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Mimio
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:17:00 -
[1]
1.
Everybody remember forum registration when you have to type in text from bitmap? It is test against bots. CCP could use this method too.
2.
Everybody can be afk. CCP cannot require presence 100% of play time in the front of keyboard. But any action registered on the server means that player presented and may be quered using bot test.
What is the routine.
GM's(or freelancer, or automated system ) have to check ships at roids and
a) send to the every pilot (supposed to be macro or not) a special noticebly BIG GUI window consists of four elements
- Bitmap with few DIGITS drawn in different colors, form, fonts etc.
- text, requiring to type in ASAP digits from the bitmap( of course, text in different languages, at least german, chineese, korean, russian, spanish, italian, french).
- text field where player could type in digits.
- button OK.
b) And wait for the next activity (warp, jettison, pickup, module activation, speed change). Any such action means that player is present and MUST respond because big window well seen.
c) Check reponse from the player. No response, but player actions are presented - black label on account, invalid response after three times - black lable on account.
Further action is up to CCP. May be after three black labels ban, may be just notification, etc.
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Roshan longshot
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:23:00 -
[2]
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box. |
Gariuys
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:26:00 -
[3]
Yes lets have huge immersion breaking GUI elements with flashy colors and freaky fonts ask us to type in leters. GREAT idea.
And any such idea should be linked to mining, since that's what's macroed most.
~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~
A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX
The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool |
turnschuh
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:26:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Mimio
1.
Everybody remember forum registration when you have to type in text from bitmap? It is test against bots. CCP could use this method too.
2.
Everybody can be afk. CCP cannot require presence 100% of play time in the front of keyboard. But any action registered on the server means that player presented and may be quered using bot test.
What is the routine.
GM's(or freelancer, or automated system ) have to check ships at roids and
you can stop reading here.
GMs dont have the time to fly in every belt in every sys in empire to hunt macro miners. they have FAR MORE important things to do (help the REAL costumers).
beside that most farmers are not afk.
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King Frieza
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:29:00 -
[5]
It seems to King Frieza that you're all frellin m4d and want to make the game unplayable for King Frieza's miners.
King Frieza once put text-bitmap on his blog-comments to stop spammer. It stop spammer for good, but also made King Frieza's subjects stop commenting on his divine blog.
--ooc--
To be honest, all these methods you're suggesting are only making this more bothersome for legit miners. Maybe you're young, and perhaps stupid(not my place to judge), but if you've watched over the movie/game/music industry you can see just how destructive any kind of protection are. If anything, these industries have discouraged people from being legit, and by imitating them, you're only going to discourage people from mining, which would leave the economy in a dire situation.
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Monkey nut
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:32:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
Unfortunatly, the new tractor beam would make this useless. as you could just tractor it back when it's out of range.
---------------------------------
Monkey Nut
CEO - Nova Syndicate
Dedicated to helping new players |
ToxicFire
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:34:00 -
[7]
not another one of these threads ffs, please keep them all in one place. right now
Right now lets see whats wrong with ur problem. Firstly your idea is common its been suggested before for eve, plus its a common security feature on the net. Meaning there are most certainly programs out there that are built to deal with it rendering it useless.
Secondly hows the system going to determin between mining lasers stopping because of cargo hold full or capcitor run out huh?
Thirdly this will impair normal game play no matter how much you say it won't and it will cause more problems than it solves.
As for the first reply... jet cans floating away.... Again would anoyy the normal populace to no end, plus its not exactly going to give macroers a challenge to deal with heck you could just click approach can while its targeted or orbit can the features of the game already defeat that idea.
Finally... all these people suggesting rather simple idea's, do you not think ccp will have thought of them already CCP is full of some rather smart people, they designed and develop this game they know more about the internal game mechanic's if there was an easy way to solve the problem that was viable im sure it would be ingame by now. Plus the fact no other mmo in the world has really been able to tackle the same problem shows it can't be defeated easily without anoyying the main populace of a server.
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smashsmash
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:35:00 -
[8]
You have to give Mimio some credit for coming up with the idea. If it were implemented it would surely work against macro miners. It does take away from the game for people who aren't macro miners and could become annoying.
I would be willing to put up with minor inconveniences to try and stop exploiters but it is just hopeless.
----
Would you like some cries with your whaaamburger? |
Germain
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:48:00 -
[9]
i think this is a great idea.
it is very easy to story line it as well.
customs could do spot checks on roid belts and ask for credencials of the miners. in the form of an id print e.g. your bitmap thing. if they get a bad reply back they get a warning and if more bad replys come back.
pop by customs or inpund of the pod. you would then have to contact CCP to get you pod back and explain your actions.
yay the first good idea for this problem. and make the universe much more imersive as well. as there is more interaction with the NPC part of the game.
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Roshan longshot
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Posted - 2006.01.04 12:52:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Monkey nut
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
Unfortunatly, the new tractor beam would make this useless. as you could just tractor it back when it's out of range.
Whats the skill requirments for the new tractor beam? Macro miners dont train any skill other then the minning requirments...
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box. |
smashsmash
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:04:00 -
[11]
*turns on his interrogation lamp*
so Mr. Longshot.. how do you know so much about macro miners? Hmmmm? Are you a macrominer overlord? We want information. :p
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Originally by: Monkey nut
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
Unfortunatly, the new tractor beam would make this useless. as you could just tractor it back when it's out of range.
Whats the skill requirments for the new tractor beam? Macro miners dont train any skill other then the minning requirments...
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Would you like some cries with your whaaamburger? |
Coconut Joe
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:08:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
your idea wouldnt work.
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Nifty |
Jennai
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:12:00 -
[13]
they're multi-account sweatshop farmers, not completely automated macros. popups would do nothing but annoy everyone.
-------
macro hunters - join channel MacroIntel
macro miner killboard: www.anti-macro.com |
Roshan longshot
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:12:00 -
[14]
Originally by: smashsmash
*turns on his interrogation lamp*
so Mr. Longshot.. how do you know so much about macro miners? Hmmmm? Are you a macrominer overlord? We want information. :p
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Originally by: Monkey nut
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
So after can is Jetted, it starts to drift away, and you will have to chase after it.
No need to bug the real players with some pop-up questions....
Unfortunatly, the new tractor beam would make this useless. as you could just tractor it back when it's out of range.
Whats the skill requirments for the new tractor beam? Macro miners dont train any skill other then the minning requirments...
Kill one and see what is left over...civi shield boosters...civi cargo expanders...good loot there...all things you dont need to train any other skills for.
And to top it off, when they go for another ship, (Other then a barge or industrial) they show up in what? Newbie frigates and low tier cruisers. Very few fly Battle ships, and those cant equip large guns. Ever get shot at with a small gattling laser from an apoc? Thought my alt was dead when he showed up in that apoc
Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter pirate or mixture of them all.
[i]As read from the original box. |
Mimio
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:38:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Roshan longshot
Lets do this simple...you know the old saying...K.I.S.S (Keep It Simple Stupid...
Jet cans float away...at 15 meters a minute...
Nope. Modern macro do not used jetcans. Just warping in and out.
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Mimio
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:41:00 -
[16]
Originally by: turnschuh
you can stop reading here.
GMs dont have the time to fly in every belt in every sys in empire to hunt macro miners. they have FAR MORE important things to do (help the REAL costumers).
beside that most farmers are not afk.
Automated system will be as effective as GMs.
Yes, if macro not afk it will not work. Just because this fact I have 90% effective, not 100%.
But problem is with afk.
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Mimio
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Posted - 2006.01.04 13:58:00 -
[17]
Originally by: ToxicFire
Secondly hows the system going to determin between mining lasers stopping because of cargo hold full or capcitor run out huh?
System perfectly knows the difference between stopping lasers by player(it is player action) and stopping laser due to capacitor empty(it is command from the server). You may believe me.
Quote:
Thirdly this will impair normal game play no matter how much you say it won't and it will cause more problems than it solves.
Yes, of course it may be nervous for honest miner to see few times a day stupid window. But no more, than everydays disconnects, constant lags and memory leaks.
Quote:
Finally... all these people suggesting rather simple idea's, do you not think ccp will have thought of them already
Possibly thought, possibly not.
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Lifewire
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Posted - 2006.01.04 14:03:00 -
[18]
Macros can handle this - there is only one solution to get rid of the macrominer pest: kill em! Challange -> kill, like a small wardeclaration, not corp vs corp, just player vs player.
Forum:http://www.tundragon.com/forum/
Movies:http://www.tundragon.com/pub/eveclips
Killboard:http://www.tundragon.com/
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Cerberal
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Posted - 2006.01.04 14:05:00 -
[19]
Okay heres my take on the whole idea.
*Cerberal warps into belt 5-2 to find the enemy pirate in wait, he quickly closes in and scrambles*
*POP UP!!! Hi please type 4 digits*
*Cerberal has died*
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Mimio
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Posted - 2006.01.04 14:53:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Cerberal
Okay heres my take on the whole idea.
It is not very clever "take"
Quote:
*Cerberal warps into belt 5-2 to find the enemy pirate in wait, he quickly closes in and scrambles*
*POP UP!!! Hi please type 4 digits*
*Cerberal has died*
NPC belt pirates 0.5-1.0 not need to be scrambled and weak as a dead dog.
It's almost impossible to meet aggro human pirates in 0.5 - 1.0.
Macrominers DO live in 0.5-1.0 because they will be DEAD in 0.0-0.4.
So, I do not understand who could kill you in safe belts.
And for wtfh GM or automated system should ask non-mining and non-transport ship about macro-presence?
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Khabok
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Posted - 2006.01.04 15:04:00 -
[21]
Yeah...and how would you like to be one of the innocent 10% that gets banned from your clever little annoyance?
90% isn't good enough.
Khabok
_______________________________________________
Insanity / Rank 1 / SP: 256000 of 256000  |
Ukucia
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Posted - 2006.01.04 21:26:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Mimio
1.
Everybody remember forum registration when you have to type in text from bitmap? It is test against bots. CCP could use this method too.
Won't work.
The bitmaps you describe can't be fed directly into an OCR library. But some simple image manipluation can clean them up enough to OCR them. For example, one thing that most of these bitmaps use is fine lines over the text. So remove all lines <= 2 pixels wide, and you're left with text.
There is no software solution to bots. Otherwise, every MMOG would be using one.
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SengH
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Posted - 2006.01.04 21:32:00 -
[23]
wouldnt the easiest solution to be make all roids have pollution clouds that drift in a random direction from the belt at a VERY slow rate? These could spawn every 5 mins and last an hour or so. Any normal active miner would be able to move out of the way, however macroers would have a problem maintaining distance between the cloud and the roid across all their accts.
Think up something mean for the mercoxit roids on the other hand.
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Queal T'ir
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Posted - 2006.01.04 22:06:00 -
[24]
How about changing roid fields in 1.0 and 0.9 to be alot bigger, three-dimensional, and having a lot of small roids (i.e., not worth a cycle of the strip miners) in them, with a few large ones here and there for diversity?
I figure the macrominers will either waste their time on the small roids, or try to navigate the field to get to the big ones, and getting stuck on the small roids. NPCs might have a hard time navigating fields like this, but thats a moot point since they dont spawn there anyway. |
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