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Ichtar
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Posted - 2005.08.10 09:17:00 -
[1]
Hi all!
What HAC is best for PvP and why?
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Dimitri Forgroth
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Posted - 2005.08.10 09:22:00 -
[2]
Could you possibly make your question a little more vague?
Don't be a bad loser | DPS Spreadsheet |
Kyle Caldrel
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Posted - 2005.08.10 09:23:00 -
[3]
yes- what hac?
that would be even more vague.
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Soros
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Posted - 2005.08.10 09:23:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Dimitri Forgroth
Could you possibly make your question a little more vague?
Well said.
Think about it this way, if one HAC was best, why isn't everyone flying it?
-= Soros =-
BoB
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Crying Neemen
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Posted - 2005.08.10 09:26:00 -
[5]
Deimos probally does the most DPS @ close range,
ishtar has the best drone capabilities,
Sacrelidge has the best tank,
zealot does ALOT of damage very fast, (mini gankgeddon)
vagabond is very very fast and can get under guns optimals in a flash
munin does alot of damage but doesn't tank that well
eagle is the best sniper, shield tanker, and and least versaltile in my opinion
cerberus = missile spammer
Endeth
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Aliksr
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Posted - 2005.08.10 10:12:00 -
[6]
Wait are you guys saying these ships are balanced, and the difference in pvp comes down to experience and compatibility with your playing style?
Hogwash! What kind of game do you think this is!
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Russo
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Posted - 2005.08.10 10:18:00 -
[7]
I would have to say the best HAC is the zealot. Reason being it is very flexible. Thats the key. Flexibility. Every other ship seems to have its amazing ability with some exotic.
Diemos is only close range. A few Nos on a battleship will neutralize it though....uh oh.
Cerberus...extreme range, not great on damage.
Munnin is pretty decent...
Zealot can stay outside of nos range, do amazing damage. It has average range, can be made to tank decent, or gank very well. It is a good balance. Not really long range, not really short range.
Flexibility is key I think to a good ship...
But every other HAC has its own style of fighting and its own specialization. Whatever you would enjoy most is what I would suggest flying. Just play to your strengths and avoid getting into situations where your weaknesses are exploited and you will be fine in any ship you choose.
Russo - CEO Amarria Auxilia
XL pod for an XL personality
'Russo, what exactly do you feed your ego to keep it that big?.'
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.08.10 10:30:00 -
[8]
"Wait are you guys saying these ships are balanced, and the difference in pvp comes down to experience and compatibility with your playing style?"
Nah, they're saying these ships are merely different. Being different doesn't necessarily and automagically make them balanced with one another...
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Dust Puppy
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Posted - 2005.08.10 10:37:00 -
[9]
Originally by: j0sephine
"Wait are you guys saying these ships are balanced, and the difference in pvp comes down to experience and compatibility with your playing style?"
Nah, they're saying these ships are merely different. Being different doesn't necessarily and automagically make them balanced with one another...
That is true but as long as each ship has a unique ability to perform a specific task better than the other hac's it's balanced enough for me. If we would insist that each ship could perform all tasks as well as any other tasks then I suspect that the ships would be mostly the same.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.08.10 10:52:00 -
[10]
"That is true but as long as each ship has a unique ability to perform a specific task better than the other hac's it's balanced enough for me. If we would insist that each ship could perform all tasks as well as any other tasks then I suspect that the ships would be mostly the same."
I don't want them to perform everything equally well... i just wish the specific task each of them can do were equally useful ^^
(unfortunately in game which revolves around killing stuff this doesn't leave us with that many specific tasks.. it's either about very good offense or very good defense, and pretty much anything that falls short in both of these becomes second-rate option...)
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Apoll
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:17:00 -
[11]
Ichtar all HAC are good when you have the skills and the experience to fly and fight with them.
There isn't the UBER one. And ofc if you don't have experience on flying smaller ship on PVP (elite frigs) and you pop there with HAC you just lose it. It doesn't matter if it's Zealot or Deimos or Vagabond. (unfortunately i don't like the Caldari ones, after the day an Eagle pilot tried to gang my retribution holding tank for hours, 5 times).
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ELECTR0FREAK
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:18:00 -
[12]
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 10/08/2005 11:19:53
Caldari HACs try to use range instead of power, and end up just sucking in general. All of the other HACs in general however have pretty good strengths and weaknesses.
The Deimios is raw DPS. It can put out some serious hurt at close range. Not much else to say here but, if you're under the guns of one of these, expect some punishment.
The Ishtar is a badass drone ship. This allows it to fight very defensively because it doesn't have to devote fittings to weaponry.
The Zealot is another damage beast. It is a bit more mid-range than the Deimos, having a range bonus. Very versatile.
The Sacriledge is relatively weak in terms of damage output, but can tank like nobody's business. The ultimate defensive HAC.
The Vagabond is fast, and deadly. Great in PVP situations where speed is of the essence. It still packs decent firepower in the process.
The Muninn sacrifices some speed for firepower, and can be quite a powerful ship, definately not to be underestimated. Note that both Minmatar ships can perform fairly well in short and long range setups, allowing you to fit them depending on your taste.
The Eagle is a long range sniper HAC. It also has a fairly nice tank, but since it uses range, its very susceptible to long-range turret BS fire and will not survive well. Its DPS is pitiful compared to many other HACs. Its only real strength, being able to pop Tech 1 frigs from a safe distance.
The Cerberus looks great on paper, but performs miserably in practice. Neither tanking or ganking well, its only advantage lies in its ability to fire missiles over very long ranges, and fit Assault launchers for decent anti-frigate work. Problem is, most ships warp off when they see a Cerberus open fire at long range, before the missiles even impact. Decent for NPCing and some complex work, but not a great PVP choice.
Thats my assesment of HACs. As you can probably tell, I'm a Caldari HAC pilot. Why? Several months back when I trained them, I thought they looked decent on paper, and while a bit weak, I figured CCP would give them a little love. Hasn't happened yet. Despite all the training I've put into them, they continue to perform vastly under par. (My bro just got a Zealot today. I let him attack my Raven with it... and damn, it's just not fair.  )
-Electrofreak
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
madaluap
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:35:00 -
[13]
Edited by: madaluap on 10/08/2005 11:36:18
we really need a search function on these forums...this question has been asked 20.000 times and people always end up with flying the ammar race, because they are so versatile or something.
i fly deimos btw 
/edit: just looked at electrofreak his reply: told you so, about that versatile part 
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Alex Harumichi
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:43:00 -
[14]
I fly an Ishtar and love it to bits. But it needs high skills, including high drone skills, otherwise it's useless. It's also a bit tricky to fit (tight on both cpu and grid). But there's a lot you can do with a 5/5/5 layout.
One thing, though... it's easy to forget that HACs are still glorified cruisers, not battleships, and to get overconfident. Lost 2 Ishtars so far and probably will lose more 
Drone Interfacing V ftw
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mavskji
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:47:00 -
[15]
from what ive seen lately the moomin has the shortest waiting list... this makes it the best HAC for PvP cos u can get blown up more often
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Skylar Keenan
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Posted - 2005.08.10 11:58:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Apoll
(unfortunately i don't like the Caldari ones, after the day an Eagle pilot tried to gang my retribution holding tank for hours, 5 times).
Admitted - The damage output of the Caldari HACs is absolutely horrible, but the Eagle is capable of the second best sustainable tank in the game.
That thing can tank a gank-zealot and laugh at it (believe me, we tested it). We're still trying to figure out a way to bring the opponent to his knees, but one thing is sure - you won't kill him solo (or with a squadron of small ships for that matter)
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Nyxus
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Posted - 2005.08.10 13:35:00 -
[17]
Well I don't fly them, so I can't say whats "best". But I can tell you which one I fear the most when I see them.
Zealots and Deimos are frightning becuase of thier damage output, and you should be very wary of them. Worry about Ishtars because of the complete unpredictability (5/5/5). Caldari you can ignore unless you are in a frigate.
The one that scares the bejesus outta me is the frecking Vagabond. It gets up in your grill at interceptor speeds while you yell something like "OMFGWTHOUTTAMYFACEARRRGHGHGHGH" and proceeds to tear your face off like a rabid wolverine hopped up on smack. It takes about a full 15 seconds to tear through BS level armor, while you sit and scream like a little girl since you can't hit it up close and it's normally carrying a couple of scrams which mean -4 scrambling strength to boot.
It's a hideous machine of teeth-gnashing, bloody-frothed, super-speed death. Webs don't help becuase even webbed they move at normal speed, assuming that you can web it before it starts humping your tailpipe.
So yeah. All are dangerous. But nothing induces bowel loosening fear like a well piloted Vagabond. 
Nyxus
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Trevedian
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Posted - 2005.08.10 13:44:00 -
[18]
Personally I like the Deimos the best, but a Zealot is a close second imo and is much more versatile.
Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
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Asharaak
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Posted - 2005.08.10 13:47:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Skylar Keenan
the Eagle is capable of the second best sustainable tank in the game.
Apologies for the slight threadjack, but could someone explain how this is possible...? 
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W0lverine
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Posted - 2005.08.10 13:53:00 -
[20]
with your name I would go for ishtar
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Alex Harumichi
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Posted - 2005.08.10 13:56:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Nyxus
So yeah. All are dangerous. But nothing induces bowel loosening fear like a well piloted Vagabond.
Nyxus
Yeah, I'm really tempted to train up Minmatar Cruiser V just to fly a Vagabond. They are also one of the HACs I fear most in my Ishtar, since they can engage so fast and it takes me some time to dump out drones, and also because they can do expl damage which Gallente ships are weak against. Nice boats.. but of course, once you do manage to hit them they are pretty fragile.
HACs are pretty balanced, I think, though the Caldari ones might need a small bit of love(?).
Oh, and thanks for the great Vaga description, make me laugh out loud
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Ichtar
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Posted - 2005.08.10 14:07:00 -
[22]
Hi all again!
And thx for all!
I think i go for Minmatar for i have high missiles skills and small Proj spec on both autocanons and Art.
Now i need to find same that have Minmatar HAc for good price 
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Rafein
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Posted - 2005.08.10 15:30:00 -
[23]
whichever one uses the weapon skill you already dumped the most points into
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Apoll
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Posted - 2005.08.10 15:46:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Nyxus
So yeah. All are dangerous. But nothing induces bowel loosening fear like a well piloted Vagabond.
Nyxus
Mate I feel the need to apply and join your corp :)
The funniest post up to now.
But indeed Vagab is a deadly ship at the hands of experienced pilots. Especialy the 220mm AC, are hot knives cutting butter.
Already thinking to get one (my options are between Vagabond and Zealot). Atm i'm trying to get T2 weapons on my mini vagab and try it. :)
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LUKEC
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Posted - 2005.08.10 16:15:00 -
[25]
it is obvious:
vaga > zealot > deimos...
ishtar is nice thing, but different. Also sacrilege is in this category.
Munin, cerberus and eagle are long range, but somehow that is still area where BSs are better.
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Kaylana Syi
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Posted - 2005.08.10 16:34:00 -
[26]
Originally by: LUKEC
Munin, cerberus and eagle are long range, but somehow that is still area where BSs are better.
I FULLY armor tank my munnin w. 1600 plates AND use dual 180mm IIs... not to be f@cked with if your a laser lubber! I doubt a zealot could kill me before I decimated it first.
jide's oBject eXplorer
The Nest
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LUKEC
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Posted - 2005.08.10 16:47:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Kaylana Syi
Originally by: LUKEC
Munin, cerberus and eagle are long range, but somehow that is still area where BSs are better.
I FULLY armor tank my munnin w. 1600 plates AND use dual 180mm IIs... not to be f@cked with if your a laser lubber! I doubt a zealot could kill me before I decimated it first.
That's what i'd personaly use there... somehow i have problems with flying long range anything. Approach reflex 4tl:)
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Isonkon Serikain
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Posted - 2005.08.10 16:52:00 -
[28]
I'll reply it this way: train gallente.
You'll get a choice of Ishtar and deimos. Both can kick tons of ass...
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Gariuys
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Posted - 2005.08.10 17:02:00 -
[29]
The one that has a fighting style you are most comfortable with, and you are most skilled with. And for which you have the skillpoints to make it work. Too many people in elite ships that don't even have the basic upgrade skills to level 5.
~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~
A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX
The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool |
Cinnander
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Posted - 2005.08.10 17:11:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Nyxus
The one that scares the bejesus outta me is the frecking Vagabond. It gets up in your grill at interceptor speeds while you yell something like "OMFGWTHOUTTAMYFACEARRRGHGHGHGH" and proceeds to tear your face off like a rabid wolverine hopped up on smack. It takes about a full 15 seconds to tear through BS level armor, while you sit and scream like a little girl since you can't hit it up close and it's normally carrying a couple of scrams which mean -4 scrambling strength to boot.
It's a hideous machine of teeth-gnashing, bloody-frothed, super-speed death. Webs don't help becuase even webbed they move at normal speed, assuming that you can web it before it starts humping your tailpipe.
Agreed (nicely put too), this thing scares the crap out of me.
OMGWTFVAGABAHI'MDEAD. |
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