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The Battleship: It's Fundamental Flaw (Long)

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Gariuys	Posted - 2005.09.20 21:21:00 - [91] Originally by: Natasha Kerensky Originally by: Tar om Why? because I've trained millions of SP to get my BS working properly, thats why :)Tar om dont forget teh moneh!!!! frigs = $ battleships = $$$$$$$$$$$ i want bang for my buck!! frigs = $ battleship = $$$$$$$$$ godmode = $$$$$$$?????? ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool
Drutort	Posted - 2005.09.21 07:51:00 - [92] I would like to point out to those who say dronesà well drones are not high slots last time I checked, so plz focus on the proposed ideas and why you would agree/disagree and or if you have anything useful to contributeà TBH every bigger more expensive ship will always carry a anti smaller gun or whateverà its just practical itÆs a DUH type of thingà in the worst case scenario you want to have it regardless, you wouldnÆt want to let something like this be the down fall of your ship. Its practical and a no brainer but yet, itÆs a hard concept for some to see why people have always wanted it. As far as exploiting or balancing issues, those are other topics and probably should not be focusedà main focus is on the concept at hand, the exploit/abuse balancing can be handled easy once there is something on the drawing board support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo my PhotoBlog
Jorev	Posted - 2005.09.21 09:50:00 - [93] The real problem is the damage output of interceptors and some AFs/HACs. Battleships are balanced against T1 ships, but T2 ship like a claw or a taranis costs 7m...12m nicely equipped and their evasive abilities are combined with insane DPS rates. HACs are at least balanced with their high price tags. Interceptors aren't.
EternalDark	Posted - 2005.09.21 13:02:00 - [94] Edited by: EternalDark on 21/09/2005 13:02:31 Oveur killed this thread some time ago. CCP wants to go the teamwork rout with bs's. My idea was sort of a ballance point for the overpowered abilities of sniper ships. Personally as a caldari veteran I would love to see turret ships damage capped, aka no more sniping. But moving on ill probably just sell my caldari character as ive waited years for ccp to make them worthwhile to fly and they are still worthless in most respects. Close the thread its dead.
HUGO DRAX	Posted - 2005.09.21 13:11:00 - [95] Originally by: EternalDark Edited by: EternalDark on 21/09/2005 13:02:31 Oveur killed this thread some time ago. CCP wants to go the teamwork rout with bs's. My idea was sort of a ballance point for the overpowered abilities of sniper ships. Personally as a caldari veteran I would love to see turret ships damage capped, aka no more sniping. But moving on ill probably just sell my caldari character as ive waited years for ccp to make them worthwhile to fly and they are still worthless in most respects. Close the thread its dead. There is a fix for snipers. an easy fix.
Avon	Posted - 2005.09.21 13:12:00 - [96] Originally by: EternalDark Edited by: EternalDark on 21/09/2005 13:02:31 Oveur killed this thread some time ago. CCP wants to go the teamwork rout with bs's. My idea was sort of a ballance point for the overpowered abilities of sniper ships. Personally as a caldari veteran I would love to see turret ships damage capped, aka no more sniping. But moving on ill probably just sell my caldari character as ive waited years for ccp to make them worthwhile to fly and they are still worthless in most respects. Close the thread its dead. Caldari ships decide the battle... ...assuming they are still there at the end :/ ______________________________________________ The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Christopher Scott	Posted - 2005.09.22 01:45:00 - [97] Originally by: Avon Caldari ships decide the battle... That used to be true, before a couple of T2 sniper ships could kill another battleship in a fraction of a second.
Jorev	Posted - 2005.09.22 01:47:00 - [98] There's no urgency on part of CCP to address most pressing Caldari flaws: Agilty, Weight, Pitiful DPS, Subpar tanking. Why does it take a year to release a tech2 BCU? Why is it not a priority?
Hanns	Posted - 2005.09.22 03:02:00 - [99] Originally by: Oveur I'll get right to the point! Thread summed up: Battleships need bigger, better anti-frig/cruiser weapons. Answer: No, Battleships intentionally have weaknesses against these ships. Reasoning: The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile Alternative suggestions: Check out small and medium guns (They are quite a valid choice, as pointed out in the thread). Check out Drainers/Nosferatus. Check out Drones. Check out Smartbombs. Check out Webifiers. Check out gasp flying with a friend! lolzor gogo Oveur Originally by: Oveur I'll get right to the point! The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile
ElCapitan	Posted - 2005.09.22 03:21:00 - [100] you whiny people are forgetting somehting - losing t2 kitted interceptor or assault frig costs almost as much as losing a battleship (insurance costs wise). And nos+web on a battleship will get any smaller ship killed fast.
Nyxus	Posted - 2005.09.22 04:53:00 - [101] Battleships need more surviveability. Smaller ships do a stupidly high amount of dps right now. I ubertanked a scorp once and had 18 frigs (tech1 and 2) kill me over a period of 3 or 4 minutes. It was EPIC! With that in mind.... Increase ship HP Place a Sig Radius cap on weapons so small guns don't go into "permanent wrecking" mode on larger sig ships I have seen a single ceptor take out a BS in under 45 seconds to a minute. It wasn't fun on either side really. If there is no difficulty, there is no sense of accomplishment. A ship fighting another 10 times it's size should feel like an epic fight. David vs Goliath. Right now it just feels like "meh" or another 30 second BS killmail. Nyxus
Loka	Posted - 2005.09.22 07:55:00 - [102] Edited by: Loka on 22/09/2005 07:55:11 Originally by: ElCapitan you whiny people are forgetting somehting - losing t2 kitted interceptor or assault frig costs almost as much as losing a battleship (insurance costs wise). And nos+web on a battleship will get any smaller ship killed fast. Megathron Platinum = 31 mil 7x 425mm II = 7 * 6mil each = 42mil 2x sensorbooster II + 2x Tracking CPU II = 4x 1mil each = 4 mil 6x Tech 2 dmg mods or Tracking Enhancer = 6x 1mil = 6mil suma sumarum = 31 + 42 + 4 + 6 = 83mil loss on a Tech 2 fitted BS. The BS itself is replaced, but the item and insurance is lost. Now tell me ElCapitan what for ueber commander items you use on your Ceptor to loose 83 mil isk per kill. Even without any Mods, you will loose 31 mil isk insurance. 2 times as much as any ceptor incl fitting. I dunno where everyone is comming up that loosing a BS is void in this game or is no loss at all. Because my wallet is shrinking each time i would loose such a such by this ammount of money. _________________________ Dead or Alive
Band Zior	Posted - 2005.09.22 08:16:00 - [103] Originally by: ElCapitan you whiny people are forgetting somehting - losing t2 kitted interceptor or assault frig costs almost as much as losing a battleship (insurance costs wise). And nos+web on a battleship will get any smaller ship killed fast. As Loka eloquently pointed out, no, not even close. Way to NOT make a valid point. ---------- Richard Simmons in Space
Everbane	Posted - 2005.09.22 09:51:00 - [104] Originally by: Jorev Why does it take a year to release a tech2 BCU? Why is it not a priority? They're too busy making the godly, cheap as chips, insta warping, insta jumping, frigates even more invulnerable. Real men fly BS.
LukAsh	Posted - 2005.09.22 09:54:00 - [105] Originally by: Oveur DEAR GOD THE WEAPONS HAVE DRAWBACKS!!!!!! Wanting to be a jack of all trades has drawbacks. Simple as that. Hehe basically I agree with you. I think the way it is now is rather good, but could use some improvements. BS should use small guns against frigs ! BS should use medium guns agains cruisers ! BS should use big guns against other BS ! This is the way it should be, Im with you 100%. But there is one thing which makes this impossible - amount of turret high slots on BS's. You would have prolly around 16 to have some kind of defence against frigs and cruisers and still be able to fight a BS to some degree... I know that will never happen. Here is my idea (if someone already havn't posted something similar). BS's have big turret bays (hardpoints) and its obvious that in one turret bay it is possible to fit only one of those huge BS size guns, more just wouldn't fit. But now imagine how stupid does a single small laser looks in that huge turet bay ! If there is so much space why can't I mount more than one small turret there?? Im sure my techincians could somehow manage this crazy idea Would need some balancing but you can: - drop up to 4-8 small turrets (damage output would need most balancing here) of the same kind into one BS size slot (now you sacrificed one high slot but you deal damage with 'one' slot as 1-2 t2 frigs do, and have a tracking/range on that gun, which can actually hit a fast frig sometimes. -drop ut to 2-4 medium turrtes of the same kind... And now we have simple 'point defence'. Also there would have to be a limit (or maybe not) to the amount of 'point defence' slots. Depending on the DOT (so the big guns still would have higher DOT than the 'point defence' ones). A BS which can sacrifice one high slot, can now fight effectively against 1-2 frigs. More would still kick the c**p out of BS becouse this point defence slot can only target and shoot one ship at a time. Still that BS would only 'sacrificed' one slot, so still would be effective in combat. ___ My Tech2 BPC market clicky WTS: Providence freighters (1,4B) WTB: R&D Character clicky WTB: +5 WIL Implant
Nifel	Posted - 2005.09.22 10:16:00 - [106] Originally by: Loka Edited by: Loka on 22/09/2005 08:36:35 Edited by: Loka on 22/09/2005 07:55:11 Originally by: ElCapitan you whiny people are forgetting somehting - losing t2 kitted interceptor or assault frig costs almost as much as losing a battleship (insurance costs wise). And nos+web on a battleship will get any smaller ship killed fast. Megathron Platinum = 31 mil 7x 425mm II = 7 * 6mil each = 42mil 2x sensorbooster II + 2x Tracking CPU II = 4x 1mil each = 4 mil 6x Tech 2 dmg mods or Tracking Enhancer = 6x 1mil = 6mil suma sumarum = 31 + 42 + 4 + 6 = 83mil loss on a Tech 2 fitted BS. The BS itself is replaced, but the item and insurance is lost. Now tell me ElCapitan what for ueber commander items you use on your Ceptor to loose 83 mil isk per kill. Even without any Mods, you will loose 31 mil isk insurance. 2 times as much as any ceptor incl fitting. I dunno where everyone is comming up that loosing a BS is void in this game or is no loss at all. Because my wallet would suffer a hard hit each time i would loose such a ship. Insurance payout: 100+ million Netto: 100 - 83 = 17 million over Rough price for a claw with fittings: 10+ million Insurance premium cost: 600k Insurance payout: ~2.5million Netto: 2.5 - 0.6 - 10 = -8.01 million "We wield swords for the sound of laughter that used to be there long ago."

Eris Discordia	Posted - 2005.09.22 10:22:00 - [107] Thread has ran its course, please re read the wise words of Oveur and come to terms with it. I ♥ my pink dreadnought of pwnage You spin me right round, baby.

Farjung	Posted - 2005.09.22 10:22:00 - [108] Originally by: Nifel Originally by: Loka Edited by: Loka on 22/09/2005 08:36:35 Edited by: Loka on 22/09/2005 07:55:11 Originally by: ElCapitan you whiny people are forgetting somehting - losing t2 kitted interceptor or assault frig costs almost as much as losing a battleship (insurance costs wise). And nos+web on a battleship will get any smaller ship killed fast. Megathron Platinum = 31 mil 7x 425mm II = 7 * 6mil each = 42mil 2x sensorbooster II + 2x Tracking CPU II = 4x 1mil each = 4 mil 6x Tech 2 dmg mods or Tracking Enhancer = 6x 1mil = 6mil suma sumarum = 31 + 42 + 4 + 6 = 83mil loss on a Tech 2 fitted BS. The BS itself is replaced, but the item and insurance is lost. Now tell me ElCapitan what for ueber commander items you use on your Ceptor to loose 83 mil isk per kill. Even without any Mods, you will loose 31 mil isk insurance. 2 times as much as any ceptor incl fitting. I dunno where everyone is comming up that loosing a BS is void in this game or is no loss at all. Because my wallet would suffer a hard hit each time i would loose such a ship. Insurance payout: 100+ million Netto: 100 - 83 = 17 million over Rough price for a claw with fittings: 10+ million Insurance premium cost: 600k Insurance payout: ~2.5million Netto: 2.5 - 0.6 - 10 = -8.01 million Eh? You're forgetting the cost of the new battleship in that sum. Someone really needs to keep me away from the Taranis

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