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Berluth Luthian
Meltdown.
74
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Posted - 2013.06.06 12:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
So with regular turrets, IMO players have an easier time figuring out the chance to hit and damage amount of their turrets relative to their tracking speed and the target's transversal and signature size.
What I've noticed with my own missile damage calculations is that you can quickly have an idea something close to the relative damage amount +/- 5% if you figure out a basic number for the missiles and the target...
I call it signature speed.
It is the (velocity of an object/radius). So for ships its ship velocity/signature radius, for missiles it is explosion velocity/explosion radius.
The interesting thing is that when you take a ship's signature speed divided by a missile's signature speed you only start to do 100% damage when this number is 1 or greater.
So for example, with no skills, a light missile's sig-speed is 4.25.
A frigate with a small sig radius of 40 only needs to be traveling at greater than 170 m/s to get less than 100% damage, and >540 m/s to get approximately 50%.
However, if you put a target painter on the frigate giving it a sig radius of 52 it now needs to go at least 221 m/s to get less than full damage, but >700 m/s to get less than half damage.
So if you roughly know the 'sig-speed' of various missiles ahead of time, the only unkown you are left with (which can be pretty big) is what explosion velocity/radius rigs are fitted to the target and whether they have the target navigation prediction skill, or guided missile precision skill trained up.
Also, its interesting to look at what increases in sig radius does to what's necessary for speed tanking. For example, to dodge 50% of the damage of base skilled rockets, a rifter with a 35m sig radius needs only ~475 m/s of velocity. But when the rifter fits a medium extender II, it now needs ~600 m/s to dodge the same amount of damage. IOW a 10% increase in sig radius means around a 10% increase in speed needed to dodge the same damage. That same rifter with 3 shield extender rigs will now need ~725 m/s. |
Combatevolved
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry
Templis Dragonaors
26
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Posted - 2013.06.06 15:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
This has already been figured out.
Unlike turrets, missiles will always deal damage to a target if they impact against it, regardless of the target's speed, radial velocity, or size (signature radius). Instead, the damage that the missile deals is affected.
As missiles do not have tracking speeds, a missile launched at a target will do the same damage if the target's speed remains the same. In other words, the damage dealt to a target orbiting the launcher at 300m/s and a target flying directly at the launcher at 300m/s will be exactly the same.
The important factor in this scenario is the speed of the target ship. When a missile hits a target, the speed of the target is compared to the Explosion Velocity of the missile. For example, if when a Scourge Heavy Missile - which has a base Explosion Velocity of 81m/s - is fired, the Explosion Velocity is much lower than the target's speed, then damage is significantly reduced as the target is outrunning most of the missile's damage.
The other factor that will decrease missile damage is Signature Radius. The Scourge Missile previously used has a Explosion Radius of 125m - if this missile is fired against a target with a smaller Signature than its Explosion Radius, damage will again be reduced, as only a small portion of the explosion is affecting the target. Although if your missile hits a target whose signature radius is greater then the explosion radius of your missile then the explosion velocity of your missile is increased by the same multiple.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Missiles |
Berluth Luthian
Meltdown.
74
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Combatevolved wrote:This has already been figured out. Unlike turrets, missiles will always deal damage to a target if they impact against it, regardless of the target's speed, radial velocity, or size (signature radius). Instead, the damage that the missile deals is affected. As missiles do not have tracking speeds, a missile launched at a target will do the same damage if the target's speed remains the same. In other words, the damage dealt to a target orbiting the launcher at 300m/s and a target flying directly at the launcher at 300m/s will be exactly the same. The important factor in this scenario is the speed of the target ship. When a missile hits a target, the speed of the target is compared to the Explosion Velocity of the missile. For example, if when a Scourge Heavy Missile - which has a base Explosion Velocity of 81m/s - is fired, the Explosion Velocity is much lower than the target's speed, then damage is significantly reduced as the target is outrunning most of the missile's damage. The other factor that will decrease missile damage is Signature Radius. The Scourge Missile previously used has a Explosion Radius of 125m - if this missile is fired against a target with a smaller Signature than its Explosion Radius, damage will again be reduced, as only a small portion of the explosion is affecting the target. Although if your missile hits a target whose signature radius is greater then the explosion radius of your missile then the explosion velocity of your missile is increased by the same multiple. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Missiles
Dude, I get the missile formula...I'm not saying I discovered it or anything. Also, signature radius of the target is just as important as its speed, give or take depending on hull size. My point was just that you can turn velocity:radius of missiles and ships into a ratio that can easily be compared in the same way that turret tracking speed can be compared to a ship's transversal. |
Bouh Revetoile
TIPIAKS
340
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Posted - 2013.06.09 12:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Berluth Luthian wrote:Dude, I get the missile formula...I'm not saying I discovered it or anything. Also, signature radius of the target is just as important as its speed, give or take depending on hull size. My point was just that you can turn velocity:radius of missiles and ships into a ratio that can easily be compared in the same way that turret tracking speed can be compared to a ship's transversal.
In fact, that's exactly the same with turrets : the signature resolution and the signature radius make a modifier for the tracking. The difference is that signature resolution is standard for each class of turret whereas nobody is used to missiles values. |
Cara Forelli
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.06.24 15:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
Combatevolved wrote:the target is outrunning most of the missile's damage.
Is this based on the target ship's total speed, or directional speed? I would think a ship meeting the missile head on would be able to "outrun" more damage than if the missile was chasing it (missile momentum would carry the explosion toward the ship instead of away from it). Or am I just making stuff up? Sorry if this is a noob question :p |
Berluth Luthian
Meltdown.
84
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Posted - 2013.06.24 15:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cara Forelli wrote:Combatevolved wrote:the target is outrunning most of the missile's damage.
Is this based on the target ship's total speed, or directional speed? I would think a ship meeting the missile head on would be able to "outrun" more damage than if the missile was chasing it (missile momentum would carry the explosion toward the ship instead of away from it). Or am I just making stuff up? Sorry if this is a noob question :p
Direction has nothing to do with missiles afaik. I think the game engine checks for speed and sig radius. Transversal doesn't matter. |
Untanas Volmyr
Running with Knives
Nexus Fleet
26
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Posted - 2013.06.28 00:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cara Forelli wrote:Combatevolved wrote:the target is outrunning most of the missile's damage.
Is this based on the target ship's total speed, or directional speed? I would think a ship meeting the missile head on would be able to "outrun" more damage than if the missile was chasing it (missile momentum would carry the explosion toward the ship instead of away from it). Or am I just making stuff up? Sorry if this is a noob question :p
Well now that you mention it. It would seem a missile would have to have penetrating abilities on top of an explosion radius versus just exploding after impacting shield/armor or hull. If shields are full when a missile hits head on I could understand some mitigated explosion damage. Now a missile with a drill for a warhead could get interesting when it comes down to armor/hull.
Murphy's Technology Law - If your not thoroughly confused. Then you were not thoroughly informed. |
Cara Forelli
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.06.28 18:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Now that is some wild theory crafting.  |
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