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Jack Brimstone
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Posted - 2005.09.21 22:50:00 -
[1]
I have been thinking a lot recently about making the standing system achieve something tangible in game, coupled with the idea that the economic power is not something currently that can be wielded easily by powerful industrial entitites.
Please don't get that glazed look, I can see you thinking "It's a carebear thing" -- quite the reverse actually -- it's a PVP thing.
Overview
I have seen several threads previously about improvement to the standing system, most (with the exception of POS) deal with standings as they relate to npc corporations. This suggestion deals with relations between player corps based on standings through one of the most commonly used player-to-player interaction mechanisms -- the market.
A standings based market system would allow corps to specify restrictions on buy/sell orders based on standings. For example, Corp X is at war with corp Y and wants to ensure that none of their production is going to end up being used against them, so they can use the option to restrict sales based on standings. Similarly, friendly corps could give each other discounts based on standings, all handled by the market automatically.
In Brief
This Image of a modified sell order dialogue box pretty much speaks for itself, and would apply equally to buy orders. I've chosen to present it visually like this because its quicker and easier.
Details
Trouble with pirates/hostiles? You can choke off sales to them. Indy corps can lean on their suppliers "Don't sell to X, or kiss our buy orders goodbye" and make pacts with others "set X to -10 and we'll do you a deal". I don't see this having much of an impact in the hub systems where the market is a free for all of cost cutting, but in marginal areas, low sec and NPC sovereign 0.0 is where it would make a difference.
Pirates in turn would be able (and would need to) to foster standings relationships with pet indy corps, in order to be easily re-equipped. Those indy corps would, in turn be set to -10 by the industrial corps that suffer from pirate attacks as they were discovered etc -- which would build up an underground black market of morally questionable indy corps - who would, of course compete amongst themselves. This would lead to an actual economic growth in areas of low sec currently regarded as "no go" by industrial corps due to pirate infestation (essentially a lot of low sec empire). I daresay the sell orders of the pirate-friendly industrial corps would also draw in potential victims to low sec as well.
You may think "oh noes! An indy corp has blocked me buying their ships/modules, guess I'll have to get them from one of the thousand other or so suppliers out there".
Unless it's NAGA. Or a corp with are rare in-demand bpo (Cap recharger II, Zealot). Which has mutual standings agreements with other t2 producers. There are only a certain amount of T2 bpos out there, and mutual standings agreements between manufacturers could lock the offending party out of (easily) obtaining a whole variety of equipment.
This opens up the scope of industrial competition as manufacturers broker trade agreements involving setting mutual standings to punish wrongdoing, corner regional markets and crush rival business cartels. Alliances (in combination with allies) would be able to use their economic weight (through their own standings and influence on the standings of others) as well as military power as a weapon against their enemies.
Combined with the t2 supply chain (with its ongoing expense -- ice) this could lead to lots of delicious intrigue, rivalry and backroom dealing with standings as industrial corps strive to literally put their competitors out of business.
Continued below ... |
Jack Brimstone
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Posted - 2005.09.21 22:52:00 -
[2]
Continued from above...
Circumvention
Of course it is possible through non-affiliated middlemen, but drives costs up for the (blacklisted) buyer and removes the convenience that the market provides. The "no sales to members of npc corps" option puts in another "convenience speedbump" to circumvention -- as blacklisted parties can't easily log on a noobcorp alt to make their purchases. Second accounts and alts in 3rd party corps remain of course. Of course this also opens up a host of opportunities for savvy middlemen.
I think this would be so effective because a lot of purchasing is done in EVE based on convenience, not price. How many times have you thought "well, thereare Cap rechargers on sale 5 jumps away at 12,000 isk, but also in station at 40k"? I know which one I would buy.
It's obviously also entirely optional, and doesn't detract from market functionality at all. If you didn't want to set standings based restrictions, you would be perfectly free to ignore the "broker instructions" section of the buy/sell dialogue box.
I'm sure I'm not the first to suggest standing based market options, and I expect at least some of these ideas have been covered before, but would be interested in hearing what others think with regard to the above change.
Questions? Comments? "Brimstone is a doodyhead, and he owes me 5 minutes of my life back"?. If so, please be constructive and say why. |
Yslath
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Posted - 2005.09.22 03:29:00 -
[3]
I like it a lot. When I first looked at the image I wondered where all the hate against people in NPC corps is coming from, but I can see where you are coming from now that I read the entire thing.
It would also neat to see a player blacklist added. Maybe it could feed off your player blocklist? That'd be neat.
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WickedWeasel
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Posted - 2005.09.22 04:59:00 -
[4]
generally, i think its a good idea. market needs a change!
just don't forget the complexity it would add to buying/buy orders aswell
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Jack Brimstone
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Posted - 2005.09.22 08:03:00 -
[5]
 Quote:
just don't forget the complexity it would add to buying/buy orders aswell
Yeah I didn't add an image for the buy orders dialog as the options would be effectively duplicated from the sell orders box, with "do not buy from.." replacing "no sales to.."
As for visual complexity when buying, theres no need to make it any more complicated that it is already. i.e. If an individual/corp that has low standings to you is viewing the market, and you have enabled the broker instructions options - your buy sell/orders would simply not appear on the market to that corp/individual. |
Yith Solarius
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Posted - 2005.09.22 13:16:00 -
[6]
its a clever idea and would make the market much more interesting. Theres still the dreaded alt problem but with the ability to blacklist certain players as its impossible to set standings with an npc corp (correct me if i'm wrong) you can still prevent a players alt from buying stuff as long as you know who he is.
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Jack Brimstone
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Posted - 2005.09.22 13:32:00 -
[7]
Quote:
Theres still the dreaded alt problem but with the ability to blacklist certain players as its impossible to set standings with an npc corp (correct me if i'm wrong)
It is possible to set negative standings to npc corps, or was last time I checked, no-one does obviously, as there is rarely any point.
The "no sales to npc corp members" option button would simply allow you to disallow sell/buy orders to npc corp members at a stroke without having your overview fill with flashing red whenever you passed though Chaven or Kisogo.
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Yith Solarius
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Posted - 2005.09.22 20:04:00 -
[8]
oops my bad, i didn't spot that button the first time around
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Jack Nike
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Posted - 2005.10.01 22:05:00 -
[9]
Excelent idea Jack - in fact I was thinking exactly in somthing like this the other day.
This concept has my support.
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Idio T
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Posted - 2005.10.02 07:37:00 -
[10]
This is a great idea, that adds more realism and dynamics to the Market.
I have a few questions though.
Wouldn't this have to be done during the shoppers query ? And if so, if said shopper is blacklisted, the item wouldnt show as a market result anyhow (I would imagine) and thus the person would not know to use an alt in the first place. So , no real alt isue anyhow. 
again . Great idea.
Frigate about it! |
Scyrdein
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Posted - 2005.10.02 12:57:00 -
[11]
Wise idea but.
-- No sale to corporations whose staning is lower that .. --
It`s is impossible to set standings to all pirate corps...
Better to use: -- Don`t sell to players if their security status is lower than .. --
-- No sales to NPC copr members --
NPC corps are good and many players just hate to join any copr, so:
Don`t sell to players who played only for .. days(months)
--Discount for corporations --
same as first.
Better to use: -- Discount for players if their security status is higher than .. --
IMHO it is a bit better because in original idea it is possible to cheat and create alt character, give him money and train corporation management skill to allow him create his corp... so this new corp is not in your standing list and this new char, buys your stuff and give it to an another corp...
With a limits by gametime and security status it appears much better..
And additionaly there could be options as in original idea:
Don`t sell to players if their standing is lower than ..
Don`t sell to corps if its standing is lower than
Don`t sell to npc corps at all
Discount for players if their standing is higher than ..
Discount for corps if its standing is higher than
What do you think?
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Derron Bel
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Posted - 2005.10.02 13:50:00 -
[12]
Impractical. Hostile players need only create their own player corp to buy stuff from you. The only ones being screwed are the altless and the newbies.
-==-
Holy-Jim> as you know, surprise is the key to victory.....surprise!
LooseCannoN> ahh!
LooseCannoN> my plans have been foiled! |
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