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Kibachaan
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Posted - 2005.07.29 16:10:00 -
[1]
Well, there are a lot of Mercenary corporations in EVE now. Bounty hunting and pirating are popular ideals to many people who play MMOGs, it's no wonder that some very powerful corporations are mercenaries.
EVE, unfortunately lacks the ability to officially track and proove kills. There are 2 systems in place:
1 - corpses, that can only be picked up by 1 person, and it could be anybody who happens along it. Also, they only come from pod-kills.
2 - CONCORD mail, only available to people involved in the kill.
Sad but true. The mailing system is fine, for the people involved in a kill and corpses don't tell you anything about what ship was destroyed, as well as equipment, not to mention the fact that only 1 corpse comes from the kill hence only 1 player gets it. But why are killboards popping up everywhere? It's because people want to display their achievements. They want to PROOVE it. A mail from CONCORD can be forged, which makes killboards unreliable. What if a corp wants to offer mercenaries payment based on ships destroyed? Where Battleships are worth more than shuttles?
Here's hoping that this topic opens up an area. What ideas do people have to include a kill-proof system in EVE???
My ideas:
Idea number 1 -
Actual item records. When you kill somebody, in the same way that you receive the kill mail from CONCORD, you could also receive a kill log in your cargo. Occupying 0.0m3 of space (or perhaps an actual size to make it more interesting) these logs will have the "Show Info" option from right-clicking it which will bring up the description matching exactly what you would see in the CONCORD mail.
These logs cannot be edited, but they can be copied. They have a log number which could match the "item ID" that CCP uses to ID all the items in the game, or it could be more meaningful like YYMMDD-HHMMSS-CHAR where "char" is the name of the player and TTMMDD-HHMMSS is the date-time of the kill.
Copies of the logs will stack. Different ones will not. This way, keeping track of your kills and PROOVING it is a matter of a simple trade.
To simplify archiving, the copy function of a log could be via right-click and stacks could be limited to 10.
FLAW - Somebody could run a macro to create billions of logs from 1 kill and crash the system. But that's really not different to current abilities with copying bookmarks. If somebody did that, I'm sure a GM would have something to say to them.
Idea number 2 -
A new interface. Just like you have a TAB under "People and Places" for bookmarks and locations, you could have one for kills. Instead of getting a CONCORD mail, you could get one of these. They can be sorted by date or name just like bookmarks can be sorted by system and name. Other fields could include enemy name, enemy's corp name, alliance name or ship type destroyed. Then you can make folders and make your own filing system.
Hell, you could make it an entire new button on the left bar of the EVE game! Where the first TAB is the same as described above, and the second TAB is a corporation version. YES THAT'S RIGHT kills for the entire corporation. View access can be a role given just the same way the "station manager" role is given to members/groups by directors, to sa***uard corporate secrets. Then a third TAB, where you can mail your collection to a player. You can select a folder of kills, or just individual ones, and they are mailed to the player of your choice, where the receiver get's a mail from "EVE SYSTEM" or CONCORD or something official containing proof of an unedited and unforged kill report. The inbox for these could also be on the 3rd TAB to keep kill mail seperate from the normal mailbox, and the receiver needs to accept the package to prevent spamming. Finally, a 4th TAB also granted access to by derectors assigning a "role", that allows a corporation to mail their selected kill results to another corporation or player.
The possibilities are endless!!! What does everybody think???
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Kibachaan
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Posted - 2005.07.29 16:20:00 -
[2]
Additional to idea number 1:
You could make the kill logs like Blue Prints, where there are 2 types. 1 original which you get if you struck the decisive blow, and copies, which all the "involved parties" get a copy. The original can be copied in a lab-slot using data sheets or something expendable like that. Or they could actually have a production property like BPOs, where they use factory slots (more common to find) and require simple things to manufacture copies. Copying takes 1 day or so, that way it's reasonable to make a copy for corp records, for your own records, and for clients or showing off.
Finally, a killboard-minded person could collect these, or perhaps CCP could do it themselves. Where "Kill-Log" copies from idea number 1 or forwardable kill-mails from idea 2 are sent in, and an official EVE killboard is available. That way, only those who CHOOSE to send them in will have them on display and those who don't can have their privacy.
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Xaat Xuun
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Posted - 2005.07.29 16:36:00 -
[3]
http://www.eve-kills.com/
doesnt that work
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Cmdr Sy
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Posted - 2005.07.29 16:37:00 -
[4]
CCP have not wanted to introduce an in-game killboard for a while, I believe for similar reasons that these forums do not display character postcount - it would only lead to kill-whoring of the weakest players for points.
The present system of corporate killboards allows some kill comparisons among friends, without giving everyone in the game an incentive to grind out points.
PVP grind, now that's a weird image. 
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Winterblink
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Posted - 2005.07.29 16:52:00 -
[5]
This isn't a flame, but can someone please explain to me the importance of having a killboard? I mean it's cool and all that people have constructed their own, but what's the point of having one in-game? Or at all?
___winterblink/warp_drive_active/eve_nature_vraie// |
Quanteeri
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Posted - 2005.07.29 17:01:00 -
[6]
WTS: *Authentic Looking Killmails*
Be the envy of all your stat padding buddies!
Also, for 50mil ISK/month, you can have access to my online killmail generator, a value worth well over 100mil/month.
It's a good idea, if it were needed. I don't think there should be an official killboard, and I've never understood the point of having a scoring system on the killboards. Granted, none of this has kept me from building my own, of course.
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Scorpyn
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Posted - 2005.07.29 17:20:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Winterblink
This isn't a flame, but can someone please explain to me the importance of having a killboard? I mean it's cool and all that people have constructed their own, but what's the point of having one in-game? Or at all?
It makes it possible for the enemy to get some information about your tactics, locations, ships and so on.
hmm... ok maybe that wasn't good... ok I don't know...
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Kibachaan
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Posted - 2005.07.30 00:03:00 -
[8]
Well so far focus has been on the killboard part of it. There are reasons for and against killboards true, and that's a matter in itself.
But even without a public-view killboard in-game or out-of-game, there is still no way to prove you've made a kill.
[Quote="Scorpyn"]Some kind of hash function where you could enter a kill id to bring up the details of it ingame
Soudns good to me. A killmail ID so that it can be looked at in-game and not forged. At 1KB per kill mail it would take a million for it to take up 1GB of disk, and it's hardly different to storing mail data anyway.
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Guardian Alpha
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Posted - 2005.07.30 00:21:00 -
[9]
Killboards? People grinding kills for a higher kill rank? People turning into jerks and griefers to destroy RP in the name of that extra kill point?
What the hell? Is there a redirect URL mistake from eve-online to counterstrike.com?
[ / sarcasim]
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Ikvar
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Posted - 2005.07.30 00:32:00 -
[10]
This one time I ate a whole lemon
__________________
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NeoThermic
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Posted - 2005.07.30 02:06:00 -
[11]
For a mercenary corp to show their client what the're doing they need things like killboards. You may say that these can be tricked and are unreliable, but this simply gives rise to a new factor in mercenary choice - not only is your corp good at pvp, but can they be trusted?
___________________________
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Zensige
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Posted - 2005.07.30 02:50:00 -
[12]
Not having killboards is a good idea, dont want any of that kill whoring going on. However I do think that a system to better prove that the pirates, bounty hunters and mercs actually kill their targets...AND get paid as well. Its annoying to get the mission done only to come back to your client who then refuses to pay( Ofc you just pod him as well) But id rather have some money then two corpses.
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Brej Donierik
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Posted - 2005.07.30 04:01:00 -
[13]
Are you looking for something similar to CoH's badges, medals, and accomplishment accolades thing? Viewable by anyone, and you get them not just for PvP kills, but also for passing a number of milestones or completing missions.
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F'nog
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Posted - 2005.07.30 04:15:00 -
[14]
You too can be a Just and Noble Defender of the Human Race.
Originally by: Morela
"hey! I'm gonna go attack the north! Afk till tuesday!"
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.07.30 05:43:00 -
[15]
Combat in Eve shouldn't be simply about kills. Killboards promote deathmatch style gameplay.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.07.30 05:55:00 -
[16]
- Find out what settings the opponent was using
- Where do they operate
- Do they fly alone or in a blob
OR
Oh look, I die everytime I go into a malediction vs claw fight. Maybe I should change my tactics or avoid the engagement.
Theres a number of good reasons for private killboards. I'm not really in favour of a public EVE-wide one though.
Back on topic - I liked the idea of a "log" type thing that could be picked up.
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Brej Donierik
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Posted - 2005.07.30 07:32:00 -
[17]
Would you be in favor of a statistics tab displaying number of kills, types of ships killed, number of deaths, total volume of ore mined, number of swearwords typed in chat channels, and other non-specific scores like that?
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2005.07.30 07:39:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Brej Donierik
Would you be in favor of a statistics tab displaying number of kills, types of ships killed, number of deaths, total volume of ore mined, number of swearwords typed in chat channels, and other non-specific scores like that?
Nothing character specific. I.E. "X apocs have been destroyed in the past week" is okay. "X Apocs have been killed by player Y" is not okay
Kills should not be a measure of PvP effectiveness in Eve. It's like bragging about kill count in a CTF match when your team didn't cap a single flag.
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Brej Donierik
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Posted - 2005.07.30 07:53:00 -
[19]
Actually, it would be specific to the character, like if you viewed my page it would say "Has killed X Apocs," but not as specific as "Has killed Johnny's Apoc yesterday in system XB-6v3."
Yes, bragging rights, and was thinking not just kills; you gotta include carebear things like systems visited, profit made, volume of ore mined, NPC rats destroyed, etc. so that they don't feel left out.
I don't care about PvP, if you don't feel that number of kills is representative and should be bragged about, do represent your profession and suggest more things. POSes destroyed, longest sniping range achieved, hours spent in the vicinity of gates, largest fleet commanded or been a member of, quickest logoff time, I don't know.
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Oreah
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Posted - 2005.07.30 08:22:00 -
[20]
I could see how a Merc based Corp. with a station board for friends would be fun. Although I also have to agree that it would cause even more griefing. Not to mention multi-boxers exploiting this to death.
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Idio T
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Posted - 2005.07.30 08:33:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Idio T on 30/07/2005 08:39:14
Edit: above was me being Minmatarded.
Good idea in the short term for a few, but I also think it not only would promote unruly griefing, but would be exploited by all the people who duel+ box.
Frigate about it. |
Celebon
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Posted - 2005.07.30 09:02:00 -
[22]
Originally by: F'nog
You too can be a Just and Noble Defender of the Human Race.
(
heh
)
Drink StarsiÖ
Security Division
Caldari State Citizen
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Heritor
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Posted - 2005.07.30 11:52:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Ikvar
This one time I ate a whole lemon
Band CAMP perhaps 
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theRaptor
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Posted - 2005.07.30 12:43:00 -
[24]
Kills don't matter.
Kills don't matter.
They are meaningless because military objectives are rarely tied to body counts. If your objective is to prevent another corp from mining you can carry out that objective without killing anyone. And thats what merc contracts are generally based on.
If you want to kill ***** go play a online fps, its what I do. I think its retarded to pay $15 a month just to kill *****.
That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die.
-- Ancient "Dirt" Religious figure. |
Verone
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Posted - 2005.07.30 13:10:00 -
[25]
It would certainly help a Merc if there were some way other than a killmail to identify a ship kill.
Of course, you get a corpse from a podkill, why not get something similar to an npc insignia/tag for a ship kill?
i.e.
The tag is created on destruction of the ship, and show info contains the date and time of the kill, to be referenced agaist the CONCORD killmail.
So for instance if i was ship killed, the person sifting through my loot would find "Verone's Tag" or something similar. Which could be either given to the person who hired him to kill me, or sold at a DED station, for a varying price depending on my security status.
The tags could also be graded similar to that of an NPC tag, for instance, destroying a frigate class would give you "Verone's Copper Tag", killing a cruiser/battlecruiser class would give "Verone's Silver Tag", destroying a HAC would give "Verone's Gold Tag" and a battleship woud give "Verone's Platinum Tag"
(obviously shuttles would be excluded from receiving a tag on destruction to remove the exploit factor, and giving tags for the destruction of non combat vessels would probably also be pointless.)
I personally think it'd get more people into the bounty hunting scene if some form of reward scheme was implemented for killing scum like myself.
Obviously this is a rough idea of what i think would be appropriate, and CCP would have to find ways to code in possible explots to the system as they arise.
MY NAME IS VERONE OF SNIGG, AND I'M GOING TO KILL YOU TILL YOU DIE FROM IT! |
Psychopat
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Posted - 2005.07.30 13:38:00 -
[26]
1 Word FRAPS
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Demarcus
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Posted - 2005.07.30 15:03:00 -
[27]
They should just make it so that missions actually have contracts (think they were supposed to add that anyways) and have the person who made the kill get a kill mail, and the person issuing the contract would get a contract completed mail with the kill details.
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You are all worthless, and weak.
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XpoHoc
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Posted - 2005.07.30 15:15:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Guardian Alpha
Killboards? People grinding kills for a higher kill rank? People turning into jerks and griefers to destroy RP in the name of that extra kill point?
What the hell? Is there a redirect URL mistake from eve-online to counterstrike.com?
[ / sarcasim]
Posting on public killboards is mass ************.
Having a private one for statistics is essential.
If you don't trust your mercenaries, there is no point to hire them.
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Plim
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Posted - 2005.07.30 18:59:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Plim on 30/07/2005 18:59:51
Public killboards are usefull so that when someone says "haha your corps sux, you dont fight even odds!!!111six", you can link them to your killboard and tell them to be quiet, (unless its true, in which case it can show that as well lol).
But saying that some corps probably don't post loss mails, to make themselves look good.
I just like it when everything is kept track of, it settles arguments better than just screaming vacuous crap at each other in a circle forever. And making sure you have both losses and kills scored maintains your credibility, allowing you to say "If you disagree, feel free to expose any innacuracies".
Materialism 4tw.
EDIT: Actually by public, I mean a killboard which is open for everyone to see, I don't mean a publically used killboard.
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Kin Hanyerec
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Posted - 2005.07.30 19:14:00 -
[30]
proof of a loss would indeed be useful to insure the cargo and modules by player corporations
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