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Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 16:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
99.9% of my PvP encounters have always been consensual. What I mean by that is both me and my opponent wanted the fight. IMO due to the mechanics of the game it is nearly impossible to force a competent player into a fight without the help of crazy fast lock times. An example of this is the past plague of plex farmers. Try as I may I could never pin one down. Even now you'd have to be asleep at the wheel for someone to get the jump on you in a plex.
So in order to get fights I've been flying almost nothing but T1 frigates, employing a strategy I call BYOB or "Be Your Own Bait". It works in the sense I find plenty of fights. It doesn't work in the sense that 90% of the fights I get are navy or pirate frigs requiring me to punch above my weight, which a lot of times I cannot seem to do. I could ship up and start flying slicers but although I haven't logged a lot of hours in one, nobody seems willing to fight it.
So there you have it. Do I have preconceived misconceptions about ones ability to engage an unwilling opponent? Would I actually find more fights in a slicer than what I think? Should I just stick with T1frigs and only accept fights from other T1 frigs? |
David Devant
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
91
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 16:21:00 -
[2] - Quote
T1 frigs will definitely get you the most fights. I get plenty in faction stuff as well because players in t1 figure "what the hell, might get a nice km". Sadly there's very little incentive to fly anything bigger than a dessie if you want to solo in FW. |
Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 16:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
David Devant wrote:T1 frigs will definitely get you the most fights. I get plenty in faction stuff as well because players in t1 figure "what the hell, might get a nice km". Sadly there's very little incentive to fly anything bigger than a dessie if you want to solo in FW.
So you agree that it is near impossible to force an unwilling player to fight? |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
737
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 16:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:David Devant wrote:T1 frigs will definitely get you the most fights. I get plenty in faction stuff as well because players in t1 figure "what the hell, might get a nice km". Sadly there's very little incentive to fly anything bigger than a dessie if you want to solo in FW. So you agree that it is near impossible to force an unwilling player to fight? That is how it should be, we all pay to play after all.
Question you should be asking is why FW mechanics are constructed in a way that encourages death-averse players to join up in such insane numbers and why one has no reason to undock in bigger than a destroyer (bunkers are one cycle of 2-3 dreads).
Address those two and your Blood God will drown in the offerings showered upon him.
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Mabego Tetrimon
Spiritus Draconis Sicarius Draconis
12
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:99.9% of my PvP encounters have always been consensual. What I mean by that is both me and my opponent wanted the fight. IMO due to the mechanics of the game it is nearly impossible to force a competent player into a fight without the help of crazy fast lock times. An example of this is the past plague of plex farmers. Try as I may I could never pin one down. Even now you'd have to be asleep at the wheel for someone to get the jump on you in a plex.
So in order to get fights I've been flying almost nothing but T1 frigates, employing a strategy I call BYOB or "Be Your Own Bait". It works in the sense I find plenty of fights. It doesn't work in the sense that 90% of the fights I get are navy or pirate frigs requiring me to punch above my weight, which a lot of times I cannot seem to do. I could ship up and start flying slicers but although I haven't logged a lot of hours in one, nobody seems willing to fight it.
So there you have it. Do I have preconceived misconceptions about ones ability to engage an unwilling opponent? Would I actually find more fights in a slicer than what I think? Should I just stick with T1frigs and only accept fights from other T1 frigs?
i think its a good mechanic. I like solo playing from time to time, and it gives a lot of fights, and i dont wann be at risk getting blobbed everytime i enter a plex...(thats what happen if you put in mechanics "to force a fight")
if you wanna go after farmers, well might try out cloaky ships to catch them... |
Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 19:04:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote: if you wanna go after farmers, well might try out cloaky ships to catch them...
Not really after farmers. I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. |
Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch OLD MAN GANG
538
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 20:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:Mabego Tetrimon wrote: if you wanna go after farmers, well might try out cloaky ships to catch them...
Not really after farmers. I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights.
then you need better plan. |
Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 21:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
Bad Messenger wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:Mabego Tetrimon wrote: if you wanna go after farmers, well might try out cloaky ships to catch them...
Not really after farmers. I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. then you need better plan.
Working on it. When attack frigates got rebalanced there was a huge spike in TD condors and atrons orbiting at 20k while optimal range disrupting turreted ships. I fitted beams and locus rigs to my coercer and blapped them with 40k optimal.
I'm seeing a lot of web fitted faction frigs now. Might break out my coercer again but I'm looking for something that looks like an easier kill. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
2911
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 00:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
You have two choices...
- Lure your targets into a situation of your choosing by putting them in to a false sense of superiority (either by using a lol-ship and/or lol-fit). For example: The Coercer supposedly excels at tank and gank type situations. Most people buffer fit the thing which leaves it with so-so DPS as far as destroyers go. If you fit the Coercer for maximum DPS and range (forfeiting tank almost entirely) then you can utterly wreck frigates and some destroyers once they come within range... and very few expect it. Another example: brick-tank a Tristan and load up the mid slots with drone enhancement modules (speed and tracking). Equip Warrior IIs and watch as super fast frigates cry "wtf!" and warp off.
- Rush in and nuke. Simple strategy, but it hinges on you being faster than the target. In the cases with Condors... with links and special implants they go stupid fast. This leaves specially fit Interceptors and Atrons the only things that can catch such targets. That or have links/special implants yourself. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 01:13:00 -
[10] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:You have two choices...
- Lure your targets into a situation of your choosing by putting them in to a false sense of superiority (either by using a lol-ship and/or lol-fit). For example: The Coercer supposedly excels at tank and gank type situations. Most people buffer fit the thing which leaves it with so-so DPS as far as destroyers go. If you fit the Coercer for maximum DPS and range (forfeiting tank almost entirely) then you can utterly wreck frigates and some destroyers once they come within range... and very few expect it. Another example: brick-tank a Tristan and load up the mid slots with drone enhancement modules (speed and tracking). Equip Warrior IIs and watch as super fast frigates cry "wtf!" and warp off.
- Rush in and nuke. Simple strategy, but it hinges on you being faster than the target. In the cases with Condors... with links and special implants they go stupid fast. This leaves specially fit Interceptors and Atrons the only things that can catch such targets. That or have links/special implants yourself.
Yeah that's pretty much what I've done with Coercers in the past. Was trying to do the same thing with T1 Amarr frigates but not as much luck with that. Will just have to keep experimenting. |
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
2911
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 05:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:You have two choices...
- Lure your targets into a situation of your choosing by putting them in to a false sense of superiority (either by using a lol-ship and/or lol-fit). For example: The Coercer supposedly excels at tank and gank type situations. Most people buffer fit the thing which leaves it with so-so DPS as far as destroyers go. If you fit the Coercer for maximum DPS and range (forfeiting tank almost entirely) then you can utterly wreck frigates and some destroyers once they come within range... and very few expect it. Another example: brick-tank a Tristan and load up the mid slots with drone enhancement modules (speed and tracking). Equip Warrior IIs and watch as super fast frigates cry "wtf!" and warp off.
- Rush in and nuke. Simple strategy, but it hinges on you being faster than the target. In the cases with Condors... with links and special implants they go stupid fast. This leaves specially fit Interceptors and Atrons the only things that can catch such targets. That or have links/special implants yourself. Yeah that's pretty much what I've done with Coercers in the past. Was trying to do the same thing with T1 Amarr frigates but not as much luck with that. Will just have to keep experimenting. Have a look at the Crucifier. It's sorely underestimated. Just fit and fly it like one of those Condors you see all the time... but with drones for damage. Avoid missile and drone ships.
edit: also look into the Atron (aka. "Derptron"). Fit the largest blasters you can fit with a MWD, scram, web, and a damage control. Overload the MWD and rush at anyone who looks at you funny. Laugh when you nuke them, get another 4.5 mil one when you die. Loads of fun. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Fret Thiesant
Oregon Trail rising
28
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 08:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
I get plenty of fights no matter what i fly in fw's most days.
But here's the thing.
i usually get more fights from O-Plexing than I do when I go out to hunt plexers.
So I'd suggest flying what you like and doing some O-Plexing. |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
443
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 11:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sebo dessy w/long point. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
Maxamus Rex
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry Templis Dragonaors
0
|
Posted - 2013.07.21 16:22:00 -
[14] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:99.9% of my PvP encounters have always been consensual. What I mean by that is both me and my opponent wanted the fight. IMO due to the mechanics of the game it is nearly impossible to force a competent player into a fight without the help of crazy fast lock times. An example of this is the past plague of plex farmers. Try as I may I could never pin one down. Even now you'd have to be asleep at the wheel for someone to get the jump on you in a plex.
So in order to get fights I've been flying almost nothing but T1 frigates, employing a strategy I call BYOB or "Be Your Own Bait". It works in the sense I find plenty of fights. It doesn't work in the sense that 90% of the fights I get are navy or pirate frigs requiring me to punch above my weight, which a lot of times I cannot seem to do. I could ship up and start flying slicers but although I haven't logged a lot of hours in one, nobody seems willing to fight it.
So there you have it. Do I have preconceived misconceptions about ones ability to engage an unwilling opponent? Would I actually find more fights in a slicer than what I think? Should I just stick with T1frigs and only accept fights from other T1 frigs?
Trying to pin down a farmer is the most frustrating thing about FW they cloak or run even before you are in short d-scan range. But I have found a few honorable opponents that always give me a good 1v1 but it makes for a boring kill board. As for being your own bait that is the only way too get a fight most of the time. |
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome A T O N E M E N T
485
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 03:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:Mabego Tetrimon wrote: if you wanna go after farmers, well might try out cloaky ships to catch them...
Not really after farmers. I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights.
Something with high scan res and catch them when they try and enter plex gates.
Plexing is a bit boring too so it is easy for people to become inattentive.
Drop a few funny gif links in local as you head to attack. Can buy you the few seconds you need sometimes.
Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
Theroine
Justified Chaos
28
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 04:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. Everything has its time and everything dies. We all want to win our fights; however, being overly focused on beating other players/not losing will lead you to cherry picking, so in the end you become what you hate. Once that happens, you're on your path to the Dark Side, if you aren't already there as your portrait suggests. Or as Yoda would suggest, "train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose".
Live long and prosper.
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IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome A T O N E M E N T
485
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 04:52:00 -
[17] - Quote
Theroine wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. Everything has its time and everything dies. We all want to win our fights; however, being overly focused on beating other players/not losing will lead you to cherry picking, so in the end you become what you hate. Once that happens, you're on your path to the Dark Side, if you aren't already there as your portrait suggests. Or as Yoda would suggest, "train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose". Live long and prosper.
Eve, Star Wars and Star Trek all in one post!!!!
Impressive.
Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
Theroine
Justified Chaos
28
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 05:34:00 -
[18] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:Theroine wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. Everything has its time and everything dies. We all want to win our fights; however, being overly focused on beating other players/not losing will lead you to cherry picking, so in the end you become what you hate. Once that happens, you're on your path to the Dark Side, if you aren't already there as your portrait suggests. Or as Yoda would suggest, "train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose". Live long and prosper. Eve, Star Wars and Star Trek all in one post!!!! Impressive.
There's one more scifi quote in there. |
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome A T O N E M E N T
485
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 07:20:00 -
[19] - Quote
Theroine wrote:IbanezLaney wrote:Theroine wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. Everything has its time and everything dies. We all want to win our fights; however, being overly focused on beating other players/not losing will lead you to cherry picking, so in the end you become what you hate. Once that happens, you're on your path to the Dark Side, if you aren't already there as your portrait suggests. Or as Yoda would suggest, "train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose". Live long and prosper. Eve, Star Wars and Star Trek all in one post!!!! Impressive. There's one more scifi quote in there.
Oh -- Dr Who as well.
I missed that.
Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
Ovv Topik
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
461
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 16:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
Fret Thiesant wrote:I get plenty of fights no matter what i fly in fw's most days.
But here's the thing.
i usually get more fights from O-Plexing than I do when I go out to hunt plexers.
So I'd suggest flying what you like and doing some O-Plexing. Definitely agree plexing in a t1 gets more fights than roaming the WZ looking for fights.
Fights come thick and fast in the right junction systems with 4+ gates, and you dont waste half your time chasing stabbed farmers.
Edit: I got 'shwacked by an awesome little hustle the other day on this topic: Landed in a sys with only 2 in local. A -10 Tusker who I knew better than to tussle with and a WT Fweddit farmer in a Tormentor running a novice who hadn't even changed his ship name!
Landed in the plex expecting an easy kill or most likely he'd just run, and it was the Tusker who'd changed his ship name to match the Newb!
Well played! "Jita 4 4 spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!" |
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Deacon Abox
Justified Chaos
160
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Posted - 2013.07.22 18:22:00 -
[21] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:Theroine wrote:IbanezLaney wrote:Theroine wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:I'm just trying to beat players who cherry pick all of their fights. Everything has its time and everything dies. We all want to win our fights; however, being overly focused on beating other players/not losing will lead you to cherry picking, so in the end you become what you hate. Once that happens, you're on your path to the Dark Side, if you aren't already there as your portrait suggests. Or as Yoda would suggest, "train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose". Live long and prosper. Eve, Star Wars and Star Trek all in one post!!!! Impressive. There's one more scifi quote in there. Oh -- Dr Who as well. I missed that. isn't the "everything dies" from Pitch Black? |
Koujjo Dian
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
49
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 19:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ovv Topik wrote:Fret Thiesant wrote:I get plenty of fights no matter what i fly in fw's most days.
But here's the thing.
i usually get more fights from O-Plexing than I do when I go out to hunt plexers.
So I'd suggest flying what you like and doing some O-Plexing. Definitely agree plexing in a t1 gets more fights than roaming the WZ looking for fights. Fights come thick and fast in the right junction systems with 4+ gates, and you dont waste half your time chasing stabbed farmers. Edit: I got 'shwacked by an awesome little hustle the other day on this topic: Landed in a sys with only 2 in local. A -10 Tusker who I knew better than to tussle with and a WT Fweddit farmer in a Tormentor running a novice who hadn't even changed his ship name! Landed in the plex expecting an easy kill or most likely he'd just run, and it was the Tusker who'd changed his ship name to match the Newb! Well played!
Yeah that's awesome. Seems like the best way to get a "fair" fight is to make yourself seem weaker than you really are. |
Salan Steel
Nasranite Watch OLD MAN GANG
2
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 20:52:00 -
[23] - Quote
Koujjo Dian wrote:[quote=Ovv Topik]
Yeah that's awesome. Seems like the best way to get a "fair" fight is to make yourself seem weaker than you really are.
Yes. |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
560
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 02:18:00 -
[24] - Quote
Salan Steel wrote:Koujjo Dian wrote:[quote=Ovv Topik]
Yeah that's awesome. Seems like the best way to get a "fair" fight is to make yourself seem weaker than you really are. Yes.
This |
Harry Stampernox
Solarii Assault Squad Solarii Federation
1
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Posted - 2013.07.23 02:33:00 -
[25] - Quote
I've got things on excel gates, the rare time you can catch someone just as they open a plex by warping to it, if you are ready you can land with them. Experienced plexers will open a plex and cancel warp, waiting to see if any enemies go there.
I find my t1 frigs get way more action than an destroyer will. However not many pilots are flying solo and will bring a friend or two and be perfectly willing to engage a destroyer in a 3v1. |
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome A T O N E M E N T
488
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 11:10:00 -
[26] - Quote
Harry Stampernox wrote: Experienced plexers will open a plex and cancel warp, waiting to see if any enemies go there.
Depends on the ship and if a few people the fleet comp and if they need to set up in the plex 1st to be effective.
Sometimes its gogogo to get in and have things in place. Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
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