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Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.15 02:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
Huh. Away from the game for a couple of years, and I come back to find that my Drake's been nerfed. Down to 6 launchers now. When did that happen? |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
1060
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Posted - 2013.03.15 02:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
A month ago. Damage bonus got doubled too. |
Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.15 02:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
Ah, well that's not so bad then. What was the reason for the change? |
Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.15 03:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
Actually, that's not a nerf, it's a buff. Overall DPS up by about 10%. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
1060
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Posted - 2013.03.15 03:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Want the long story? CCP has decided to rationalize ship progression while also shunting ships out of tiers and into niches. The original idea is described in a dev blog from January 2012. After working through frigates, destroyers, and cruisers (and changing missile stats rather significantly; if you plan to fly your Drake you should give that a look), they announced that BCs were next.
The BC change thread pretty much lays out the sweeping concept behind the changes and then devolves into people yelling at other people about whether the Harbinger is **** or utter ****. It's a great read. Another dev blog explains the final changes.
And while we're on the topic of BCs, you really should know that the skill is being split into racial variants sometime around May. If you want to get all 4 to 5 when it happens, start training BC to 5 and all racial cruisers to 3.
tl;dr: they're doing a big ship rebalance. They just got done with BCs. |
Storm Novah
SASN Mining Corp.
3
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Posted - 2013.03.15 17:02:00 -
[6] - Quote
You may also wanna know that they are doing the same thing to destroyers as with the BCs. They are splitting it the same way and to get all races you should train Destroyers to 5 and have all racial cruisers to 3. |
hellcane
Never Back Down
2
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Posted - 2013.03.15 17:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
What makes you think that DPS is down? |
Fireflyb1
Walden 2.0
37
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Posted - 2013.03.15 18:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
hellcane wrote:What makes you think that DPS is down?
No one in this thread said that DPS was down... |
Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.15 21:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
Fireflyb1 wrote:hellcane wrote:What makes you think that DPS is down? No one in this thread said that DPS was down...
I thought for a second that DPS had gone down because the ship had one fewer launcher. Then it was pointed out that the loss of a launcher came with an increase in per launcher damage, which results in a net gain of DPS. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
422
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Posted - 2013.03.15 21:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jon Rackham wrote:I thought for a second that DPS had gone down because the ship had one fewer launcher. Then it was pointed out that the loss of a launcher came with an increase in per launcher damage, which results in a net gain of DPS. Unless you try to use non-kinetic missiles, that's it. Although it seems to be one of the main thing about this change... |
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Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.15 22:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Slightly annoyed that I'm going to need Information Warfare V and Skirmish Warfare V to fly a Command Ship after the Summer, but pretty happy that I probably won't need Caldari Battleship V anymore. Kind of wish I could get it to turn back to white from yellow, but oh well. |
Tikktokk Tokkzikk
Parallax Shift The Periphery
140
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Posted - 2013.03.15 23:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jon Rackham wrote:Slightly annoyed that I'm going to need Information Warfare V and Skirmish Warfare V to fly a Command Ship after the Summer, but pretty happy that I probably won't need Caldari Battleship V anymore. Kind of wish I could get it to turn back to white from yellow, but oh well.
No. You need info/skirm warfare V to INJECT the command ships SKILLBOOK, not fly command ships. So if you can fly command ships now, you'll be able to after the patch. |
Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.03.16 00:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tikktokk Tokkzikk wrote:Jon Rackham wrote:Slightly annoyed that I'm going to need Information Warfare V and Skirmish Warfare V to fly a Command Ship after the Summer, but pretty happy that I probably won't need Caldari Battleship V anymore. Kind of wish I could get it to turn back to white from yellow, but oh well. No. You need info/skirm warfare V to INJECT the command ships SKILLBOOK, not fly command ships. So if you can fly command ships now, you'll be able to after the patch.
... Hm, that's a bit of an unusual situation. Less upset now, but more amused. |
Apollo Cochrane
Eve Archaeological Society
17
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Posted - 2013.04.01 13:32:00 -
[14] - Quote
All this is fine... I just wish they would update the ship model along with the stats. One empty missile slot looked bad enough, Looks bloody stupid with TWO! They always do half a job. |
Marc Callan
NullOcular Order THORN Alliance
136
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Posted - 2013.04.01 15:15:00 -
[15] - Quote
For the Drake, I think the way the numbers worked out with kinetic missiles was that it was a nerf at BC level III and below, a push at BC level IV, and a buff at BC level V.
And yeah, at some point the models do need some work. They had to do funky things to the Naglfar because there was no place to put a third turret, the Myrmidon shares the Drake's issue of having more turret slots on its model than it has high slots, and the Moa (along with the Eagle, the Onyx, and the Gila) is still uglier than sin..
Oh, and if you can inject the Command Ships skillbook now, do it. Get that plus Battlecruisers V and you'll be a very happy camper when Odyssey drops. "Nevertheless a prince ought to inspire fear in such a way that, if he does not win love, he avoids hatred..." - Niccolo Machiavelli-á |
Baggo Hammers
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2013.04.01 15:38:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jon Rackham wrote:Slightly annoyed that I'm going to need Information Warfare V and Skirmish Warfare V to fly a Command Ship after the Summer, but pretty happy that I probably won't need Caldari Battleship V anymore. Kind of wish I could get it to turn back to white from yellow, but oh well.
When did you need BS 5? |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Tribal Band
433
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Posted - 2013.04.01 18:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
One additional thing to note: (especially for you pilots who like flying with gang links): the tech 1 battlecruisers can more easily be fit with a single gang link than before, and even still be quite viable for use in combat. For now, that means you can have gang links in small roams. But eventually links will probably have to be on the field to function -- or at least outside of a POS shield. There was a devblog mentioning that too, but I can't remember where it is and don't want to go digging for it.
Here's something you might be interested in, though. It's a devblog which goes over all the changes to skill requirements for ships. If you can fly it now, you will be able to later. But if you're close to being able to fly it now and haven't injected the book, you might wanna browse and see what changes will be made, to decide if you wanna make a push and get it before Odyssey, or wait till afterwards. Either way, you can potentially save yourself a ton of trouble. http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/74234 Mittani, where have you gone to? I miss you :( |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
58
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Posted - 2013.04.01 19:07:00 -
[18] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:One additional thing to note: (especially for you pilots who like flying with gang links): the tech 1 battlecruisers can more easily be fit with a single gang link than before, and even still be quite viable for use in combat. For now, that means you can have gang links in small roams. But eventually links will probably have to be on the field to function -- or at least outside of a POS shield. There was a devblog mentioning that too, but I can't remember where it is and don't want to go digging for it. Here's something you might be interested in, though. It's a devblog which goes over all the changes to skill requirements for ships. If you can fly it now, you will be able to later. But if you're close to being able to fly it now and haven't injected the book, you might wanna browse and see what changes will be made, to decide if you wanna make a push and get it before Odyssey, or wait till afterwards. Either way, you can potentially save yourself a ton of trouble. http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/74234
I love that's become the mantra of the forums with people posting it time and time again, but this is in the dev blog:
Quote:Navy Battleships:
Increasing requirement to fly Navy Battleships previously known as Tier 1 (Armageddon Navy Issue, Scorpion Navy Issue, Dominix Navy Issue, Typhoon Fleet Issue) from level1 to level2 to make it consistent with other navy ships. Since the training from level1 to level2 only takes a few hours, we will not adjust your Racial Battleship level. Please make sure you train it before the change if you still wish to be able to fly Navy Battleships
So I know it's a minor thing at best, but that mantra needs an footnote. :p
But it does make me wonder why the change for consistency when it defeats your mantra of "if you can fly it now you can fly it after." Especially when they state that the training time difference is only a few hours at most anyway.
/shallow thoughts with Ersahi Kir |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Tribal Band
433
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Posted - 2013.04.02 05:21:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ersahi Kir wrote:But it does make me wonder why the change for consistency when it defeats your mantra of "if you can fly it now you can fly it after." Especially when they state that the training time difference is only a few hours at most anyway.
/shallow thoughts with Ersahi Kir Simple. They have no interest in coddling us and holding our hand while we play EVE. But coming back to EVE on an already-trained character and finding out you can't fly your stuff anymore unless you spend several weeks in re-training is absolutely crippling. A few hours is negligible. Mittani, where have you gone to? I miss you :( |
Inkarr Hashur
Sine Nobilitatis
300
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Posted - 2013.04.02 05:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Who would fly a navy battleship with such a low ship skill anyway? It boggles the mind. Such a thing is almost not even worth mentioning. |
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Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
306
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Posted - 2013.04.02 06:26:00 -
[21] - Quote
everything is worth mentioning.
one of the big problems eve faces is the lack of documentation internal and external of how things work, are supposed to work and do actually work.
this also happens to be true of most things and is not a problem exclusive to CCP. they just have it slightly worse. Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.
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Inkarr Hashur
Sine Nobilitatis
300
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Posted - 2013.04.02 06:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
Kusum Fawn wrote:everything is worth mentioning.
one of the big problems eve faces is the lack of documentation internal and external of how things work, are supposed to work and do actually work.
this also happens to be true of most things and is not a problem exclusive to CCP. they just have it slightly worse.
The issue got sufficient documentation. In the dev blog. It came up here because a player neglected to mention an exception to a rule. Not CCP, a player. |
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
1271
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Posted - 2013.04.02 11:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
Apollo Cochrane wrote:All this is fine... I just wish they would update the ship model along with the stats. One empty missile slot looked bad enough, Looks bloody stupid with TWO! They always do half a job.
It's not the only one. They didn't update any models for several ship changes now, and it really shows in a bad way. You should see the mess that is the Arbitrator now, or even the Myrmidon.
I'm sure they'll fix it SoonGäó
CCP: "Working as intended." Live Events are neither. |
Jon Rackham
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2013.04.07 03:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
Baggo Hammers wrote:Jon Rackham wrote:Slightly annoyed that I'm going to need Information Warfare V and Skirmish Warfare V to fly a Command Ship after the Summer, but pretty happy that I probably won't need Caldari Battleship V anymore. Kind of wish I could get it to turn back to white from yellow, but oh well. When did you need BS 5?
You used to need Battleship V to train Dreadnoughts or Carriers in faction. When the new expansion drops you will only need a IV; that'll save me three weeks before I can get into a Phoenix.
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Umega
Solis Mensa
149
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Posted - 2013.04.07 06:29:00 -
[25] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:Apollo Cochrane wrote:All this is fine... I just wish they would update the ship model along with the stats. One empty missile slot looked bad enough, Looks bloody stupid with TWO! They always do half a job. It's not the only one. They didn't update any models for several ship changes now, and it really shows in a bad way. You should see the mess that is the Arbitrator now, or even the Myrmidon. I'm sure they'll fix it SoonGäó CCP: " Working as intended."
It is worth pointing out...
That if CCP charged 20 USD (or a plex) per expansion, per account.. they'd have, roughly 15ish mil USD a year to hire more people to give us a more polished and finished product.
But they are infact, free expansions.
Personally.. I try not to ***** too much concerning free products handed to me. I don't know.. maybe I'm just weird like that. I wouldn't mind if they went the other route either, and charged us so they had more funds to do more.
It is also worth pointing out.. that hardpoints can still be used on ships (not all now, I know) if you place the turret/launcher in 'utlity slots'. Incase some people unaware that have read this.. try it out. It's kinda cool how you can makes yours a lil different looking than someone elses setup.
-áUme-Pro Studios |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
213
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Posted - 2013.04.07 10:12:00 -
[26] - Quote
Umega wrote:Katran Luftschreck wrote:Apollo Cochrane wrote:All this is fine... I just wish they would update the ship model along with the stats. One empty missile slot looked bad enough, Looks bloody stupid with TWO! They always do half a job. It's not the only one. They didn't update any models for several ship changes now, and it really shows in a bad way. You should see the mess that is the Arbitrator now, or even the Myrmidon. I'm sure they'll fix it SoonGäó CCP: " Working as intended." It is worth pointing out... That if CCP charged 20 USD (or a plex) per expansion, per account.. they'd have, roughly 15ish mil USD a year to hire more people to give us a more polished and finished product. But they are infact, free expansions. Personally.. I try not to ***** too much concerning free products handed to me. I don't know.. maybe I'm just weird like that. I wouldn't mind if they went the other route either, and charged us so they had more funds to do more. It is also worth pointing out.. that hardpoints can still be used on ships (not all now, I know) if you place the turret/launcher in 'utlity slots'. Incase some people unaware that have read this.. try it out. It's kinda cool how you can makes yours a lil different looking than someone elses setup.
You are meaning keeping the 'empty' or 'utility' slot in the middle or at the start, rather than lining them all up from the first slot right? Nice catch. I hadn't tried that trick yet. |
Ayame Tao
72
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Posted - 2013.04.08 09:21:00 -
[27] - Quote
Storm Novah wrote:You may also wanna know that they are doing the same thing to destroyers as with the BCs. They are splitting it the same way and to get all races you should train Destroyers to 5 and have all racial cruisers frigates to 3 4
fixed... you don't need the cruisers to get the new racial destroyers.
Most are going for the full set (racial frigate 4, racial cruiser 3, destroyers 5 and battlecruisers 5)
Plus it's worth injecting Command Ships and Racial Freighter before the change too if you are near to meeting the current requirements to learn the skill. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Tribal Band
437
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 03:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Ayame Tao wrote:fixed... you don't need the cruisers to get the new racial destroyers.
Most are going for the full set (racial frigate 4, racial cruiser 3, destroyers 5 and battlecruisers 5)
Plus it's worth injecting Command Ships and Racial Freighter before the change too if you are near to meeting the current requirements to learn the skill. Actually the requirements will be 3 all the way up. Amarr Frigate 3 >Amarr Destroyer 3 > Amarr Cruiser 3 > Amarr Battlecruiser 3 > Amarr Battleship 3 > Amarr Carrier and Dreadnought Mittani, where have you gone to? I miss you :( |
George Boothe
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2013.04.10 12:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
Injecting the skill will not do you any favor.
You cannot add skills to the training queue that you do not have the prerequistites for.
THEREFORE: If you get (i.e. for dreads) racial BS V and inject the dreadnaught skill, even if you skill it to III, you will not be able to get this skill any higher if you do not have the new requirements.
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Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Tribal Band
439
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Posted - 2013.04.13 18:19:00 -
[30] - Quote
George Boothe wrote:Injecting the skill will not do you any favor.
You cannot add skills to the training queue that you do not have the prerequistites for. Actually you can train any skill that you have injected, but you cannot inject a skill that you do not meet the prerequisites for. Used to be you couldn't train them either, but CCP changed that, perhaps due to the coming skill requirement changes (and some already past). So if you meet the requirements now and won't after Odyssey, then inject it now and you can train it later. In fact, train it to 1 just in case it needs to be a trained skill--I haven't tested otherwise. Mittani, where have you gone to? I miss you :( |
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