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Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 102	Posted - 2013.06.18 10:23:00 - [1] - Quote So, I log on over the weekend with a view to setting my high sec pos up for some building, and hoping that I can ninja a worm hole for some rare mins that I needed. However, I find that I have been wardecked. No biggie, that's Eve. So I do the sensible thing, as I am in a solo Corp, I pull down the POS and stow it all away for the duration. For me it is a huge investment, which I don't want to loose. But after that, I get into the spirit of things, jump into a PvP (clean) friendly clone and invest a hundred mil or so in some cheap throwaway PvP ships. I am actually looking forward to a bit of PvP as a change, even though it will probably end in me getting my as.... botty handed to me. The problem is, as soon as the war goes guns live, the whole of the 12 man Corp that wardecked me logged off and I have not seen hide nor hair from any of their members on-line since. I have 9 of them on my watch list, from doing an intel search of kill boards and the like, and so far I have not seen one log on. My concern is, either they will keep the war running, and again not log on, or they will let me put my POS up again when it is safe to do so, then re-wardeck me. So I guess, the question is, if they continue doing this, do I have any argument under harassment and griefing? As I say, it's not the actual wardeck that I have an issue with, it's the wardeck then not logging on that is the issue. Thanks for any thoughts and advice MG
Jayka Kyer M1N 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 10:40:00 - [2] - Quote Heres what i would do. 1, contact people they were previously at war with and see what they can tell you, find out if they were after a ransom and what tactics and ships they used. ( the reason they may be offline is they probably watch with a alt and log in only when they can quickly gank etc so you feel safe.) 2, look through their kill board history and try to pin point friends and alts that they have worked with and war dec them. (make sure their friends know the reason is because of the people that deced you. 3, watch to see if they dec anyone else, they may just be decing you to prove a point and have bigger fish to fry, if possible fly blackbird a rr ships if you can team up with others, you being a pain in the ass increases the chances your not worth the effort. 4, if all else fails join an alliance for a little bit or just go play in in low sec till it blows over. 5, forget about thoughts of griefing, complaing to ccp and play the game.
Sean Parisi Fugutive Task Force A T O N E M E N T 296	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:09:00 - [3] - Quote Set up the pos while they aren't on. But a **** ton of ECM and Guns on it. Energy Neuts and warp disruptors. Don't let your POS run out of fuel and then let them die on your POS if they try anything.
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 1337	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:20:00 - [4] - Quote Strange things happen in highsec wars. Sometimes people who only play on weekends declare war during the week so the target is good and complacent by the time they log in at the weekend. Other people declare war on folks with inactive shell corps specifically to try and get them to take down POS towers without a fight. There's also a lot of mercenary scamming going on at the moment (which is why you should use the MERC Contracts channel) where someone will pay money to a corp to declare a war, they declare a war and then don't do anything. Or they may just be in a different timezone to you. Look at their war history and see how many other active and finished wars they have and if those wars have kills in them, that might shed some light on what they are actually doing.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 102	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:32:00 - [5] - Quote I have done most things people here have suggested. The Corp appears to only be able to kill POS arrays. They did appear to have some 'teeth' a couple of years ago, but any active ship killing players that they had have moved on. They do have a long history of wars, though I seem to be the first this year. I did wonder if there might be a wardeck scam going on, as I was also contacted by a couple of Corps offering to take up the fight against them. I accepeted the offer of the Corp willing to take on the job for free, but another was requesting a fee. I don't even think it's about ransoming or the like, again, they do seem to be tied in with player NPC corp characters. Though I live in High Sec I live in an as out of the way sytem as I can. and just prior to the war deck had noticed a rapide increase in mining activity by a team appearing to be made up of characters in several different NPC corps. To me it is just that one big annoying thing about Eve, that CCP appear to be happy to let players influence the game by not playing
Sean Parisi Fugutive Task Force A T O N E M E N T 296	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:39:00 - [6] - Quote Depending on the size of the tower. A few guns and ECM will definitely deter them, it is much harder to kill a High Sec POS. With 11 people they would have a very hard time fighting it. Many people are looking to get more targets, so they will offer assistance. But I believe after a certain point you have to pay something like 10 mil to get more allies on top. I would not pay anyone for assistance though, just accept people who are looking for targets. A while back a guy war decced an indy corp my friend is apart of. Only reason he did so was because they had allowed the POS to run out of fuel. This guy spend hours with a stealth bomber slowly killing POS's to pad his killboard. Once guns and the shield were put on, he dropped the war dec.
Jayka Kyer M1N 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:42:00 - [7] - Quote "To me it is just that one big annoying thing about Eve, that CCP appear to be happy to let players influence the game by not playing " If their not online then they cant hurt you. Any influence is in your head or because it effects your afk play. You choose to play in hi-sec, take the good with the bad.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 102	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:43:00 - [8] - Quote Sean Parisi wrote: Depending on the size of the tower. A few guns and ECM will definitely deter them, it is much harder to kill a High Sec POS. With 11 people they would have a very hard time fighting it. Many people are looking to get more targets, so they will offer assistance. But I believe after a certain point you have to pay something like 10 mil to get more allies on top. I would not pay anyone for assistance though, just accept people who are looking for targets. A while back a guy war decced an indy corp my friend is apart of. Only reason he did so was because they had allowed the POS to run out of fuel. This guy spend hours with a stealth bomber slowly killing POS's to pad his killboard. Once guns and the shield were put on, he dropped the war dec. Ah well, I guess I know what to do with those 2 x 3 run small Dark Blood laser doobries that I have gathering dust in my station hanger
Sean Parisi Fugutive Task Force A T O N E M E N T 296	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:48:00 - [9] - Quote Max Godsnottlingson wrote: Sean Parisi wrote: Depending on the size of the tower. A few guns and ECM will definitely deter them, it is much harder to kill a High Sec POS. With 11 people they would have a very hard time fighting it. Many people are looking to get more targets, so they will offer assistance. But I believe after a certain point you have to pay something like 10 mil to get more allies on top. I would not pay anyone for assistance though, just accept people who are looking for targets. A while back a guy war decced an indy corp my friend is apart of. Only reason he did so was because they had allowed the POS to run out of fuel. This guy spend hours with a stealth bomber slowly killing POS's to pad his killboard. Once guns and the shield were put on, he dropped the war dec. Ah well, I guess I know what to do with those 2 x 3 run small Dark Blood laser doobries that I have gathering dust in my station hanger Don't forget ECM. 11 People have a hard enough time killing a POS, you throw the ECM in - they cannot bring logi effectively. This acts as a force multiplier and would force them to bring more people if they were going to try in any way to take down the POS.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 102	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:48:00 - [10] - Quote Jayka Kyer wrote: "To me it is just that one big annoying thing about Eve, that CCP appear to be happy to let players influence the game by not playing " If their not online then they cant hurt you. Any influence is in your head or because it effects your afk play. You choose to play in hi-sec, take the good with the bad. I choose toplay where I want, and no you are wrong. This is probably the most hypocritical argument you see in Eve. Yes it's OK to screw over AFK miners/and ice miners, but you are not allowed to spoil my AFK PvP Meta gaming, such as this, or AFK cloaking. As I say, I am not worried about the fight and the wardeck. That is Eve, what I am annoyed about is that (a) My character training has been slowed because I am not going to risk the best part of 2 bils worth on implants (b) My industrial game is hampered because I cannot do all that I want o do at my POS It has nothing to do with where I am based, and all to do with **** poor hypocracy
Jayka Kyer M1N 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 11:58:00 - [11] - Quote My alts tower is in a wormhole system, no war dec is effecting it. Having a +4 implant set is about 80 mill isk , the difference in training time over a few weeks is probably less than a couple of hours, (edit - between +4s and +5s) You telling people on a forums that you normally fly with bills of implants is way more risk than the chance of losing implants in hisec war if your not afk or super unlucky.
Aquila Sagitta Blue-Fire Confederation of xXPIZZAXx 53	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:09:00 - [12] - Quote Don't like 90% of wars in eve go on with 0 killz by both sides? Its just how it is. Maybe try living in a C1 wh for your pos with a static HS?
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 103	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:35:00 - [13] - Quote Jayka Kyer wrote: My alts tower is in a wormhole system, no war dec is effecting it. Having a +4 implant set is about 80 mill isk , the difference in training time over a few weeks is probably less than a couple of hours, (edit - between +4s and +5s) You telling people on a forums that you normally fly with bills of implants is way more risk than the chance of losing implants in hisec war if your not afk or super unlucky. Yes, but at least I will get killed and loose a few bills worth of implants and ship to people actually playing the game. Or at least playing the game in such a way that I can either have a go back myself, or talk to somebody like REPO Industries, or whoever the current good Mercs are and say, "Hurt them". As I am trying to say, and you are failing, or unwilling to understand is tha; I choose to live in High Sec, the only way my POS can 'legally' be attacked is through a war deck. War decks happen, no worry, that's Eve. But trying to annoy players by war decking, then hiding behind NPC Corp Alts which can't be touched is rubbish. All it does is cause bad feeling and makes player pirates look bad, whenI know most are actually OK guys when you keep Eve in perspective
Tsukino Stareine EVE University Ivy League 383	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:41:00 - [14] - Quote if you lose your pod in high sec you're doing something wrong
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 103	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:44:00 - [15] - Quote Tsukino Stareine wrote: if you lose your pod in high sec you're doing something wrong lol I am human, I make mistakes. On top of that I am an old fart so I make even more mistakes that are every body elses fault
Jayka Kyer M1N 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:45:00 - [16] - Quote As i already said you cant get killed by people not playing. Imagine this, instead of them not being online they live in an unknown wormhole system, and don't come out during the dec so you cant follow them in some how. how is this different to them not being online to you. You still would of removed clone and took down tower, you still cant get at them. That is my point, its your play style and views on whats happening not what the war targets are doing.
Bad Messenger Nasranite Watch Confederation of xXPIZZAXx 523	Posted - 2013.06.18 12:47:00 - [17] - Quote maybe they wanted to take your tower down, but you took it already down, they have no reason to be online (alts) they can not easily quit war because it is not possible without surrending mechanism, so maybe they just wait that week goes on and wardec end when more payments are not made to continue. If war continues more than week then something bigger may be behind it.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 103	Posted - 2013.06.18 13:00:00 - [18] - Quote Jayka Kyer wrote: As i already said you cant get killed by people not playing. Imagine this, instead of them not being online they live in an unknown wormhole system, and don't come out during the dec so you cant follow them in some how. how is this different to them not being online to you. You still would of removed clone and took down tower, you still cant get at them. That is my point, its your play style and views on whats happening not what the war targets are doing. No, the point is, even if they are hiding in a worm hole system, there is always that million to one chance that I get a direct link to them, and as anybody who has read Terry Pratchett knows, a million to one chance always succeeds. But seriously, I can get my head around that. While my POS may be high sec based, I ninja gas and minerals out of WH/Null sec systems regularly. It is actually quite conceivable that some WH bod, mentions to his mates. "Say, remember that Insert expletive of your choice Godsnottlingson guy who was 'Pigging' us off the other day, well I have found a tower of his in High Sec, lets at least annoy the little s**t. Again, that is Eve, I understand that. ItGÇÖs the level of meta gaming, that means you can effect another player at no risk to yourself that is what is spoiling things for me. And this is the one thing, which to me at least, is becoming more prevalent in Eve and will probably in the end kill it for me.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 103	Posted - 2013.06.18 13:03:00 - [19] - Quote Bad Messenger wrote: maybe they wanted to take your tower down, but you took it already down, they have no reason to be online (alts) they can not easily quit war because it is not possible without surrending mechanism, so maybe they just wait that week goes on and wardec end when more payments are not made to continue. If war continues more than week then something bigger may be behind it. Actually, I think this is where I am getting annoyed with myself. Some of the guys have posted me some good ideas for POS defences, so now I am annoyed that I took the easy way out and 'up sticks', when I should have said "Bring it on!" as I strapped more ECM and gun onto the tower
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 104	Posted - 2013.06.18 14:00:00 - [20] - Quote Jayka Kyer wrote: As i already said you cant get killed by people not playing. Imagine this, instead of them not being online they live in an unknown wormhole system, and don't come out during the dec so you cant follow them in some how. how is this different to them not being online to you. You still would of removed clone and took down tower, you still cant get at them. That is my point, its your play style and views on whats happening not what the war targets are doing. edit - think your post got edited there as i was writing mine but ill leave it that. best of luck with how you deal with it. o/ Actually I have got a better 'counter' to your argument. As I say, I am old and it takes time for the old grey matter to tick over. We obviously disagree with me, so say for example; rather then reply here you think "This Godsnottlingson guy is an idiot who needs a lesson taught him." So then you promptly wardeck me from your worm hole before getting on with what you do. Ok, I get the war deck notification. Think "Oh Poop!" and get on getting ready. Part of getting ready is trolling all of the kill boards trying to get as much info on you and your Corp, adding you to my 'watch list' and generally doing what I can do to get ready for some PvP. Then today comes. All of my PI is brimming to overflowing, I realy need to get out and get them all emptied so I can set up fresh runs, but I see, you are on-line. OK, you are doing your thing in a WH. I don't know that, for all I know you could be lurking in a near by stytem in some insta locking snort guzzling gank machine that will kill my ship, kill my pod and probably take down half of the city that I live in too. I don't know, all I know is that you are on-line. So, I jump in my Imphal, throw on a couple of extra WCS for good luck then undock with heart in mouth, and having to put up with said heart missing a beat every time I have to jump through a gate. Or I ask a mate to run scout for me. I may be in a solo Corp, but having played Eve for many years now I do actually know a few people who will help me and who I help when the need arises. Which ever way, I eventually dock up with a smug feeling of satisfaction at being able to 'do what I need' even while in a war state. So, the big difference is, you have actually added to my game play experience, (First by adding a lot of tension to what is frankly a routine game job, and next giving that feeling of satisfaction). You provided all of that, even if there was never an actual threat because you were busy in your WH and had no intentions of following up on the wardeck. And that is the difference between if you war decked me and what this bunch of idiots have done, because, that is exactly what I did last night, and I didn't even bother throwing on any extra WCS because, yet again, nobody was on-line nor came on-line while I was active.
Tinu Moorhsum Random Events 223	Posted - 2013.06.18 14:01:00 - [21] - Quote Max Godsnottlingson wrote: Actually, I think this is where I am getting annoyed with myself. Some of the guys have posted me some good ideas for POS defences, so now I am annoyed that I took the easy way out and 'up sticks', when I should have said "Bring it on!" as I strapped more ECM and gun onto the tower My first thought when I read the OP was to think that for some reason they wanted your moon and they flexed to see if you would move.... Personally my attitude about it has always been to bat-phone my friends and contact the aggressors saying, "come and get it" . In almost the same time it took you to remove your POS you could have upgraded to a dickstar or a death-star..... 9 times out of 10 they will respond with a half hearted attempt geared more at saving face than actually taking down your POS and if you DO lift up the veil a bit and show them who your friends are then most will back down. (at least in my case. I have good friends who could fist you so deep that they could open and close your mouth like a sock puppet). That said. I've also lost at least one POS like that (maybe more than one LOL) but my ego would rather lose 1 POS in 10 than back down from someone who walks into me to see if my fontanelle is closed. This is EVE online, not OMGRUNTHEYAREGOINGTOEATME online. It's just isk. the experience of fighting back is more valuable.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 104	Posted - 2013.06.18 14:05:00 - [22] - Quote Tinu Moorhsum wrote: Max Godsnottlingson wrote: Actually, I think this is where I am getting annoyed with myself. Some of the guys have posted me some good ideas for POS defences, so now I am annoyed that I took the easy way out and 'up sticks', when I should have said "Bring it on!" as I strapped more ECM and gun onto the tower My first thought when I read the OP was to think that for some reason they wanted your moon and the flexed to see if you would move.... Personally my attitude about it has always been to bat-phone my friends and contact the aggressors saying, "come and get it" . IN almost the same time it took you to remove your POS you could have upgraded to a ****-star or a death-star..... 9 times out of 10 they will respond with a half hearted attempt geared more at saving face than actually taking down your POS and if you DO lift up the veil a bit and show them who your friends are then most will back down. (at least in my case. I have good friends who could fist you so deep that they could open and close your mouth like a sock puppet). That said. I've also lost at least one POS like that (maybe more than one LOL) but my ego would rather lose 1 POS in 10 than back down from someone who walks into me to see if my fontanelle is closed. This is EVE online, not OMGRUNTHEYAREGOINGTOEATME online. It's just isk. the experience of fighting back is more valuable. As I say, that is the one thing that I am realy beating myself up over. I should never have pulled down the POS.
Tinu Moorhsum Random Events 223	Posted - 2013.06.18 14:29:00 - [23] - Quote Max Godsnottlingson wrote: As I say, that is the one thing that I am realy beating myself up over. I should never have pulled down the POS. This is totally off topic but I've had an experience like this in real life too. (if you don't like RL then stop reading here). It was in 1989 in Zambia. I was in Lusaka in the main market. They had just come off the heels of a war and there was literally nothing in the markets. Some lettuce, some tomatoes, some cooked chicken.... not even bread. Lusaka was a city of about a million (I think) at the time and they were being serviced by one (count 'em) one baker. I've done a lot of stupid ** in my life but walking around in that market alone, being the only westerner in the whole wide area, and carrying a backpack... well..... I was asking for trouble, even if I didn't know it. At some point I had the feeling that a group of young men were following me. I made twists and turns and even stepped between two kiosks in the market to try giving them the slip but every time I checked out of the corner of my eye they were there. This is the point where Tinu's real life person and my in-game personna intersect. I thought. "well ** me. they're going to try to mug my ass.... fine but not without paying the price!" But obviously they didn't care to do it while i was actually IN the market. so I walked to the edge of the market where there was an open field and started crossing it like I had to go to the other side. Little did they know that I had many years of recent Kung-fu training under my (black) belt and unless they had a gun, this was going to hurt. I walked about 20m into the field and turned around. 3 of the guys who were following me were right behind me. They didn't know what to do when I turned around so I took the initiative. I took off my backpack, threw it on the ground in front of my and said, "If you want it, come and get it" . They scattered like pigeons LOL.
Jayka Kyer M1N 2	Posted - 2013.06.18 18:34:00 - [24] - Quote edit - messed up my post some how
Tinu Moorhsum Random Events 223	Posted - 2013.06.18 19:21:00 - [25] - Quote Jayka Kyer wrote: edit - messed up my post some how In fact, that wasn't the only time that day that someone tried to mug me. About 2 hours after the experience I wrote about above, I was walking into a large open public space and a couple of guys "tackled" me in a corner and pinned me against the wall. I could feel hands going into my pockets and I could hear the zip of my backpack being opened before the resistence of an arm digging in. My survival reflexes took over. I didn't even think about what I was doing. I think it took about 3 seconds before I .... er.... "pacified" one of them. I'll never forget the "crack" or my guilt about how I hurt him. The other one was bigger than I was and used his weight to push me down into a corner with no room to manoeuvre. I managed to get a hand free and used a "chin na" attack to get him to back off...... but it wasn't looking good. About that time 2 police or security people "landed" on him and took over. The guy started screaming "sorry sorry sorry" and acting like it was some kind of mistake. He wanted to give me the blame for over reacting..... I let the police deal with him and just walked away.
Max Godsnottlingson Bitter Veterans 104	Posted - 2013.06.18 20:15:00 - [26] - Quote lol Tinu, your stories remind me of something that happened where I live back in the 80's. A couple of guys tried to sue an old lady. After they had tried to mug her, one woke up with a concusion and the other had a dislocated shoulder and bust elbow. Turned out that the 'little old lady' used to be thrown out of aeroplanes over occupied Europe back in the 40's and had been taught to do all sorts of nasty things to people. Thankfully back then,in the UK, we didn't have the suing culture that we have today and their claim was laughed out as they got 'sent down' themselves. Sadly today it would probably have been the little old lady sent down while they got a pat on the head
Texty State War Academy Caldari State 71	Posted - 2013.06.19 06:17:00 - [27] - Quote Max Godsnottlingson wrote: I have 9 of them on my watch list, from doing an intel search of kill boards and the like http://evewho.com/ This site is pretty good for finding out corp members.
Evangelina Nolen Sama Guild 2	Posted - 2013.06.19 06:20:00 - [28] - Quote Put up a POS in lowsec.
Inxentas Ultramar Ultramar Independent Contracting Home Front Coalition 542	Posted - 2013.06.26 11:14:00 - [29] - Quote I disagree on a few points with you Max. While I understand this is inconvenient and frustrating to no end, I'd like to make a case for it's validity. Corporations are groups, their mechanics are intended to cover group activities and achieve group-based objectives. You are trying to achieve these same things solo, without the capacity to defend your investment really well. You are tapping into gameplay one scale above the intended level (corporate) playing solo. For the record: doing these things is what makes a sandbox a sandbox, so you are doing nothing wrong. But neither are those gunning for your POS! My advice would be to train the skills needed to manually control your POS guns. If you have a lot of time to play, there's a high chance you will be online when it's truly under attack. The AI on those guns is terrible, manual control makes POS defenses far better because you can focus fire.

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