, they usually indicate the defender has at least one cap, which makes a supcap fleet rather difficult to field. Two, a reinforce timer of more than 24 hours means having to find another route back to the attacker's home WH after killing your tower.
TL;DR Put your reinforce timer to above 24 hours, have at least a carrier and a moros if not more to defend.
This is both somewhat right and VERY wrong. Full stront is good, yes, but it is not sufficient; your starbase will need some serious teeth (a combo of racial guns (but not missiles!), tackle, neuts, and very heavy rainbow ECM is what has been shown to work well in sub-C5 space) to go with that 40+hr reinforcement timer. Towers without tackle and/or using missiles as their sole damage source can be vulnerable to attacks from bombers, while a lack of jamming and neuts means that hostile logistics can do their job without serious risk of interference. Another good idea is to have starbase gunners in your corporation; they greatly bolster the effectiveness of the defenses you do have in place.
Furthermore, floating caps (or sometimes even a XL-SAA) can draw a siege, especially if in a lightly defended or undersized tower; T3/logi gangs with energy neuting support can down caps much more easily than most folks anticipate them to. While building them is a good idea, especially if you have some working relationships with more gun-happy groups that have skilled cap pilots among their ranks, its best to leave them stuffed in SMAs to serve as an unpleasant surprise for an actual invader than to leave them floating and risk getting a tower sieged by someone who's trying to get those capitals to come out and play. |
Johnson 1044
Johnson Organic Produce
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 21:26:00 -
[22] - Quote
I don't know why manufacturing arrays would attract more attention than any other well-stocked POS. Odds are the real money is in the hangar array (sleeper loot) and the ship maintenance array anyway. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
Situation: Normal
1150
|
Posted - 2013.02.17 21:51:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui wrote:Furthermore, floating caps (or sometimes even a XL-SAA) can draw a siege,
The most common reason for POS sieging a C2/C3 I've been a part of was to get the caps to come out and play. |
Tinu Moorhsum
Random Events
128
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 16:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
Stonewall Jackson Adama wrote:Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s? I'm not talking fuel blocks or t3 cruisers. I'm talking more about regualar low to mid-level production, t1/t2 frig and cruiser hulls and mods/boosters. I was thinking about moving a small manufacturing operation into a c4/c3, but I was worried it would arouse too much attention. If I leave it in k-space, there will be a lot of transporting in and out of w-space, just as there will be a lot of transporting in and out if I stay in w-space, so the logistics isn't really what is bothering me.
I don't see any advantage to doing actual construction in a wormhole beyond what you actually use for your WH operations.
Mining and Invention are another matter. You pretty much need your own POS if you take T2 production seriously at all. What I personally do is mine and invent in the WH and then take the BPC's and minerals out to run them at my production base. If you do it on any scale at all you'll also need a rorqual in the WH to compress the ore because ... well... hauling suck.
T- |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Swift Angels Alliance
900
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 01:31:00 -
[25] - Quote
You can produce in a WH, but, for a start, the refinery is inefficient. You lose up to 25% of the minerals. So there goes your profit margin. And everything else is irrelevant immediately, so we won't discuss manufacturing inefficiencies, etc.
The only thing worth manufacturing in wormholes is ammo, preferably T2 stuff you've researched BPC's for at your POS.
Reactions, as Azreal said, can be profitable, but they are a PITA to set up, very expensive to run, and a whorebeast of complexity.
That said, there are several C1's owned by big nullsec blocs with 40+ large lab towers, some have massive reaction operations in C2's they use to refine and value-add to moon goo in total security (no capital hotdrops in a C2!) etcetera.
Taking submissions for "Trinkets friendly Advice Column" via evemail or private convo in-game. Anonymity sorta guaranteed.
http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
|
Oxandrolone
Bite Me inc
Bitten.
138
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 02:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
Stonewall Jackson Adama wrote:Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s?
No it is not, everything is less efficient, harder and more dangerous than doing it in HS (nerf highsec) |
Althiare
Posthuman Society
10110001100111101000
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 10:08:00 -
[27] - Quote
Doing indie in wh space can be very profitable. I have done my share of reactions in wh space but I would only recommend doing that if you also want some pvp on the side, else just get a hs POS setup and do your thing there.
If some pvp on the side sounds good. get a c2 with a hs static so logistics is manageable and you can get some visitors to blow up (or scan down the chain to find some pew). I also would recommend some friends to join you in your hole for all the obvious reasons.
Also after the ninja harvesting fix in patch 1.1 you can expect gas prices to go back up so stock up while you can if you plan to do reactions. |
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