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Sitarta Radeih
Primera Milonga
0
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Posted - 2013.03.21 12:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
I just asked my self what are the effects of a Titan impacting on to a planet.
Well if the Titan crashs on the planet as some dust battles indicate, Caldari prime will face a extinction level event. A leviathan class Titan is around the same size as the meteor that hit earth 65 mio. years ago that formed the chixculub crater in Mexico and removing the dinosaurs. The crater has a size of 160 km reaching 10 km in to the ground. Of corse this meteor was not made of super robust alloys, covered in armor plates, had no shields an was not filled with, reactors, warpcores, jumpdrives, jump fuel and plenty of amo to destroy half a solar system.
The shockwave of a meteor impact will travel around the planet with supersonic speed leveling al the buildings in its path, creating serval earthquakes of high magnitude, eruptions of vulcanos and super tsunamis on the oceans. The heat of the shockwave would ignite serval large scale fires around the globe, burning most of the plants and city's. the melted material of the impact would be thrown in to low orbit leading to serval high energy infrared radiation burst up on reentering the atmosphere, killing plankton insects bacteria and creating acid rain across the globe. It would change the composition of the atmosphere by reducing the oxygen level and adding carbon dioxide and other gases. For the next 10 years or more, the atmosphere is so saturated with particles that only 10-20% of the sunlight will reach the ground. Leading to an ice age/ nuclear wither, or in case of Caldari prime reverting the planet to pre terraforming conditions.
In case of a Titan instead of a meteor, you can ad a mix of toxic and radioactive materials being spread al over the surface. With in an hour most of the population and animals would be dead, some will survive if they are lucky and in fortified underground facilities or in submarines diving. Lets hope that if the titan goes down, it has a very brave captain with honor and love for nature (yea i know Caldari and honor, two things not going along very well ) and some propulsion left to preform a crash landing instead of full impact. So it destroys only some citys instead of the whole surface.
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Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
1147
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 12:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Not only size matters, velocity, too. I think your average titan doesn't go 10-70 km/s. So while it will still be disastrous, it's not going to be a world ender. Mining Overhaul Nothing changed since 2008. |

Sitarta Radeih
Primera Milonga
0
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Posted - 2013.03.21 12:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Not 100% sure, i think the meteor that hit earth was estimated around 22 km/s |

Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
93
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 15:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
This is also assuming of course that EVE is not set in the future and that in the EVE Universe they don't have ways to contain and quickly (compared to modern Earth) rebuild after such an event. |

Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
1714
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 15:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Actually the ISS is orbiting at 7 km/sec. And the Titan is not in orbit now, it is always over the same part of the planet.
But Eve ships have some odd gravity drive thing going on. It lets them "hover" near gravitating bodies, and limits their top speed relative to the nearest large body. Its not clear how fast it would hit the planet. If it started to crash into the planet the captain may try and save it, use the engines as much as possible, resulting in a very slow crash.
Its also not clear that even if it did crash if the Caldari would not just replace it. That way CCP gets their "crashed Titan map" for Dust, yet we still get to decide the outcome of the event. We could have several Titan crashes, but in the end the planet stays in Caldari hands with a new Titan still above it. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |

Tavin Aikisen
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
154
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 21:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Actually the ISS is orbiting at 7 km/sec. And the Titan is not in orbit now, it is always over the same part of the planet.
That's a technical limitation of the games engine. The news articles have clearly stated that the titan is orbiting Caldari Prime. This is the same as customs offices which appear to hover over the planet, yet in planet view mode you can clearly see the wire-frame representation of the CO orbiting the planet.
So for all intents and purposes the titan and it's escorts are orbiting Caldari Prime from a low orbit. Remember this. Trust your eyes, you will kill each other. Trust your veins, you can all go home. -Cold Wind |

Grigori Annunaki
2
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Posted - 2013.03.21 22:10:00 -
[7] - Quote
Fortunately for us, Purdue University has an impact calculator that can give us a decent idea of what might happen. First, though, we need some numbers.
A Leviathan has a mass of 2,430,000,000 kg and a volume of 132,500,000 m3, which gives us an overall density of 18.34 kg/m3. Most of the titan is empty space, though its armor would resist a lot of the heat from reentry, so let's bump that to 20 kg/m3. It has a rough "diameter" of 3 km according to the model. Assuming it's propelled into the planet and doesn't just fall out of space, it could have a rough impact velocity of 25 km/s.
According to the site, this has the following effects:
A crater depth of 631 m and diameter of 2.97 km. Magnitude 7.2 earthquake at the point of impact. At 20 km from impact, 627 m/s wind velocity, major structural damage to buildings, and a catastrophic thermal blast. At 40 km from impact, 245 m/s wind velocity, considerable structural damage, and a catastrophic thermal blast. At 80 km from impact, 82.2 m/s wind velocity, slight structural damage, and enough thermal damage to severely burn people and set things on fire.
In short, utter devastation and incineration out to 40 km, with severe wind and thermal damage out past 80 km. It wouldn't be an extinction-level event, but it would obliterate the area it crashed into. By way of comparison, if it crashed in Trenton, NJ, the impact would destroy New York City, Philadelphia, and everything in between. |

Rekkr Thorgard
Strategic Tactics And Recon Academy Strategic Tactics And Recon Corporate Alliance
2
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Posted - 2013.03.21 22:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
Nice info, puts thing in perspective.
Also keep in mind that the impact wouldn't be the only harmful effect. I'm sure there is plenty of stuff in the engines, fuel tanks, etc. of a titan that might be released in a crash that be nasty if dispersed into the atmosphere. |

Ark Destroyer
Neutral Talent
282
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 23:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Sitarta Radeih wrote:I just asked my self what are the effects of a Titan impacting on to a planet. Well if the Titan crashs on the planet as some dust battles indicate, Caldari prime will face a extinction level event. A leviathan class Titan is around the same size as the meteor that hit earth 65 mio. years ago that formed the chixculub crater in Mexico and removing the dinosaurs. The crater has a size of 160 km reaching 10 km in to the ground. Of corse this meteor was not made of super robust alloys, covered in armor plates, had no shields an was not filled with, reactors, warpcores, jumpdrives, jump fuel and plenty of amo to destroy half a solar system. The shockwave of a meteor impact will travel around the planet with supersonic speed leveling al the buildings in its path, creating serval earthquakes of high magnitude, eruptions of vulcanos and super tsunamis on the oceans. The heat of the shockwave would ignite serval large scale fires around the globe, burning most of the plants and city's. the melted material of the impact would be thrown in to low orbit leading to serval high energy infrared radiation burst up on reentering the atmosphere, killing plankton insects bacteria and creating acid rain across the globe. It would change the composition of the atmosphere by reducing the oxygen level and adding carbon dioxide and other gases. For the next 10 years or more, the atmosphere is so saturated with particles that only 10-20% of the sunlight will reach the ground. Leading to an ice age/ nuclear wither, or in case of Caldari prime reverting the planet to pre terraforming conditions. In case of a Titan instead of a meteor, you can ad a mix of toxic and radioactive materials being spread al over the surface. With in an hour most of the population and animals would be dead, some will survive if they are lucky and in fortified underground facilities or in submarines diving. Lets hope that if the titan goes down, it has a very brave captain with honor and love for nature (yea i know Caldari and honor, two things not going along very well  ) and some propulsion left to preform a crash landing instead of full impact. So it destroys only some citys instead of the whole surface.
^ this. Very well done. Neutral Talent CEO Specializing in "complete" super-capital packages
Complete supercapital packages |

Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
15
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 23:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
Sitarta Radeih wrote:I just asked my self what are the effects of a Titan impacting on to a planet. Well if the Titan crashs on the planet as some dust battles indicate, Caldari prime will face a extinction level event. A leviathan class Titan is around the same size as the meteor that hit earth 65 mio. years ago that formed the chixculub crater in Mexico and removing the dinosaurs. The crater has a size of 160 km reaching 10 km in to the ground. Of corse this meteor was not made of super robust alloys, covered in armor plates, had no shields an was not filled with, reactors, warpcores, jumpdrives, jump fuel and plenty of amo to destroy half a solar system. The shockwave of a meteor impact will travel around the planet with supersonic speed leveling al the buildings in its path, creating serval earthquakes of high magnitude, eruptions of vulcanos and super tsunamis on the oceans. The heat of the shockwave would ignite serval large scale fires around the globe, burning most of the plants and city's. the melted material of the impact would be thrown in to low orbit leading to serval high energy infrared radiation burst up on reentering the atmosphere, killing plankton insects bacteria and creating acid rain across the globe. It would change the composition of the atmosphere by reducing the oxygen level and adding carbon dioxide and other gases. For the next 10 years or more, the atmosphere is so saturated with particles that only 10-20% of the sunlight will reach the ground. Leading to an ice age/ nuclear wither, or in case of Caldari prime reverting the planet to pre terraforming conditions. In case of a Titan instead of a meteor, you can ad a mix of toxic and radioactive materials being spread al over the surface. With in an hour most of the population and animals would be dead, some will survive if they are lucky and in fortified underground facilities or in submarines diving. Lets hope that if the titan goes down, it has a very brave captain with honor and love for nature (yea i know Gallente and honor, two things not going along very well  ) and some propulsion left to preform a crash landing instead of full impact. So it destroys only some citys instead of the whole surface.
fixed it for you  CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens Viro Mors Non Est
154
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Posted - 2013.03.22 00:40:00 -
[11] - Quote
The initial effects of the crash alone would certainly destroy tens of kilometers of cities and kill the people living there. Even if it isn't moving at high speeds, there is still a lot of mass. Beyond that, the dust and debris kicked up would have far reaching effects on an already marginal climate.
Also, if I remember correctly, warp drives can explode rather violently. I seem to remember something about an interceptor reactor overloading that caused huge problems during the retaking of Caldari Prime; now scale that up a hundred times. |

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord Celestial Imperative
99
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Posted - 2013.03.22 01:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
Depends on the reactor.
Gallente reactors are, in effect, a contained nuclear explosion waiting to happen. amarr ones use contained and channeled plasma flows...
there's a tech page somewhere regarding it. can't remember where. |

Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
15
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 01:29:00 -
[13] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:The initial effects of the crash alone would certainly destroy tens of kilometers of cities and kill the people living there. Even if it isn't moving at high speeds, there is still a lot of mass. Beyond that, the dust and debris kicked up would have far reaching effects on an already marginal climate.
Also, if I remember correctly, warp drives can explode rather violently. I seem to remember something about an interceptor reactor overloading that caused huge problems during the retaking of Caldari Prime; now scale that up a hundred THOUSAND times.
fixed it  CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Raiz Nhell
Kangaroo Ate my baby Orchestrated Alliance
247
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Posted - 2013.03.22 03:50:00 -
[14] - Quote
There is a massive difference between a 17km ball of ferrous rock traveling at 22km/s and an actively piloted Titan...
Rocks are solid and are steered by Newton. Bad news if you are a sauropod.
Titans are mostly atmosphere and open space for the crew, admittedly they have dangerous stuff on board (reactors, magazines) but that is minimal compared to the overall size.
I am assuming the Titan enters the atmosphere damaged but still in one piece the crew would be trying to shallow up the angle of entry, or to skip/bounce off the atmosphere back into open space. They don't want to die. Skipping would mean a busted Titan heading off into deep space, shallowing up entry would mean a badly overheated Titan breaking up high in the atmosphere.
And the fact that there is wreckage that is recognizable means a shielded, piloted re-entry, followed by a badly executed landing attempt.
If you happen to be on Caldari Prime for the impact it will ruin your day... But not quite as much are a similar sized solid rock.
There is no such thing as a fair fight...
If your fighting fair you have automatically put yourself at a disadvantage. |

Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens Viro Mors Non Est
155
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 04:16:00 -
[15] - Quote
It's not going to be a world ending event like an asteroid that size, but it will cause a lot of fuckupage destroying tens of kilometers of city and infrastructure and killing tens of thousands to millions of people depending on how populated an area it lands on and it will have a long term environmental impact.
You DO NOT want a capital ship hitting a populated planet ever. |

Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
15
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 04:29:00 -
[16] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:It's not going to be a world ending event like an asteroid that size, but it will cause a lot of fuckupage destroying tens of kilometers of city and infrastructure and killing tens of thousands to millions of people depending on how populated an area it lands on and it will have a long term environmental impact.
You DO NOT want a capital ship hitting a populated planet ever.
titan jump drive+warp core=worse then meteor CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Pham Tzu
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.03.22 07:21:00 -
[17] - Quote
It'll probably be on a scale comparable to Yakiya Tovil-Toba crashing his carrier into Gallente Prime early in the first war, with the difference being that the crew might be trying to mitigate the disaster as much as they can while they auger in.
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Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
15
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 07:35:00 -
[18] - Quote
Pham Tzu wrote:It'll probably be on a scale comparable to Yakiya Tovil-Toba crashing his carrier into Gallente Prime early in the first war, with the difference being that the crew might be trying to mitigate the disaster as much as they can while they auger in.
a titan is a f.uck-ton more massive then a measly carrier (and yes, that's a real weight) CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Jess Tanner
Hard Knocks Inc.
20
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 07:51:00 -
[19] - Quote
but what if i use my wizard hat to cast a spell of protection over the planet?
its a freaking video game people.... |

Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
15
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 07:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Jess Tanner wrote:pls delete this post, thought about who i was talking to, decided to just let it go...
you're new to eve, aren't you  CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
174
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 08:13:00 -
[21] - Quote
Calathorn Virpio wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:It's not going to be a world ending event like an asteroid that size, but it will cause a lot of fuckupage destroying tens of kilometers of city and infrastructure and killing tens of thousands to millions of people depending on how populated an area it lands on and it will have a long term environmental impact.
You DO NOT want a capital ship hitting a populated planet ever. titan jump drive+warp core=worse then meteor
If the warp core is active still, the Titan will not crash into the planet at any speed, because the warp cores 'drag' effect will slow it relative to the planets surface very rapidly. This becomes doubly true if it was in a low orbit bombarding the planet as it's speed is significantly lower at that point anyway. I would refer to the Pikes landing Carrier crash as a reference for a crash landing showing that a crash landing capital does land at normal speeds rather than super speeds. Now 'if' the warp core blows, then it would be a significant nuclear event, but only a singular one, nowhere near the scale needed for a nuclear winter most likely (We don't have numbers but it takes way into the gigatons to do this, the largest nuke ever tested was only 50 MT, (Downpowered from 100 MT), & the largest US nuke is only about 8-10 MT. The whole Nuclear winter scenario is constructed around hundreds of them going off over several hours around the entire globe. However, since Titans normally leave semi intact hulls when destroyed in space, rather than only a few shards of metal & a cloud of dust, we can assume that the warp drives don't always go critical. When refering to the interceptor overload during the Caldari invasion, also remember that it was deliberatly overloading therefore was considerably larger than if it had gone off when the ship was destroyed, probably by an order of magnitude or two. Also while not entirely clear, the implication was it only knocked ships out of the sky in a few mile radius at best. |

Jess Tanner
Hard Knocks Inc.
20
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 10:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
Calathorn Virpio wrote:Quote:#19Posted: 2013.03.22 07:51 | Report | Edited by: Jess Tanner Like but what if i use my wizard hat to cast a spell of protection over the planet?
its a freaking video game people.... you're new to eve, aren't you 
yep, first day
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Sitarta Radeih
Primera Milonga
2
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 10:21:00 -
[23] - Quote
Grigori Annunaki wrote:Fortunately for us, Purdue University has an impact calculator that can give us a decent idea of what might happen. First, though, we need some numbers. A Leviathan has a mass of 2,430,000,000 kg and a volume of 132,500,000 m3, which gives us an overall density of 18.34 kg/m3. Most of the titan is empty space, though its armor would resist a lot of the heat from reentry, so let's bump that to 20 kg/m3. It has a rough "diameter" of 3 km according to the model. Assuming it's propelled into the planet and doesn't just fall out of space, it could have a rough impact velocity of 25 km/s. According to the site, this has the following effects: A crater depth of 631 m and diameter of 2.97 km. Magnitude 7.2 earthquake at the point of impact. At 20 km from impact, 627 m/s wind velocity, major structural damage to buildings, and a catastrophic thermal blast. At 40 km from impact, 245 m/s wind velocity, considerable structural damage, and a catastrophic thermal blast. At 80 km from impact, 82.2 m/s wind velocity, slight structural damage, and enough thermal damage to severely burn people and set things on fire. In short, utter devastation and incineration out to 40 km, with severe wind and thermal damage out past 80 km. It wouldn't be an extinction-level event, but it would obliterate the area it crashed into. By way of comparison, if it crashed in Trenton, NJ, the impact would destroy New York City, Philadelphia, and everything in between.
Hey thank's to al of you, for keeping this discussion civilized and al the interesting info! |

Steve Spooner
Divine Spirit DSM Strategic Operations Brigade
6
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 15:09:00 -
[24] - Quote
What of the citadel torpedoes that have a explosive radius of 2km and the doomsday weapon that can annihilate a State? I would imagine the power core of the titan would have to be powered by something immense and utterly volatile, as well as the 1 million or so stored megawatts in the capacitor that will disperse upon the ship's destruction. Let's not forget the fuel as well, which would add to the destruction. At the very least the amount of raw materials, gasses, and other unnatural materials that the titan consists of would destroy the planets ecosystem. This is assuming the titan pilot doesn't just decide to actually launch the doomsday weapon and fire off the citadel torpedos, because screw it he's going to die anyways. |

Gabriel Santagalos
EVE University Ivy League
9
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 21:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
He wouldnt just fire anything, because, that planet IS Caldari Prime. Its one thing to fire a DD or Missiles at corralled in Gallente civilian districts, another to fry your own Homeworld just because you are going down.
I concede that the Ecosphere will get severe trouble, though. |

Calathorn Virpio
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
18
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 21:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
Steve Spooner wrote:What of the citadel torpedoes that have a explosive radius of 2km and the doomsday weapon that can annihilate a State? I would imagine the power core of the titan would have to be powered by something immense and utterly volatile, as well as the 1 million or so stored megawatts in the capacitor that will disperse upon the ship's destruction. Let's not forget the fuel as well, which would add to the destruction. At the very least the amount of raw materials, gasses, and other unnatural materials that the titan consists of would destroy the planets ecosystem. This is assuming the titan pilot doesn't just decide to actually launch the doomsday weapon and fire off the citadel torpedos, because screw it he's going to die anyways.
woulda pointed the titan at gallente prime and given them a big F-YOU ..I. DD time CCP are the French gate camping=/=PVP everything else is fair game |

Inkarr Hashur
Sine Nobilitatis
280
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 22:09:00 -
[27] - Quote
Guys, it was only part of the titan that hit the planet. Sheesh. "as a burning section of the forward superstructure of the Shiigeru almost seven kilometers in length"
There you go. 7 kilometers. |

Sanadras Riahn
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
23
|
Posted - 2013.03.22 23:01:00 -
[28] - Quote
Adding to Inkarr's comment, the SCOPE article mentioned that the reactor and all portions of the engineering section were obliterated by the explosion, due to the reactor melting down. That would suggest that the "warp core + power core" doomsday you were talking about is not a threat, either. "This is our way of wisdom, warrior. To be true. To be full. To include our hearts in every aspect of what we do. --- Let those that fly cold numbers be the Amarr. We fly better than that."---Alica Wildfire, inscribed on the inside and outer shell of Sanadras' Capsule. |
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