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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 12:59:00 -
[1]
According to the patch notes, the stacking problem with these modules has not been fixed.
The clarify, the problem here is that dampners and tracking disruptors will stack on the same stack as sensor boosters and tracking computers. Yet those positive modules always stack first, meaning the negative modules (tracking disruptors and sensor dampners) will get a heavy stacking penalty, even if just one mod is used.
Many, many people replied to my original thread and after 17 pages it was locked. Another thread actually saw a dev response with the infamous: "We will look into it". So, how is the progress going? What solutions are you looking at? And when do you percieve a fix being implemented?
Thanks
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 17:17:00 -
[2]
Some points:
1) The stacking methods of these modules are bugged. CCP has confirmed this. There shall be no debates about how good or bad this is.
2) However lame, awesome, noobish or unholy you consider BURN EDEN and remote sensor dampners to be, doesnt change this fact and shouldn't have any influence on your opinion of these problems.
3) The intended effect of the stacking nerf was to make an effective limit of 4 dampners per target irrespective of how many sensor booster the target had. Obviously this would mean a target with x sensor boosters could never be dampened beyond a specific range determined by skills and ship bonuses.
4)Activation order makes no difference. Various orders were tried in testing and the same results were produced - in the last thread.
5) Electronic warfare plays a huge role in pvp for so many corporations and alliances that there really is a gaping hole in what was once almost a well rounded spectum of combat. This void must be closed. CCP must endevour to prioritise the fix for this.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 17:42:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Joerd Toastius
If the stacking formula was bugged it would be bugged across the board; unless there's a specific formula just for boosters and damps rather than (as I understand the way things actually are) a universal stacking formula which applies to all stacked modules, there is no bug in the actual stacking. The fact that the current values assigned to boosters and damps produce undesirable effects is at worst a user input bug. Realistically, as the values for both weren't changed during RMR, it's an undesirable and, presumably, unintended knock-on effect. If there are additional hard-coded variables specifically for boosters and damps that aren't working, then and only then is it a bug with stacking.
Dampners and boosters stack together.
Usually:
1st mod is 100% effective
2nd mod is still quite effective
3rd mod is not so effective
4th mod is even less effective
5th mod makes almost no difference
In the case of these modules, if the target has sensor boosters on, the sensor boosters start to take up these stacking slots. So if the target has 2 sensor boosters on, the 1st dampner module activated on him will take up the 3rd stacking slot. So the first dampner will be "not so effective" instead of "100% effective". This problem only applies to modules where positive and negative mods change the same attribute. IE sensor boosters increase scan resolution and targeting range, and dampners decrease these excat same modules. This is why you don't see this problem with guns or anything else.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 18:25:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Karazaan
Are you a RL lawyer?
No, I just use big words so people will take me seriously.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 19:07:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Shin Ra on 09/01/2006 19:07:18
Originally by: Joerd Toastius
Incidentally, has anyone looked at how this applies to ship-applied T2 ammo penalties? If positives work first, do four CPRs negate the cap recharge penalties, for example?
Interesting thought. Never really looked into that. However, the descriptions of the bonus is the same, and this would mean that say a Raven with 4 PDUs, would recieve no penalty for fitting fury cruise missles if the same rules applied.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 20:37:00 -
[6]
Just a little heads up on how ppl can exploit this bug:
This bug does indeed apply to Shield boost amps / cap power relays.
A raven with an XL-C5L and 4x t1 shield boost amps (invulnerability field in 6th slot) gives a 999hp shield boost per 4 seconds. Note my skills are only average at best.
With no cap mods in low slots, that is max capacitor of 5100/692 sec recharge rate (7.369 per second recharge).
With 5x t1 PDUs in low slots, that is max capacitor of 6204/469 sec recharge rate (13.228 per second recharge).
With 5x t1 Capacitor Power relays, that is max capacitor of 5100/227 sec recharge rate (22.466 per second recharge).
AND....... The wonderful stacking nerf that destroyed dampners and tracking disruptors who some claim was a "feature" or whatever, reduces the shield boost from 999hp per 4 sec to... Remember that each cap relay has -10% shield boost.... 985hp. A colossal 14hp or 00.01 %.
Stacking Nerf 4tw
Fix dampners.
Enjoy the exploit folks. Obviously not useful in every situation, but lots of possibilities.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 20:46:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Grimpak
uhmmm... the CPR's don't stack like the other modules afaik...
Yeah, but the shield boost penalty DOES
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.09 21:27:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Teblin
Thread cleaned. I'd like to remind everyone not to post anything which is against the forum rules as it can get you in a lot of trouble. If you aren't familiar with the forum rules, now's a good time to read them.
Fair enough.
If you intend to fix that exploit, your gonna have to fix dampners at the same time since its essentially the same problem.
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Shin Ra
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Posted - 2006.01.11 00:51:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Tobiaz
Having more money and more skillpoints doesn't make you god automatically. If you don't use proper tactics or are simply an idiot, you're dead. Go play WoW instead if you don't like it and see how much 'fun' it is the other way round.
Well said
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