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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.10 19:55:00 -
[1]
Well, looks like there's been some further changes to armour plates on SiSi... the mass penalty now varies, depending on the plate 'version' -- the better named module, the less penalty.
400mm plates: from 1.500.000 kg (steel) to 1.100.000 kg (tungsten) ... 100.000 kg difference per plate type
800mm plates: from 7.500.000 kg (steel) to 5.500.000 kg (tungsten) ... 500.000 kg difference per plate type
1600mm plates: from 15.000.000 kg (steel) to 11.000.000 kg (tungsten) ... 1.000.000 kg difference per plate type
(it's similar for smaller plates too, didn't bother to list them)
it's way to high as it is still, imo, reducing it to half of current values would probably do the trick... still, at least a step in good direction >>;
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Idara
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Posted - 2005.10.10 19:59:00 -
[2]
What do Shield Extenders penalize again?
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Lance Corporal
BSC Military
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keepiru
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Posted - 2005.10.10 20:20:00 -
[3]
signature radius
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Fight against the filo-communist t2 monopolies! Down with CCCP's one-week plan! Viva la revoluci¾n! o/
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Meridius
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Posted - 2005.10.10 20:24:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Meridius on 10/10/2005 20:23:50
 Originally by: j0sephine
Well, looks like there's been some further changes to armour plates on SiSi... the mass penalty now varies, depending on the plate 'version' -- the better named module, the less penalty.
400mm plates: from 1.500.000 kg (steel) to 1.100.000 kg (tungsten) ... 100.000 kg difference per plate type
800mm plates: from 7.500.000 kg (steel) to 5.500.000 kg (tungsten) ... 500.000 kg difference per plate type
1600mm plates: from 15.000.000 kg (steel) to 11.000.000 kg (tungsten) ... 1.000.000 kg difference per plate type
(it's similar for smaller plates too, didn't bother to list them)
it's way to high as it is still, imo, reducing it to half of current values would probably do the trick... still, at least a step in good direction >>;
Probably even more reason to continue using tungsten over T2(is t2 as light as tungsten?).
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Aakron
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Posted - 2005.10.10 20:33:00 -
[5]
Should nano not be the lightest?
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:02:00 -
[6]
Edited by: j0sephine on 10/10/2005 21:02:49
"Probably even more reason to continue using tungsten over T2(is t2 as light as tungsten?)."
Couldn't check since the market is broken on SiSi atm, and there's no tech.2 plates in the hangar... :/
(nano plates have 5% speed penalty instead of 10% like the others but yup, would expect them to be lightest one, too)
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Gierling
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:07:00 -
[7]
Mass and speed penalty... yep, still a kick in the gooch.
One or the other, not both.
Bastards we are lest Bastards we become. |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:11:00 -
[8]
Originally by: j0sephine
(nano plates have 5% speed penalty instead of 10% like the others but yup, would expect them to be lightest one, too)
where do the nanos fit in the range of mass increases?
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This Zig. For great justice!
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:15:00 -
[9]
"where do the nanos fit in the range of mass increases?"
Something like second worst... it's linear relation -- the more hp module gives, the less it weights.
so it's like:
steel -> nanofiber -> titanium -> carbonide -> tungsten
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:18:00 -
[10]
Shield extenders are a bit more modest too.
One other thing - if you want see the cheesiest thing every outfit an Armageddon with 8 of the best Damage Controls. I have 7 on my domi and it has sick resistances.
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Reatu Krentor
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Posted - 2005.10.10 21:39:00 -
[11]
Easy fix for what they want( a plate rebalance  ), but I'd prefer it differently. With a what I'd call Thrust Compensation, like each ship has a certain amount of thrust it puts out which gives it the maximum velocity(of course thats not how eve does it). Well this thrust compensation would act as a modifier to the velocity modifier based on mass of ship and this. So eg. a 100mm plate on a basic frigate would reduce velocity by 5% while a 400mm plate on the same frigate would reduce speed by 25%Formula I used is to get those values is: ModdedVelocityMod = 1 - ((ThrustCompensation / ShipMass) * (1 - VelocityPenalty)). Where ThrustCompensation is the new plate attribute. eg. 100mm Steel Plate: Thrust Compensation: 500000 N - 400mm Steel Plate: Thrust Compensation: 2500000 N.
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The ammatar are not the enemy, they are the smoke and mirrors of the amarr. |
FalloutBoy
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Posted - 2005.10.10 23:28:00 -
[12]
I still think that they are still off. the old numbers were fine if they shifted everything on over.
50mm plates -gone
100mm and 200mm plates for frigs
400mm and 800mm plates for cruisers
1600mm and a new 3200mm plate for battleships.
or another option would be to boost the armor bonus on all plates along with this nerf. so a 400mm plate will give about the same as a 800mm plate now with the same reqs as that 800mm plate and so on for the rest of the plates
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Altrex Stoppel
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Posted - 2005.10.11 01:32:00 -
[13]
The new 3200 plate sounds like it could make some ships pretty damn beastly. The Apoc could have some sick armor for instance.
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FalloutBoy
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Posted - 2005.10.11 01:42:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Altrex Stoppel
The new 3200 plate sounds like it could make some ships pretty damn beastly. The Apoc could have some sick armor for instance.
thats fine as long as the requirements equally nerf its abilty then to put any kind of guns on it (akin to fitting 1600 plates currently on cruisers)
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DrunkenOne
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Posted - 2005.10.11 02:11:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Hllaxiu
Shield extenders are a bit more modest too.
One other thing - if you want see the cheesiest thing every outfit an Armageddon with 8 of the best Damage Controls. I have 7 on my domi and it has sick resistances.
I thought you can only fit 1 or 2?
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keepiru
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Posted - 2005.10.11 02:15:00 -
[16]
Youre supposed to only be able to fit 1, but they havent gotten that part in yet. So you can structure-tank a domi like mad.. yo?
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Fight against the filo-communist t2 monopolies! Down with CCCP's one-week plan! Viva la revoluci¾n! o/
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Altrex Stoppel
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Posted - 2005.10.11 02:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: FalloutBoy
Originally by: Altrex Stoppel
The new 3200 plate sounds like it could make some ships pretty damn beastly. The Apoc could have some sick armor for instance.
thats fine as long as the requirements equally nerf its abilty then to put any kind of guns on it (akin to fitting 1600 plates currently on cruisers)
Good point FalloutBoy I guess you're right. 
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.10.13 02:38:00 -
[18]
w00t, more changes, and for the better \o/
mass penalty on plates has been drastically reduced. The numbers atm are as follows:
50mm: 18.750 kg
100mm: 37.500 kg
200mm: 187.500 kg
400mm: 375.000 kg
800mm: 1.875.000 kg
1600mm: 3.750.000 kg
... these are for stock tech.1 steel plates, the named plates weight less, similar to how it's reported in the first post of this thread. e.g 400 mm tungsten weights 275.000 kg, and 1600mm tungsten 2.750.000 kg
this looks very reasonable now tbh, and between it and the fixes to shield tanking stuff, starts looking like christmas come early >>;;
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Gierling
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Posted - 2005.10.13 04:54:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Gierling on 13/10/2005 05:00:54
This is acceptable!
Although the speed penelty needs to be adjusted accordingly.
Bastards we are lest Bastards we become. |
Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.10.13 05:18:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 13/10/2005 05:19:25
Originally by: FalloutBoy
I still think that they are still off. the old numbers were fine if they shifted everything on over.
50mm plates -gone
100mm and 200mm plates for frigs
400mm and 800mm plates for cruisers
1600mm and a new 3200mm plate for battleships.
or another option would be to boost the armor bonus on all plates along with this nerf. so a 400mm plate will give about the same as a 800mm plate now with the same reqs as that 800mm plate and so on for the rest of the plates
Get out of it. Realistically, 200 and 400 for frigs, 400 and 800 for cruisers, 800 and 1600 for BS.
And you're STILL looking at a 25% speed penalty on most Inties for a 200mm plate. That's still suicidal.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
keepiru
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Posted - 2005.10.13 05:37:00 -
[21]
Edited by: keepiru on 13/10/2005 05:39:33
11% of interceptor mass + mass added by mwd actually - 1625000kg for claw. And thats for t1/2, much lower for tungsten.
Would be right if they got rid of the fixed speed penalty, about time too.
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WTB: a Faction Micro Smartbomb :P |
Pottsey
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Posted - 2005.10.13 05:51:00 -
[22]
ôif you want see the cheesiest thing every outfit an Armageddon with 8 of the best Damage Controls. I have 7 on my domi and it has sick resistances.ö
If thatÆs cheesy what do you call a Domi with 7 of the best Damage Controls and 5 Dread Invulnerability fields? The cap holds. That was a fun ship but its never going to last.
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Nominate famous people in Eve who had an impact on you. |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2005.10.13 06:29:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Pottsey
ôif you want see the cheesiest thing every outfit an Armageddon with 8 of the best Damage Controls. I have 7 on my domi and it has sick resistances.ö
If thatÆs cheesy what do you call a Domi with 7 of the best Damage Controls and 5 Dread Invulnerability fields? The cap holds. That was a fun ship but its never going to last.
y not 7 damage controls and 5 hull reppers?
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This Zig. For great justice! |
keepiru
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Posted - 2005.10.13 06:41:00 -
[24]
Edited by: keepiru on 13/10/2005 06:44:10
108tf for every Large Inefficient Hull Repair Unit is why, most likely :/
Anyway, damage controls are active modules now - 30 second cycle, 1 cap activation - and you can only have 1 on at a time, so that's the end of the fun ;(
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WTB: a Faction Micro Smartbomb :P |
Kaeten
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Posted - 2005.10.13 07:52:00 -
[25]
omg, my eyes hurt, people are talknig about hull tanking. argghhhhhhhhhhhh
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Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.10.13 08:41:00 -
[26]
Originally by: j0sephine
Edited by: j0sephine on 13/10/2005 03:08:40
w00t, more changes, and for the better \o/
mass penalty on plates has been drastically reduced. The numbers atm are as follows:
50mm: 18.750 kg
100mm: 37.500 kg
200mm: 187.500 kg
400mm: 375.000 kg
800mm: 1.875.000 kg
1600mm: 3.750.000 kg
So it's square one again. Why can't they just make proper sized plates worth while instead of making oversized plates the standard for all PvP? 3.75 million kg isn't very much for a cruiser, merely 40% weight increase (results in about 24% speed reduction when MWDing)
I am throughly concerned that cruiser guns will continue to be extinct on non-HACs due to an innate imbalance concerning cruisers survivability that requires oversized plates.
Also, on inspection it is so blatantly obvious that there's a strong and a weak plate for each Gemini ship class. Why doesn't the devs adapt the plates to this? 50mm plate if you want slightly more HP on an inty but not be slowed very much or a 100mm plate if you want much HP.
On inspection the current values speaks one thing very, very, clearly: 50mm and 100mm plates might as well be removed from game entirely. The 200mm plate is better in every way, not even the PG cost would make you think about the 100mm plate...
So. Where's the battleship sized plates, then?
wheat barley kill anything? are you oats of your mind? I corn belive you just said that, rice I'm off to bed |
Jenny Spitfire
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Posted - 2005.10.13 11:04:00 -
[27]
Hi. I am a bit new to this game and I am willing to learn ;)
What has weight got to do here, as in what will the increase in weight cause?
Thanks.
RecruitMe@NOINT! |
Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.10.13 11:10:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Hi. I am a bit new to this game and I am willing to learn ;)
What has weight got to do here, as in what will the increase in weight cause?
Thanks.
* You'll turn your ship more slowly (although not from decloaking when you've just entered system as you technically do not have a direction then)
* You'll accelerate slightly slower
* Your Micro Warpdrive or Afterburner will be less efficient (will give a weaker boost)
* Let you write hillarious weight jokes about your ship without having to get into a Dominix.
wheat barley kill anything? are you oats of your mind? I corn belive you just said that, rice I'm off to bed |
without
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Posted - 2005.10.13 11:18:00 -
[29]
new values are too low,
need to stop cepters having more hp than crusiers, and cruisers having more hp than bs
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Lansfear
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Posted - 2005.10.13 11:45:00 -
[30]
Originally by: without
new values are too low,
need to stop cepters having more hp than crusiers, and cruisers having more hp than bs
Survivability vs insta damage is a good thing.
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