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Thor Darkwing
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:02:00 -
[1]
doesn't anyone else think that the skill req for t2 mods are to low? it's lvl4 on most stuff and lvl4 can be reached in no time on most skills.
give people a bigger reason to specialize and train stuff to lvl5
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:04:00 -
[2]
I agree, lets screw new people over even more in their attempt to compete.
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W0lverine
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:04:00 -
[3]
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W0lverine
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:04:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Deja Thoris
I agree, lets screw new people over even more in their attempt to compete.
yea, nerf noobs!!
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Carter83
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:08:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Thor Darkwing
doesn't anyone else think that the skill req for t2 mods are to low?
Nope
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Kerby Lane
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Posted - 2005.08.06 13:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
I agree, lets screw new people over even more in their attempt to compete.
Yes.
Gap is to narrow now and its too easy for noobs to compete.
PS. Also remove advanced learning skills from the market please.
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Balazs Simon
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Posted - 2005.08.06 15:00:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Thor Darkwing
doesn't anyone else think that the skill req for t2 mods are to low? it's lvl4 on most stuff and lvl4 can be reached in no time on most skills.
give people a bigger reason to specialize and train stuff to lvl5
you never realy fitted any TL2 thing did ya ? 
The last I checked I have to train lvl 5 skills for a lot of TL2 mods...
- New sig coming soon.. |
Xthril Ranger
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Posted - 2005.08.06 15:10:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Xthril Ranger on 06/08/2005 15:10:32
T2 stuff is there for the producer and not the user (There is named stuff just as good we could use if it wasnt for the manufacturing people providing it easier). And if the skills needed get any thougher there will not be any market.
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mavskji
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Posted - 2005.08.06 15:41:00 -
[9]
Most of them are fine, some of them are too easy to use but I'll get over it 
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Zaldiri
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Posted - 2005.08.06 16:45:00 -
[10]
Having lots of stuff with lvl 5 skill requirements is bad. It also makes the (currently completly invalid) "its to hard for noobs to catch up!" threads valid.
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Admiral of King Frieza's Super Saiyan fleet.
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Liu Kaskakka
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Posted - 2005.08.06 17:00:00 -
[11]
Yeah, I agree, all the lvl 4 skill reqs should be lvl 5. ^^
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Nafri
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Posted - 2005.08.06 17:11:00 -
[12]
tech2 EW modules have lousy reqs, there also no tech2 spec skills for EW
so basicly, give me more EW skills!
Your bla bla hit bla bla for bla bla damage. Wanna have some bubu now? |
Xelios
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Posted - 2005.08.06 17:15:00 -
[13]
There's still at least 3 tech levels above tech 2 that will require more advanced skills, we don't need to make everything uber hard to get right now. The new players are already at a huge disadvantage, lets not rub it in their faces.
Besides, some tech 2 modules take a long time to train for, especially tech 2 large turrets and ships. Then there's the increased grid and cpu on most tech 2 stuff which will force people to train support skills higher, there's a lot of hidden training you need to complete to get the most out of your tech 2 gear.
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NateX
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Posted - 2005.08.06 18:33:00 -
[14]
Afterburner t2 skill req Afterburner lvl 6 :/ or what?
NateX |
subvert
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Posted - 2005.08.06 18:35:00 -
[15]
yeh, lets screw anyone who didn't start playing at release day some more! Come on, lets really drive this game into the ground! w00t, screw the n00bs! It shoudl take them 5 years training to be able to do 1 shield damage to a veteran player!
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subvert
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Posted - 2005.08.06 18:37:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Xelios
There's still at least 3 tech levels above tech 2 that will require more advanced skills, we don't need to make everything uber hard to get right now. The new players are already at a huge disadvantage, lets not rub it in their faces.
Besides, some tech 2 modules take a long time to train for, especially tech 2 large turrets and ships. Then there's the increased grid and cpu on most tech 2 stuff which will force people to train support skills higher, there's a lot of hidden training you need to complete to get the most out of your tech 2 gear.
If they make tech 3 require tech 2 skills and more, like tech 2 did.. but longer, then they will be killing their game. A new players wouldn't able to use tech 3 for over 2 years from when they started to subscribe. The devs need to wake up to this fact and stop feeding veteran players god candy!
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Santiac
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:15:00 -
[17]
In my opinion, skill reqs on current T2 mods are fine, it's still a considerable chunk of time compared to what you get, and the T2 mods that really does give a substantial bonus over their best named T1 counterpart already require a good deal of skills to get (T2 hardeners, both types either require 1 lvl5, 1 lvl1 or 2 lvl4) :)
As for T3, they aren't going to be in anytime soon, and when they are i dont think CCP will make them improved versions of T2, and by the time they will be out i think CCP have taken into consideration nurturing their core player base, but releasing T3 items wouldn't stop them from releasing new T1 modules that makes things interresting for newcommers. In my own opinion, the fun part of EVE isn't getting the best there is, it's exploring, experimenting and trying out the next step on the ladder. The fun part for me when i was new wasn't looking at the fancy T2 cruisers, it was browsing and trying out the frigates (was very excited about getting a Tristan, after i had flown about in a Maulus) same thing when i progressed from frigate to cruiser, i wasn't worried about it wasn't a T2 ship :)
If i ever managed to get to the top of the ladder, i'd be dissapointed there wasn't more steps to take, but i'd never be sad if there was many more to take.
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<insert clever/witty comment here>
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Blind Fear
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:20:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Zaldiri
Having lots of stuff with lvl 5 skill requirements is bad. It also makes the (currently completly invalid) "its to hard for noobs to catch up!" threads valid.
Those threads are already valid and get more so by the day.
High-rank lvl 5 skill prereqs break the skill system.
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Xelios
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:25:00 -
[19]
Originally by: subvert
Originally by: Xelios
There's still at least 3 tech levels above tech 2 that will require more advanced skills, we don't need to make everything uber hard to get right now. The new players are already at a huge disadvantage, lets not rub it in their faces.
Besides, some tech 2 modules take a long time to train for, especially tech 2 large turrets and ships. Then there's the increased grid and cpu on most tech 2 stuff which will force people to train support skills higher, there's a lot of hidden training you need to complete to get the most out of your tech 2 gear.
If they make tech 3 require tech 2 skills and more, like tech 2 did.. but longer, then they will be killing their game. A new players wouldn't able to use tech 3 for over 2 years from when they started to subscribe. The devs need to wake up to this fact and stop feeding veteran players god candy!
That's not true, the majority of veterans have trained a broad set of skills. They may have 25 mil sp but it's all over the place most of the time, a newbie can specialize in one area and be caught up fairly quickly.
Besides no one is feeding the vets "god candy". Tech 2 gear is only slightly better than the best named tech 1 gear, and even a Machariel with the absolute best officer mods can be killed by a well coordinated group, like a Blackbird a couple interceptors and a couple gankageddons for instance. Team work and coordination always come out on top in this game regardless of the god candy.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:30:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Xelios
That's not true, the majority of veterans have trained a broad set of skills. They may have 25 mil sp but it's all over the place most of the time, a newbie can specialize in one area and be caught up fairly quickly.
Besides no one is feeding the vets "god candy". Tech 2 gear is only slightly better than the best named tech 1 gear, and even a Machariel with the absolute best officer mods can be killed by a well coordinated group, like a Blackbird a couple interceptors and a couple gankageddons for instance. Team work and coordination always come out on top in this game regardless of the god candy.
Named mods cost a fortune. You know this.
wtf does a blob killing a machariel have to do with skill req's for t2 mods?
Be objective. Game has evolved. Skill system is getting broken by long training times and high prerequsites for t2 equip.
Enough said.
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Dianabolic
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:45:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Originally by: Xelios
That's not true, the majority of veterans have trained a broad set of skills. They may have 25 mil sp but it's all over the place most of the time, a newbie can specialize in one area and be caught up fairly quickly.
Besides no one is feeding the vets "god candy". Tech 2 gear is only slightly better than the best named tech 1 gear, and even a Machariel with the absolute best officer mods can be killed by a well coordinated group, like a Blackbird a couple interceptors and a couple gankageddons for instance. Team work and coordination always come out on top in this game regardless of the god candy.
Named mods cost a fortune. You know this.
wtf does a blob killing a machariel have to do with skill req's for t2 mods?
Be objective. Game has evolved. Skill system is getting broken by long training times and high prerequsites for t2 equip.
Enough said.
Gotta disagree with u there, Deja. Long training times are required to prevent people from being the jack of all trades.
Hell, I've got 30m odd skillpoints and, since the last patch, I may aswell throw 20m of them down the toilet, because I no longer mine, I no longer fly anything other than a battleship or battlecruiser, I only ever fly one race, I don't run agent missions, I will be needing to train leadership related skills to 5, I don't need to refine, I don't ever build anything, I will never have this character as ceo of a corp, nor will this character every fly a covert ops ship again.
Of all my sp, only about 50% of them apply.
The skill system is fine, the req's could perhaps do with tweaking, sure, but so could most stuff - as things stand at this time it's fine. I introduced a freind to EVE who now has 6m sp, he's not been at any disadvantage and will destroy me in frigate combat.
Just as it should be.
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Xelios
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Posted - 2005.08.07 14:58:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Originally by: Xelios
That's not true, the majority of veterans have trained a broad set of skills. They may have 25 mil sp but it's all over the place most of the time, a newbie can specialize in one area and be caught up fairly quickly.
Besides no one is feeding the vets "god candy". Tech 2 gear is only slightly better than the best named tech 1 gear, and even a Machariel with the absolute best officer mods can be killed by a well coordinated group, like a Blackbird a couple interceptors and a couple gankageddons for instance. Team work and coordination always come out on top in this game regardless of the god candy.
Named mods cost a fortune. You know this.
wtf does a blob killing a machariel have to do with skill req's for t2 mods?
Be objective. Game has evolved. Skill system is getting broken by long training times and high prerequsites for t2 equip.
Enough said.
Named modules are expensive, yes, but they avoid the skill training required for tech 2, which is what this arguement is all about.
As for a "blob" (if you can call 4 or 5 ships a blob) killing a Machariel, it shows that even a group of 8 mil sp noobs can conceivably kill a 27m sp vet in one of the best battleships in the game.
The skill system itself is fine the way it is, like I said if you specialize it doesn't take long to catch up.
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Ruffio Sepico
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Posted - 2005.08.07 15:02:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Xelios
There's still at least 3 tech levels above tech 2 that will require more advanced skills, we don't need to make everything uber hard to get right now. The new players are already at a huge disadvantage, lets not rub it in their faces.
One of the problems as I see it, is that new players look at things they want to do, fly and use, but doesnt think about what they actually can do.
"OMG! Unfair he got a battleship and I just got this ickle frig, OMG! he got a gun it took several months training time to do mounted on it too *cry*cry*"
If t2 does anything at all its to make new players catch up. Does new players got any idea at all what it takes to train for like large t2 guns? And even then its specialization in auto cannons and artileries (and their counterparts in hybrid/lasers).
T2 is not a birth right in EVE, its a optional choice, if you can afford it and if you can use it. as for future techs and tech3 etc. We don't even know if it will be ships, modules or what not, it can very well be pos stuff, stations etc. "moon harvester 2 anyone?"...
EVE is about team work, last time I checked a bunch of newbs could still bring down a vet player.
Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
HiD Kills: http://eve.hidden-agenda.co.uk/kill_list.php
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Rafein
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Posted - 2005.08.07 15:08:00 -
[24]
some have too low reqs,m like CPU upgrades.
Some have way to high reqs, like gunnery
Overall, it works out
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Seth Killbain
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Posted - 2005.08.07 15:19:00 -
[25]
Its fine the way it is, the vets get to feel special, but the new players get to specialise.
And im sorry but 3 months or more to get anywhere in a game IS a long time, time is money and all that.
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Ruffio Sepico
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Posted - 2005.08.07 15:27:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Seth Killbain
Its fine the way it is, the vets get to feel special, but the new players get to specialise.
And im sorry but 3 months or more to get anywhere in a game IS a long time, time is money and all that.
EVE-Online is a demanding game. If you like it you play it, and then time doesn't matter. It's not a game where you go from level 1 to XX and max out. Tech2 gave room for specialization and diversity. Before t2 the oldest players was about end up become a blue copy of each other with the same skills trained.
Time is money? That deppens what you do with your time. If you look at the $ cost per day to play eve, compared to cost of other entertainment out there EVE comes out on top in value. If you think about time is money in-game, well, its your own choice if you idle with your time, or find something better to do with it that would benefit your character.
Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
HiD Kills: http://eve.hidden-agenda.co.uk/kill_list.php
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theRaptor
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Posted - 2005.08.07 16:07:00 -
[27]
No one would use T2 if it needed more level V skills (nearly all the good mods do anyway). Most of it isn't that good compared to T1 named to justify higher skill reqs plus the higher fitting.
Oh and CCP have left room for T3 skill wise. Im sure most T3 is going to require V in all skills needed.
That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die.
-- Ancient "Dirt" Religious figure. |
Dezzereth
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Posted - 2005.08.07 18:27:00 -
[28]
Originally by: theRaptor
Oh and CCP have left room for T3 skill wise. Im sure most T3 is going to require V in all skills needed.
Or CCP expands the max skill levels to 10 
-- TOSGI Homepage -- |
F'nog
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Posted - 2005.08.07 22:12:00 -
[29]
Apparently nobody remembers when T2 only required level II in a skill. They've upped it sufficiently in most cases, and a little too much in others, like Guns compared to Missiles. Increasing requirements any further would be very BAD.
Originally by: Morela
"hey! I'm gonna go attack the north! Afk till tuesday!"
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