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Aelius
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Posted - 2005.07.19 18:47:00 -
[1]
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
High - 6 Arbalest/tech2 Cruise Launchers, 2 HV Nosf
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
With my skills i have a RoF of 7.57 sec on the Arbalest (with rapid launch lv4, cruise spec lv3)
These were the results when hiting a cargo container:
With 4 Target Painters II 2005.07.19 18:10:10 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 410.5 damage.
WithOUT TP2005.07.19 18:06:57 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 195.5 damage.
(both with warhead upgrades lv3)
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
This is sure to be even better if i had lv5 advanced missile skills and lv5 target painters skills. 
Need a new sig, contact me ingame with offers, tks. |
Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.07.19 18:53:00 -
[2]
There IS a difference between shooting a moving target of various class sizes, and a stationary cargo can. :) But I'm glad someone out there is learning the skills and trying things out before passing final judgement.
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
Aelius
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Posted - 2005.07.19 18:58:00 -
[3]
Yes i know its a stationary target, but with 2 HV nosf any frigate that gets closer will be slowed down by the lack of cap
Need a new sig, contact me ingame with offers, tks. |
IamBen
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:14:00 -
[4]
when you try that on an angel ceptor out in 0.0 let us know the results. *Have most missle sklls on 4 and tried it.. haha this post is funny :)*
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:16:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: IamBen
when you try that on an angel ceptor out in 0.0 let us know the results. *Have most missle sklls on 4 and tried it.. haha this post is funny :)*
And your results were what? :)
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
Aelius
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:17:00 -
[6]
Originally by: IamBen
when you try that on an angel ceptor out in 0.0 let us know the results. *Have most missle sklls on 4 and tried it.. haha this post is funny :)*
As you might know NPC aren't affected by Nosferatus and their speed won't change a bit so the damage will be largely affected by a fast moving inty.
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Uther Agnoius
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:24:00 -
[7]
See my new video for t2 launchers in action, hitting for 498.4 damage (warhead 3 :( )
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:28:00 -
[8]
"I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
With 4 Target Painters II2005.07.19 18:10:10 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 410.5 damage.
WithOUT TP2005.07.19 18:06:57 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 195.5 damage.
(both with warhead upgrades lv3)"
Awesome. Your cruise missile which has base damage output in that configuration of ~550 hp can hit a cargo container that sits still in space for less than half of that damage. If you stack 4 target painters on it, the damage loss is merely 25%
Clearly since the Raven can actually still hit something for triple number damage when she goes all out with gank setup, this shows all missiles were in fact boosted...
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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2005.07.19 19:49:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
High - 6 Arbalest/tech2 Cruise Launchers, 2 HV Nosf
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
With my skills i have a RoF of 7.57 sec on the Arbalest (with rapid launch lv4, cruise spec lv3)
These were the results when hiting a cargo container:
With 4 Target Painters II2005.07.19 18:10:10 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 410.5 damage.
WithOUT TP2005.07.19 18:06:57 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 195.5 damage.
(both with warhead upgrades lv3)
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
This is sure to be even better if i had lv5 advanced missile skills and lv5 target painters skills.
If it's a gank setup doesn't that usually mean the enemy wont have a choice in the fight? 10 seconds is more time than anyship in the game needs to warp out before the first missle hits them. Add to that lock on time. What maybe 15 20 sec on the average target?
While it's is a valid setup it's hardly a gank setup. Anyone that sticks around long enough for the first missle to hit is either a moron or they plan on taking you out.
If someone decided to take you out you better have a back up plan cause in that 15 seconds am pretty sure most mega's/apocs are gonna tost ya before you stand a chance of getting them to turn on their armor repair.
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Matthias Ungabii
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:03:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Aelius
This is sure to be even better if i had lv5 advanced missile skills and lv5 target painters skills.
You're kidding me.
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Thyristor Phibes
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:21:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
Okay, put the pipe down, and come up for air for a minute. The reason its a missile boost is because you now HAVE to fit the Raven with the above in bold. That's what boosted the missiles not what CCP did. Also, you now have no defences. Quit being a Tard.
10 seconds is an absolute eternity in a battle with no defenses. Nice way to blow through $100 mill isk though!
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IamBen
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:22:00 -
[12]
Edited by: IamBen on 19/07/2005 20:23:25
it still doesnt do alot of damage. Also, a fire rate of 7 seconds is not good! compare that with armageddon with t2 pulse gank set up. Its just not good. And four painters to get there ! mamamia.
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Drilla
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:23:00 -
[13]
Only the carebears complain about the Raven being nerfed.
Wonder why 
EVE System Security - Killboard (still early alpha) |
Malken
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:32:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Drilla
Only the carebears complain about the Raven being nerfed.
Wonder why
because the other ppl got 7mill+ in gunnery and flies gunships instead?
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Drilla
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:44:00 -
[15]
No - I know plenty of PVP Raven pilots who studies the new stuff and concluded that they get even better now :D
EVE System Security - Killboard (still early alpha) |
infused
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Posted - 2005.07.19 20:48:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Drilla
No - I know plenty of PVP Raven pilots who studies the new stuff and concluded that they get even better now :D
Funny how we all said that... yet no one listened.
[World Domination]
[Patch 3366-3538: Mirror Here] |
Cheim
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Posted - 2005.07.19 21:15:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Aelius
High - 6 Arbalest/tech2 Cruise Launchers, 2 HV Nosf
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
Those target painters aren't going to do you any good against battleships or MWDing ships. 1 or 2 might be more efficient, then put a web in there. Maybe an afterburner or MWD for the bombing runs and as a missile/tracking defence. |
Aelius
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Posted - 2005.07.19 21:38:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Aelius on 19/07/2005 21:39:37
Edited by: Aelius on 19/07/2005 21:38:40
Don't forget that players are still finetunning the raven setups outthere.
I'm sure this isn't the best setup ever but it shows people that Caldari BS are still alive and kicking.
Don't forget that BCUs II/implants for missiles aren't ingame yet and to apply a good gankaggedon setup you need to be on optimal range.
Raven can be at "any" distance from the target to employ max missile damage.
I will keep training my skills and i will keep you updated on further testing.
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Larno
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Posted - 2005.07.19 21:43:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Thyristor Phibes
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
Okay, put the pipe down, and come up for air for a minute. The reason its a missile boost is because you now HAVE to fit the Raven with the above in bold. That's what boosted the missiles not what CCP did. Also, you now have no defences. Quit being a Tard.
10 seconds is an absolute eternity in a battle with no defenses. Nice way to blow through $100 mill isk though!
LOL you have no idea do you? 95% of Armageddons out there having nothing more than a medium armor rep II.
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infused
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Posted - 2005.07.19 21:49:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Larno
LOL you have no idea do you? 95% of Armageddons out there having nothing more than a medium armor rep II.
Indeed... some dont even have that... 8 heatsink 2's mmmm
[World Domination]
[Patch 3366-3538: Mirror Here] |
j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.07.19 21:49:00 -
[21]
"Don't forget that players are still finetunning the raven setups outthere.
I'm sure this isn't the best setup ever but it shows people that Caldari BS are still alive and kicking."
The small catch with this reasoning is, you're still talking about single ship with single missile type that yes, did receive a boost against its 'intended' targets thanks to much higher new speed.
But please don't turn this single case into a sweeping generalization how _missiles_ got boosted, because they simply did not... there's more missile ships than just Raven with cruises out there.
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Allen Deckard
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Posted - 2005.07.19 22:42:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Larno
Originally by: Thyristor Phibes
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
Okay, put the pipe down, and come up for air for a minute. The reason its a missile boost is because you now HAVE to fit the Raven with the above in bold. That's what boosted the missiles not what CCP did. Also, you now have no defences. Quit being a Tard.
10 seconds is an absolute eternity in a battle with no defenses. Nice way to blow through $100 mill isk though!
LOL you have no idea do you? 95% of Armageddons out there having nothing more than a medium armor rep II.
And do INSTANT DAMAGE NOT DAMAGE AFTER 10 SECONDS.
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Alerce
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Posted - 2005.07.19 23:06:00 -
[23]
Hmm, ok missiles are improved, launchers are nerved.
People say train advanced weapon upgrades to get the grid down again, then the missiles are ok again.
But, every other ship in the game enjoys also the benefit of saving up another 10 percent grid, with that skill max. trained?
Most of the setups, that were not using missiles, suddenly have spare grid free now for other things. Those will mostly be used for another heavier gun, more defence in med slots, things like that.
This means clearly: all gun ships got a pretty big upgrade with that new skill, all missile boats need the skill to be able to fit almost the same amount of launchers again on their ships as before patch.
So if you look at the bigger picture, the question is still:
Did missile setups benefit enough from the new skills to overcome the improvement that gun setups got with the new skills?
For me it seems: yes, the missiles setups are bit better on ships with missile bonus, because then the ships bonus increases the total bonus(ships*skills) enough to compete.
On ships with no missile bonus, the situation became a bit worse, since the damage/range of missiles miss the vital ship bonus part and any gun setup on the same type of ship has spare powergrid due to the new skill as well. Powergrid, that can be used for either bigger gun or extra defence or whatever that cost grid.
Some may say this is silly and they say: yes but i do clearly more damage then before patch, but then what makes a ship or setup one of the better ones?
Its that particular ship+setup VS all other possible ships+setups.
So to compare the missile situation change, you have to look also on the benefit gun setups got with the new skill. Only comparing missile damage before and after is not enough!
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.19 23:15:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Deja Thoris on 19/07/2005 23:15:49
Originally by: IamBen
Edited by: IamBen on 19/07/2005 20:23:25
it still doesnt do alot of damage. Also, a fire rate of 7 seconds is not good! compare that with armageddon with t2 pulse gank set up. Its just not good. And four painters to get there ! mamamia.
Hmm, show me a "gank" geddon that can hit from 80km with megapulses?
You will hit at about 65km with radio crystals with one low slot tracking mod.
A raven is choosing the dmg type while the geddon is dealing no damage until it is 15km closer in which case it's had the crap pummeled out of it. Then it's working with its weakest ammo.
@ Allen Deackard. This is why people fly in groups and use tacklers...
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Larno
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Posted - 2005.07.19 23:20:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Allen Deckard
Originally by: Larno
Originally by: Thyristor Phibes
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
Okay, put the pipe down, and come up for air for a minute. The reason its a missile boost is because you now HAVE to fit the Raven with the above in bold. That's what boosted the missiles not what CCP did. Also, you now have no defences. Quit being a Tard.
10 seconds is an absolute eternity in a battle with no defenses. Nice way to blow through $100 mill isk though!
LOL you have no idea do you? 95% of Armageddons out there having nothing more than a medium armor rep II.
And do INSTANT DAMAGE NOT DAMAGE AFTER 10 SECONDS.
LOL ... optimal of Mega Pulse with MF is 12.5km/9.6km falloff. Thats total of 22.1km. Cruise travelling at 8.5km/sec would take 2.6 seconds to reach target.
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Vaygr
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Posted - 2005.07.20 01:24:00 -
[26]
Cruise missles can be used for sniping. I believe its posscible to get them to reach 160km now with skills on a raven but i aint done all cacluations. Only thing that could challege you at that range would be 1400mms but they would be using low dmg carbonized lead ammo. It would take 18 seconds for the missles to reach their target but not much else in game would be able to hit you at that range and they would do more dot then 1400mms with carbo ammo once they start impacting. And the fact that you dont have to fill all your low slots with dmg mods to do that good dmg over range like 1400mms allows you to maintain a much better tank.
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Avalon Beholder
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Posted - 2005.07.20 01:37:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Vaygr
Cruise missles can be used for sniping. I believe its posscible to get them to reach 160km now with skills on a raven but i aint done all cacluations. Only thing that could challege you at that range would be 1400mms but they would be using low dmg carbonized lead ammo. It would take 18 seconds for the missles to reach their target but not much else in game would be able to hit you at that range and they would do more dot then 1400mms with carbo ammo once they start impacting. And the fact that you dont have to fill all your low slots with dmg mods to do that good dmg over range like 1400mms allows you to maintain a much better tank.
Exactly.
For PvP the Raven is up there with the Big Boys now. It has its roles, and it is VERY good at them.
For PvE. Well Find me the Other BS that can kill frigs with its main armament at close range? Wow there are none?
FIT anti-frig in your last 2 slots Dumbasses.
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OffBeaT
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Posted - 2005.07.20 01:42:00 -
[28]
Edited by: OffBeaT on 20/07/2005 01:43:37
Originally by: Aelius
I've tryed this setup and although my advanced missile skills are only at Lv3, i redraw the remarks made to CCP about the missile nerf.
It's indeed a missile boost
And this setup is the proof of it:
High - 6 Arbalest/tech2 Cruise Launchers, 2 HV Nosf
Med - 2 Sensor Boosters II, 4 Target Painters II
Low - 5 BCUs
With my skills i have a RoF of 7.57 sec on the Arbalest (with rapid launch lv4, cruise spec lv3)
These were the results when hiting a cargo container:
With 4 Target Painters II2005.07.19 18:10:10 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 410.5 damage.
WithOUT TP2005.07.19 18:06:57 combat Your Wrath
Cruise Missile I hits Cargo Container (Cargo
Container), doing 195.5 damage.
(both with warhead upgrades lv3)
Ofcourse you don't have any defences but the firepower on these is tremendous and you ALWAYS hit and cruise missiles now travel at 8500 m/s (with maxed skills on a raven) so you can hit a target at 85 Kms in 10 seconds.
This is sure to be even better if i had lv5 advanced missile skills and lv5 target painters skills.
wtf.. are you crazy man, your gona setup like that with no jamming and no sheilds and go toe to toe with a raven tanked/ nosing your ass or a ganka with pulse? eek.. it wont be me. these Target Painters are bull**** and **** up any good tank setups. just so missiles can work like turrets, real ****en bs.
if i have too use target painters i wont them too be low slot. making them all med slot is a **** up too my setups tanking. its just leting the snipers have a easyer time on me.
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bundy bear
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Posted - 2005.07.20 05:37:00 -
[29]
How much dmg is this realy with a moving ship and when resistances play a part?
also same as above with cruisers and frigates?
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bundy bear
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Posted - 2005.07.20 05:41:00 -
[30]
Edited by: bundy bear on 20/07/2005 05:42:07
double posted
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