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Yulai, can we have it back please?

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Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 806	Posted - 2013.08.03 21:58:00 - [31] - Quote Ines Tegator wrote: Rowells wrote: sure, why not What this guy said. Mix things up, watch the chat bots cry. watch chat bots just move somewhere else. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 806	Posted - 2013.08.03 22:03:00 - [32] - Quote This will change nothing except make life in hisec more trivial than it already is. People will still flock to one system for trade, it might be JIta or it might be Yulai. Also the populations excluding trade hubs in the four empires are already close to being equal in population. I got a chart to prove it. http://youtu.be/7MZD6-vGQms?t=6m39s The reason Jita is still a super hub is because consolidating trade in one place is so damn convenient for traders that no matter where you live in hisec Jita is the best place to sell your stuff, it will just be transported by others to the other hubs and have the prices marked up. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Aliventi Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 341	Posted - 2013.08.03 23:45:00 - [33] - Quote Commander Ted wrote: Eve shouldn't be a game where you just click mine and wait, then click build, and then click sell. Having things like long travel time and barriers enriches the sandbox and adds more variables to prevent homogeneity. Just making it all one really close blob will make the game much more boring just so you can have things be easy. Because highsec is the epitome of interesting and isn't already trivial at all... Whether it should be or not, Eve is a game where you just click mine and wait, then click build, and then click sell. How in the world is a few fewer jumps in a afk freighter going to make highsec more homogenous? There is nothing "racially unique" about a trade hub. The racial trade hubs will still exist in the same way that Amarr is lesser to Jita. here are the benefits: 0.0 alliances can reach the main hub quicker on average so resupplying/selling stuff takes less time. Faction warfare will have a hub that isn't patrolled by faction NPCs as Yulai is in CONCORD space. Suicide ganking will be boosted as more and more wealth flows through a smaller area of systems. Highsec officer spawns and overladen freighters go! Travel times will be shortened. Downsides: Yulai will be a larger trade hub than Jita. Which really won't be a problem once "Brain in the Box" is done. "tbh most people don't care about removing local from highsec. They want it gone from nullsec. I want to be able to solo roam hunt without everyone knowing I am there without them actually seeing me jump through the gate. Effortless intel is bad." ~Me
Ines Tegator Towels R Us 341	Posted - 2013.08.04 00:17:00 - [34] - Quote People who refer to highsec as trivial don't understand why people live there. It's not because it's easy; it's because it's predictable. Some people just prefer that kind of game. Moving the hub more centrally won't change anything except autopilot routes. - Mission Overhaul - Bridging the PVP / PVE Gap - -áIf the game stops teaching people to fear lowsec, maybe people will start going there?
Commander Ted Caldari Provisions Caldari State 807	Posted - 2013.08.04 00:35:00 - [35] - Quote Ines Tegator wrote: People who refer to highsec as trivial don't understand why people live there. It's not because it's easy; it's because it's predictable. Some people just prefer that kind of game. Moving the hub more centrally won't change anything except autopilot routes. So nothing would change? Your contradicting yourself. The routes would be shorter, making things easier. Being predictable means that the same thing happens over and over, which is easy. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
Droidster Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 14	Posted - 2013.08.04 01:08:00 - [36] - Quote Aliventi wrote: [quote=Commander Ted] ... Yulai will be a larger trade hub than Jita. Which really won't be a problem once "Brain in the Box" is done. I disagree with this. If you read my post, note that in 2004 Yulai was proportionately SMALLER than Jita is now, even though it was a more interconnected nexus. CCP never had to shut the gates to Yulai the way they are doing to Jita now on busy weekends. The regional centers (Lustrevik/Rens, Jita, Oursulaert and Amarr) were much bigger than they are now. Restoring Yulai would lead to better regional balance and less congestion.
Aliventi Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 341	Posted - 2013.08.04 05:09:00 - [37] - Quote Droidster wrote: Aliventi wrote: ... Yulai will be a larger trade hub than Jita. Which really won't be a problem once "Brain in the Box" is done. I disagree with this. If you read my post, note that in 2004 Yulai was proportionately SMALLER than Jita is now, even though it was a more interconnected nexus. CCP never had to shut the gates to Yulai the way they are doing to Jita now on busy weekends. The regional centers (Lustrevik/Rens, Jita, Oursulaert and Amarr) were much bigger than they are now. Restoring Yulai would lead to better regional balance and less congestion. Spare me if I don't put a lot of faith in how thing were in 2004 predicting how things will be in 2013. "tbh most people don't care about removing local from highsec. They want it gone from nullsec. I want to be able to solo roam hunt without everyone knowing I am there without them actually seeing me jump through the gate. Effortless intel is bad." ~Me
RubyPorto SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT 3797	Posted - 2013.08.04 07:19:00 - [38] - Quote Droidster wrote: If you read my post, note that in 2004 Yulai was proportionately SMALLER than Jita is now, even though it was a more interconnected nexus. In 2004, EVE had around 40,000 subscriptions. Today, it has around 500,000 subscriptions and a Jita pop cap of around 2000. Are you saying Yulai never saw more than 160 people in Local at once? This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody. "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon
Solstice Project I'm So Meta Even This Acronym 3428	Posted - 2013.08.04 07:40:00 - [39] - Quote You haven't actually explained why it would better anything... Anyhow, not gonna happen, because not in the slightest necessary. Dismissed.
Droidster Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 18	Posted - 2013.08.04 15:28:00 - [40] - Quote Solstice Project wrote: You haven't actually explained why it would better anything... Anyhow, not gonna happen, because not in the slightest necessary. Dismissed. At the risk of responding to the nullsec PVP players who are just trolling in a matter that has little importance to them... The reason why this is needed is two-fold: - having the hub in Caldari space gives an unfair advantage to Caldari - Jita is so busy that CCP is locking its gates during primetimes now, cutting off player's access to their goods in Jita Both of these problems could be solved by simply going back to the way it was before. Historical Footnote As a historical footnote to this thread, newer players may be interested to know that back in 2004 when they cut the gates, CCP announced that this was going to be great because it would cause everyone to leave Yulai and go back to the regional hubs making EVE "the way it was supposed to be" with distinct racial federations. They imagined that cutting all the links to Yulai would just make everybody scatter and spread out. Of course, this is not what happened at all. Everybody moved to Jita and in fact it got worse, because Jita was more isolated, many people who had operated successfully in the regionals moved to Jita because they could no longer operate so far from the hub; this caused Jita to quickly become much larger than Yulai had ever been. It was obvious within a few weeks that the change had been a huge blunder, but it was not reversed. Some people are so proud that they are willing to let a wrong continue rather than admit they made a mistake and undo it.

RubyPorto SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT 3797	Posted - 2013.08.04 19:34:00 - [41] - Quote Droidster wrote: At the risk of responding to the nullsec PVP players who are just trolling in a matter that has little importance to them... The reason why this is needed is two-fold: - having the hub in Caldari space gives an unfair advantage to Caldari - Jita is so busy that CCP is locking its gates during primetimes now, cutting off player's access to their goods in Jita 1) They're not locked. I've never had to wait more than a minute or two to enter. 2) You haven't lost access, there's plenty of stuff you can do to manipulate your stuff remotely. 3) Did Yulai ever have a population above 160 when it was a Hub? If so, it was proportionally larger than Jita. How would replacing Jita with a proportionally larger hub help anything? 4) What advantage does it give Caldari pilots? You're free to live in any region you please no matter what race you are. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody. "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon
Droidster Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 21	Posted - 2013.08.04 19:47:00 - [42] - Quote LOL, so says the criminal, who can't even enter high security space, and has only been playing the game for 2 years. How is you are flying around Jita so much with a -9.9 security status? I love how the newbie PVP players are like "everything is fine". Here, let me try to rephrase my post in a way a PVP player can understand: ships, modules and ammo will be cheaper if they put back Yulai the way it was before.
RubyPorto SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT 3797	Posted - 2013.08.04 20:01:00 - [43] - Quote Droidster wrote: LOL, so says the criminal, who can't even enter high security space, and has only been playing the game for 2 years. How is you are flying around Jita so much with a -9.9 security status? I love how the newbie PVP players are like "everything is fine". Here, let me try to rephrase my post in a way a PVP player can understand: ships, modules and ammo will be cheaper if they put back Yulai the way it was before. 2010 is clearly only 2 years ago, and the amount of time I've been playing clearly makes me unable to do simple arithmetic. ...because Ruby is my only character and there's no way that trade hubs play an important role in my day-to-day operations. YepYepYep Let me try to rephrase my question so that you can stop trying to dodge it: Did Yulai have more than One Hundred, Seventy Five people in it at any time? If so, why do you think Yulai would be proportionally less populous than it was in 2004?* *the current Jita population shrunk down to be the same proportion of the 2004 EVE population This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody. "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon
Maximus Aerelius PROPHET OF ENIGMA 225	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:49:00 - [44] - Quote Commander Ted wrote: The reason Jita is still a super hub is because consolidating trade in one place is so damn convenient for traders that no matter where you live in hisec Jita is the best place to sell your stuff, it will just be transported by others to the other hubs and have the prices marked up. I think you'll find that some items on the market, and more are becoming, cheaper in places like Rens and Hek than the Jita price. Someone is trying to decentralise Jita and it's working. I do most of my "shopping" local to Minmatar space because the 24 jumps to Jita ia just too much of a PITA. Whoever is seeding the Rens and Hek markets and balancing out the prices with or below Jita has some clout but is this a good thing? It can certainly kill trading very quickly if all the markets are balanced that's for sure. I remember the days of the Super Highway's and I'd love to see them return if only through the spine of Highsec. My Feature\Idea:-á Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee" Here's my tear jar > \|_\| < Fill 'er up!
Maximus Aerelius PROPHET OF ENIGMA 225	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:52:00 - [45] - Quote Droidster wrote: I disagree with this. If you read my post, note that in 2004 Yulai was proportionately SMALLER than Jita is now, even though it was a more interconnected nexus. CCP never had to shut the gates to Yulai the way they are doing to Jita now on busy weekends. The regional centers (Lustrevik/Rens, Jita, Oursulaert and Amarr) were much bigger than they are now. Restoring Yulai would lead to better regional balance and less congestion. By smaller if you mean people in system then yes of course it was. Back then you were lucky to see 10K people online at a single time :). Now it's >45K so you can't really do a numbers comparison on Yulai circa 2003/2004 and Jita 2013. My Feature\Idea:-á Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee" Here's my tear jar > \|_\| < Fill 'er up!
Minny Matari Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2013.08.06 10:33:00 - [46] - Quote If Yulai would become the major trade hub again it would be cool imo to have the art department create a special huge trade station with multiple exits where people get ejected from randomly when they undock so congestion is not so bad. maybe also make it impossible to warp to 0 on this station and always make people warp to it for at least 50km so they will always have to slowboat a bit to get there. And they will also need to beef up the replacement for the jita server a bit more as I expect it to be even busier.
Maximus Aerelius PROPHET OF ENIGMA 226	Posted - 2013.08.06 10:45:00 - [47] - Quote Minny Matari wrote: If Yulai would become the major trade hub again it would be cool imo to have the art department create a special huge trade station with multiple exits where people get ejected from randomly when they undock so congestion is not so bad. Please check out my Idea on this: Undocking - More Routes Out of Station and add some support\flame. My Feature\Idea:-á Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee" Here's my tear jar > \|_\| < Fill 'er up!
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 485	Posted - 2013.08.06 23:05:00 - [48] - Quote Aliventi wrote: Droidster wrote: Aliventi wrote: ... Yulai will be a larger trade hub than Jita. Which really won't be a problem once "Brain in the Box" is done. I disagree with this. If you read my post, note that in 2004 Yulai was proportionately SMALLER than Jita is now, even though it was a more interconnected nexus. CCP never had to shut the gates to Yulai the way they are doing to Jita now on busy weekends. The regional centers (Lustrevik/Rens, Jita, Oursulaert and Amarr) were much bigger than they are now. Restoring Yulai would lead to better regional balance and less congestion. Spare me if I don't put a lot of faith in how thing were in 2004 predicting how things will be in 2013. I think he might have a point. If the travel routes are shorter and there are more of them, then moving goods out to the regional hubs would not be as burdensome. The price differentials might drop sufficiently so that people wont necessarily want to go to Yulai for small batch purchases. Bulk buyers would go, but not necessarily somebody fitting a ship. So in relative terms he might be correct, although in absolute terms you might also be correct--i.e. lots and lots of people where improvements to the game itself might make this a non-issue.
Phaade Debitum Naturae WHY so Seri0Us 28	Posted - 2013.08.06 23:40:00 - [49] - Quote Shereza wrote: A "neutral hub" does not necessarily need to have any usable stations. Would Yulai be such a problem without any stations usable by players in it? For that matter what if CCP could just block market access in the entire system so that you can't buy or sell from within it? Edit: Please note that trading and establishing or accepting contracts would also have to be blocked in the system as well to eliminate all trade-based server load that isn't explicitly related to transportation. Exactly right. Doesn't have to have a station that you can trade in, maybe CONCORD's command center or somethin' crazy.
Cael Autumn e X i l e The Initiative. 1	Posted - 2013.08.07 03:31:00 - [50] - Quote Commander Ted wrote: we should do the exact opposite of what you suggest and make it even harder to get around hisec, because making things easier cheapens the experience. I think we should do exactly what he says. Make Yulai what it once was. But don't make it low sec. That would indicate some presence. Can't be faction null either. Have a solitary null sec system in the direct center of empire with claimable sovereignty. EVE King of the Hill, PVP capital of the universe. He who controls Yulai, well, gets shot at a lot. And don't just give it 4 gates, make it 6 or 7 separate connections to make it more interesting to camp.

Andrea Griffin 654	Posted - 2013.08.07 04:16:00 - [51] - Quote Caitlyn Tufy wrote: Nope, multiple more local hubs are good for business. I haven't been in Jita on my main in... I don't know, two years or so? Still, I manage just fine financially. Yup. Jita not exactly great for traders or customers either. The prices are usually on the high side, and that is separate from the ridiculous market manipulations. That, and it's crowded. Really don't have much use for Jita. The other major hubs, and the minor ones, serve me plenty well. Besides; making it more difficult to move around offers opportunities for smaller markets in Eve. Creating the One True Central System and making it easy to access will only serve to kill off the other hubs over time. CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer.
Mag's the united Negative Ten. 15339	Posted - 2013.08.07 12:59:00 - [52] - Quote RubyPorto wrote: Did Yulai have more than One Hundred, Seventy Five people in it at any time? If so, why do you think Yulai would be proportionally less populous than it was in 2004?* I don't know for sure, as it's been quite some time since I was there. But there used to be lots of battles there, including some of the major Alliances. I'm sure it went over that figure a few times, but not on a normal day to day trade basis. Jita, Rens, Amarr and (is it Dodixie?) were all still quite viable trade hubs back then, it's simply that Yulai was the main central hub. I can't recall anyone liking the change, but we all could see Jita was going to fill that role when it happened. I still have a fair few BM's in Yulai. Ahh the good old days. Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.


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