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Rhivre
TarNec Invisible Exchequer
274
|
Posted - 2013.06.09 22:47:00 -
[31] - Quote
Or, you can update a few times a day and still 0.01 :)
Its not an either/or situation :)
There are as many different styles of trading as there are traders.
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Stigman Zuwadza
Repercussus RAZOR Alliance
108
|
Posted - 2013.06.09 22:59:00 -
[32] - Quote
The market needs 0.01 iskers otherwise you'd have a market place full of people 'winning' with their razor thin margins. 
You can knock us 0.01 iskers all you like but the truth is your trading style only works because we exist, because without us you couldn't trade as you do, but without you we 0.01 iskers would make ever more profit. 
Fly safe. o7 Its broken and its been broken for a long time and it'll be broken for some time to come. |

Cawyn
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 01:07:00 -
[33] - Quote
Stigman Zuwadza wrote:The market needs 0.01 iskers otherwise you'd have a market place full of people 'winning' with their razor thin margins.  You can knock us 0.01 iskers all you like but the truth is your trading style only works because we exist, because without us you couldn't trade as you do, but without you we 0.01 iskers would make ever more profit.  Fly safe. o7 That trading style works because people generally won't sell goods below buying price. Accepting thinner margins and under-/over-cutting the competition will get you more sales, regardless whether the other guy is 0.01 isking or not.
Granted, if even a fraction of those 0.01 iskers set out to do arbitrage trading beyond their own station, competition would be a lot stiffer. But as a whole, 0.01 iskers provide no real service to the market. |

Stigman Zuwadza
Repercussus RAZOR Alliance
109
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 04:07:00 -
[34] - Quote
Quote:That trading style works because people generally won't sell goods below buying price. Accepting thinner margins and under-/over-cutting the competition will get you more sales, regardless whether the other guy is 0.01 isking or not.
Granted, if even a fraction of those 0.01 iskers set out to do arbitrage trading beyond their own station, competition would be a lot stiffer. But as a whole, 0.01 iskers provide no real service to the market. I think we can all agree that if you go and look at the 8000+ lines you will see evidence of 0.01 iskers, whether its a 5 isk item or a 5b isk item, this could imply that we are the majority and thus the better trading style. 
I've traded long enough to get the feeling that traders that like to play the choppity chop game are just butthurt 0.01 isker wannabes, they're traders that don't understand the products they're trading in and their ADD tries to expidite their trading rush. Now, maybe I'll a little off-track with that comment but its probably true of many of the non-0.01 iskers.  Its broken and its been broken for a long time and it'll be broken for some time to come. |

Cawyn
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 08:24:00 -
[35] - Quote
0.01 isking certainly requires the least intellectual effort. I guess that actually does make it the best trading style for the majority of players.
Time (and minerals) is free, after all. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
5
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 10:29:00 -
[36] - Quote
Cawyn wrote:0.01 isking certainly requires the least intellectual effort. I guess that actually does make it the best trading style for the majority of players.
Time (and minerals) is free, after all.
If you will call eve players stupid, you take away the term we use to describe other mmos players. So now we need to find a new way to call wow players, can we agree on "degenerate monkeys"? :D |

Rhivre
TarNec Invisible Exchequer
276
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 11:07:00 -
[37] - Quote
Cawyn wrote:0.01 isking certainly requires the least intellectual effort. I guess that actually does make it the best trading style for the majority of players.
Time (and minerals) is free, after all.
0.01ing is the end of a process ^^
Sure, some may just pick random item and 0.01 it, but then, some do that with your method too....
I am never sure why people are so eager to insist that their way of playing is superior....because, here is the scary thing, well, 2 actually.
Those 0.01ers on minerals may be your deep cut competitors.
If everyone deep undercut (which, lets face it, random mouse scroll is hardly more challenging that single mouse scroll), then your razor sharp margins would be....less sharp, or non existant |

Mari Hata
Main Street Crafts and Goods
24
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 11:23:00 -
[38] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:Cawyn wrote:0.01 isking certainly requires the least intellectual effort. I guess that actually does make it the best trading style for the majority of players.
Time (and minerals) is free, after all. If you will call eve players stupid, you take away the term we use to describe other mmos players. So now we need to find a new way to call wow players, can we agree on "degenerate monkeys"? :D
One is always someone elses' stupid. Deal with it and keep on 0.01 isking  GÇ£Eve. Do you know what Eve is? ItGÇÖs a thousand worlds for our eyes to see. A story we agree to tell each other, over and over, til we forget that itGÇÖs a lie.GÇ¥ |

Jivvust
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.10 21:30:00 -
[39] - Quote
I keep seeing all these little bunnies thinking they win by cutting margins to single digits. Getting more sales, eh. 30 times more sales, to compensate for the "razor sharp margins" versus the margins 0.01 iskers get? While still competing with other little bunny "winners"? 
Remember what happened the last time you had no cushion on an item going for it's weekly stroll down the price alley. That will happen again. And again.
Good luck with the razor, don't cut yourselves. |

Shizuken
Venerated Stars
140
|
Posted - 2013.06.13 19:30:00 -
[40] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Can the person currently engaged in 0.01 chicanery against my orders in Amarr please cease and desist. It's no longer funny.
Thanks.
I am sure he would ask the same of you. Why not try and drop your price by a meaningful amount and earn the sale while he waits for prices to go back up? |

Victoria Sin
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
277
|
Posted - 2013.06.13 21:14:00 -
[41] - Quote
I'm not trading as such, more selling the goods I manufacture. i.e. I'm not doing arbitrage. Anyway, this batch all sold.  |

Shizuken
Venerated Stars
141
|
Posted - 2013.06.13 22:07:00 -
[42] - Quote
arabella blood wrote: What do you think?
I think anyone that has worked in sales and distribution will tell you that high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
6
|
Posted - 2013.06.14 06:41:00 -
[43] - Quote
Shizuken wrote:arabella blood wrote: What do you think?
I think anyone that has worked in sales and distribution will tell you that high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin.
My point exactly...so keep calm and .01 zerg every 5 minutes |

Rawbert Gzon
3
|
Posted - 2013.06.15 23:16:00 -
[44] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:Shizuken wrote:arabella blood wrote: What do you think?
I think anyone that has worked in sales and distribution will tell you that high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin. My point exactly...so keep calm and .01 zerg every 5 minutes
Wat?
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Manny Moons
New Order Logistics CODE.
127
|
Posted - 2013.06.16 11:50:00 -
[45] - Quote
Shizuken wrote:I think anyone that has worked in sales and distribution will tell you that high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin.
On the other hand, people like me, who have not worked in sales and distribution, would prefer the one big score to the thousand low margin transactions. And "easier" means different things to different people.
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Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 06:17:00 -
[46] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:Rawbert Gzon wrote:arabella blood wrote:Rawbert Gzon wrote:I love the brainless .01 isk idiots. They make trading so easy and profitable. Would love to hear how you "defeat" these brainless idiots :) I bet you would.  As i thought, big words with nothing to back them ;) If we talk seriously, i dont see anything more profitable then .01 rapidly. Im talking station trading only, sure theres other methods, but nothing better then this over time if you focus station only. If we take the exact number of trades and do your "razor sharp" margins against .01 fight. After a year .01 will have more isk. What do you think?
But why would you do that? Sit in one station all the time and adjust orders by .01 ISK? That sounds about as fun as solitaire. Actually, solitaire sounds like more fun. Get out and do something fun! |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
22
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 09:19:00 -
[47] - Quote
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:arabella blood wrote:Rawbert Gzon wrote:arabella blood wrote:Rawbert Gzon wrote:I love the brainless .01 isk idiots. They make trading so easy and profitable. Would love to hear how you "defeat" these brainless idiots :) I bet you would.  As i thought, big words with nothing to back them ;) If we talk seriously, i dont see anything more profitable then .01 rapidly. Im talking station trading only, sure theres other methods, but nothing better then this over time if you focus station only. If we take the exact number of trades and do your "razor sharp" margins against .01 fight. After a year .01 will have more isk. What do you think? But why would you do that? Sit in one station all the time and adjust orders by .01 ISK? That sounds about as fun as solitaire. Actually, solitaire sounds like more fun. Get out and do something fun!
But but i thought defenetion of fun is subjective 
Anyway, i update orders 3 times a day- morning, return from work, and before sleep - netting 1 plex in 24 hours. On weekends i update a bit more. Rest of the time i spent on my other chars... |

Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 09:38:00 -
[48] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:But but i thought defenetion of fun is subjective  Anyway, i update orders 3 times a day- morning, return from work, and before sleep - netting 1 plex in 24 hours. On weekends i update a bit more. Rest of the time i spent on my other chars...
What happened to ".01 zerg every 5 minutes"? That's not updating orders 3 times a day, that's updating them 12 times an hour.
And .01 ISK wars are high margin, not low margin, since the attempt is to outbid by as little as possible, thus preserving the biggest margin possible. I think you missed his point entirely.
But, yeah, the definition of fun is subjective. And if you sit in a station updating orders every five minutes for your EVE career, I do not understand your definition of fun. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
22
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 10:07:00 -
[49] - Quote
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:arabella blood wrote:But but i thought defenetion of fun is subjective  Anyway, i update orders 3 times a day- morning, return from work, and before sleep - netting 1 plex in 24 hours. On weekends i update a bit more. Rest of the time i spent on my other chars... What happened to ".01 zerg every 5 minutes"? That's not updating orders 3 times a day, that's updating them 12 times an hour. And .01 ISK wars are high margin, not low margin, since the attempt is to outbid by as little as possible, thus preserving the biggest margin possible. I think you missed his point entirely. But, yeah, the definition of fun is subjective. And if you sit in a station updating orders every five minutes for your EVE career, I do not understand your definition of fun.
Read again, he had no point, only claiming .01 isk is stupid, which was fully discussed From several angles and to my opinion is wrong. Mind that all the descussion here is mostly theoretical, so my claim of 0.01 every 5min is as such. What i personally do could be completely different yet im going to defend the .01 tactic anyways..
As for fun, you dont need to understand it, you cant, not until you try |

goatplasma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 10:40:00 -
[50] - Quote
Quote this if you spend less than a few hours a week on trading and still make billions. |

Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:05:00 -
[51] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:
Read again, he had no point, only claiming .01 isk is stupid, which was fully discussed From several angles and to my opinion is wrong. Mind that all the descussion here is mostly theoretical, so my claim of 0.01 every 5min is as such. What i personally do could be completely different yet im going to defend the .01 tactic anyways..
As for fun, you dont need to understand it, you cant, not until you try
You read it again. He did have a point that he alluded to and you missed it completely. I don't think you understand it from your reply of "my point exactly" since it was not your point at all. No, he didn't tell you exactly what his point was. Nor should he. It's not good business to let everyone know everything. |

goatplasma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:09:00 -
[52] - Quote
Time is a resource you need to manage too. I also have an irl job to deal with, and with the eve time I do have I like to do things that do not involve sitting in a station making pew pew noises when I update buy orders. Maybe that's your thing, but it's not mine and I know that I certainly do not need to spend hours every day updating orders to make in excess of several billion a week off the market. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
22
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:19:00 -
[53] - Quote
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:arabella blood wrote:
Read again, he had no point, only claiming .01 isk is stupid, which was fully discussed From several angles and to my opinion is wrong. Mind that all the descussion here is mostly theoretical, so my claim of 0.01 every 5min is as such. What i personally do could be completely different yet im going to defend the .01 tactic anyways..
As for fun, you dont need to understand it, you cant, not until you try
You read it again. He did have a point that he alluded to and you missed it completely. I don't think you understand it from your reply of "my point exactly" since it was not your point at all. No, he didn't tell you exactly what his point was. Nor should he. It's not good business to let everyone know everything.
Done arguing about who said what and who understood who and how, its childish, leads nowhere, offtopic, grow. Let the speaker defend his point, he sure doesnt need your help, nor can you claim to understand what he said anymore then me.
If you want to discuss the "fun" aspect of station trading, im all here :) |

goatplasma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:20:00 -
[54] - Quote
Personally I don't trade because it's fun, because it's not. I trade because noone ever made their billions by shooting rats. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
22
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:25:00 -
[55] - Quote
goatplasma wrote:Personally I don't trade because it's fun, because it's not. I trade because noone ever made their billions by shooting rats.
So you say the fun part is getting the payment not the actual work thats needed to get it. I totally agree, most of works people do IRL are not fun for them, but the $$$$ are. |

Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:37:00 -
[56] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:Shizuken wrote:arabella blood wrote: What do you think?
I think anyone that has worked in sales and distribution will tell you that high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin. My point exactly...so keep calm and .01 zerg every 5 minutes
arabella blood wrote:
Done arguing about who said what and who understood who and how, its childish, leads nowhere, offtopic, grow. Let the speaker defend his point, he sure doesnt need your help, nor can you claim to understand what he said anymore then me.
I can and did claim to understand him more than you. The point he is alluding to contained in "high turnover is easier and more valuable than high margin." Again, to remind you, .01 ISK raises are a strategy to preserve margin. In other words, high turnover is easier and more valuable than .01 ISK wars.
|

goatplasma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:42:00 -
[57] - Quote
It might be a strategy to preserve margin, but that doesn't mean it's a high margin strategy. The point of 0.01 isk bumping is not for high margins, it's for high volume in a short period of time and the margins are usually very thin. You cannot have a strategy that is both high volume and high margin as it assumes a market that goes against basic supply and demand principles. |

arabella blood
Black Scorpions Inc Circle-Of-Two
22
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:47:00 -
[58] - Quote
See, its stupid, i was referring to a different post 
Now that i know what we talk about, i have to tely shortly; I was talking about the 0.01 process of mantaining 1 buy order at the top of the list, fullfiling it, then resseling at 0.01 isk lower then lowest sell order. Thats not high turnover? Thats not ".01 isk war"?? |

goatplasma
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:59:00 -
[59] - Quote
I am very happy that everyone in eve picks the 0.01 isk route as it means there is almost no competition for my trading strategies. |

Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy Caldari State
97
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 12:03:00 -
[60] - Quote
arabella blood wrote:See, its stupid, i was referring to a different post  Now that i know what we talk about, i have to tely shortly; I was talking about the 0.01 process of mantaining 1 buy order at the top of the list, fullfiling it, then resseling at 0.01 isk lower then lowest sell order. Thats not high turnover? Thats not ".01 isk war"??
Not if it takes you a long time to fill the order and then sell it. If it takes six months, that would be a low turnover. |
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