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B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.13 02:27:00 -
[1]
bloody hell. why 0.6? its bigger than DN ammo. 
because its overpowered? mightaswell nerf all gank ammo around aswell and make it 2.0 m3!
i can hold 1k torps in my raven's bay, sure that sounds really impressive doesnt it?
now compared to my tempest-flying friend. with his high end 1400mm howeiz, scraching for 900s, wrecking for 1900-2000 (PER ******* GUN) every 10 seconds, and carrying 8K ammo (ammo size 0.08 wtfgrrrr ) spewing it at 80km-100km!
why should i nerf my raven and and forfit low slots for expanders? i dont want to. i want to be able to solo a 5\10 complex in my freking battleship upto the 5th\6th stage without runing out of bloody torps!!
god damnit, a 2-3 hour extended downtime, hell, take 10 hours, and iether give ravens 6k m3 (saracsm) or decrease torp size. if you think torp size is adiquate then i would like to see all other L charges pumped up to 0.2 and 0.3.
this isnt fair god damnit. Please CCP, PLEASE. fix the ammo size! u've created a freking amazing game.. uve implemented huge arsed patched inb amatter of 7-8 hour DTs, i believe u can fix this Ammo size issue in a matter of minutes really:/ so again, Please. fix it before i go insane and mwd-torp my friend's tempest 
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
Nicoli Voldkif
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Posted - 2005.10.13 03:03:00 -
[2]
Okay Calm down and take a breath man. I'd like to say this does need to be tweaked. I don't think dropping Torp and Cruise missle sizes in half would unbalance the game in any manner. Note that I'm sure born2kill also meant to say do the same reduction on the launchers to keep the ammo in the launchers the same.
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theRaptor
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Posted - 2005.10.13 03:27:00 -
[3]
Agreed. CCP have been promising this forever.
And I heard the noise of thunder. And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him |
Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.10.13 06:48:00 -
[4]
I agree with the point.
You made it in such a way the dev's prolly think you are a moron and will hold back now to spite you
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kveldulfson
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Posted - 2005.10.13 07:10:00 -
[5]
Torpedoes and cruise missiles are large objects in real life which is prob why the developers gave them the mass they did. The shell for a conventional 14cm gun is probably about a third of the size but as heavy if not heavier than the cruise missile. The warhead is the big problem here, a torpedo carries a huge warhead in comparison to a shell but at a lower velocity, same with a cruise missile.
therefore perhaps the developers need to look at the damage done rather than the size.
Just my 2 cents 
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Fusa Iyuki
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Posted - 2005.10.13 07:18:00 -
[6]
The largest howitzrs are 1400mm, not 140mm. 10mm in a centimetre leaves us with 140cm, or 1.4 metres, which is one hell of a big shell.
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Fifteen blows to the back of your head // Fifteen blows to your mind |
B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.13 10:35:00 -
[7]
Deja
i was just so ****ed off last night, things just built up you know. 
i didnt mean to sound disrespectful or unappreciatiave, i do appreciate the hard work that has been done by the devs, and if i **** them off then im sorry:/
but this seriously needs to be looked into
p.s: im feeling much better now 
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.10.13 15:49:00 -
[8]
I don't blame you, man. I've been sick of torpedo size since 2 months after I started the game (when I got my first raven).
-Wrayeth
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Dark Shikari
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Posted - 2005.10.13 15:57:00 -
[9]
Yeah, why is the ammo for a 1400mm gun (over a meter in size) 0.1 cubic meters, and torps are 0.6... 
--
Proud member of the [23].
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Smart Bomb
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Posted - 2005.10.13 20:01:00 -
[10]
signed
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B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.14 00:29:00 -
[11]
heh, it seems that the torp issue contributes to the system pressure aswell, "Torp haulers" that feed the needs of hungry ravens and scorpions
fixing the amo size of torpedoes will surely improve overall game preformeance, just like skills i say, every % fragment of system load is crucial to a game like eve, it will surely improve the machanics and gamer-mental-health
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
NattyDreadlock
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Posted - 2005.10.15 21:28:00 -
[12]
Torpedos should be big. There is certainly a mass benefit when you dont have to carry your fuel and means of propulsion with you. The shell is almost all warhead, the torpdeo is like 10-25% warhead everything else is fuel and propulsion.
Torpedos historically cause lots of damage, but that was often due to both warhead size, but even more so due to where they hit ships...below the unarmored waterline and keel. With no real "soft" spot to exploit in these spae vessels the torpedo will unfortuantly lose some of its histrorical punch...like when ships began having armored skirts placed along the waterline.
_____________________________
You hit "insert pirate" with a frozen turd right in the eye from your 150mm railgun for 0.0 damage. |
Hiram
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Posted - 2005.10.15 23:53:00 -
[13]
signed
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Dr Tetrahydrocannabinol
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Posted - 2005.10.16 00:24:00 -
[14]
yeah smaller torps and cruise would be nice, especially when you carry par charges
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Signature filesize exceeded. Maximum sig size is 400*120 and 24000 bytes - Teblin - aww come on now :(
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B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.16 00:31:00 -
[15]
Edited by: B0rn2KiLL on 16/10/2005 00:32:55
 Originally by: NattyDreadlock
Torpedos should be big. There is certainly a mass benefit when you dont have to carry your fuel and means of propulsion with you. The shell is almost all warhead, the torpdeo is like 10-25% warhead everything else is fuel and propulsion.
Torpedos historically cause lots of damage, but that was often due to both warhead size, but even more so due to where they hit ships...below the unarmored waterline and keel. With no real "soft" spot to exploit in these spae vessels the torpedo will unfortuantly lose some of its histrorical punch...like when ships began having armored skirts placed along the waterline.
yeah, and how much ammo you can carry on your pretty little megathron? 3-4K anti matter? thorium L ?
Stop comparing real life shell sizes!! its space! 4th age (earth, earth 2, 1st gate, eden etc)
i think we're beyond bulky explosives!
edit: if you want decent damage amount- size, then please start asking ccp to nerf those 2000 damamge 1400mm howiz kthx? or large nuetron blasters? k? grr
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
Jemba'k Ko'cha
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Posted - 2005.10.16 00:39:00 -
[16]
if 1 unit is that large then the damage output should be equaly as vast.
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.10.16 10:37:00 -
[17]
Edited by: The Wizz117 on 16/10/2005 10:39:06
i know the problem,it sucks i was doing this guirista extravaganza lvl4 with a friend and i had to get back to get ammo evry jump with my raven.
lets say the missiles where 1 jump away, and there are 5 gates in guista extravaganza: thats 25 jumps!!! and with the raven being the slowest ships and worste internia that realy SUCKS
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B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.17 02:02:00 -
[18]
Edited by: B0rn2KiLL on 17/10/2005 02:02:31
doubt any change will be introduced anytime soon *sighs*
edit: spelling, tired :p
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
Binary Mind
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Posted - 2005.10.17 08:20:00 -
[19]
if you do so much more damage with your Tempest... why do you still use the Raven then?
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The Wizz117
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Posted - 2005.10.17 09:05:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Binary Mind
if you do so much more damage with your Tempest... why do you still use the Raven then?
couse we need a year Skil trianing, all raven pilotes are 100% totaly ******
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B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.17 13:51:00 -
[21]
Edited by: B0rn2KiLL on 17/10/2005 13:51:51
Originally by: Binary Mind
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if you do so much more damage with your Tempest... why do you still use the Raven then?
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getting large projectile to lvl 3 would need alteast 3-4 months.. and i dont have minmatar battleship skill, so thats another 3 months of training minm frigat 1 -minm battleship 2
the damage is not the issue here.. it was just a means to justify a point, which is the huge god damned size of a torpedoe versus all other charges. its bigger than XL ammo..
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
Kelgen Thann
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Posted - 2005.10.18 17:20:00 -
[22]
SIGNED with a pretty please on top.
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TotensBurntCorpse
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Posted - 2005.10.18 17:39:00 -
[23]
Originally by: NattyDreadlock
There is certainly a mass benefit when you dont have to carry your fuel and means of propulsion with you. The shell is almost all warhead, the torpdeo is like 10-25% warhead everything else is fuel and propulsion.
Most howitzer shells use rocket assist now to get extra range. So shells DO carry fuel with them. Also to get the correct burst distance for HE-AP shells they come equipt with position Radar. Dont confuse shells with bullets. Only AT solid shot is "dumb" rounds.
Also I would expect with this game there is a "waterline" for the torpedoes to explode under to get high end damage for wrecking hits.
TotensBurntCorpse
Likes
EVE, Starfleet Command Series, Earth & Beyond, Anything Battlefield, MOHAA, Call of Duty.
Dislikes
Not much. |
B0rn2KiLL
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Posted - 2005.10.21 13:43:00 -
[24]
i dont think ammo behavior should dictate its size, i mean, with all the tech advancements that has been made in human civs, and its not like missiles are a 2ndry weapon, if they were, a raven would atleast have some hybrid bonuses.
too bad a dev hasnt responded to this yet :(
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When It Absolutely Positively Has To Be Desotroyed. |
kveldulfson
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Posted - 2005.10.25 07:50:00 -
[25]
One thing no one has mentioned is the basic physics of balistics i.e. Mass x Velocity squared = Energy. so basically the bigger it is and the faster it goes the more damage it will do and with a near frictionless environment it will travel very fast. A 1400mm shell must weigh in at 5 tons thats a lot of Kinetic energy impacting any kind of target even without a warhead. Cruise missiles (and others) by comparison are probably way less than a ton and so must rely on a warhead to do any damage, same with torpedoes.
Now those statements are based on today's understanding of physics.
If we apply newtons 3rd law any ship firing a 1400mm shell weighing 5 tons at say 3000 M/s would suffer a huge mount of recoil (45,000,000,000 j), and with ships having 4 of these firing!!
So I think we have to accept that this is a game set in the future and it is not going to be realistic to todays physics therefore.
I do have to agree however that the way CCP have worked the ammo sizes does not make any sense and needs to be looked at.
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Smart Bomb
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Posted - 2005.10.25 19:47:00 -
[26]
a round for a 1400mm howzter would weigh about as much as a the bomb dropped on hiroshima in reality
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kveldulfson
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Posted - 2005.10.26 07:16:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Smart Bomb
a round for a 1400mm howzter would weigh about as much as a the bomb dropped on hiroshima in reality
in reality an 18" shell as fired from a gun had a projectile weight of 1 ton and a seperate firing charge. The Hiroshima bomb was not that heavy as it was constructed of light weight materials as it was not required to penetrate or provide shrapnel
if you scale up an 18" shell to a 54" shell as a close approximation and fit the propellent charge to the round instead of having it seperate then you are looking at 5 tones per round !! Approx
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Malken
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Posted - 2005.10.26 10:49:00 -
[28]
Originally by: kveldulfson
Torpedoes and cruise missiles are large objects in real life which is prob why the developers gave them the mass they did. The shell for a conventional 14cm gun is probably about a third of the size but as heavy if not heavier than the cruise missile. The warhead is the big problem here, a torpedo carries a huge warhead in comparison to a shell but at a lower velocity, same with a cruise missile.
therefore perhaps the developers need to look at the damage done rather than the size.
Just my 2 cents
and if a real life torpedo exploded near my kids tricycle there would not be a tricycle.
in eve a torpedo hitting something small doesnt even do more then a civilian gatling gun.
how that for your real life analogy.
if missile users is going to have to shoot those 80k ammo to kill one ship atleast let them not be forced to have a freighter hauling them enough ammo to fight it.
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without
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Posted - 2005.10.26 11:04:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Malken
Originally by: kveldulfson
Torpedoes and cruise missiles are large objects in real life which is prob why the developers gave them the mass they did. The shell for a conventional 14cm gun is probably about a third of the size but as heavy if not heavier than the cruise missile. The warhead is the big problem here, a torpedo carries a huge warhead in comparison to a shell but at a lower velocity, same with a cruise missile.
therefore perhaps the developers need to look at the damage done rather than the size.
Just my 2 cents
and if a real life torpedo exploded near my kids tricycle there would not be a tricycle.
in eve a torpedo hitting something small doesnt even do more then a civilian gatling gun.
how that for your real life analogy.
if missile users is going to have to shoot those 80k ammo to kill one ship atleast let them not be forced to have a freighter hauling them enough ammo to fight it.
in rl a torp would not explode EXACTLY on the bike.
assume t lands 100m away. will your house or the bike be more likely to survive?
the bike would survive as it is compact and would take less dmg
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NattyDreadlock
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Posted - 2005.10.26 23:11:00 -
[30]
Torpedos have always been limited weapons on warships. The torpedo is and should be a bulky weapon. Perhaps missile based ships should have a damage modifier, but for any other ship the torpedo should be a devasting but bulky, and thus limited, secondary weapon.
I can accept looking into having torpedos have higher damage output, but that damage should not be the same as the projectile's damage to weight ratio...the torpedo's damage to weight ratio should be lower due to so much of it being the motor/propellant. They need to include or determine warhead mass to both projectiles and propulsion based weapons and have the damage output be based on that. That way no one could argue weither the torpedo was under powered if one understood how much of a torpedo's bulkiness was actually warhead.
_____________________________
You hit "insert pirate" with a frozen turd right in the eye from your 150mm railgun for 0.0 damage. |
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